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I wonder where BDSM and other kinks interact with Xtian morality-- is any of sinful? Does the more "abusive" stuff do something to degrade the imago dei in the partner?
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Jan 13, 2017 22:26
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WerrWaaa posted:I wonder where BDSM and other kinks interact with Xtian morality-- is any of sinful? Does the more "abusive" stuff do something to degrade the imago dei in the partner? Ever watch Preacher?
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Jan 13, 2017 22:31
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WerrWaaa posted:I wonder where BDSM and other kinks interact with Xtian morality-- is any of sinful? Does the more "abusive" stuff do something to degrade the imago dei in the partner? I imagine Jesus would not have been down with fin dom. Or maybe he would've, actually? Personally I don't see any problem with Christian morality and BDSM/kinks as long as there's mutual consent.
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Jan 13, 2017 22:34
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WerrWaaa posted:I wonder where BDSM and other kinks interact with Xtian morality-- is any of sinful? Does the more "abusive" stuff do something to degrade the imago dei in the partner? Don't make me post bdsm christology again
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Jan 13, 2017 22:44
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pidan posted:I imagine protestant bdsm is discipline and abstinence. Well... (NSFW, obviously)
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Jan 13, 2017 23:37
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Jan 14, 2017 00:19
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Pellisworth posted:Does Catholic BDSM involve hair shirts and hail Marys somehow orthodox bdsm is remembering byzantium 
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Jan 14, 2017 00:43
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Pellisworth posted:I imagine Jesus would not have been down with fin dom. Or maybe he would've, actually?
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Jan 14, 2017 00:50
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Samuel Clemens posted:Well... (NSFW, obviously) quote:(This website is not intended to offend anyone. If the subject of wife spanking offends, please just click the little "x" at the top of the page to exit.)
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Jan 14, 2017 01:12
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As promised.
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Jan 14, 2017 02:11
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Keromaru5 posted:As promised. if you or anyone in this thread can read that title please let me know because i only know enough to know that i don't know the important bits like that english doesn't look accurate because i don't see chyugokujin anywhere but i've only been at this three months maybe there's some new poo poo to describe chinese that i don't know
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Jan 14, 2017 02:19
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might want to crosspost it to the japanese expats thread I see kanji and my brain just goes "nope."
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Jan 14, 2017 03:08
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i want to hear about bdsm and/or queer jesus completely serious, thanks mo tzu
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Jan 14, 2017 03:34
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The Phlegmatist posted:might want to crosspost it to the japanese expats thread I'm learning Chinese so the kanji is the only part I can work with.  Looks like maybe something about secrets of scriptural divination that have been sealed for 2000 years and finally revealed in this shocking book. Nothing that seems to refer to China.  Hopefully we can find some Japan goon to solve this one for us.
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Jan 14, 2017 03:44
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P-Mack posted:I'm learning Chinese so the kanji is the only part I can work with. This is more or less right, here's my translation: quote:Undoing the 2000 year old seal of Christianity: As I've mentioned my Japanese is bad, and I'm translating between two foreign languages, please be kind, namaste. Mo Tzu posted:like that english doesn't look accurate because i don't see chyugokujin anywhere but i've only been at this three months maybe there's some new poo poo to describe chinese that i don't know This author seems like the type who would use shina rather than chuugoku anyway. pidan fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Jan 14, 2017 |
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Jan 14, 2017 06:53
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Pellisworth posted:i want to hear about bdsm and/or queer jesus i'm a bit out of the queer theology game, but i can try. not gonna talk about bdsm christology because lmao i do not want to talk about christ as the suffering bottom, that's just a bit too much for me there's actually a lot of different queer christs, whether it's dale martin's "sex and the single savior" looking to queer readings of the new testament or patrick cheng's gay asian jesus, everyone seems to have an opinion on how to reconcile christ and clobber texts with their sexuality or gender identity (mostly it's sexuality; trans theologians are few and far between and they're not exactly in print these days, unless they're just... god i don't know how to describe how bad mollenkott is) the one i like is fairly simple, and one that helped me come to terms with my sexuality; robert shore-goss' "jesus acted up: a gay and lesbian manifesto" is a good example of liberation theology meeting gay and lesbian experience (though marcella althaus-reid is probably a better example of that, i haven't read her as