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NTRabbit posted:More launchers with fewer torpedoes makes for bigger gaps and easier torpedo beats, I vastly prefer quad and quint launchers to the torps on these steaming shitpile IJN DDs. They made a new line because nobody was playing them (because they were mediocre), and managed to split a mediocre line into two aggressively bad ones, and then add a German one that is superior in just about every way, I wonder how that's going to turn out for them. While I agree that the new line isn't exactly stellar, don't overestimate the German DDs. I'd say that their guns are still inferior to American and Russian DDs, while torpedoes are much better (at least until tier 6). They're also exceedingly big and easy to spot while not being that fast.
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Dec 29, 2016 12:44
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The only IJN dd currently worth a drat is the shima and only just barely. Every single one before that is worse than the german dd counterpart.
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Dec 29, 2016 12:53
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Cippalippus posted:While I agree that the new line isn't exactly stellar, don't overestimate the German DDs. I'd say that their guns are still inferior to American and Russian DDs, while torpedoes are much better (at least until tier 6). They're also exceedingly big and easy to spot while not being that fast. my Z-46 is only slightly easier to spot than my yugumo (.5km) while also being faster, better armed, better torpedoed, and cooler
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Dec 29, 2016 12:54
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Its advantages are marginal, compared to the other dds. It's good but it's not overpowered.
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Dec 29, 2016 15:38
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Rage grinding the Pensacola is going to ruin me  I know we went through this particular discussion yesterday, but after being deleted from full heath while bow own to a Bis and then losing ~80% of my health bow on to a Colorado there is nothing this ship can do when it's being shot at.
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Dec 29, 2016 16:07
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Cippalippus posted:Its advantages are marginal, compared to the other dds. It's good but it's not overpowered. Even NTRabbit isn't saying they're overpowered, just that they are yet another reason not to play IJN DDs.
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Dec 29, 2016 16:09
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There were already several reasons to stop playing IJN Dds...
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Dec 29, 2016 16:20
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Rage grinding the Pensacola is going to ruin me Unfortunately pensacola is CA-hard mode. It's already hard in squishy CAs, but it probably can't get any worse. Okay, you're probably stock, so it's actually the worst. No range, poo poo traverse and even lower HP. Once you get up to 100% unlock though, that traverse is like what, 16 seconds? Pretty absurd. Never go alone, stick to islands, and never be caught out in the open .. unless there are BBs fighting each other and you can get away with taking shots at them without them noticing. If you get seen by BBs, retreat to the nearest island, MLG ruddering along the way and pray to RNGesus that BB shell isn't going to hit you and overmatch you or plunge into your lovely deck followed by a citadel. Your guns become hilarious when you ambush people and unload salvos of nasty heavy AP into them. e: At least it's a T7 cruiser, so it will usually have favourable matchmaking. If you're uptiered, then, well, eh.. good luck. Iceshade fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 16:23
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Per arishtat, here is the full skill tree list: http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/109557-060-public-test/page__pid__2675972#entry2675972 One thing I noticed that wasn't in the original leak was that fire prevention also drops your max fires to 3 instead of 4. That isn't a big deal if you are playing intelligently though. But speaking of fires, I wonder how effective heap shells might be on the dunk. The fire penalty won't be enough to stop it from setting all the fires due to the large fire chance its he shells already have. Though, I guess it isn't a big deal on her since a lot of players like to broadside it.
