|
Not China related, but this is my favorite story about war games and military simulations. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Challenge_2002 The US sets up a massive wargame simulation centered around a potential Iranian war in order to test out a bunch of new tech. The opfor general opts to use WWII level tech instead and manages to launch a surprise attack on the US Navy "killing 20,000" soldiers and ending the war in a single day. The military then decides that this wasn't fair and resets the simulation and forces the opfor general to follow a script so that the good guys win.
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 18:56 |
|
|
Let us English posted:Not China related, but this is my favorite story about war games and military simulations. The dude did cheat pretty hard though, if I remember right. There wasnt any latency for the messages he sent via dirtbikes/non-radio, and the missiles used was kind of "All of them" rather than "The ones that can be used in the specific area and are ready to fire". Both sides were acting pretty lame.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:18
|
|
|
The opfor general basically said gently caress it and was doing nuh uh my motorbike couriers can travel light speed and i have like a million speedboat kamikazes, pew pew pew Which can be a problem for a exercise.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:19
|
|
|
Ceciltron posted:Taiwan is a big mountain and all their highways are designed/ have explosives built into them/ to be blown at a moment's notice to create a literal impassable interior. Example from South Korea.  Explosive charges take out the supports and you're left with a massive concrete roadblock to stop North Korean tanks. South Korea and Taiwan have had lots of time to create obstacles, defences, and plan tons of simulations to determine the best way to halt an invading army and funnel them into kill-zones where their artillery (having the locations pre-programmed) would start to shell them when they are at their most vulnerable. Basically you design everything to cause the invaders to get into a bottleneck, then when they are all crammed in a location they can't easily escape, you start shelling their forward and rear positions (boxing them in) then pound everything in-between until you're satisfied that nothing left alive or working in that area is going to be a threat any more. Once that's done you move on to the next area the enemy is trying to squeeze through. Both South Korea and Taiwan are absolutely horrible countries to try and invade. Like Ceciltron said, they are mountainous and comprised of tons of ridges and valleys that are ambush heaven. Basically you have a scene like this happening over and over again, but even worse for the invaders because unlike this part of Iran, Taiwan has vegetation on their hills, and the defenders can hide really easily. PLA troops that actually make it ashore would be absolutely demoralized as soon as they started meeting the enemy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:21
|
|
|
Didn't it turn out that he had motorcycle couriers traveling at the speed of light, and launched cruise middles from fishing boats too small to show up on Radar?
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:34
|
|
|
Idk, gonna read it now and hopefully find out: http://www.dod.mil/pubs/foi/Reading_Room/Joint_Staff/12-F-0344-Millennium-Challenge-2002-Experiment-Report.pdf Sorry for OT 
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:36
|
|
|
226 posted:Didn't it turn out that he had motorcycle couriers traveling at the speed of light, and launched cruise middles from fishing boats too small to show up on Radar? PRC has a lot of fishing boats already deployed, just saying... Murray Mantoinette fucked around with this message at 05:41 on Dec 16, 2016 |
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:38
|
|
|
BCR posted:The opfor general basically said gently caress it and was doing nuh uh my motorbike couriers can travel light speed and i have like a million speedboat kamikazes, pew pew pew Basically what the Marine General was doing was using cheat codes that allowed him to pause the game, turn on "nofog" so he could see exactly where the enemy was, issue orders, allow his players to move while the game was still paused, move units outside of the map so they could attack from an impossible direction, mod units so they could fire weapons they were not designed to carry, spawn new units without anyone knowing, and fire his weapons so that they all hit the enemy at the exact same instant. All without a single radio signal. The only thing he accomplished was winning another PR coup for the Marine Corps (all of their other boasts are based on lies anyway) and cost the military millions of dollars in now useless results.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:41
|
|
|
Ceciltron posted:Taiwan is a big mountain and all their highways are designed/ have explosives built into them/ to be blown at a moment's notice to create a literal impassable interior. By that point you're talking about giving up the Western coast, dude, that's a phyrric victory if I've ever seen one.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:42
|
|
|
Come see China number one new stealth bomber. Just as good as western make technology! *crashes at first public demonstration killing their first female test pilot* Yes but in simulation it took out Taiwan missile battery!
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:44
|
|
|
Pirate Radar posted:By that point you're talking about giving up the Western coast, dude, that's a phyrric victory if I've ever seen one. I'm merely stating how the island is presently designed/fortified that I know of. We can assume Taiwan has had 50 years to prepare.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 05:59
|
|
|
I wish there was some sort of frequently posted image that would quickly mock all of the nerds in this thread who once again think they are military strategists...