much as i did shore-goss). he talked about how lgbt people have been persecuted throughout history, how they're still being persecuted, and the church's role in perpetuating the aids crisis and how these things are contrary to christ's basileia teachings (which amount, essentially, to a utopian vision of human society in the eschaton, where oppression and suffering are gone; also, we have a responsibility to work towards that vision here on earth). i don't know, pretty simple, but i was a self loathing person deep in the closet and hearing that stuff made me go "oh it's okay to like dudes (and also to be trans)" he also went into some sexual spirituality which, like, okay i'm not gonna lie if you're transitioning from "uptight sexually repressed closeted catholic gay" to "healthy sexuality" it can be helpful but it's still fuckin weird. sorry for not going more into it, i find it kinda hard to talk about this kinda stuff lately. probably still a bit burned out on theology pidan posted:This is more or less right, here's my translation: also you'd think that me knowing 仏教 was buddhism would clue me in that クリスト教 would be christianity also also thanks for giving me a reason to install a japanese keyboard on this computer, i've been dilly dallying about it
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Jan 14, 2017 07:33
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Mo Tzu posted:i'm a bit out of the queer theology game, but i can try. not gonna talk about bdsm christology because lmao i do not want to talk about christ as the suffering bottom, that's just a bit too much for me It's too bad that complementarians and queer theologians have no overlap, because linking Eternal Subordination of the Son to BDSM Christology and coming up with BDSM Trinitarianism would be the best theological essay to read that will never be written. e: In fact, thinking about it more, that would make the events at Calvary a "type" representing the economic relationship between the three Persons of the Trinity. I wonder if this heresy is a novel theological development. The Phlegmatist fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Jan 14, 2017 |
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Jan 14, 2017 17:11
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So, on a completely different note, has anyone else been reading what seems like an increasing number of opinion pieces about Pope Francis causing dissatisfaction / acting autocratically / furthering cronyism / etc? I will admit that I was linked to this one by Fr. Z, but - take note, those of you who are pre-emptively rolling your eyes - he closed his comments on it, suggesting he wasn't just posting it so he could get his requisite sixty "rargh rargh Vatican II worst ever" comments for the day. In fact, he didn't even comment on it himself. "Why more and more priests can't stand Pope Francis" Right after Pope Francis was elected I did a bunch of explaining "no, he didn't actually mean THAT, he meant THIS", and then when my non-Catholic friends stopped paying much attention just confined my "here we go again" grumbles to Spacewolf, because my sons are now old enough to get annoyed when I yell at the radio while I'm driving. But it seems like the pace of things I feel the impulse to explain (so as to make them fit into what the Catholic Church teaches) or can't help but wince about (when it's church-politics-mismanagement stuff) is picking up. Just me?
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Jan 14, 2017 20:23
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The Phlegmatist posted:e: In fact, thinking about it more, that would make the events at Calvary a "type" representing the economic relationship between the three Persons of the Trinity. I wonder if this heresy is a novel theological development. It does sound like something someone might have considered before, but also like something I'd be fascinated to read about. I haven't encountered it that I can remember, but there's a whole lot of theology that I haven't encountered.
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Jan 14, 2017 21:55
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zonohedron posted:So, on a completely different note, has anyone else been reading what seems like an increasing number of opinion pieces about Pope Francis causing dissatisfaction / acting autocratically / furthering cronyism / etc? I have noticed this, too. I am reminded that Pope Francis himself prefers detractors to flattery. "Detractors speak ill of me and I deserve it because I am a sinner: that's the way I see it. That doesn't worry me." I find his consistent humility very arresting, and it paradoxically makes me pay more attention to his wisdom. For myself, I can only say what is most sincerely in my spirit about Pope Francis: his pastorship has lead me away from temptation and closer towards God.
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Jan 14, 2017 23:25
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zonohedron posted:Right after Pope Francis was elected I did a bunch of explaining "no, he didn't actually mean THAT, he meant THIS", and then when my non-Catholic friends stopped paying much attention just confined my "here we go again" grumbles to Spacewolf, because my sons are now old enough to get annoyed when I yell at the radio while I'm driving. But it seems like the pace of things I feel the impulse to explain (so as to make them fit into what the Catholic Church teaches) or can't help but wince about (when it's church-politics-mismanagement stuff) is picking up. Just me? Is there a difference between setting up the best people for the job and people who are going to follow your particular brand of holiness in order to keep your faith around going into the next century? "Cronyism" can sometimes simply be used as an excuse to complain about why you might not be getting a promotion even though its actually because your bad at your job. I don't fully understand the last bit of the sentence I quoted though, could you clarify?