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Dec 29, 2016 16:30
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Rage grinding the Pensacola is going to ruin me Islands and patience are your friend. I like to get behind islands close to the cap and just wait for the fight to develop. Once everyone seems to be good and engaged with friendly battleships, I come out and wreck things. It doesn't always work, but I'd say--anecdotally--that 80% of the time pubbies do not change targets once they start shooting, unless their target literally becomes impossible to shoot. At least at close range that is. Edit So someone tell me how to play the Atago. I seem to be just "meh" in it. Not terrible, but not great. I don't have a 15pt captain for her, but I feel like this shouldn't matter. ZombieLenin fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 16:42
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Iceshade posted:Unfortunately pensacola is CA-hard mode. It's already hard in squishy CAs, but it probably can't get any worse. Okay, you're probably stock, so it's actually the worst. No range, poo poo traverse and even lower HP. Once you get up to 100% unlock though, that traverse is like what, 16 seconds? Pretty absurd. Free xp'ed the hull and range mods because lol gently caress that. It's only been 6-8 games, but I've been also grinding up the USSR and KM line and christ those things feel like BBs compared to the Pensa. Just checked the win rate and it's bottom basement for nearly every performance stat. On the upside the few games I've made it work it's done reasonably well and I know if I can get it to work that's only going to help all my other CA play. I know for a fact the time in the Cleveland has caused significant improvements in the Budy and Konigsberg. Edit: Cheers ZL as well ^^^ 
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Dec 29, 2016 16:48
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E Equals MC Hammer posted:The only IJN dd currently worth a drat is the shima and only just barely. Every single one before that is worse than the german dd counterpart. My Akizuku wants to disagree 
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Dec 29, 2016 17:18
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ZombieLenin posted:
Your ideal engagement range is anything past 10km as this affords you the opportunity to stop firing and stealth up which makes it hard for battleships to keep track of you while your great shell speed an accuracy allow you to reliably hit even DDs. Your torpedoes are amazing, don't risk broadsides to get them off unless you're sure you won't get shot for it but at the same time launch them any time you think you might be able to get a hit. I'd estimate almost half of my torpedo hits are from me just firing them at where I think an enemy might roll up soon. I might try to record some games in it because while I do really well in the ship, I'm not good at vocalizing exactly what I'm doing. EDIT: Just to confirm: a 15 point captain + flags do help but they are by no means mandatory. I've been smurfing it up on my younger brother's account to help him grind out the ARP mission since he wants the boats but doesn't have the time and I've still been pulling solid numbers in the atago with what started as a 3 point (now 11 point) captain and pretty much no flags. Astroniomix fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 17:23
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Free xp'ed the hull and range mods because lol gently caress that. It's only been 6-8 games, but I've been also grinding up the USSR and KM line and christ those things feel like BBs compared to the Pensa. Just checked the win rate and it's bottom basement for nearly every performance stat. On the upside the few games I've made it work it's done reasonably well and I know if I can get it to work that's only going to help all my other CA play. I know for a fact the time in the Cleveland has caused significant improvements in the Budy and Konigsberg. I got an Indianapolis from a santa box and I can see that I have no interest in that line. Being able to hit hard is nice and all, but they are spotted too easily and can't take a hit. Its amazing how enjoyable the Fiji/Belfast are compared to other cruiser lines simply because you have real defensive options. I still think the developers need to take a look at cruisers and find something to do with their survivability. Stealth firing isn't the best solution, nor is giving everything smoke. Only thing I've really thought of is reducing the damage of citadel hits from 12"+ guns. A citadel hit would still do a ton of damage, just not the huge 10k+ hits they do now.
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Dec 29, 2016 17:29
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Oh god demolition expert will now effect secondaries at 2% fire chance per shell, hory sheeetttttttt.
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Dec 29, 2016 17:31
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So uh, what will be the point of Inertia Fuzes again? Why use slightly penetrating HE instead of AP.
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Dec 29, 2016 17:40
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E Equals MC Hammer posted:So uh, what will be the point of Inertia Fuzes again? Why use slightly penetrating HE instead of AP. I want to Citadel a minotaur with 18in HE.
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Dec 29, 2016 17:46
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Astroniomix posted:I want to Citadel a minotaur with 18in HE. So you can do less damage?
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Dec 29, 2016 17:52
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I guess there is a minor case to be made that when you are firing AP at something that is guaranteed to be an overpen. So maybe like a warspite shooting at a really close omaha? Swap to HE and you won't get 8 overpens?
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Dec 29, 2016 17:57
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E Equals MC Hammer posted:So you can do less damage? I think I have had a Yamato AP shell detonate inside a minotaur exactly once. 99% of the time it just overpens.
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Dec 29, 2016 17:59
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Yeah, I'm pretty sure you can overpen citadels on some ships with AP.
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Dec 29, 2016 18:03
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Vengarr posted:Yeah, I'm pretty sure you can overpen citadels on some ships with AP. At one point I know WG was considering making this a special overpen that does 25% damage instead of 10%, but I dont think they ever did that. Did they nerf boxes? Been on a bad dry streak and not even the flamu video helped
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Dec 29, 2016 18:11
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Lakedaimon posted:At one point I know WG was considering making this a special overpen that does 25% damage instead of 10%, but I dont think they ever did that.
