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Bongo Bill posted:I don't think that the CGI heads were particularly monstrous. It's not so much about them being disgusting, or anything, it's about those occasional, uncanny twitches that you inevitably catch because you're so compelled to look at the masking technology, it's like seeing the imperfections in stop-motion - but, again, returned merely to the task of replicating familiarity. Like, Cushing's texture. What his pores were like, how his body moved suddenly and subtly like we all do. It's like the Paul Walker and Tupac thing, but framed much more intimately. There's an understated, 'wormy' energy that emanates from the sycophantic death cult of the Empire, and CGI Peter Cushing only magnifies it.
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Jan 6, 2017 05:53
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K. Waste posted:It's not so much about them being disgusting, or anything, it's about those occasional, uncanny twitches that you inevitably catch because you're so compelled to look at the masking technology, it's like seeing the imperfections in stop-motion - but, again, returned merely to the task of replicating familiarity. Like, Cushing's texture. What his pores were like, how his body moved suddenly and subtly like we all do. It's like the Paul Walker and Tupac thing, but framed much more intimately. There's an understated, 'wormy' energy that emanates from the sycophantic death cult of the Empire, and CGI Peter Cushing only magnifies it. A lot of people didn't get that. The Uncanny Valley is a highly subjective phenomenon.
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Jan 6, 2017 05:53
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Bongo Bill posted:A lot of people didn't get that. The Uncanny Valley is a highly subjective phenomenon. Fair enough about the Uncanny Valley, but that's just a small part of what I'm getting at. Surely enough people got that Peter Cushing and especially Carrie Fisher are neither alive nor young. These aren't just 'posthumous' roles, they're a complex masking of rejuvenated celebrities that are fascinating to think about just in technical terms alone. Inevitably these fascinations connect with the political terms of the film as well.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:05
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Maxwell Lord posted:So yeah all those stories about hate crimes increasing in the wake of the election are fake. Literal Nazis being appointed to cabinet positions will hurt nobody. You have to look at what he's saying in the context of all his blather about divine justice, the dictatorship of the proletariat, etc. He's not defending Trump. There are people who will not survive this administration, sure, but the same was true of Obama's. Personally I hated all the false equivalencies in the election, because I really don't think the Democrats and Republicans are equally bad (the latter is way worse). But that doesn't change that we have an entire system that's screwed up. To put it in Star Wars terms, imagine if after the OT the Rebels managed to restore the Republic to its former state. Would that solve anything? gently caress no. The Republic voted Palpatine into power. The Republic is the Empire. Lord Krangdar fucked around with this message at 06:08 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 06:05
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True, but the Rebels saying they want to restore the Republic are more invoking a symbol, an ideal of what the Republic is supposed to be rather than the corrupted reality. Almost all revolutionary movements do this- the French and American revolutions, modern Communists making reference to Lenin and Trotsky, etc. I just don't buy that we shouldn't sympathize with Leia because she's bougie scum like the rest of 'em. She's imperfect, but so's everybody.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:11
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bah humbug wrong thread
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Jan 6, 2017 06:12
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Mecha Gojira posted:The thing is, though, the Radical Fringe literally went on a Suicide Mission. They can no longer lead the larger movement; they're all dead. Even Admiral Fishguy. It just pushed the already militant faction (ironically lead by Bail Organa of "pacifist" Alderaan) to move up its time table. The Death Star still ended up pushing that timetable up dramatically, as it happens. An observation: in ANH and TFA, these symbolic liberal Americas are destroyed. Likewise, they are saved in the parody versions Spaceballs and Guardians of the Galaxy. That GotG happened to be released before TFA is an indication of how embedded Star Wars is in our culture.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:17
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Maxwell Lord posted:True, but the Rebels saying they want to restore the Republic are more invoking a symbol, an ideal of what the Republic is supposed to be rather than the corrupted reality. Almost all revolutionary movements do this- the French and American revolutions, modern Communists making reference to Lenin and Trotsky, etc. Are they, though? These are characters we literally saw as Senators of the actual functioning Republic in Episode I-III. Mon Mothma was cast as the same actress that played her in a deleted Episode III scene where the foundation of the Rebellion is just a bunch of Senators wanting Palpatine to step down. Some of these dumb motherfuckers actually thought they could fight the goddamned Emperor with Senate Committee Hearings on Secret Weapons Projects. They share Obi Wan's nostalgia for a golden age that never really existed.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:20
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One thing that I think White did get right is to point out how easily Reagan appropriated Star Wars the first time around. And I think it's pretty clear that while an uncomfortable number of white Americans would be okay with Hitler, a huge number would be ecstatic with another Reagan. That is most likely who Trump is. And that's loving bad enough. And Donald "I am Batman" Trump would definitely appropriate Star Wars.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:26
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Maxwell Lord posted:True, but the Rebels saying they want to restore the Republic are more invoking a symbol, an ideal of what the Republic is supposed to be rather than the corrupted reality. Almost all revolutionary movements do this- the French and American revolutions, modern Communists making reference to Lenin and Trotsky, etc. So if they don't literally want to restore the Republic, what exactly do they want? This is why I said earlier I wish TFA had taken inspiration from Dune Messiah. Anyway who said anything about bougie scum? Lord Krangdar fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 06:32
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Hodgepodge posted:One thing that I think White did get right is to point out how easily Reagan appropriated Star Wars the first time around. And I think it's pretty clear that while an uncomfortable number of white Americans would be okay with Hitler, a huge number would be ecstatic with another Reagan. That is most likely who Trump is. And that's loving bad enough. Oh, yeah, Reagan rode Star Wars hard. Dude literally wanted to build space lasers to fight the "evil empire" of Soviet Russia. The satire had to be palpable in the prequels for that reason. Lucas was probably afraid of another Reagan so he made sure to name his badguys Raygun (Gunray).