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:06
|
|
|
Since Taiwan is part of china and the Taiwanese people Chinese, couldn't they welcome the PLA? I think the PLA would be very confused why they are being shot at by the Taiwanese. Oh Taiwan could pull a dick move and hire a bunch of Africa mercenaries.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:07
|
|
|
Yorkshire Pudding posted:I wish there was some sort of frequently posted image that would quickly mock all of the nerds in this thread who once again think they are military strategists... If only.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:08
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:11
|
|
|
Atlas Hugged posted:Come see China number one new stealth bomber. Just as good as western make technology! Did this happen IRL?
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:12
|
|
|
Blistex posted:but she is of the idea that certain TCM's are more of a "slow burning" treatment rather than a cure-all. This is my favorite TCM thing. "See, I was sick and I took this stuff and after a couple weeks I felt better!" 
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:14
|
|
|
Grand Fromage posted:This is my favorite TCM thing. "See, I was sick and I took this stuff and after a couple weeks I felt better!" At least she doesn't have a peanut-brittle coating.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:15
|
|
|
Lazer Monkey posted:Did this happen IRL? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/11/14/first-woman-to-fly-chinas-j-10-fighter-killed-in-crash/ More or less. I made up the missile battery simulation part. The article notes there have been a bunch of crashes though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:16
|
|
|
Dandywalken posted:I dont think any simulation to date of an invasion of Taiwan has China actually being repelled and Taiwan "winning" by any definition. Depends on if the US is involved. If it's just Taiwan vs China then simulations favor China but if the US is involved they favor Taiwan Don't forget that there's no such thing as an accurate war simulation too
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:17
|
|
|
Blistex posted:I think I found the findings in question? This will make Taiwan great again. LOL Blistex pretty much nailed how terrible it is to invade either places. Taiwan has a defence treaty in all but name with the US that people keep forgetting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan_Relations_Act quote:The act further stipulates that the United States will "consider any effort to determine the future of Taiwan by other than peaceful means, including by boycotts or embargoes, a threat to the peace and security of the Western Pacific area and of grave concern to the United States". This was what happened last time China went full on autistic screech back in 1996 backing up that Act. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Taiwan_Strait_Crisis 2 CBGs, one to sail in between China and Taiwan and one standby to back it up which is a massive concentration of naval power. Pirate Radar posted:By that point you're talking about giving up the Western coast, dude, that's a phyrric victory if I've ever seen one. It's not really about winning although winning is still on the cards, it's more about making the other side lose. The only country that has the ability and the logistics to invade Taiwan is the US. A Chinese invasion would bog down so badly and with so little supplies it would be untenable. The US doesn't even have to fight directly, they just have to limit the amount of supplies and troops moving through. This ignore the diplomatic poo poo storm that would hit the PRC. There are also 23 million people on the island, so I guess all that riot training will come to good use. Iraq has about 38 million and the worlds greatest military force ever with nigh unlimited logistics couldn't police that. If the USN did throw down, there is no question China would lose. Being the defending country always sucks in the fact that any attack is going to be destroying your ground, not theirs. Dicky mouse posted:Oh Taiwan could pull a dick move and hire a bunch of Africa mercenaries. Battle of Jadotville: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3922798/
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:18
|
|
|
Fojar38 posted:Depends on if the US is involved. If it's just Taiwan vs China then simulations favor China but if the US is involved they favor Taiwan "Home by spring festival boys!"
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:21
|
|
|
Blistex posted:Basically you have a scene like this happening over and over again, For anyone interested in watching people getting wrecked: https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/ It's wild, but cool, that there are now drones everywhere recording the action in HD, and people wearing Go Pros while getting shot to death. Also, whatever you open on there links to something else on the side and, before you know it, you've spent an hour watching people blow themselves up to Pop Nasheeds. This one is my favorite. He looks so stoked to be suiciding, and the anticipation really builds. Will he make it to the target? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9PBVYnXcDE The drive starts at 2min.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:32
|
|
|
This picture always makes all the armchair strategery worthwhile.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:35
|
|
|
Murray Mantoinette posted:PRC has a lot of fishing boats already deployed, just saying... Also, keep in mind, the objection there is less "no one would ever be so dishonorable as to put missiles on a fishing boat" and more "the missiles themselves would barely fit on boats that small, and the forces imparted by launching them would loving destroy the boat, and apparently the missile is guided by magic and apparently all this retrofitting happened overnight with an invisible army of skilled technicians without anyone ever noticing". The lesson to take from that anecdote isn't that the US military sucks so bad they have to rig their own wargames to make sure the good guys win, it's that wargames and simulations and training exercises are only as good as the parameters of the scenario and should be taken with a grain of salt regardless of the predicted outcome.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:36
|
|
|
China tried using fishing boats. They got repelled by tanks and peanut oil smugglers. The Chinese were so poorly armed that they had no real counter against tanks RoC had which were early WW2 war surplus. Story goes that when the tanks ran out of ammo, they started driving over the Chinese soldiers.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 06:50
|
|
|
Kinmen must be protected at all costs since that's where the 高粱 comes from.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 07:00
|
|
|
Haier posted:For anyone interested in watching people getting wrecked: What am I looking at exactly? The happy tank man drives to an abandoned fort(?) then gets bombed by long range cannons?
