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Okay, since Mt. Weather having more missiles was a plot point in S3, is there a reason given as to why they didn't use them against the army before the acid fog was shut down or threaten the capital at any time?
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Dec 24, 2016 23:39
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Lycus posted:Okay, since Mt. Weather having more missiles was a plot point in S3, is there a reason given as to why they didn't use them against the army before the acid fog was shut down or threaten the capital at any time? I'll venture a guess and say that maybe the army were too close and they couldnt risk it.
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Dec 24, 2016 23:53
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We also don't know how many more missiles they had, and refilling the acid fog tanks is easier than manufacturing missiles.
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Dec 24, 2016 23:54
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enraged_camel posted:It sounds like you weren't paying attention. Mt. Weather had a lot of Grounder prisoners, who would undoubtedly be executed in the event of invasion. Mt. Weather simply made a secret pact with Lexa and told her to back off in return for keeping those people alive. And Lexa took it because as a leader, she wanted to do what was best for her people, even if that meant betraying Clarke. Ya except Lexa made that huge speech about vengeance and poo poo at the start of the day. Unless she just forgot they had all those prisoners??? Also clearly it's better to leave the MM alive because they would never go back on their word and start attacking you again, now with radiation immunity! All the ghost leaders wept at her decision.
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Dec 25, 2016 01:00
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There's also the fact that grounders aren't people, who really cares what happens to them?
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Dec 25, 2016 02:21
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:Ya except Lexa made that huge speech about vengeance and poo poo at the start of the day. Unless she just forgot they had all those prisoners??? Yeah. And probably they woulndt even have time to execute all those prisoners. And even if they could kill them all, previously Lexa sacrificed and entire village she could have saved so to not compromise this very plan, because beating the MM was so important The gate was open, the army was ready, they had Bellamy and co. free inside, all they had to do was to rush in and finish the MM, the very dangerous and evil guys who had been killing, slaving, and harvesting then for blood for decades, and had missiles and weapons of mass destruction. And instead of just finishing them for good, when she had the enemies on her hand, she choose back out. Very smart indeed Elias_Maluco fucked around with this message at 14:05 on Dec 25, 2016 |
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Dec 25, 2016 13:54
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Lexa has a robo chip in her brain and it was giving her brainproblems
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Dec 25, 2016 14:03
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Elias_Maluco posted:yeah, except she does not seems to have that at all? The plan against Mount Weather was Clarke, the grounders didn't even understand what the mountain men were before the ark people came On the other hand, she was the only one who could move past tribal "blood must have blood" politics, and was able to keep the coalition going through quite a bit of crap.
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Dec 25, 2016 14:20
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The tribal politics seems to have been an unintended outcome by Becca. Despite having the ability to pass on memories and knowledge to each successive Commander, their society became very primitive very fast, and I'm not sure what the benefit was.
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Dec 25, 2016 14:31
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I honestly wonder if a lot of that was on purpose, really. To keep the society from making the same technological mistakes that led to ALIE nuking the planet. Granted I just think this to myself mostly to explain how the grounders could forget modern society in 97 or so years.
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Dec 25, 2016 14:42
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Astroman posted:The tribal politics seems to have been an unintended outcome by Becca. Despite having the ability to pass on memories and knowledge to each successive Commander, their society became very primitive very fast, and I'm not sure what the benefit was. Running anything above tribal level requires a lot of societal support. The grounders are supporting a large military caste which requires a lot of support, like farmers, craftsmen and what not. Also tends to require keeping the lower castes subjugated, as who wants to be a serf?
