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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:Wait, what? Police is now allowed to murder people in custody? Can't be right. It's so out of place with all the other law changes. I wonder what the definition of 'in custody' is here because someone in custody obstructing so hard that warning shots and then shooting at are needed doesn't sound like the common sense meaning of the term.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:05
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I wonder if the cops in question would have to pay the costs for repairing the bullet holes in the room out of their wages. naaaah.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:27
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Phlegmish posted:i.e. instead of 95℅ communists it's only 80℅ communists DnD hasn't been majority socialist in a good while.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:31
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I agree, bring back lf.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:42
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YF-23 posted:DnD hasn't been majority socialist in a good while. Well yeah it's full of Americans. They try to be socialist but most of them don't actually read so it's all a bit cargo culty.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:45
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double nine posted:I wonder if the cops in question would have to pay the costs for repairing the bullet holes in the room out of their wages. When you see how hard it is for cops to be held to face any real scrutiny after a black guy in police custody dies of And after protests, it's the guy's brothers who are in jail. And this was before this law. Nenonen posted:I wonder what the definition of 'in custody' is here because someone in custody obstructing so hard that warning shots and then shooting at are needed doesn't sound like the common sense meaning of the term. Le Monde is talking about people under arrest who are trying to escape and the police officers can't stop them in any other way.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:47
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That's a mistranslation. It doesn't refer to people being held in jail, but to people being chaperoned by a cop and attempting to flee. If a cop tells you to stay there, and you don't, then they get to warn you thrice to obey and then shoot.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:56
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It's not exactly reassuring that this is "only" a license to shoot people in the back if they run.
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Dec 21, 2016 18:59
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1. Capture "criminal youths" 2. Tell them to stay put. 3. Go hide somewhere and wait for them to attempt to escape. 4. Weakly yell "Stop!" three times, then unload your arsenal. 5. Go to 1.
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Dec 21, 2016 19:03
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Pretty much. Until now, they only needed to scare them into hiding into electrical substations. But I've got a funny piece of news though: François Hollande said that he regrets giving up on running for reelection and that he didn't say he was giving up on politics. 
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Dec 21, 2016 19:13
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A Buttery Pastry posted:1. Capture "criminal youths" They fought the law and the law won. In other news: https://twitter.com/YanniKouts/status/811638612827705345 Please can the EU do something about this? Maybe have some kind of system that stops illegal immigrants who commit crimes (any crime, sorry but if you are a guest, you better behave) from committing more crimes? Either send them back to where they came from or put them in jail until they can be send back. GaussianCopula fucked around with this message at 19:30 on Dec 21, 2016 |
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Dec 21, 2016 19:24
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GaussianCopula posted:They fought the law and the law won. Sounds like a great way for countries to pass restrictive laws that allow them to round up and deport immigrants en masse.
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Dec 21, 2016 19:46
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So it looks like the truck thing was done by a Tunisian refugee who the German police knew was dangerous but since Tunisia wouldn't take him back they did nothing about it. Real huge mystery how the right is surging in power, a real head scratcher here. That is near criminal negligence on the part of the authorities, are they really just going to sit back and wait for everyone to start goose stepping? You just can't bring in a million people without any sort of plan of how to deal with the inevitable problems that arise from a huge influx of unskilled and mostly uneducated people along with the gigantic cultural differences. What in the hell were they thinking? There was definitely ways to prevent the backlash that has happened (and is about to get significantly worse) but it required honesty, not calling everyone who had justifiable concerns about the difficulties involved a horrible racist. When had that ever worked? Certainly not brexit, certainly not trump...it's time for a change in strategy because it objectively dies not work! As was predicted years ago in the old refugee thread the moderates, who would be amenable to dealing with this problem in a thoughtful manner, are getting alienated and are fleeing to the only parties that pretend to give a gently caress. I mean you couldn't give a bigger gift to the far right than admitting that you know dangerous people are coming in with the refugees but you can't do anything about it.