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Dec 29, 2016 18:19
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Is there a link to the new skill tree? Without having the test client or w/e installed that is.
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Dec 29, 2016 18:28
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Uh, the new detection skill is lame. Lame as gently caress. WG is really downplaying it, saying it's highly situational. http://imgur.com/a/BzLOl You can see it in action there. The curved line pretty accurately indicates the closest ship, all across the map. Sure, there is no speed indication, no distance, etc .. but nothing can sneak up on you like this. The downside is the 4pt investment, and the constant-in-your-face thing on the screen. I'm sure mods will make that curve smaller though, so it's not as obnoxious.
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Dec 29, 2016 18:29
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I'd like to know how people manage to get 4-6 citadels a game. I can mabye get one every few games and that's if I'm a BB shooting a cruiser 
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Dec 29, 2016 18:46
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if they insist on adding it why not have it become a rechargeable skill, like one use every 5 five minutes or something. having constant magic boat detection is just dumb as hell
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Dec 29, 2016 18:47
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Sun Wu Kampf posted:I'd like to know how people manage to get 4-6 citadels a game. I can mabye get one every few games and that's if I'm a BB shooting a cruiser Git gud scrub. Seriously though picking targets and being able to hit them amidships is the key here. Something that I cannot do as well. EDIT: Where you at eurogoons? Lady Morgaga fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 18:53
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Sun Wu Kampf posted:I'd like to know how people manage to get 4-6 citadels a game. I can mabye get one every few games and that's if I'm a BB shooting a cruiser Be close and shoot low. Aim for your shells to land between the turrets. With a BB I can usually get 2 to 3 a game 5+ on a good game or a really good dispersion roll. With CAs can usually get a few here and there ~8km or so. Think I got a few with the Mahan yesterday when a Cleveland sailed broadside at 5km.
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Dec 29, 2016 18:56
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Iceshade posted:Uh, the new detection skill is lame. Lame as gently caress. WG is really downplaying it, saying it's highly situational. This isn't lame, especially for games where you have to hide to win/are trying to win as a solo warrior. poo poo won't matter early on with multiple enemies but here is an example: The new German DD uses smoke and hydro to spot you out of smoke. Now you know where to torp in the smoke. Or another: you are chasing an enemy and note the aura is pointing through the island. Time to turn around to avoid an ambush. How about this: you are a in an Atago trying to sneak up on a cruiser for a devestating hit late in the game. He charges in knowing he is spotted from your direction, and in so doing angles against you. Edit: beep boop I am unable to read sarcasm. Blindeye fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 19:00
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What are the other 4 point skills that we'd be giving up for magic ship detection?
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Dec 29, 2016 19:08
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Blindeye posted:This isn't lame, especially for games where you have to hide to win/are trying to win as a solo warrior. poo poo won't matter early on with multiple enemies but here is an example: I think you need to re-read his post.
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Dec 29, 2016 19:09
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Gwaihir posted:Is there a link to the new skill tree? Without having the test client or w/e installed that is. JuffoWup posted:Per arishtat, here is the full skill tree list: Elsewhere: Ice Fist posted:What are the other 4 point skills that we'd be giving up for magic ship detection? HEAP shells, manual secondaries, suvivability expert, aft, manual aa, concealment expert, and air supremacy. However, one must remember you aren't giving it up though. You top out at t4 now instead of t5 in live. Yet, your captain can still get to level 19. Thus, the 3x t4 skills used on russian DDs is going to be a thing in every ship really. Edit: just flipped to flamuu's twitch stream and he is testing around on the test server currently. Just took an attempt at that centerline catapult fighter skill. IE, 2 fighters per launch thing. It basically launches a second plane without the consumable cost (so still 1 charge for 2 planes). They are launched independently and flies counter orbit to each other. Basically giving you free long term hydro until they are shot down. JuffoWup fucked around with this message at 19:35 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 19:18