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Dec 25, 2016 14:43
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Lycus posted:Okay, since Mt. Weather having more missiles was a plot point in S3, is there a reason given as to why they didn't use them against the army before the acid fog was shut down or threaten the capital at any time? Judging by the destruction wrought on TonDC, the missiles almost certainly have conventional warheads, so you'd need to fire off a lot of them to do significant damage against an army of that size. Especially if the army deliberately spread out specifically to limit the amount of damage that missiles or artillery could do to them. As for threatening Polis, maybe they did do that and that was one of the reasons that Lexa took the deal. CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:Also clearly it's better to leave the MM alive because they would never go back on their word and start attacking you again, now with radiation immunity! All the ghost leaders wept at her decision. The MM would have to be colossal idiots to start a war with people who have to outnumber them at least 100 to 1* right after they've solved both their "can't go outside" and "need Grounder blood to survive" problems. And it's not like the Grounders have anything that the MM really want. The resources of MW are clearly capable of meeting all of their material needs, the fact that the Reapers were only used for jobs that MM couldn't do indicates that they don't have a large demand for unskilled slave labor, and considering that there are less than 400 of them, the territory surrounding MW that the Grounders already let them have should give them way more lebensraum than they'll need for a long time to come. If the MM ever did come into conflict with the Grounders, it would probably look more like the Spanish conquest of the Aztecs and Incas than the English/American colonization of North America: the MM would ally with a group of Grounders that wasn't a fan of the current power structure (the Ice Nation is a very likely candidate) and help them take over in exchange for whatever the MM were after. However even there there would be significant differences, because without plagues to devastate the native population** or further waves of colonists to replace them, the equivalent of the Tlaxcalans would ultimately end up running the place. So it might not be such a bad idea for Lexa to step into that role at the start. * There were 382 MM before a bunch of them died on Level 5, in the acid fog explosion, etc. Meanwhile, if the nearby Grounders have a population density of even 1 person per square mile, then there are more than 40,000 Grounders just in the former territory of Virginia. Considering the size of Polis and the various Grounder armies, and considering how in pre-industrial societies you need ~9 food producers for every non-food producing specialist, that's probably a low-end estimate. ** Nobody knows about Nukepocalypse 2.0 at this point. Elias_Maluco posted:Yeah. And probably they woulndt even have time to execute all those prisoners. And even if they could kill them all, previously Lexa sacrificed and entire village she could have saved so to not compromise this very plan, because beating the MM was so important I think you're greatly overestimating how easy it is to assault a fortified bunker defended by people with modern firearms and explosives who have literally spent their entire lives inside that bunker with a force consisting of several thousand warriors who are scared of guns plus maybe a few dozen space cops. The writers actually originally scripted a scene where the Grounder+Arker army gets the door open only to be met by two .50 caliber machine gun turrets that proceed to slaughter wave after wave WWI-style. Then Lexa decides to take the deal. Unfortunately they didn't have the budget to film that. However, I totally agree with this: CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:Ya except Lexa made that huge speech about vengeance and poo poo at the start of the day. It isn't hard to come up with good reasons why Lexa might have wanted to take the deal, but it is still awful writing to have a character make a complete 180 like this offscreen without even an attempt at an explanation. Even if they didn't have the money to film the aforementioned machine gun scene, they could have made this a lot better by simply having Clarke ask Lexa, "Why are you doing this?" And then having Lexa explain her reasons for doing it. But they never do that, not even in Season 3 when they have absolutely no time pressure. EDIT: As a side note, does anyone else find it hilarious how the whole Nukepocalypse 2.0 thing retroactively makes Season 2 totally pointless? If the Mountain Men had won, they would have gotten the chance to live on the surface for nine months, at best, before they would have had to go back into their "concrete coffin" for who knows how long. INH5 fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Dec 25, 2016 |
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Dec 25, 2016 16:05
