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Avasculous posted:Access to Ambush stance might be the main reason the Beastman campaign is better than Chaos. Why would you need Ambush stance as Chaos, you have no cities to protect, you -want- them to come to you and break trying to fight your chosen.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:15
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Loopoo posted:Also, on another note: what does getting sacked actually do? My settlement was sacked and they walked off with 4700 gold, but none of my buildings were damaged and the settlement was still producing quite a lot of gold each turn. Sacking can damage buildings, or it can even destroy a level of settlement development (sending it down from tier 3 to tier 2, for instance, and therefore destroying an entire building too). If Greenskins are doing the sacking they can leave special negative 'buildings' behind after sacking, which are generally piles of poo poo or whatever, and you have to demolish them before rebuilding stuff. Ra Ra Rasputin posted:Why would you need Ambush stance as Chaos, you have no cities to protect, you -want- them to come to you and break trying to fight your chosen. The main reason I wanted it was so that I could actually catch and destroy enemy armies rather than them running away constantly.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:16
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Loopoo posted:Also, on another note: what does getting sacked actually do? My settlement was sacked and they walked off with 4700 gold, but none of my buildings were damaged and the settlement was still producing quite a lot of gold each turn. Your settlement loses a level of development and one of your buildings is destroyed.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:17
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:Why would you need Ambush stance as Chaos, you have no cities to protect, you -want- them to come to you and break trying to fight your chosen. Being able to hide when three Empire stacks are beelining for your half strength army would be nice
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Dec 13, 2016 18:17
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Kaza42 posted:Being able to hide when three Empire stacks are beelining for your half strength army would be nice I usually let them chase me into razed areas to take attrition for a few turns before turning on them to lightning strike them down one by one. Or I keep my hordes close enough that they can move to support each other for big gently caress-off battles when needed. You'll eat a turn or two of infighting attrition but that's a minor nuisance.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:21
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Is the general consensus that wood elves are a more fun/complete faction than beastmen? Trying to decide which one to pick up.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:21
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PerilPastry posted:Is the general consensus that wood elves are a more fun/complete faction than beastmen? Trying to decide which one to pick up. They're both good but I prefer the Wood Elf campaign gameplay just because the horde style isn't really my thing. The army rosters are great for both.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:23
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A fun trick to do against the AI is to step right outside of your settlement with your main army and ambush stance. If the settlement is vulnerable they'll often make a beeline for it and you typically will have your army+the adjacent garrison. There's no such thing as 'choke points' when enemy armies are going to always exploit your weakest points. Buidling walls in a settlement in a choke point but not in another settlement will just have the AI bypass your tough garrison and go after the weaker one.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:24
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PerilPastry posted:Is the general consensus that wood elves are a more fun/complete faction than beastmen? Trying to decide which one to pick up. It depends on a few things; If you liked Chaos then Beastmen are even more fun in my opinion. They can sneak around the map, don't suffer attrition simply by having stacks close together, and get a similar mechanic to Greenskin waaghs. I think they are the better of the two playable 'horde' factions right now. Wood Elves play differently than most other factions and have their own learning curve. Managing Amber is important, and whichever LL you start with kind of limits you to that half of their roster to a small degree. But they get some amazing stacking bonuses that can make their units absolutely insane in the late game.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:30
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Panfilo posted:There's no such thing as 'choke points' when enemy armies are going to always exploit your weakest points. Buidling walls in a settlement in a choke point but not in another settlement will just have the AI bypass your tough garrison and go after the weaker one. Yeah exactly, walls are pretty essential if you really can't stomach the idea of your poo poo getting occasionally sacked or razed. Helmgart, for example, is definitely a good choke point for the Empire against the human and undead factions to their west (and chaos, if they happened to be lost, I guess), but every other faction will just bypass it with world roots/beast paths/underground and gently caress up your settlements without walls, assuming you haven't built any in the other two settlements.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:31
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PerilPastry posted:Is the general consensus that wood elves are a more fun/complete faction than beastmen? Trying to decide which one to pick up. Probably, but I think that the Beastmen DLC got a lot of unfair negative reviews due to sticker shock not the actual DLC itself. I'm not saying it's impossible to dislike it, I just think that the price tag resulted in some serious bias against it. Fun is subjective. Beastmen are my 3rd favorite faction and a great change of pace faction. You get to run around like an army of insane minotaur ninjas, gently caress some poo poo up, move until you have 25% movement left and go into your hide/heal stance. Wood Elves are more challenging, don't have any 'i win' units (minotaurs are amazing) and have what I consider to be a frustrating mechanic if you like to play with all the units. They also have a really, really hard start but once you get rolling with some upgrades and some outposts with a certain building in them they become pretty badass. Really they're both very polarizing, Wood Elves is a better value because you get more stuff and open up a new part of the map. I still think King and the Warlord is the best DLC they've put out to date and I was hyped af for Wood Elves.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:48
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Thanks a ton for the feedback, guys! I'm thinking I'll go with the wood elves for now and pick up the beastmen a little further down the line. Which faction is next down the DLC pipeline btw? Brettonia's due in February, right?