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Dec 21, 2016 19:47
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TROIKA CURES GREEK posted:So it looks like the truck thing was done by a Tunisian refugee who the German police knew was dangerous but since Tunisia wouldn't take him back they did nothing about it. Real huge mystery how the right is surging in power, a real head scratcher here. Certain states (deporting is a state responsibility in Germany) governed by SPD/Greens coalition are even stopping all deportations during winter, because otherwise that's just mean.
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Dec 21, 2016 19:54
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Again, fascism is a boon for capitalists,not a problem.
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Dec 21, 2016 19:55
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TROIKA CURES GREEK posted:So it looks like the truck thing was done by a Tunisian refugee who the German police knew was dangerous but since Tunisia wouldn't take him back they did nothing about it. Real huge mystery how the right is surging in power, a real head scratcher here. If what happened here in the US is at all representative they'll probably keep calling everyone racist, lose, and then blame the loss on racism.
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Dec 21, 2016 20:18
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GaussianCopula posted:Please can the EU do something about this? Maybe have some kind of system that stops illegal immigrants who commit crimes (any crime, sorry but if you are a guest, you better behave) from committing more crimes? Either send them back to where they came from or put them in jail until they can be send back. I like this proposed system that gives an advantage to native terrorists, it'd be horrible if we lost that industry.
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Dec 21, 2016 20:31
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MaxxBot posted:If what happened here in the US is at all representative they'll probably keep calling everyone racist, lose, and then blame the loss on racism. You don't seem to have the first inkling of what happened during the US election.
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Dec 21, 2016 21:18
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Flowers For Algeria posted:You don't seem to have the first inkling of what happened during the US election. Oh OK they didn't just blame it on racism, they also blamed Russian hacking, the FBI, and the media.
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Dec 21, 2016 22:14
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Ah yes the good old "you can't talk about the risks of the refugee crisis without being called a racist!"-myth when every major party and their leadership, all major news outlets, millions of people on daily basis, thousands of academics and studies have done exactly that. If you see that sentence either the person saying it has spent the last year and half in a bunker isolated completely or they are an actual racist mad about being called a racist.MaxxBot posted:Oh OK they didn't just blame it on racism, they also blamed Russian hacking, the FBI, and the media.
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Dec 21, 2016 22:42
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DarkCrawler posted:If you see that sentence either the person saying it has spent the last year and half in a bunker isolated completely or they are an actual racist mad about being called a racist. Or, if they're Finnish, both.
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Dec 21, 2016 22:45
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DarkCrawler posted:Ah yes the good old "you can't talk about the risks of the refugee crisis without being called a racist!"-myth when every major party and their leadership, all major news outlets, millions of people on daily basis, thousands of academics and studies have done exactly that. If you see that sentence either the person saying it has spent the last year and half in a bunker isolated completely or they are an actual racist mad about being called a racist. Yeah I have had people talking to me actually saying "none of those people want to integrate! none!" and when called on that poo poo "I'm not a racist, but.." My own view on these things has changed recently. I understand the panic people are feeling, even though I don't really feel like I'm in danger because the probability that I die in a terror attack is so low. I think there is a fundamental difference that people don't grasp. When there's a terrorist attack people wrongfully say "a refugee did it". A TERRORIST did it, he's certainly no refugee. What people don't seem to get is that, refugees or no, those that want to harm us would get to Europe anyway. There's no wall that would protect us. I think there need to be more initiatives near the muslim community. Talk to the Imams, understand the issues that people feel are important, make a deal that benefits both sites and makes sure that they denounce extremists, actually get to know what these people feel.
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Dec 21, 2016 22:49
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DarkCrawler posted:Ah yes the good old "you can't talk about the risks of the refugee crisis without being called a racist!"-myth when every major party and their leadership, all major news outlets, millions of people on daily basis, thousands of academics and studies have done exactly that. If you see that sentence either the person saying it has spent the last year and half in a bunker isolated completely or they are an actual racist mad about being called a racist. The public discourse has been changing but the 'myth' was mostly true throughout 2015.
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Dec 21, 2016 22:51
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All reasonable people agree that people, whether they be citizens or asylum seekers, who pose a public threat should be prevented from going postal. All reasonable people also agree that you can't shoot those people to the Moon because they would die there, making us murderers. And if they are refugees who have left their homes and families to save their lives then we can't send them back to a place where they would die, for the same reason.