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INH5 posted:I think you're greatly overestimating how easy it is to assault a fortified bunker defended by people with modern firearms and explosives who have literally spent their entire lives inside that bunker with a force consisting of several thousand warriors who are scared of guns plus maybe a few dozen space cops. The writers actually originally scripted a scene where the Grounder+Arker army gets the door open only to be met by two .50 caliber machine gun turrets that proceed to slaughter wave after wave WWI-style. Then Lexa decides to take the deal. Unfortunately they didn't have the budget to film that. Yes, but that's why it would make sense that she would take her chances even if they had machine guns waiting for them inside, because anyway they had am excellent opportunity and would not have it again anytime soon. I mean, the MM have been their plague, their oppressors, their biggest problem for a lot of time, decades. And they have been real monsters, really evil. And then, for the first time, the grounders actually have chance to end it all, to beat them, exterminate that danger. And they were so close: the army was at the gate, the gate was bust, they had a guy inside wreaking havoc, and another team ready to infiltrate from the tunnel door. They never been so close, and realistically, they would never be on that same position again anytime soon. And she chooses to take a deal and go home That was so dumb and coward that even her own people wanst happy about it,. and Clarke became the legendary "wanheada" because she finished the job But anyway, my point was: the commander is supposed to be helped by this A.I inside her head, and all previous commanders, who are there too. But we dont see that, it does not seems to make any real difference. They act like completely dumb clueless primitive morons, and the MM would still be oppressing and controlling them if wanst for the Ark kids, the same ones the grounders were trying to exterminate from the very begging for... reasons Elias_Maluco fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Dec 25, 2016 |
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Dec 25, 2016 22:16
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A motley bunch of former commanders in the finale would've so much more fun and interesting than just Lexa.
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Dec 25, 2016 22:21
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Also: Clarke gets the bad rep, but Bellamy is so much worst Yes, she was responsible for a lot of deaths. But Bellamy is guilty of even more. He is as guilty as Clarke of the Mount Weather massacre (something people seems to forget all the time. It took ALIE possesed Raven to say it out loud for the first time), but he is also guilty of the 300 killed at the Ark and of the 300 killed by Pike and himself. And the MW deaths were unavoidable, but the Ark sacrifice and the friendly army butchered were both pointless and avoidable, if Bellamy wanst so dumb and selfish Elias_Maluco fucked around with this message at 22:46 on Dec 25, 2016 |
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Dec 25, 2016 22:37
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Clarke and Bellamy did nothing wrong. If you're watching this for 'the story' and not teenage dipshits rocking hitler-stalin killcounts, you're watching the wrong loving show.
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Dec 25, 2016 22:59
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jfood posted:Clarke and Bellamy did nothing wrong. I totally agree about Clarke Its only that Bellamy was such a huge shithead in season 3 that Im still loving mad at him. Octavia should have stabbed him too
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Dec 26, 2016 00:34
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INH5 posted:Judging by the destruction wrought on TonDC...  --edit: INH5 posted:** Nobody knows about Nukepocalypse 2.0 at this point. Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Dec 26, 2016 |
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Dec 26, 2016 02:07
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Combat Pretzel posted:Can't wait to see them explain how all nuclear power plants on earth decided to throw a party after 97 years of idling happily ever after. And the party date just happens to be less than a year after the Arkers finally returned to Earth. Everyone in Arkadia should be very grateful to Finn and Raven, because if those two hadn't wasted 3 months of air with their illegal spacewalk, they would all be totally screwed, judging by how quickly things go to poo poo in the S4 trailer.
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Dec 26, 2016 04:14
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Combat Pretzel posted:Can't wait to see them explain how all nuclear power plants on earth decided to throw a party after 97 years of idling happily ever after. INH5 posted:And the party date just happens to be less than a year after the Arkers finally returned to Earth. The TV IV > The 100 (s3) - Death by Nitpicking
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Dec 26, 2016 05:01
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Combat Pretzel posted:Now that you spell it that way, I finally understand where the hell that Tond-C came from. It's already been leaked that it's Alie's last gently caress you for scuppering her plans. They have been filming back at her mansion for Season Four.
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Dec 26, 2016 12:33
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INH5 posted:And the party date just happens to be less than a year after the Arkers finally returned to Earth. PriorMarcus posted:It's already been leaked that it's Alie's last gently caress you for scuppering her plans. They have been filming back at her mansion for Season Four. --edit: I've been reading up on the spoilers a bit. Please don't be season finale nanotech cleaning up the atmosphere! Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Dec 26, 2016 |
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Dec 26, 2016 14:13
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Rewatching this with my girlfriend, and I totally forgot about the mutant dude they show when Octavia is poisoned. They literally do nothing with that afterwards  Going to try to videotape her reaction when Finn war crimes it up. 
