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This game is This poll is closed. |
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180 | 32.61% |
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212 | 38.41% |
| Good! |
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160 | 28.99% |
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ImpAtom posted:1. The ring is infinitely crappier than anything you have at that time. Yeah, it can one-hit kill things for all your MP but that isn't really very impressive, especially if you've been doing side quests, and there's a reason you don't keep using the ring after you get your other stuff back even though it's available. Think about the ring from the perspective of the emperor, who hasn't been running around gaining levels. Or pretty much everyone else other than the core 4 + the occasional person that joins your party. To them it would feel like they became god. I agree that the ring is weaker than what you had previous to the chapter, and no, I never once used it afterwards, but you can't tell me that it doesn't feel powerful to blow away a room full of enemies including iron giants or whatever they're called in like 2 seconds. Even though you have a dozen other ways of doing the same thing, it still feels powerful. It works on a story level ore so than a gameplay one, but that was the intention of that level and it worked for me. ImpAtom posted:2. "Noctis is weak and helpless" mixed with "The ring is so powerful" doesn't make any sense. If they wanted to make noctis weak then it shouldn't have gone hand-in-hand with him accepting the ring. They're contradictory statements and even you admit this. There's no sense of actual powerlessness aside from maybe the very very start because you're oneshotting everything. I didn't say weak and helpless, I said alone and depowered, and those are not the same thing. By depowered, I literally mean that he has suddenly lost most of his powers, not that he was weak, which I thought was clear as I spent the rest of what I wrote talking about how his options were limited and the impact that had. He is literally depowered when they take most of his abilities away. I apologize if that wasn't clear, but it's not a contradiction. Despite the fact that it's so powerful, the ring is and feels limiting, and had the effect of making me appreciate the enormity of the task ahead of me. Maybe it didn't to you, and that's fine. Different opinions, I'm not trying to say that mine is the only one. ImpAtom posted:3. The sword runs into the same problem. You're not suddenly given a boon. There's no reason to use the sword when you're already oneshotting everything, and you don't get your full combat mechanics back either. I disagree, and I'll bet you $5 that the moment you got the sword you (and almost everyone else) started using it and never went back to the ring, or maybe only when there were huge enemies or a ton of them on the screen. I certainly did. The reason being not that the sword is more powerful but that it gives you more options and is what we are used to at that point in the game. It' comforting. I guarantee you that most people felt relief when they got it, and from a storytelling perspective re Noctis's father it works great. ImpAtom posted:You're arguing about what they intended and I agree that is a cool idea. The problem is the execution is flawed and even you admit that. There's no problem with defending the concept but a strong concept and a strong execution aren't the same thing. If you want to argue it was executed well that's fine and I'd like to hear it, but I think it's going to have a hard time getting past the contradiction of "you're alone and helpless" and "you can oneshot everything," the same problem the game has. (Why does it even have stealth mechanics?) Again, I never used the word helpless or meant to imply that Noctis was helpless, and apologize for being unclear that that's the impression you got from what I wrote. Noctis is actually very powerful while he's using the ring and I never meant to imply otherwise. There is no contradiction. I absolutely, 100% agree that the execution is flawed, particularly by including and even stressing the stealth mechanics. That was stupid. However, flawed does not mean that it wasn't well executed, and I believe that it was. Maybe it's because I didn't even try to do stealth, but the atmosphere and gameplay mechanics worked great for the story, and the poorly told story up to that point was my biggest complaint with the game. I honestly believe that chapter 13 to the end of the game has better storytelling than anything that came before it. I guess the train levels are ok as regards to story too but not as effective, and it got so monotonous running up and down the same train a dozen times. Same problem I had with the end of Bravely Default :p Incidentally, I'm not trying to change your or anyone's mind about 13. I completely understand why you don't like it, and I even think that your reasons for disliking it are valid from your perspective. I just hope you can understand that from my and others' perspective, there are also valid reasons why we did like it. My main reason for jumping into this discussion was to try to stop people from using words like "indefensible" regarding chapter 13, not to change anyone's minds on it. I encourage you to try the level again with all this in mind. You will probably still dislike it, as most people seem to, but it might help you appreciate better why some people do enjoy it. edit: I just realized that I actually did say in my first post that the ring made you feel week. I don't know why I said that, because it's the opposite of what I think as hopefully I've demonstrated elsewhere. So no wonder you saw the contradiction. Too many words. I'll shut up now. The Pirate Captain fucked around with this message at 03:46 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 03:15
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The 500k gil is way more useful, yeah. As a catalyst, Wind-Up Lord Vexxos does give you a silly number of limit break spells for one item, but it also only gets up to a maximum of around 200 Potency on the spell if I'm remembering right, and that's with all the expensive AP skills from the Magic Ascension tree. In comparison, it only takes like 15 minutes or so to get 9 Zu Beaks from the bird on the volcano, and while you'll only get 17 casts of the limit break magic from that, you will hit the 999 Potency cap (again with all the AP skills from the Magic tree).