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Dec 21, 2016 22:57
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The police and authorities need some tools to deal with these guys though, because almost every single terrorist in europe was well known and a risk beforehand. And yet they slipped through the net. So if the answer is more money, stricter rules then hell yes do it. Doing nothing will end up destroying society.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:04
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Doctor Malaver posted:The public discourse has been changing but the 'myth' was mostly true throughout 2015. Nah. And neither was it in 2014, 2013, 2012, 2011, 2010, or any year before that.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:11
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Flowers For Algeria posted:Nah. it definitely was in sweden.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:13
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Wild Horses posted:it definitely was in sweden. Racists have never liked being called racist, and they have always whined about it. Hasn't ever stopped them from being racist and peddling their racist poo poo in the media, on the Internet, or anywhere, really. They're just extra annoying about it. EDIT: vvvvv You don't understand! People are mean to them and contradict them! That's an intolerable assault on their free speech!
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Dec 21, 2016 23:17
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Doctor Malaver posted:The public discourse has been changing but the 'myth' was mostly true throughout 2015. No, it was not and never has been. Anyone reading the news, considering it was the biggest single topic, would be able to grasp that a wide variety of opinions were aired then.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:17
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Flowers For Algeria posted:Racists have never liked being called racist, and they have always whined about it. http://www.expressen.se/nyheter/lofvens-kovandning-i-flyktingpolitiken/ there was a shift, but for a long time our very own populist party was the sole peddler of criticism against the asylum policy in sweden. Everyone who voiced critique found themselves in their camp, like it or not.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:21
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You can talk about the risks of the refugee crisis without criticising the asylum system.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:39
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Of course non-racist criticisms of immigration policy exist. Just for someone reason these right-wing people criticising immigration policy tend to not be arguing out of genuine concern for the immigrant.
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Dec 21, 2016 23:56
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Flowers For Algeria posted:Racists have never liked being called racist, and they have always whined about it. I'm guessing they'll still dislike it when they're in power and controlling the government, you'll have to let me know how that goes. Perhaps you should start calling them "deplorables," that was a successful tactic here in the US. MaxxBot fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Dec 22, 2016 |
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Dec 22, 2016 00:03
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MaxxBot posted:I'm guessing they'll still dislike it when they're in power and controlling the government, you'll have to let me know how that goes. One put a bullet in his own head in a bunker and the other took a bullet to the head from Communists.
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Dec 22, 2016 00:05
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Wait, I feel like this question wasn't really resolved. Can police now legally murder unarmed people in custody in France? This can't be loving serious, right? I'm pretty sure even in the Soviet Union you couldn't do that legally.
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Dec 22, 2016 00:07
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:Wait, I feel like this question wasn't really resolved. Can police now legally murder unarmed people in custody in France? Oh you were being serious. I thought you were making a joke because it happens all the time. Usually it's hand-waved away as "mistakes were made, lessons are learned." In this case it's just a guy in a uniform-beret going "merde 'appens"
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Dec 22, 2016 00:10
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Tesseraction posted:Oh you were being serious. I thought you were making a joke because it happens all the time. Unarmed people in police custody get shot to death all the time? 
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Dec 22, 2016 00:20
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:Unarmed people in police custody get shot to death all the time? More so in America. But we... We Are All America Now.
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Dec 22, 2016 00:22
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DarkCrawler posted:No, it was not and never has been. Anyone reading the news, considering it was the biggest single topic, would be able to grasp that a wide variety of opinions were aired then. Perhaps if you look at the entire spectrum but I'm talking about respectful (whatever that means these days), mainstream media.
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Dec 22, 2016 00:27
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GaussianCopula posted:They fought the law and the law won. So Greece releases Murder-Rapists to Germany and Italy Islamo-Fascists. If these failed states want their deficit guaranteed by Germany, they should stop biting the hand that feeds them, i.e. killing potential taxpayers.
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Dec 22, 2016 00:32
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