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Jan 6, 2017 06:34
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Really, Rogue One is a perfect double feature with HyperNormslisation.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:34
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Mecha Gojira posted:The satire had to be palpable in the prequels for that reason. Lucas was probably afraid of another Reagan so he made sure to name his badguys Raygun (Gunray). Wow.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:42
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Nute (Newt (Gingrich)) Gunray.
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Jan 6, 2017 06:52
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[Free] Trade Federation 
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Jan 6, 2017 07:03
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The Trade Federation flagship in TPM is called Profiteer, and Grievous' flagship in ROTS is Invisible Hand [of the Free Market]. It's not really subtle.
Prolonged Panorama fucked around with this message at 07:11 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 07:06
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Maxwell Lord posted:So yeah all those stories about hate crimes increasing in the wake of the election are fake. Literal Nazis being appointed to cabinet positions will hurt nobody. You need to read the news carefully. The stories are of the increase in reports of bias-related incidents following Trump's election. The main/only source for these stories is the Southern Poverty Law Center's Hatewatch program: "reports from news articles, social media, and direct submissions via our #ReportHate intake page." 'Incidents' are defined as anything from actual hate crimes to the overhearing of someone using a slur. The "#ReportHate intake page" is completely anonymous and overtly partisan. The largest number of the reports come from gradeschools, K-12. Most reports are unverified. Even with these loose guidelines, the SPLC has only tallied around 1000 reports of incidents since the election - and they note that the rate of reports is declining. The point is not that hate crimes don't occur, but that these fantasies about roving street gangs and concentration camps for gays are ridiculous. However well-intentioned the SPLC may be, it's feeding a (social) media circus that obfuscates rather than clarifies. It distracts from the failures of liberalism that led to this clown-man getting elected, turning it into an issue of 'harassment' by nebulous bad people. People are under immense pressure to 'get involved' - like, "can't you see that the starving orphans are dying? Donate to this charity now!" My question is why are those orphans are starving in the first place. Why is this charity presented as the only viable alternative? That's what you should stop to ask yourself. You do not gotta go fast. Back to the topic of Rogue One: one of its larger accomplishments is subtly reconfigure the Death Star's threat. The emphasis is no longer on the indiscriminate "planet-killer" but on its use as a precision-targeted weapon, cutting down on (relative) collateral damage. The imagery is less apocalyptic and more simply dystopian. it's certainly not apocalyptic in the same way as in A New Hope. There the threat was of liberal Alderann being altogether replaced - transformed-into/revealed-as a metal nightmare world. The space station in Rogue One is not presented as an environment. It really is 'just a space station' that coexists in space along with 'rebel base' and 'refinery'.
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Jan 6, 2017 07:41
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Hodgepodge posted:You're right. Although I think I like it better when I thought it was Tantooine, I guess the idea of her offering up a remote planet much like Luke's was close enough without making her enough of a jerk that she isn't sympathetic when Alderaan is destroyed. We're not given any evidence that Dantooine isn't inhabited (and indeed, we learn in EU materials like KOTOR that a lot of people live there). Tarkin's objection was that no one cared about it, not that it didn't have people on it. Your instinct there was sound.