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Dec 30, 2016 06:15
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Just finished season 3. Yeah losing Lexa and Lincoln sucked but I think the biggest casualty of season 3 was Jasper's personality. RIP man, the writers did you dirty. I think I'm just going to pretend ALIE made him lie to Monty about why he took the chip, since we never saw him take it onscreen. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it. My favorite characters are probably Murphy and Kane. Back in season 1 I never thought I would be saying that. Acacia REI fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Dec 30, 2016 |
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Dec 30, 2016 23:31
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Acacia REI posted:Just finished season 3. Yeah losing Lexa and Lincoln sucked but I think the biggest casualty of season 3 was Jasper's personality. RIP man, the writers did you dirty. I think I'm just going to pretend ALIE made him lie to Monty about why he took the chip, since we never saw him take it onscreen. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it. The biggest casualty was Bellamy character development
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Dec 30, 2016 23:35
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I stopped watching in season 2 and just read this thread/watched snippets of season 3. My biggest complaint about season 2/3 was how many grounders there were. I liked it a lot more when it seemed like there weren't many humans left on earth and there was less of the giant grounder clans.
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Dec 30, 2016 23:57
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Luvcow posted:I stopped watching in season 2 and just read this thread/watched snippets of season 3. My biggest complaint about season 2/3 was how many grounders there were. I liked it a lot more when it seemed like there weren't many humans left on earth and there was less of the giant grounder clans. My boyfriend commented that the show would be a lot better/more believable if it took place more than 97 years after the bombs fell. I don't disagree with him, but it didn't really bother me either. This is probably my second favorite apocalypse show, next to Colony. Acacia REI fucked around with this message at 00:03 on Dec 31, 2016 |
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Dec 31, 2016 00:01
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Acacia REI posted:My boyfriend commented that the show would be a lot better/more believable if it took place more than 97 years after the bombs fell. I don't disagree with him, but it didn't really bother me either. I love post apocalyptic shows/stories and obviously they've done something right here because there are still people watching and talking about it. For me season 1 and parts of season 2 were my favorite. For season 1 I was hoping for more of a "watch the 100 dwindle down to only a few as the people in space watch in horror" but I liked what they did anyways as far as killing people off out of left field and developing people like Jasper and Bellamy. Season 2's Mt. Weather storyline seemed pretty cool but again I just wished they'd done something more/different with the grounders. I think it's a missed opportunity not to delve more into the oral traditions/history of the grounders that made them more human/survivors than just tribal savages. End of season 2 and then 3 just lost me with thousands of grounders roaming the world etc. Especially all the axes and swords and things. Seems like it might have been better to show them with repurposed axes and tools rather than a society that somehow relearned the whole smelting and blacksmithing trades while losing most/all memory of the world before them.
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Dec 31, 2016 00:09
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Me too, I love apocalypse shows. I started this one because TWD just hasn't been doing much for me lately (though I am totally looking forward to the "All Out War" story arc for the second half of this season) and Colony doesn't come back until February. I think Into the Badlands came back on, but I just can't really get into that one. I watched the first season and it just didn't do it for me. I may give it another shot at some point though. Anyway yeah there are a lot of things in the Grounder society that don't make a whole lotta sense to me, like what you just mentioned, but there are so many other things that I enjoy about The 100 that I just kind of ignore it.
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Dec 31, 2016 00:22
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Yeah I gave up on the TWD thread when the several page rape apology derail happened. That and the constant whining and hating, seems like 70-80% of that thread is miserable people trying to spread their misery and try to out rear end in a top hat each other. Still watching it though, just not expecting as much from it. Into the badlands seemed interesting but I just forgot about it after a few episodes and never went back. Same with Colony. Not that I thought either of those shows were bad but there was so much other good tv this year and there's only so much free time.
