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we got iraq 2005 without even having to invade!
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Dec 31, 2016 17:04
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the paradigm shift posted:I'm sure the people killed in his torture dungeons believe it would be a worse place without him So I guess you have a faction you'd rather empower than Assad? Stability should be the goal
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Dec 31, 2016 17:05
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I am wondering about something. Since chambers of commerce are essentially unions/lobbyists for business owners, could a law be passed that allowed all businesses to get the benefits of the chamber but without having to pay to be a member? It could be called a right to own law and it could similar to a right to work law.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:06
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NewForumSoftware posted:So I guess you have a faction you'd rather empower than Assad? Why should I choose who gets empowered? That's up to the people of Syria once they can get some semblance of security. Which won't happen so long as Assad has power. What the hell do you see as stable in this environment? Assad is not stability. It's mass murder. the paradigm shift fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Dec 31, 2016 |
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Dec 31, 2016 17:08
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the paradigm shift posted:Why should I choose who gets empowered? That's up to the people of Syria once they can get some semblance of security. Which won't happen so long as Assad has power. And what if the people of Syria choose Assad? Or a islamist group like in Egypt?
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Dec 31, 2016 17:08
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Bizarro Kanyon posted:I am wondering about something. do you think only paying members get the benefits of what chambers lobby for
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Dec 31, 2016 17:09
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remember when the people of palestine chose hamas lol
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Dec 31, 2016 17:10
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Badger of Basra posted:remember when the people of palestine chose hamas pepperidge farm remembers
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Dec 31, 2016 17:11
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NewForumSoftware posted:And what if the people of Syria choose Assad? Ok? This doesn't change that stability starts with Assad gone. Obviously they won't choose him or this war would be over. Islaaaaaaamiiiiiistssss hisses the westerner
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Dec 31, 2016 17:13
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FactsAreUseless posted:Because America wanted this. This. Our president is a legit anime villain. In other news, visiting family for the holidays, Fox news was on. Not my choice. There's a Russian apologist on saying something to the effect of, "if Russia really wanted to mess with or election, is this the best they could do? So obviously it's all lies made up by sore loser liberals." No one called him on his bs, the just accepted it. 
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Dec 31, 2016 17:14
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Badger of Basra posted:do you think only paying members get the benefits of what chambers lobby for No, but that is in the same manner that non-union workers (or just workers in general) benefit from union negotiations since it can help boost wages and benefits for all.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:14
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the paradigm shift posted:Ok? This doesn't change that stability starts with Assad gone. Obviously they won't choose him or this war would be over. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/13/world/middleeast/syria-aleppo-civilians.html the paradigm shift posted:Islaaaaaaamiiiiiistssss hisses the westerner The Egyptian military seems to agree
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Dec 31, 2016 17:14
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Bizarro Kanyon posted:No, but that is in the same manner that non-union workers (or just workers in general) benefit from union negotiations since it can help boost wages and benefits for all. exactly, so the thing you just posted about already exists
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Dec 31, 2016 17:16
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NewForumSoftware posted:http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/13/world/middleeast/syria-aleppo-civilians.html Can't read times articles until tomorrow but I think that's the one saying the civil war is over now that they captured Aleppo. Did you not see the protests already going on waving the rebellion flags? We'll see about Egypt in another year because their stability is very much surface deep right now.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:22
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the paradigm shift posted:Can't read times articles until tomorrow but I think that's the one saying the civil war is over now that they captured Aleppo. Did you not see the protests already going on waving the rebellion flags? So your claim is as long as there are protests Assad's rule isn't legitimate. What a strange place to put your bar for approval.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:23
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NewForumSoftware posted:So your claim is as long as there are protests Assad's rule isn't legitimate. What a strange place to put your bar for approval. No my claim is that if Assad was palatable to a wide portion of the Syrian people he wouldn't have needed to starve and bomb his people into submission. Why are you defending a mass murdering dictator?