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If you don't feel like looking at the link, please note that skills were moved around, in addition to new ones being added. Basic Firing Training is now a 3-point skill, rather than a 1-point one. In fact, I'm somewhat ehhh on most of the 1-point skills now, though there are some at least theoretically interesting ones. 1-point options: -Priority Target: Get an indicator showing just how many enemy ships are currently aiming at you with their main batteries (by which I assume it means how many ships have you selected). Interesting, but most decent captains can figure this out relatively well on their own anyways. -Preventive Maintenance: -30% to incapacitation of modules. Likely useful on battleships, but I don't generally find this to be a huge issue on cruisers, and destroyers will probably still be getting them knocked out left and right when under fire, given how little the supposed -20% reduction modules already seem to do. Previously a T5 skill, which shows just how "useful" it was considered. -Expert Loader: Exact same effect and position. If you liked it before it's still there, if you didn't then nothing has changed. -Direction Center for Catapult Aircraft: Now here's the interesting one that I'll be trying on my cruisers and battleships. +1 catapult aircraft launched, with a -20% reduction in their speed. I've never found their speed to be particularly relevant, so putting multiple seaplane fighters in the air seems like a pretty decent benefit, at least compared to most other stuff at this tier now. -Dogfighting Expert: Exact same as before, but moved down to a 1-point skill. Fucks over Saipans, and that's about it. Still mostly worthless for any other CV tier. -Incoming Fire Alert: Exact same as before, moved down to a 1-point skill. Still basically completely worthless - and Priority Target basically does this better anyways, if you still want it for some reason. -Evasive Maneuver: Several buffs to carrier aircraft when they're returning to the CV, in exchange for a speed reduction at the same time (-40% detection, +15% ~HP~, -20% speed). I'm not sold on it, as I'd generally rather have my squadrons back faster to launch again instead of possibly getting more planes back eventually, but some might like it. It also only applies to strike aircraft, not fighters. All-in-all, not terribly impressed with the 1-point skills. Battleships and cruisers can benefit from Preventive Maintenance and Direction Center, but nothing really for destroyers or carriers. Destroyers will probably take Preventive Maintenance simply for lack of anything better, but they get modules knocked out so frequently already I'm not sure how much it will really help. Carriers may try Evasive Maneuver, but it doesn't look particularly good for me, at least outside of extremely limited hangar bay space through T6. Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 19:49
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Yeah, the 1pt skills look like rear end. I'll probably just take double fighters for all my ships except Bismarck and such ships.
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Dec 29, 2016 19:57
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Previous to the Atlanta, my son is playing up an aircraft carrier and he's going to start with the Langley. What is a good cruiser I can play to support him and fend off planes and just play support cruiser for him? I'll switch to the Atlanta once he tiers up a few.
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Dec 29, 2016 20:51
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I'm very dubious on the HEAP skill (or rather, Inertia Fuse for HE Shells) now, in several respects. I believe the +25% penetration of HE shells is the same as previously thought, but the flat -6% reduction barely affects battleships while making it extremely dubious for everyone else. And it is a true -6% reduction, as opposed to the moronic way Fire Prevention still works. This makes it much more viable on battleships, since they're not seeing nearly as much of a reduction in fire chance, and very dubious on light cruisers/destroyers, who instead of looking at a heavily cut chance, no have basically no chance of ever setting a fire with the skill. Hell, it actually is 0% with US destroyers/Akizuki. Who the gently caress decided on this change? Especially since Demolition Expert was buffed for BBs/nerfed for everyone else too. I'm going to try it with Akizuki on the test server when I get a chance, but I'm extremely suspicious of it actually being better than simply blanketing someone with HE and eventually getting a fire, along with occasional damage from the shell itself. Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Dec 29, 2016 |
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Dec 29, 2016 20:54
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Bitter Beard posted:Previous to the Atlanta, my son is playing up an aircraft carrier and he's going to start with the Langley. What is a good cruiser I can play to support him and fend off planes and just play support cruiser for him? I'll switch to the Atlanta once he tiers up a few. I would say either us or german cruisers. While shooting planes is one thing, I would also add that with those two lines focus on good radar and hydro, they make good choice to defend and aircraft's other evil. Destroyers.
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Dec 29, 2016 20:57
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Starting with Japanese CVs would definitely be better, btw, since although the Langley is good, the US line is relative crap in comparison until it reaches much higher tiers. (Outside of going P2W with Saipan.) At that tier though, none of the cruisers are really AA standouts. There's the quite rare Yubari, which is the only thing at T4 with defensive fire, but otherwise there's really just not much AA to go around. So anything you pick is a solid bet. The only low tier cruiser line I would absolutely stay away from is the Germans. None of them really compare well to their same tier competition.
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Dec 29, 2016 20:58
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JuffoWup posted:Per arishtat, here is the full skill tree list:
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Dec 29, 2016 20:59
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