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 08:08
|
|
|
Suicide bomber.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 08:12
|
|
|
https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/66540c7b-a562-42af-8f30-14f5563b8d83/TheBattleOfQuemoy.aspxquote:But the plan went badly. After the first three regiments were delivered to the beachhead—in the middle of the night, apparently undetected by the defenders the tide went out, and all the ships grounded in the shoals, where they were mercilessly destroyed by the KMT defenders by shore, sea, and air. Not a single ship or boat was able to return to pick up the reinforcing second landing group. Although grave miscalculation of ocean tides was later blamed by most partici-pants and PRC historians as the chief culprit for the transport debacle, it was not the most decisive factor in the failure of the transport vessels to return for the quote:In the event, the most deadly weapons used by the KMT defenders against the invading PLA troops and vessels were the twenty-one M5A1 Stuart tanks. The PLA command had known about the tanks beforehand and had prepared antitank rockets to deal with them. But the antitank rockets came in three parts, which needed to be assembled before launch. General Xiao ordered the parts carried by separate ships. When the force attempted to land and came under fierce and devastating tank fire, none of the antitank rockets could be assembled. nickmeister posted:What am I looking at exactly? The happy tank man drives to an abandoned fort(?) then gets bombed by long range cannons? He went pop. I am not sure if there was anything of value there. The explosion was bigger than I expected.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 08:25
|
|
|
Question for those who have taught English in China: Is giving small children bottles of ink so they can write with dip pens a common thing? There's a China blogger I like to watch who is always complaining about his children spilling their bottles of ink. When I asked him why small children have bottles of ink, he said it's because they use dip, quill style pens.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 08:25
|
|
|
nickmeister posted:Question for those who have taught English in China: Unless he is blogging from the 1920's, then no. Pretty much everyone has been using bic style ballpoints and felt tip for decades, and before that it was reservoir-style fountain pens.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 09:22
|
|
|
nickmeister posted:Question for those who have taught English in China: The only time I ever see people using bottles of ink are with a brush for calligraphy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 09:42
|
|
|
nickmeister posted:What am I looking at exactly? The happy tank man drives to an abandoned fort(?) then gets bombed by long range cannons? He is a jihadi, talking about how much it owns to fight for Allah and the cause, and he's happy to help everyone out, and he gets into his bomb-ladden tank that is fused to blow at his command. He drives to an enemy compound while the rest of the group advances on it, and he Hu Ackbars and blows everyone away in an explosion that Michael Bay would be jealous of. Then it has another clip of him talking about how it owns to blow up.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 09:51
|
|
|
nothing is going to beat abu hajaars incompetence. does feature ISIS fighters being killed this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jPTrS-7d14
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 09:59
|
|
|
Eh, that compound was probably empty. Usually you see those guys driving towards positions and they get toasted by the Milan, tanks or autocannons. It's a cool firework though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 10:02
|
|
|
sorry for interrupting the suicide bomber talk, but does anyone happen to be in "Gwangjou"? One of my old students is going there for 6 months, and he's a super cool kid and not very korean at all.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 10:03
|
|
|
I don't know about other cities, but lately on the Shenzhen Metro they've been playing this dramatic video on loop about Tencent E-sports teams. The narrative is trying to romanticize being a giant nerd, showing these pale scrawny/fat guys in cargo shorts standing at winners podiums and traveling to all of these exotic locations to sit inside a dark room, with shots of them looking off into the distance like they are contemplating more than that next bowl of instant noodles during a 16-hour click-fest in a Counter Strike knock-off.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 12:28
|
|
|
Well I hate reddit but thats a nice collection of videos. Nothing better than HD war cam footage to remind you that infantry battles are basically just running, hoping you don't get shot, and then returning fire from where you think it might be coming from but who knows?Now for the SUPER HIGH DEF QUALITY chinese vs taiwanese camera footage!!! (CENSORED) That reminds me, what was that old video game before things like Arma where you fought the Russians in the 80s should make games more like that wher eyou run and get shot out of nowhere, a true Syrian and Ukrainian experience
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 13:16
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 18:56 |
|
|
Arma has that in spades, as well as lovely military chatter from the AI which doesn't help. "Number 3, opfor, 98 degrees west, machine gunner." You turn and it's an arid scrublands for miles. Then you get shot a die.
|
|
#
?
Dec 16, 2016 13:23
|
|