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Jan 15, 2017 03:18
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CodfishCartographer posted:It becomes a lot less tense and thematic when you're like level 70. I did most of the side quest stuff before progressing, and when I got there being solo felt like zero problem at all. I was only relieved to get the sword because it meant I could kill poo poo faster. The ring lets you feel almost invincible because it lets you insta-kill almost everything. If I was like level 30 or so then I'm sure it'd feel a lot more tense and appropriate, but the lack of pacing out the side quests can kill that feeling entirely and instead turns into a bit of a slog. Yeah, but that's due to pacing throughout the rest of the game and not a problem with 13 specifically. I was also overpowered in 13. The game as a whole is messed up in a lot of ways I would have found unforgivable in other games, but I just had so much drat fun playing it that I can't help but like it.
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Jan 15, 2017 03:19
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ImpAtom posted:Huh, I completely misremembered. Mostly because yeah I sold it right away. It's about 50-60 casts of the highest level of the spell of that element, (4th level) Freeze, ~fire spell~ or Zap or whatever they are called.
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Jan 15, 2017 03:25
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Time TO GAMBLE
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Jan 15, 2017 04:29
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Sapozhnik posted:Costlemark wasn't anywhere near as bad as people made it out to be, assuming the cube hub is actually the end and not just like, the midpoint of the area. If you go in when you're like, level 40 with crappy equipment it's a nightmare and the bombs keep making more bombs Also one of Dino's quests sends you there way too early for most people
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Jan 15, 2017 05:17
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:If you go in when you're like, level 40 with crappy equipment it's a nightmare and the bombs keep making more bombs When I came back I got almost all the way to that room with what is still the only functional teleporter pad I've found before I realized Gladios sword did 0 damage to them  Costlemark is not my favorite place
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Jan 15, 2017 06:55
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I'm at the very end of the game, gearing up to return to Insomnia, and I'm only just now realizing that I'm total garbo at the battle system. Enemies regularly hit for 1/4~1/2 of my HP (which when you have like 1.5k, is only like mid-300s), and I constantly get clowned on and hit into the Danger zone. Items are the only things keeping me alive. Is there some trick to avoiding damage that I'm missing, or is it just a matter of stacking vitality or something? My usual FF strategies are totally useless here and I'm confused as hell.
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Jan 15, 2017 07:05
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:If you go in when you're like, level 40 with crappy equipment it's a nightmare and the bombs keep making more bombs I thought this was pain the rear end until I realized that dodging their attacks repeatedly builds the Armiger bar in seconds.
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Jan 15, 2017 08:02
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Pollyanna posted:I'm at the very end of the game, gearing up to return to Insomnia, and I'm only just now realizing that I'm total garbo at the battle system. Enemies regularly hit for 1/4~1/2 of my HP (which when you have like 1.5k, is only like mid-300s), and I constantly get clowned on and hit into the Danger zone. Items are the only things keeping me alive. Is there some trick to avoiding damage that I'm missing, or is it just a matter of stacking vitality or something? My usual FF strategies are totally useless here and I'm confused as hell. Dodge, it's an action game.
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Jan 15, 2017 08:18
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ImpAtom posted:Thematically appropriate doesn't make it good gameplay design in terms of being fun or make it hard to understand why people dislike it. Like I honestly don't understand your point or why you jumped on me about it. I And others Have said It's fun You personally think it could have been done better I'm not saying it was my favourite thing ever, but it isn't as bad, in my opinion, as you are making it out to be. I don't really get why this statement is hard to understand. Jeedy Jay posted:"There's no real defense for it" can come off that way, especially as a reaction to "I don't see how it's so bad." This right here The Pirate Captain posted:I have to disagree with the bolded part completely, and no one is surprised that its hated. With its limited cut scenes, the whole game is basically relying on visual storytelling, and chapter 13 nails that better than any of the game that comes before it. You get SO MUCH information in that chapter, both from the stuff they tell you outright and from the environment/enemy and boss types. Regarding the mechanics changing, I also thought that contributed greatly to the feel of the chapter (and to the storytelling) in that we come to realize that: And also this, thanks for using better words than I could mash out on my phone Essentially, I responded mostly because ImpAtom keeps stating their personal reaction to the elements of that chapter and then stating that it's irrefutably objectively bad, and anyone who thinks otherwise has no possible basis for being right, in spite of me and several others who are posting specific reasons why we thought it was effective. It's an arbitrary, dismissive approach to making an argument and it's rubbing several of us the wrong way. Tae posted:Dodge, it's an action game. Also if you hold back on the left stick while doing a combo with a sword you will hop back and queue up to start an air combo. You can then repeat the dodge back -> air combo thing until you run out of MP to mitigate a lot of the incoming damage.