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Dec 13, 2016 18:58
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So, I think the Wood Elves were the easiest campaign I ever played. After a brief touch-and-go difficult early game (as in the first 20-30 turns) they just spiraled out of control. Allied the Empire, conquered Bretonnia and the Southern Realms, and I had enough Amber to build up the world tree, get every tech, upgrade every province, and still had plenty left over if I wanted treemen or eagles (I didn't want eagles). I was sitting on 200,000+ gold for most of the game, and ended up just declaring war on other factions just to have fun killing them. I could have easily won the campaign by turn 80 (had the Oak upgraded fully with Orion's full stack nearby) but I wanted to get the 10 ambush battle achievement first and fight dwarfs and undead some more. The +Global recruitment skill on generals, plus the +4 global slots tech and the -1 global recruit time tech means that I could build up an entire stack anywhere in two turns. In the final battle, my Deepwood Scouts had ~225 missile damage and my Glade Guard had ~145, so they just melted everything that got remotely close until they ran out of ammo (one glade guard unit scored about 500 kills. The others weren't far behind). In the end, I think Wood Elves have just way too much synergy with their skills, heroes and techs. It's fun to stomp stuff, but it's even more fun to just barely win after a long war.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:58
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PerilPastry posted:Thanks a ton for the feedback, guys! I'm thinking I'll go with the wood elves for now and pick up the beastmen a little further down the line. Bretonnia's next but I wouldn't expect any further new races until the expansion, although new variant factions (like possibly a playable Mousillon?) are not out of the question.
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Dec 13, 2016 19:09
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Kaza42 posted:So, I think the Wood Elves were the easiest campaign I ever played. After a brief touch-and-go difficult early game (as in the first 20-30 turns) they just spiraled out of control. Allied the Empire, conquered Bretonnia and the Southern Realms, and I had enough Amber to build up the world tree, get every tech, upgrade every province, and still had plenty left over if I wanted treemen or eagles (I didn't want eagles). I was sitting on 200,000+ gold for most of the game, and ended up just declaring war on other factions just to have fun killing them. I could have easily won the campaign by turn 80 (had the Oak upgraded fully with Orion's full stack nearby) but I wanted to get the 10 ambush battle achievement first and fight dwarfs and undead some more. The +Global recruitment skill on generals, plus the +4 global slots tech and the -1 global recruit time tech means that I could build up an entire stack anywhere in two turns. In the final battle, my Deepwood Scouts had ~225 missile damage and my Glade Guard had ~145, so they just melted everything that got remotely close until they ran out of ammo (one glade guard unit scored about 500 kills. The others weren't far behind). What did you do with your fellow Wood Elf people? I'm at turn 120 with Durthu and I the other elves don't like me much. My economy is poo poo and I've had to ally with Brettonia and now I'm sacking fake french people who Brettonia doesn't like. I've never felt like I could take out a fellow Wood Elf just because they have 17 units in Garrison plus full stack of high end units I'm thinking I should start again and try to conquer them early, I just don't know how I can accomplish that since they all turtle up super quick.
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Dec 13, 2016 19:32
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CA testing some WElves balance changes. All foot archers get a 20m range increase. https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/5i4v7x/wood_elves_hotfix_beta_info/ quote:
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Dec 13, 2016 19:45
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I hope if Mousillion ever becomes a playable subfaction in the Grand Campaign we get unique french sounding undead. "BLEH! honhonhon!" 