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Jan 6, 2017 09:04
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Crion posted:We're not given any evidence that Dantooine isn't inhabited (and indeed, we learn in EU materials like KOTOR that a lot of people live there). Tarkin's objection was that no one cared about it, not that it didn't have people on it. Your instinct there was sound. Did I say that it wasn't inhabited? Hodgepodge fucked around with this message at 09:33 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 09:21
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Hodgepodge posted:Did I say that it wasn't inhabited? I was expanding upon your post, not contradicting it. But sure, why not.
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Jan 6, 2017 09:26
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Crion posted:We're not given any evidence that Dantooine isn't inhabited (and indeed, we learn in EU materials like KOTOR that a lot of people live there). Tarkin's objection was that no one cared about it, not that it didn't have people on it. Your instinct there was sound. I thought his objection was that Dantooine was too far away right now and he really had an itch to show off his death weapon?
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Jan 6, 2017 09:33
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Crion posted:I was expanding upon your post, not contradicting it. But sure, why not. My bad. To clarify, the difference between Tatooine and Dantooine is that one is Luke's home village and the other is another nearby village with a nearly identical name. This is mostly significant because while they are ethically equivalent one is more weighty in a moral and/or emotional sense because it would mean that she came within a few hours of bargaining away her brother's life on top of the weight of knowing that she doomed innocents. TheKingofSprings posted:I thought his objection was that Dantooine was too far away right now and he really had an itch to show off his death weapon? I believe it was that it was too remote for anyone to care. In Theoryspeak, no one gives a poo poo about the periphery. Hodgepodge fucked around with this message at 09:41 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 09:34
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TheKingofSprings posted:I thought his objection was that Dantooine was too far away right now and he really had an itch to show off his death weapon? He said it was too remote to make an effective demonstration. That means "no one living there we care about," which means "I'm not settling for Pierre, South Dakota when I can nuke New York City."
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Jan 6, 2017 09:35
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Hodgepodge posted:Did I say that it wasn't inhabited? Yeah, I think you're right. Leia is stone cold. I just think Tatooine is barely on her radar.
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Jan 6, 2017 09:49
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LesterGroans posted:Yeah, I think you're right. Leia is stone cold. I just think Tatooine is barely on her radar. No, she clearly doesn't feel good about it in the scene. She is trained to be a leader from birth and an important member of the resistance, though. She's mentally prepared to make that sort of choice and live with it but she isn't emotionally hardened to it. In terms of characterization it's spot on. My misreading just layered on the dramatic irony a little deeper.
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Jan 6, 2017 10:19
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Hodgepodge posted:No, she clearly doesn't feel good about it in the scene. She is trained to be a leader from birth and an important member of the resistance, though. She's mentally prepared to make that sort of choice and live with it but she isn't emotionally hardened to it. In terms of characterization it's spot on. My misreading just layered on the dramatic irony a little deeper. Yeah, I don't mean she isn't emotionally affected by giving up a whole planet to be merked, just that if she has to she'll give up some backwoods planet to protect the Rebellion.
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Jan 6, 2017 10:25
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:The point is not that hate crimes don't occur, but that these fantasies about roving street gangs and concentration camps for gays are ridiculous. However well-intentioned the SPLC may be, it's feeding a (social) media circus that obfuscates rather than clarifies. It distracts from the failures of liberalism that led to this clown-man getting elected, turning it into an issue of 'harassment' by nebulous bad people. The way I see it both these things need addressing. There is a danger of a more authoritarian fascist order resulting from all this- it's no guarantee and there's every chance the Trump administration's ineptitude will get in the way of any real tyranny, but on the other hand it's not like actual fascist governments were particularly competent. It's the sort of thing where you just can't safely assume "it can't happen here". So, yeah, some effort needs to be put forward to make sure this doesn't metastasize. Some fretting is justified. That doesn't detract from the deeper, more long term work of addressing the failures of capitalism that are at the root of all this, but you can't ignore the immediate danger either.
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Jan 6, 2017 10:29
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LesterGroans posted:Yeah, I don't mean she isn't emotionally affected by giving up a whole planet to be merked, just that if she has to she'll give up some backwoods planet to protect the Rebellion. Leia is badass and eventually garottes a giant penis monster as part of a plan to rescue her legendarily badass boyfriend, and that's just the first totally sweet thing she does that happened to come to mind.