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Dec 31, 2016 00:35
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Luvcow posted:Yeah I gave up on the TWD thread when the several page rape apology derail happened. That and the constant whining and hating, seems like 70-80% of that thread is miserable people trying to spread their misery and try to out rear end in a top hat each other. Still watching it though, just not expecting as much from it. That's pretty much why i stopped reading the thread too.. Its like, 10% ppl talking about the thread, and 90% people who have been hating the show since season 2 but keep hate watching it. Acacia REI posted:Me too, I love apocalypse shows. I started this one because TWD just hasn't been doing much for me lately (though I am totally looking forward to the "All Out War" story arc for the second half of this season) and Colony doesn't come back until February. I think Into the Badlands came back on, but I just can't really get into that one. I watched the first season and it just didn't do it for me. I may give it another shot at some point though. Have you both considered Z Nation? Its a super non-serious zombie show that's pretty enjoyable to watch. E:   <--- That old guy is named Doc
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Dec 31, 2016 01:13
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Luvcow posted:Yeah I gave up on the TWD thread when the several page rape apology derail happened. That and the constant whining and hating, seems like 70-80% of that thread is miserable people trying to spread their misery and try to out rear end in a top hat each other. Still watching it though, just not expecting as much from it. I think part of it, at least for me, is sometimes it's just easier to complain about the things I don't like in a show than talk about the things I do like. Like I freakin' love Colony but for some reason I feel like I never have much to contribute in discussion about it other than "ummmm... I really really like it?" With shows like TWD, there are definitely a lot of things that I love about it, but it's also chocked full of dumb poo poo that's fun to make fun of and for some reason that's just easier for me to talk about. With The 100, I can talk about the good and the bad about evenly. I love the pacing of action most of the time, and how dynamic most of the character development is. I never would have thought I'd like characters like Murphy and Kane so much (even Indra became way more likeable), nor did I expect I'd grow to resent others like Jasper and Octavia. And Jaha is just... something else altogether like WUT. And I really like how all the plots in S3 ended up converging; I thought it was well executed. On the other hand, I think it's really odd that the Grounders have no concept of what society was like before the bombs fell, despite the fact that some of them would have had grandparents that were alive back then. Also, like you said, there are so many of them even though it's been less than 100 years since the nuclear apocalypse.
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Dec 31, 2016 01:15
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Dalael posted:That's pretty much why i stopped reading the thread too.. Its like, 10% ppl talking about the thread, and 90% people who have been hating the show since season 2 but keep hate watching it. Yep! It's on my Netflix Queue and now that I'm done with The 100, it's next up on my "to watch" list. Also idk I still find all the self-loathing and shitposting in the TWD thread fairly entertaining. But that whole rape discussion was just... yikes. 
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Dec 31, 2016 01:20
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I'm gonna pop in and recommend 'Jericho' Small town in Kansas tries to survive a nuclear apocalypse. Surprisingly less gritty than you'd expect from the genre, but refreshing nonetheless.
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Dec 31, 2016 01:22
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Dalael posted:That's pretty much why i stopped reading the thread too.. Its like, 10% ppl talking about the thread, and 90% people who have been hating the show since season 2 but keep hate watching it. From what I saw of Z Nation I wasn't a fan but since there are zombies it's something I might try to watch again somewhere down the line. FELD1 posted:I'm gonna pop in and recommend 'Jericho' I loved season 1 but not so much of season 2. I thought it was a great concept and wish someone would try something like that again.
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Dec 31, 2016 01:36
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Acacia REI posted:On the other hand, I think it's really odd that the Grounders have no concept of what society was like before the bombs fell, despite the fact that some of them would have had grandparents that were alive back then. Also, like you said, there are so many of them even though it's been less than 100 years since the nuclear apocalypse. It's actually quite plausible.