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Dec 13, 2016 19:46
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Smith Comma John posted:CA testing some WElves balance changes. All foot archers get a 20m range increase. The only part that seems necessary to me is the Wildwood Rangers buffs (I'm assuming they're quietly fixing the missing Waywatchers passive).
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Dec 13, 2016 19:59
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sassassin posted:The only part that seems necessary to me is the Wildwood Rangers buffs (I'm assuming they're quietly fixing the missing Waywatchers passive). From that post: quote:Waywatchers are missing an ability, modders found it!
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Dec 13, 2016 20:03
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I don't really care what CA says about the Quarreller/WElf Archer matchup, the loving dwarfs shouldn't have been winning an archer duel with the archer race. Giving the fire on the move archers more range to kite the stunties is where they should have been in the first place.
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Dec 13, 2016 20:21
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Quarrellers pretty much have to beat wood elf archers because how else do dwarves deal with that?
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Dec 13, 2016 20:26
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wiegieman posted:I don't really care what CA says about the Quarreller/WElf Archer matchup, the loving dwarfs shouldn't have been winning an archer duel with the archer race. Giving the fire on the move archers more range to kite the stunties is where they should have been in the first place. I mean the Dwarfs are probably THE gunline race on TT and the Welfs have a lot more roster options, and besides, Quarrelers are shielded so...  That said, the range increase does sound like a good change and will make skirmishing much more effective.
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Dec 13, 2016 20:34
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Fangz posted:Quarrellers pretty much have to beat wood elf archers because how else do dwarves deal with that? Artillery?
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Dec 13, 2016 20:45
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Do Welves have some invisible bonus to ambush chance? They seem easier to ambush with than anybody else - enemies see Empire lads hiding in dense forest a mile away, but with the Asrai I can either gently caress up or totally lose pursuing armies by plopping down into ambush stance in the middle of barren plains. I didn't even buy any ambush upgrades.wiegieman posted:I don't really care what CA says about the Quarreller/WElf Archer matchup, the loving dwarfs shouldn't have been winning an archer duel with the archer race. Giving the fire on the move archers more range to kite the stunties is where they should have been in the first place.
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Dec 13, 2016 21:00
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wiegieman posted:I don't really care what CA says about the Quarreller/WElf Archer matchup, the loving dwarfs shouldn't have been winning an archer duel with the archer race. Giving the fire on the move archers more range to kite the stunties is where they should have been in the first place. Whatever skill the dwarves lack they make up for with armor. Plus with no real cav (if you say gyrocopter I will freak out) I'm ok with them being able to 1v1 the Orlando Blooms
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Dec 13, 2016 21:03
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Shame theres no dragon buff
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Dec 13, 2016 21:08
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There's no lore reason why a unit from "the archer race" should beat a unit from the heavily armoured race in a straight shootout. Longbows aren't the best ranged weapon in warhammer by a long shot. Wood Elves aren't a gunline army on the tabletop. They're a skirmisher/ambush army.
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Dec 13, 2016 21:24
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Surprise Giraffe posted:Shame theres no dragon buff Yeah the Dragon and Eagle are super overwhelming. The only time the eagles were useful for me was when I was playing on small unit sizes without realizing it. 4 of them dive bombing Morghur sure works well when he's at like, 1k max health or whatever it was. Treemans, Treekin, Archers, Waystalkers, healy spellslinger and some Glade Guard were basically the only things I used much in either campaign.
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Dec 13, 2016 21:36
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Do the DLC factions appear in the Grand Campaign even if you don't buy them/can't play them yourself?
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Dec 13, 2016 22:07
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Verranicus posted:Do the DLC factions appear in the Grand Campaign even if you don't buy them/can't play them yourself? I've got plenty of beastmen causing a ruckus.
