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red buff gives massive health regen which is the real reason its a nightmare when your jungler feeds the enemy laner his buffs
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Dec 24, 2016 07:03
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thanks yall, i'll clean up my pathing if i take him to the jungle again (iirc i got autofilled and had no idea what else to pick) i also took him mid last night against diana, who i ended up getting bullied out of lane by at 6 (she took CotC, so if i tried to trade with her past that point at all she'd chunk me for half my health and i'd do nothing to her). she was basically irrelevant lategame because she refused to group for fights and i could easily 1v1 her once i got a maw and edge of night, but i'm wondering what i could have done to not get hosed so hard midgame. she basically shoved me under my tower constantly and then went to kill my botlane (which we eventually just answered by having our kha group with me and take two mid towers) should i have just beaten the poo poo out of her harder early on? rushed hexdrinker first instead of dirk->hex? (i figured edge would be enough to survive her burst but she killed me through a null-magic mantle so i figured i should switch gears and get a hexdrinker)
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Dec 24, 2016 08:37
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Diana is a weird laner pre-6 because she only does moderate poke damage, but has no way to engage and constantly shoves the wave and is pretty dreadful at receiving ganks. She's easy pickings for enemy junglers, and struggles against ranged lane bullies (part of the reason she takes teleport is to compensate for that early weakness)
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Dec 24, 2016 08:42
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Diana has hard cc?
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Dec 24, 2016 08:46
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Tired Moritz posted:Diana has hard cc? E is knockup
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Dec 24, 2016 08:47
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yeah, by the time she had her E i basically couldn't win a trade anymore between her W and the CotC proc. i guess next time i'm against her i'll be a bit more patient and see if i can get a gank, and also maybe not pick an almost pure melee champ into her  also, replays being in-client and not crashing the client on startup is amazing e: well i figured out how i lost lane: i took an extended trade against a champ with a 3-hit passive before i hit 2 
Hashtag Yoloswag fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Dec 24, 2016 |
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Dec 24, 2016 08:57
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The match rating system has a personal vendetta against me.
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Dec 24, 2016 09:52
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Hashtag Yoloswag posted:
To be fair, the urge to outplay some early game bully hero and somehow win against someone with a free damage passive/resourceless spammable nuke/etc. Is omnipresent. It doesnt help that sometimes it pays off
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Dec 24, 2016 15:15
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What is it with whiny adc's these days - 2 games in a row they're bitching me out for 'KS' when im supporting (carrying) them. Not my fault Naut hits like a truck
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Dec 24, 2016 16:07
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el dingo posted:What is it with whiny adc's these days - 2 games in a row they're bitching me out for 'KS' when im supporting (carrying) them. Not my fault Naut hits like a truck Reply with 'You farm the minions, I farm the champions'
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Dec 24, 2016 16:10
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I've heard you can win the level 1 trade by taking one crit rune
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Dec 24, 2016 17:01
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Why would you steal my MMR jungle Twitch why would you be so mean to me
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Dec 24, 2016 18:17
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i pretty much just mute someone the instant they complain about KS.
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Dec 24, 2016 18:50
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KS stands for "kill secured."
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Dec 24, 2016 18:59
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I feel like the only time it is ever OK to complain about someone else taking a kill on purpose is if you are Draven with a ton of passive stacks. I was supporting a Draven who had like 180 something stacks of Adoration, and our jungler flashed to steal a kill Draven had on a dude who had no chance to escape (Ashe with no flash or heal sitting in a Morg binding). Draven gets pissed, jungler tells him he needed the gold to carry. I'm pretty sure the 0/1/5 Draven needs that extra gold more
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Dec 24, 2016 19:11
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Bitching about KSing was legit as prework veigar, where assists didnt get you AP. It's also worth bring up if say, allies are wasting fightwinning ults on an enemy about to die just to pump their KDR.
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Dec 24, 2016 20:01
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Imo if there really wasn't any reason to fire off that last button or auto then yeah it kind of is your job as a supp to not take the kill and it's reasonable for them to hit you with the question ping. Examples of this include stuff like vayne condemning someone into the wall and being a shot or two away from the kill. If the situation is even remotely iffy it's totally fine to accidentally secure it tho. Oh and lastly when someone is obviously hosed but someone wastes their good ult on it just for the kill thats obviously bad for the team, not really about ksing at that point but wastin cooldowns.