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Dec 31, 2016 17:27
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NewForumSoftware posted:Stability should be the goal
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Dec 31, 2016 17:28
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the paradigm shift posted:No my claim is that if Assad was palatable to a wide portion of the Syrian people he wouldn't have needed to starve and bomb his people into submission. Because Syrians would be suffering less if we had just swallowed our own pride and kept him in power until ISIS(again, an American creation) was no longer bordering them instead of pretending like human rights violations give us the right to back our own human rights violators. Alhazred posted:That's not a great argument for Assad considering the civil war happened on his watch. It's the best of the collection of bad options unfortunately.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:30
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NewForumSoftware posted:
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Dec 31, 2016 17:34
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Alhazred posted:That's not a great argument for Assad considering the civil war happened on his watch. Guess the South shall rise again for stability's sake.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:34
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Alhazred posted:Because the Syrians have now forgiven Assad and promised to never ever raise up in arms against him? If you have a better idea, please share. The world would like to hear it.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:35
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Simultaneously attacking the american foreign policy consensus and supporting Kissinger's idea of legitimate stability
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Dec 31, 2016 17:36
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the paradigm shift posted:Why should I choose who gets empowered? That's up to the people of Syria once they can get some semblance of security. Which won't happen so long as Assad has power. Again though, in Iraq, after we killed the scummy torturing monster the whole place fell apart and all of King George's men could not put it back together again. The huge civilian body count, the loss of basic services, propose a way that won't happen again.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:40
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NewForumSoftware posted:Because Syrians would be suffering less if we had just swallowed our own pride and kept him in power until ISIS(again, an American creation) was no longer bordering them instead of pretending like human rights violations give us the right to back our own human rights violators. What support do you see us as having provided to any group attempting to topple Assad? As far as I can tell we've done everything we can to keep Assad in power by not helping the groups interested in regime change. instead supporting those willing to collaborate with Assad for scraps like the YPG Why do you think the man willing to rule over a pile of skulls is better than anyone else involved? He isn't
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Dec 31, 2016 17:41
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Dubya's revenge on Saddam involved the deaths of millions. Little kids gone kaput without ever a chance to reflect on their political reality.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:42
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the paradigm shift posted:What support do you see us as having provided to any group attempting to topple Assad? lol quote:As far as I can tell we've done everything we can to keep Assad in power by not helping the groups interested in regime change. instead supporting those willing to collaborate with Assad for scraps like the YPG Alright clearly you're just a bit underinformed on the topic. https://www.whitehelmets.org/
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Dec 31, 2016 17:43
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syscall girl posted:Again though, in Iraq, after we killed the scummy torturing monster the whole place fell apart and all of King George's men could not put it back together again. That's still not a good argument for backing a guy who not only let a civil war happen but escalated it with the use of chemical weapons.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:44
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syscall girl posted:Again though, in Iraq, after we killed the scummy torturing monster the whole place fell apart and all of King George's men could not put it back together again. I mean, it already has is the thing. We're looking at hell on earth and going nah we'd just make it worse. I don't know if that is the case here.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:44
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NewForumSoftware posted:lol Get lost Putin bootlicker
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Dec 31, 2016 17:45
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the paradigm shift posted:I mean, it already has is the thing. We're looking at hell on earth and going nah we'd just make it worse. I don't know if that is the case here. We would make it worse. We have. Look to RT to show the bombs the US is missing with and Fox News to show the Russian bombs killing innocents.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:46
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the paradigm shift posted:Get lost Putin bootlicker I still haven't heard a better idea from you. Do you have a better solution or is just whining about how bad Assad is good enough? the paradigm shift posted:What support do you see us as having provided to any group attempting to topple Assad? As far as I can tell we've done everything we can to keep Assad in power by not helping the groups interested in regime change. still laughing at this post https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American-led_intervention_in_Syria
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Dec 31, 2016 17:46
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NewForumSoftware posted:Because Syrians would be suffering less if we had just swallowed our own pride and kept him in power until ISIS(again, an American creation) was no longer bordering them instead of pretending like human rights violations give us the right to back our own human rights violators. I like how you're advocating everyone sitting with their thumbs up their rear end years ago all on the basis of hindsight some 5 years later. "Get me the guy with the floor shitter avatar into the oval office, 5 years from now, stat!"
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Dec 31, 2016 17:49
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"intervention will work this time guys" what makes you say that "i gotta hunch"
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Dec 31, 2016 17:49
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Gin and Juche posted:I like how you're advocating everyone sitting with their thumbs up their rear end years ago all on the basis of hindsight some 5 years later. Who could have possibly known intervening in the middle east in the name of Democracy could blow up in our faces? Are you being ironic?
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Dec 31, 2016 17:51
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NewForumSoftware posted:Who could have possibly known intervening in the middle east in the name of Democracy could blow up in our faces? "He's gassing his own people, what do you want to do?" "Nah let's just see how this plays out."
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Dec 31, 2016 17:52
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"Five years from now a man with bowel problems will think we're foreign policy geniuses."
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Dec 31, 2016 17:52
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Gin and Juche posted:"He's gassing his own people, what do you want to do?" Could always send aid instead of bombs.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:53
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syscall girl posted:We would make it worse. We have. I don't think anyone is saying we're perfect, but I'd be willing to bet it's a drat sight better than mass graves of the gassed.
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Dec 31, 2016 17:55
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the paradigm shift posted:What support do you see us as having provided to any group attempting to topple Assad? As far as I can tell we've done everything we can to keep Assad in power by not helping the groups interested in regime change. instead supporting those willing to collaborate with Assad for scraps like the YPG Well there was the billion odd dollar cia-led train and equip programme that predated the anti-ISIS intrrvention
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Dec 31, 2016 17:55
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Badger of Basra posted:"intervention will work this time guys" That's not what I was saying either badge. It's already a failed state being propped up through foreign intervention so yeah we really probably couldn't make it worse. I don't relish it either but when we see what the next few years bring we'll probably be as embarrassed as we are about Rwanda now
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Dec 31, 2016 17:58
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