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Jan 15, 2017 00:01
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zonohedron posted:So, on a completely different note, has anyone else been reading what seems like an increasing number of opinion pieces about Pope Francis causing dissatisfaction / acting autocratically / furthering cronyism / etc? I always brace myself for "Pope's on the plane again, how is everyone going to take His Holiness' words wildly out of context to fit their agenda this time." There's a lot of grumbling from unnamed sources in the Vatican about Pope Francis being an authoritarian dictator, but I'm not really sure I believe them since they seem to be coming from media that already has an ideological axe to grind. Pope Francis isn't a theologian and his papacy reflects that; he takes a pastoral approach to everything. On the other hand he's elevated cardinals from untraditional archbishoprics just because they agree with him ideologically, which a little bit disconcerting in that he's setting a nasty precedent.
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Jan 15, 2017 00:52
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Josef bugman posted:Is there a difference between setting up the best people for the job and people who are going to follow your particular brand of holiness in order to keep your faith around going into the next century? "Cronyism" can sometimes simply be used as an excuse to complain about why you might not be getting a promotion even though its actually because your bad at your job. "But it seems like the pace of things I feel the impulse to explain (so as to make them fit into what the Catholic Church teaches) or can't help but wince about (when it's church-politics-mismanagement stuff) is picking up. Just me?" "I've been doing this since Pope Francis was elected, but it feels like the number of stories that make me yell at the radio have gone up. Some of them are things I feel like I should be explaining to non-Catholics, so they understand that Catholic doctrines aren't changing; some of them are just things that make me make angry faces, because they're about Pope Francis playing politics in ways I don't like." The Phlegmatist posted:On the other hand he's elevated cardinals from untraditional archbishoprics just because they agree with him ideologically, which a little bit disconcerting in that he's setting a nasty precedent. It's not just a nasty precedent (though it is) - it can be an unpleasant surprise for dioceses that don't have a lot of money.
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Jan 15, 2017 00:54
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Hi Christian Goons. Here's some stuff. I struggle terribly with faith, or, more accurately speaking, I struggle to have faith. I was raised by a scornful, frothy-mouthed atheist dad and a reasonably Episcopalian ma, who didn't practice at all from the time she was young, on account of marrying the aforementioned Dad. In short, irreligious. I had moments of smug atheist-ery in my adolescence but I mercifully grew out of them. Where I stand now is that, I find myself drawn to Christianity. I had the amazing good fortune to spend a semester in France in college and I remember sitting in the church in Rouen (built on the site of Saint Joan of Arc's martyrdom) in a pew and being totally emotionally overwhelmed by the sensation that sounds like how Christians describe "the presence", even though it feels hypocritical of me to call it as much. I read passages from Christian thinkers, mostly Church Fathers, and I feel an overwhelming...draw? Compulsion? To them? When I'm troubled, and I mean deeply troubled about something- this isn't for the small stuff- I try to pray. I pray to how I conceive a big, omnibeneveloent, Christian God to be. But, again, I feel a little like a hypocrite given that I'm not part of that tradition and I don't know if I'm doing it right. Or if there is a right way, or if maybe I'm just deluding myself. I deal with chronic pain from an old injury and I know that relief from pain can cause euphoria. I wonder sometimes if my flirtations with religious thinking feel so "right" because they ease my worries and emotional suffering. I know its a real possibility and that gnaws at me. Basically I feel called to participate in some kind of Christian practice. I don't know how to do so, or why I feel compelled. But I know that it feels right and good when I try. I wrestle with this feeling. I am also generally of the opinion that while I may never fully assure myself of the existence of God, or that Christian worship is the right way to experience contact with said God, that the ethical foundation of Chtistianity- i.e. forgiveness, mercy, serving the poorest and most vulnerable, is so commendable that the actual metaphysical elements might be irrelevant. I guess I don't have a question. There's not even much of a statement in there. I just wanted to spill all of this nonsense out somewhere, to someone. So there you go. Make of that what you will.
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Jan 15, 2017 06:34
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VoteTedJameson posted:Hi Christian Goons. Here's some stuff. Welcome brother
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Jan 15, 2017 06:46
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VoteTedJameson posted:Hi Christian Goons. Here's some stuff. we like silly hats and The Gay Agenda and people who suck
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Jan 15, 2017 07:45
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also i'm drunk
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Jan 15, 2017 07:49
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Hi Gail. I'm working on it, too. Finally going to Compline tomorrow and I'm stoked! Also welcome TedJameson.