There is a reason Einstein said that the fourth world war would most likely be fought with sticks and stones. He understood the fragile nature of society's technological state and the way a nuclear war would devastate most if not all of it. The show simply takes place in such a setting, and once you logically work through the most likely consequences of nuclear war you'll find it quite realistic.
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Dec 31, 2016 02:46
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Luvcow posted:From what I saw of Z Nation I wasn't a fan but since there are zombies it's something I might try to watch again somewhere down the line. You have to keep in mind, that Z Nation is a show that doesn't take itself seriously at all. Its a goofy show. If you were to compare Z Nation and TWD, I would say that TWD is more like Dawn of the dead, while Z Nation is closer to Shaun of the dead.
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Dec 31, 2016 11:44
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enraged_camel posted:It's actually quite plausible. I like when you make such good posts. I should strive to make those kind of posts too, but it sounds like 
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Dec 31, 2016 11:47
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I dont think is that absurd that they would forget modern society, but it is kinda strange that they so quickly developed that strange variation of feudalism they seems to be living under Also, the fact they all (on Earth and on space) developed radiation resistance so fast, was there ever a good explanation for that?
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Dec 31, 2016 12:36
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Elias_Maluco posted:I dont think is that absurd that they would forget modern society, but it is kinda strange that they so quickly developed that strange variation of feudalism they seems to be living under Their culture didn't develop organically. Becca Pramheda (the first Commander), and the AI chip inside her, had a significant influence on it. Becca's intent with the AI chip was to "reset" humanity such that they never make such mistakes as the nuclear war again, so it's likely that during her reign as the leader of the human survivors on Earth, she took steps to ensure whatever remnants of technology that remained were eradicated. quote:Also, the fact they all (on Earth and on space) developed radiation resistance so fast, was there ever a good explanation for that? Well, no. Then again, the entire premise is flawed. It's simply not possible to develop resistance to radiation the way one develops resistance to iocane powder.  That said, he numbers are kinda fun to work with in a back-of-the-napkin calculation. I may be somewhat drunk as I type this. In the episode where Becca first makes landfall near Polis in her escape pod, she gets out of the pod and looks at the Gieger counter on her suit, which shows the radiation levels at around 1200 mSv (it actually doesn't show units over time, but we can assume it was mSv/hour, as with most Gieger counters). This is considered quite unsafe, and would lead to severe radiation poisoning in less than two hours and death not long after that. The humans approaching Becca's pod are indeed wearing hazmat suits for this reason. Now, this was about 2 years after the war. We know that radioactivity decreases exponentially over time. According to the Seven Ten Rule, for each factor of seven increase in time, the radiation is reduced by a factor of ten, such that after 2 years, the radiation level would be 1/100,000th of the original level. If that amount is 1200 mSv/hour, that means after 14 years, surface radiation levels would be down to 120 mSv/hour, and after 98 years (around the time the show takes place), they would be down to 12 mSv/hour. This is still a really high amount. It means that after 4 hours of exposure to surface radiation, a naked Grounder would absorb ~50 mSv, which is the yearly limit for US radiation workers. The fact that they can survive prolonged exposure as depicted in the show, even with clothes on and living inside various huts and caves, means they must have developed some form of resistance. We know for a fact that they aren't totally immune to radiation. Many, maybe even most, of them have mutations. We also don't know the average life span. Without knowing those things, it's hard to say exactly how resistant Grounders are to radiation. As for the ones in space, at least according to the numbers shown above, space has less radiation than Earth's surface at the time of the show. Astronauts that go on six-month missions on the International Space Station are exposed to between 50 to 2,000 mSv over six months. Even at the high end, that's only 0.46 mSv/hour, which is a fraction of the 12 mSv/hour number above. So why is Sky Crew's blood more valuable to Mt. Weather people? No idea.  Then again, the show definitely takes a lot of liberties when it comes to radiation in general. The way Mt. Weather people start melting after brief exposure is just dumb, for instance. Radiation doesn't work that way!
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Dec 31, 2016 15:10
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