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Dec 24, 2016 20:18
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Yeah without context of seeing the plays it's kind of hard to say whether you're legit just being a bozo who could let the ADC take the gold but instead let the game auto-follow and auto-attack them and whatever or if you really had to secure the kills There are plenty of times I've been like "why" when a support just right clicks a free kill and then backs away from their keyboard and starts jerking off it's one of those small things that people can improve on that takes basically no effort to fix
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Dec 24, 2016 20:25
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i'm in a low enough elo where no kill is guaranteed until it has happened
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Dec 24, 2016 20:32
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Mystery Prize posted:I feel like the only time it is ever OK to complain about someone else taking a kill on purpose is if you are Draven with a ton of passive stacks. I was supporting a Draven who had like 180 something stacks of Adoration, and our jungler flashed to steal a kill Draven had on a dude who had no chance to escape (Ashe with no flash or heal sitting in a Morg binding). Draven gets pissed, jungler tells him he needed the gold to carry. I'm pretty sure the 0/1/5 Draven needs that extra gold more Deliberately stealing a kill is, generally, a dick move no matter what. However, 99% of the time somebody bitching about kill stealing is something where you didn't specifically mean to kill somebody but did. Things like Blitzcrank arcing lightning at the wrong moment or that Nautlius Q killing the target when it lands. Same with stuff like the Leona W *plaff* killing a target or whatever. It's like hey bro I wanted to give you the kill but the damage on my stun did it. When I'm trying to hammer somebody in place to make sure they die sometimes that kills them. Generally speaking it's better to just land the stun and accidentally kill the target than to risk them getting away. Granted these are the same people that will scream and yell if the support ever had >0 CS. It's like hey sometimes that Sona Q kills a minion. I still remember when the fancy new support items came out some ADCs would scream and yell if you actually used a relic shield. It's like shut the hell up dude you get the gold still.
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Dec 24, 2016 20:40
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In like almost every possible situation you aren't kill stealing and anyone who freaks out over it is really dumb. Exception generally is if they're supremely dead to rights and you Janna W or Nami healing wave on top of them or so on. Supports getting a kill or so on dead to rights people is one thing but after that you're negatively impacting your ADC
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Dec 24, 2016 20:40
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I ganked for a Trynd and got the last hit on the person we were ganking. I didn't see that he had ignite so I last hit him Trynd yells at me saying that he's behind now. As in behind the dude we just killed ...no you aren't?
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Dec 24, 2016 20:45
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I'm a scrub who doesn't know how to fight manaless champions, except I guess Garen who is usually easy for me for whatever reason. I'm a silver player who can get around 7 cs per minute in lane, and that's usually my ticket to winning games. I prioritize farming and I try to harass where I can, with the goal of eventually split pushing in the mid-game. It generally works, and against most champions even if I can't stay even with them I can at least not die and hold tower. But whether I'm being a lane bully like Kayle or Teemo, or a melee fighter like Illaoi or Maokai, I have no idea how to handle manaless champions. If they choose to be aggressive, even if they're otherwise terrible (bad cs, missing lots of skill shots, etc.), then I'm just done. I don't know what to do. A recent example is a match where I was Teemo vs Rumble, and we each had about 30 cs at 9 minutes. I have no idea why his cs was that low, because after a few attempts to harass or trade with him and nearly dying I gave up trying to fight him — but mine was that low because he was constantly trying to kill me. I could not get in range to auto or Q either him or a minion without him dumping his entire kit on me and nearly killing me. He succeeded a couple of times, even with me behind my tower. The entire lane phase for me was a frantic, panicked attempt to eke out any CS at all while avoiding being killed. I ended the game with only a single full item completed, and in addition to being unable to cs while in Rumble's presence much less fight him, I was also useless in split pushing or team fighting because I was so far behind on gold. And that's exemplary of most manaless matchups for me. By comparison it's so much easier for me to deal with champions that supposedly counter my picks, because at least versus them I can just sit back and farm while conserving my health and mana while they blow theirs trying to engage or shove. But with a manaless champion, they can just choose to never quit. They can just keep poking and keep shoving. And it feels like there's nothing I can do but hope my jungler saves me. There ought to be something I can do, but I don't know what. Thoughts?