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Dec 13, 2016 22:10
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Skaven, elves, beastmen, WHATEVER I want more DWARVES! This week i've already played two dwarf campaigns back to back. MORE DWARFS MORE DWARF UNITS Verranicus posted:Do the DLC factions appear in the Grand Campaign even if you don't buy them/can't play them yourself? YEAH
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Dec 13, 2016 22:10
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Dwarfs are somewhat OP atm because they buffed a lot of their infantry without a commensurate nerf to Runelords. I had a really tight match against dwarfs with Wood Elves; rear end in a top hat (playername: DawiStandTall) even tried to draw-kite me at the end, with his plodding Runelord lol. It's ridiculously weak matchup for Wood Elves but I snatched at least one victory against the Dwarfs from his bitter, stubby hands. Not so tall now! Posting replay because I thought it as a pretty cool looking match. https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxL-q9Tcsh-aOUZ6Y3dZRzFtNTg/view?usp=sharing
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Dec 13, 2016 22:32
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Does anyone have any preferred mods for making the chaos invasion harder? Even when I'm playing in the south and ignoring it, it tends to get crushed around Talabheim/Middenheim rather than being a real threat
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Dec 13, 2016 22:39
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Kaza42 posted:Does anyone have any preferred mods for making the chaos invasion harder? Even when I'm playing in the south and ignoring it, it tends to get crushed around Talabheim/Middenheim rather than being a real threat The Skaeling and Varg are the real threat anyway.
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Dec 13, 2016 22:50
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Its not necessarily chaos themselves but I was pretty impressed with The Uncivilized North, it adds in all possible norse tribes at the start and they all get stacks once the big chaos invasion comes, really wreaked a lot of havoc across the empire, and that time I was actually playing on easy
The Chad Jihad fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Dec 13, 2016 |
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Dec 13, 2016 22:55
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John Charity Spring posted:
Let them run, if they are running it means they don't think they can beat you and it leaves their cities completely invulnerable, you don't have any vulnerable cities they can attack behind you, you don't have to care at all about anyone running from you.
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Dec 13, 2016 23:14
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Dongattack posted:Skaven, elves, beastmen, WHATEVER I feel like Augustus, pacing the halls and lamenting what could be. "Where are my demon-slayers, CA?! Give me my demon-slayers!!" Mukip posted:Dwarfs are somewhat OP atm because they buffed a lot of their infantry without a commensurate nerf to Runelords. I agree, and the Dwarfs' 25% resistance to magical damage really skews their matchup against Wood Elves. I hope the New World expansion seriously retools how spellcasting works, because the current system just leaves Dwarfs in a weird spot. The 25% magic resistance is useless against vortexes since they're based more on mass, and it does nothing to stop buffs/debuffs/net of amyntok. My fingers are crossed for some sort of dispel ability, but I'm afraid of how CA would implement it without adding a huge new layer of micromanagement.
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Dec 13, 2016 23:17
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I'm not thrilled about Tilea being able to build up and maintain 3 stacks with just a single city and no trade partners to their name, after I beat them down to next to nothing. Begging for peace one minute, declaring war again the next. Definitely less than 8 turns, anyway..
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Dec 14, 2016 00:03
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:Let them run, if they are running it means they don't think they can beat you and it leaves their cities completely invulnerable, you don't have any vulnerable cities they can attack behind you, you don't have to care at all about anyone running from you. Except that where they're ultimately running to is the cities, where oftentimes they + the garrison and walls can beat you, and the AI will sit inside accumulating units with its magic economy while you fend off Norsca stack #17 even though the Empire farmland is right there, you assholes. Then there's the other scenario, where right after you take a city, Karl Franz walks into a vision range with a doomstack and chases you clear across the entire loving map on forced march because you don't have any walls to hide behind and the AI doesn't give a poo poo about attrition. Which is why the first half of the Chaos Campaign feels more like a Benny Hill chase skit than the End Times. (or at least did, I haven't played it in 6 months and it might have been patched a lot better since) And yeah, there's other ways to deal with those- agents blocking movement and lightning strike can help- but Ambush stance is a lot more accessible and often more useful than either one.
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Dec 14, 2016 00:06
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My mistake was killing off the two wizards and 3 units of theirs that were wandering the forest 90% dead. They were harmless and if I'd left them/kept blocking Tilea would have been stuck with them. What's a good agents "fix"? Using a mod that stops all aggressive agent actions for ai and player, but that feels a bit heavy handed and boring after a while.
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Dec 14, 2016 00:06
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