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Jan 6, 2017 10:32
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Oh look, RLM made another video mocking the people criticising their review of Rogue One. How mature and high-minded of them. Kind of ironic for supposed critics to not be capable of taking criticism well. Nephthys fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 13:52
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Nephthys posted:Oh look, RLM made another video mocking the people criticising their review of Rogue One. How mature and high-minded of them. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sExTt4j69zI So everyone can see. It's funny though, they parody the random 3 guys talking only positive stuff about movies sycophant videos. "We're not supposed to care about war movie characters" argument is also p loving hilarious considering some talk in this thread.
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Jan 6, 2017 13:57
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Mecha Gojira posted:I feel like anyone who says Rogue One didn't have any characterization didn't watch the movie. I don't need a lengthy backstory on Krennic to know who he is. I just need to see him get into pissing matches with his bosses and smile when Vader-sempai notices him. Hell, everything you really need to know about the guy you can gleam from his costume, or his ship's aesthetics, or his personal Death Troopers. He's the only Imperial we see wearing white, and aside from Vader, the only one who wears a cape. His stormtroopers have striking black armor to distinguish them from their white-clad brethren. He flies around in a one-of-a-kind shuttle; even Vader uses the classic Return of the Jedi Lambda, which had to have been mass-produced and relatively common for the plan on Endor work. He stands out from everyone but wants everyone, especially Vader and the Emperor, to praise his accomplishments. The executed engineers also wore white. Cassian could have used a little bit more to fluff him out a bit. But I agree Krennic's role as the eccentric science officer was well done. I like how they showed the Navy loving him over.
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Jan 6, 2017 14:15
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Nephthys posted:Oh look, RLM made another video mocking the people criticising their review of Rogue One. How mature and high-minded of them. Mocking dumb internet comments is basically why SA exists. They would fit in well here.
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Jan 6, 2017 14:15
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Not the NBA thread.
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Jan 6, 2017 14:18
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Maxwell Lord posted:The way I see it both these things need addressing. There is a danger of a more authoritarian fascist order resulting from all this- it's no guarantee and there's every chance the Trump administration's ineptitude will get in the way of any real tyranny, but on the other hand it's not like actual fascist governments were particularly competent. It's the sort of thing where you just can't safely assume "it can't happen here". So, yeah, some effort needs to be put forward to make sure this doesn't metastasize. Some fretting is justified. That doesn't detract from the deeper, more long term work of addressing the failures of capitalism that are at the root of all this, but you can't ignore the immediate danger either. This is a picture of college students in Kabul, Afghanistan in 1978. I keep a copy of it in my wallet to remind me that we can always lose what we have if we become conceited arrogant pricks and disappear up our own assholes like a certain solvenian Hegel fan who endorsed Trump:  I guess maybe some of those ladies were able to see Star Wars in a theater before reactionary elements armed with CIA-provided rockets blew them all up for wearing pants and learning to read.
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Jan 6, 2017 14:30
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You dont really keep that picture in your wallet. Come on.
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Jan 6, 2017 14:33
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euphronius posted:You dont really keep that picture in your wallet. Come on. He's a leg man.
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Jan 6, 2017 14:34
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Mecha Gojirra posted:I feel like anyone who says Rogue One didn't have any characterization didn't watch the movie. I don't need a lengthy backstory on Krennic to know who he is. I just need to see him get into pissing matches with his bosses and smile when Vader-sempai notices him. Hell, everything you really need to know about the guy you can gleam from his costume, or his ship's aesthetics, or his personal Death Troopers. He's the only Imperial we see wearing white, and aside from Vader, the only one who wears a cape. His stormtroopers have striking black armor to distinguish them from their white-clad brethren. He flies around in a one-of-a-kind shuttle; even Vader uses the classic Return of the Jedi Lambda, which had to have been mass-produced and relatively common for the plan on Endor work. He stands out from everyone but wants everyone, especially Vader and the Emperor, to praise his accomplishments. It reminded me a lot of "Stahl" (literally: Steel), an industrialist character in Killzone 3 who has pretty much the same things: personal ships, personal guard following him around etc. He takes the role of German industrialists (krupp steel/iron) in WW II building the weapons for the Empire. edit:  Stahl flanked by his 'deathtroopers'. Nielsen fucked around with this message at 15:47 on Jan 6, 2017 |
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Jan 6, 2017 14:59
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Nephthys posted:Oh look, RLM made another video mocking the people criticising their review of Rogue One. How mature and high-minded of them.
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Jan 6, 2017 15:17
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They're creating a Rogue One Review Cinematic Universe.
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Jan 6, 2017 16:58
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Maxwell Lord posted:They're creating a Rogue One Review Cinematic Universe. Not enough character depth imo
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Jan 6, 2017 17:41
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