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Dec 24, 2016 20:53
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kingcobweb posted:I ganked for a Trynd and got the last hit on the person we were ganking. I didn't see that he had ignite so I last hit him He might be depending on how the lane looks, given that he has ignite and the other guy is probably about to tp back to lane
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Dec 24, 2016 21:01
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Addamere posted:A recent example is a match where I was Teemo vs Rumble, and we each had about 30 cs at 9 minutes. I have no idea why his cs was that low, because after a few attempts to harass or trade with him and nearly dying I gave up trying to fight him — but mine was that low because he was constantly trying to kill me. I could not get in range to auto or Q either him or a minion without him dumping his entire kit on me and nearly killing me. He succeeded a couple of times, even with me behind my tower. The entire lane phase for me was a frantic, panicked attempt to eke out any CS at all while avoiding being killed. I ended the game with only a single full item completed, and in addition to being unable to cs while in Rumble's presence much less fight him, I was also useless in split pushing or team fighting because I was so far behind on gold. First off, Rumble is a Teemo counter in some ways. Not AA reliant, manaless shield on a low cooldown, spammable AoE damage so he's somewhat ranged, and can last hit with E if he needs to, and of course he's sticky as hell once he gets you with an E and ultimate. As a ranged champion you need to learn the windows for Rumble's cooldowns. There's no way you should have cs that low when you have Teemo's W, which can run him out of Flamespitter really fast. Go in and attack him as soon as the ability is ending and he has no way to attack you and push him to his tower. Beating those manaless champs is mostly just about understanding the cooldowns of their abilities and using those windows to force them to eat your rear end in a top hat or lose farm. Baiting those abilities as well is a huge part of winning, since if they use their Q or whatever and it gets them nothing, they have basically nothing left to fight with. Also you need to know what items to build. A hexdrinker is probably the best first thing to buy versus Rumble if you're Teemo. Rumble likes teamfighting in the jungle so you need to force him to come to you by splitting top. At level 1 you hide in the bush and wait for him to use Flamespitter and then go loving wild on his rear end for a few seconds of free damage and then start lane as normal, but he'll have to use hit pots. Also Rumble naturally pushes so spam ping your jungler when he's overextended https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgoWWKL06Ks Teikanmi fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Dec 24, 2016 |
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Dec 24, 2016 21:09
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Like a day or so ago the bard supp got super fed and ended the game like 9/2/8 bitching at his team because we beat them. At the end of the day i think their team mighta won if those 9 kills were on carries but they ended up kinda stalling out once we scaled a bit.
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Dec 24, 2016 21:11
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Addamere posted:manaless champ stuff i think manaless champions is a little too broad, you just need to learn power spikes of every champion you're having trouble with and get an idea of how to play around that. ie: rumble is going to outscale teemo every game if you give him enough time. also as was written above: rumble never really gets bullied by teemo. stump collector fucked around with this message at 21:18 on Dec 24, 2016 |
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Dec 24, 2016 21:12
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kingcobweb posted:I ganked for a Trynd and got the last hit on the person we were ganking. I didn't see that he had ignite so I last hit him I know you're just going to change the narrative so it fits you but there are a lot of situations where he's hosed now. If that was early, he probably needed that lvl 2 first blood to justify his ignite. Who knows maybe that was the first time all game you went top?!
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Dec 24, 2016 22:27
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It was first gank of the game at level two. He was tp vs teleport, yes. But the extra gold I got instead of him isn't going to swing the game against him. The opposing dead champion lost a ton of XP because we shoved the wave in No he was not behind
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Dec 24, 2016 23:30
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Eh ignite Trynd does kinda need to win lane THAT hard to be useful. Not getting FB doesn't mean you're going to lose the game, but it does pretty much mean you aren't going to have any fun.
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Dec 24, 2016 23:40
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Hell I got this guy 150g and then took a wave and made him split two waves of xp, whats the issue here.
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Dec 24, 2016 23:43
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Ah yes!! Finally. After years of being neglected by my jungler... the fabled Gank. All of my fortunes will be reversed *the jungler gets the last hit instead of the laner* My soul has been cursed for eternity. There is no escape
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Dec 24, 2016 23:52
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junglers (either team) are the natural enemy of top laners and this tradition must be respected
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Dec 25, 2016 00:05
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You guys shouldn't trip over yourselves to do that weird ironic style of posting, in my humblest of opinions.
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Dec 25, 2016 00:13
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Servaetes posted:You guys shouldn't trip over yourselves to do that weird ironic style of posting, in my humblest of opinions.
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Dec 25, 2016 00:15
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Lovechop posted:junglers (either team) are the natural enemy of top laners and this tradition must be respected hashinshin himself couldnt have said it better
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Dec 25, 2016 00:26
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Lovechop posted:junglers (either team) are the natural enemy of top laners and this tradition must be respected I want to kick their asses
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Dec 25, 2016 00:26
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Palette cleanser https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvlqQCDGiag
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Dec 25, 2016 00:31
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Servaetes posted:Palette cleanser Nice, unlike the posters who wont stop saying jokes, this joke has the funny dog meme at the end so you know when it's safe to laugh. Thank You.
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Dec 25, 2016 00:44
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Flex queue is weird and dumb. Why/how did I just get a Silver 4 adc on my team when I'm currently Plat 3? The dude was unranked last season too, so it's not like his MMR is really high.
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Dec 25, 2016 00:45
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