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Jan 15, 2017 07:59
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VoteTedJameson posted:Hi Christian Goons. Here's some stuff.  dudeIf you have any questions post 'em and you'll get a ton of diverse responses. Without revealing any more personal information than you're comfortable with, what nation are you in and what denomination are your local churches? If you're interested in Christianity, the first steps are to start reading a Bible and attend services at your local churches to check things out. Assuming you're American, you should at least have several Protestants and a Catholic church nearby. If there are any Orthodox in your area, check them out too it's a good contrast. Any congregation should be very open and welcome to you, even if you don't convert to their denomination they will shower you in hospitality and food. You might ask for recommendations where to start reading the Bible, and also research local churches and plan to attend some services to try them out.
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Jan 15, 2017 07:59
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VoteTedJameson posted:I am also generally of the opinion that while I may never fully assure myself of the existence of God, or that Christian worship is the right way to experience contact with said God, that the ethical foundation of Chtistianity- i.e. forgiveness, mercy, serving the poorest and most vulnerable, is so commendable that the actual metaphysical elements might be irrelevant. this is cool, and you're cool on the topic of serving the poorest, you reminded me about fritz eichenberg, an artist who made a lot of illustrations for the catholic worker newspaper. i just looked up his religious background, and he came from a non-religious jewish family, left germany before the holocaust, and after practicing zen buddhism converted to the society of friends where he met dorothy day at some conference. his work is really, really good  this is "christ of the breadlines"  "christ of the homeless"  "black crucifixion" it's kinda hard to find good quality images of his art online, and i'm pretty sure that has something to do with copyright stuff. something about how his estate and the catholic workers have some kind of conflict? i don't know i haven't looked into it in a while
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Jan 15, 2017 07:59
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WerrWaaa posted:Hi Gail. I'm working on it, too. got ripped with a croatian dude at church tonight and we discussed ww2 because he saw a book i had with me, history is good and talking with friends is good 
HEY GUNS fucked around with this message at 08:07 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 08:01
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history is bad, actually. like, overwhelmingly so
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Jan 15, 2017 08:09
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Mo Tzu posted:history is bad, actually. like, overwhelmingly so
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Jan 15, 2017 08:12
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HEY GAIL posted:it's a nightmare from which we're trying to awake, op Plato complained about kids these days, there are dick jokes in the graffiti inscribed in Pompeii, and Shakespeare wrote "Yeah but I boned your mom!" jokes in his plays. Human nature is not going to change and never has.
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Jan 15, 2017 13:10
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Mo Tzu posted:history is bad, actually. like, overwhelmingly so History rules, especially the parts where heads are split open (cooler than decapitation imo, unless the decapitation is done by something weird like a suspension bridge cable)
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Jan 15, 2017 14:15
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Rodrigo Diaz posted:History rules, especially the parts where heads are split open (cooler than decapitation imo, unless the decapitation is done by something weird like a suspension bridge cable) It didn't have much to do with Christianity but listen to hardcore history about the golden horde http://www.dancarlin.com/product/hardcore-history-43-wrath-of-the-khans-i/ Skull piles for miles
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Jan 15, 2017 14:21
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Cythereal posted:Plato complained about kids these days, there are dick jokes in the graffiti inscribed in Pompeii, and Shakespeare wrote "Yeah but I boned your mom!" jokes in his plays. Yeah but one of these days Jesus is going to come back and there will be a new heaven and new earth, read yer bible
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Jan 15, 2017 14:23
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History owns, especially the parts where dudes wearing leather skirts led by men in white dresses conquered most of Europe and a hefty chunk of Africa and Asia. Then.....the pants peoples came.
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Jan 15, 2017 14:28
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Ceciltron posted:History owns, especially the parts where dudes wearing leather skirts led by men in white dresses conquered most of Europe and a hefty chunk of Africa and Asia. This is why Hillary wasn't allowed to be president
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Jan 15, 2017 14:38
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syscall girl posted:It didn't have much to do with Christianity but listen to hardcore history about the golden horde In a later episode he gets into the letters back and forth between the Pope and the Khan which are pretty awesome. Guyuk Khan to Pope Innocent IV posted:If bearer of this petition reaches you with his own report, you, who are the great Pope, together with all the Princes, must come in person to serve us. And hello VoteTedJameson! Thanks for sharing your awesome story.
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Jan 15, 2017 15:18
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