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Jan 15, 2017 09:11
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Shadow Ninja 64 posted:The 500k gil is way more useful, yeah. As a catalyst, Wind-Up Lord Vexxos does give you a silly number of limit break spells for one item, but it also only gets up to a maximum of around 200 Potency on the spell if I'm remembering right, and that's with all the expensive AP skills from the Magic Ascension tree. In comparison, it only takes like 15 minutes or so to get 9 Zu Beaks from the bird on the volcano, and while you'll only get 17 casts of the limit break magic from that, you will hit the 999 Potency cap (again with all the AP skills from the Magic tree). I get 338 on the potency from Vexxos. If your magic is high, then you'll still be doing 77k-99k damage with that.
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Jan 15, 2017 10:37
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Kalenn Istarion posted:then stating that it's irrefutably objectively bad, It... is? The developers have actively commented on the chapter and said they plan to try to work it improve it because the criticism of it was so bad. That is as close to objectively bad as you can get. It is about as close to an objectively bad level as I've ever seen in a video game. It does almost everything wrong and it is telling that the absolute best praise for the level anyone can come up with is "it is bad to play because it's thematic." And that's fine if you like it for that reason but it is not at all hard to understand why people dislike it and jumping down my throat because I dared to criticize the level you liked is pretty tiresome. I didn't even say you shouldn't like it, just that it's easy to understand why people dislike it, but apparently even that is too much criticism for you? ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 11:24 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 10:40
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It isn't particularly great but I fully admit I have a particularly high tolerance for bullshit curveball levels in games which is why I didn't mind it. It's not really a merit for the favour of the chapter
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Jan 15, 2017 10:57
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By the time you get the sword you have a lot of options. Besides the whole sword moveset you can also nuke enemies while dodging (something that should've been carried over to other chapters as legit tactic) and Aeterna instant killing mobs. They need to buff Death's cast speed and overall make the ring a viable weapon for endgame. Then chapter 13 feels like you actually earned something (besides the cool and semi useful sword)
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Jan 15, 2017 11:50
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WaltherFeng posted:By the time you get the sword you have a lot of options. Besides the whole sword moveset you can also nuke enemies while dodging (something that should've been carried over to other chapters as legit tactic) and Aeterna instant killing mobs. Actually there is an endgame dungeon where the best strategy is equipping the ring and dodging everything and letting them holy themselves to death
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Jan 15, 2017 12:13
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WaltherFeng posted:By the time you get the sword you have a lot of options. Besides the whole sword moveset you can also nuke enemies while dodging (something that should've been carried over to other chapters as legit tactic) and Aeterna instant killing mobs. They intend to do those things with the ring
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Jan 15, 2017 12:38
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I don't think they need to buff the ring at all because it's boring to use as is. Unless they drastically change its mechanics to be something inherently different to what it is, it's pointless even if tapping circle instantly kills everything because it's not fun. Chapter 13 sucks because it flips absolutely everything about the game all at once. Changing the game to a resident evil style key gathering game with really poorly implemented stealth and removing your entire arsenal is just dumb. You can probably get away with all of those things individually, but all at once, for a good 2 hours of gameplay overall is really bad.
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Jan 15, 2017 12:58
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Is any of the friend specific equipment good for trying out endgame? For Ignis I have the one where he uses Hi Potions on Noct. Pretty good but the guy went through like 20 of them in an hour For Gladio I saw he gets a Megaphone that boosts the entire party's regen, and apparently stacking it with your own regen stuff makes you really tanky in combat and makes it almost free to use royal weapons. i haven't gotten it and am wondering if it's worth getting now. There's also equipment for Gladio and Prompto for fighting big/small enemies that seems eh. I saw people with 3 slots of that accessory you get from beating the robot superboss on their whole team but no thanks. Also not going to get 3 dark matters or whatever Also for Adamantoise the allies pretty much do nothing anyway right?
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Jan 15, 2017 14:00
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:For Gladio I saw he gets a Megaphone that boosts the entire party's regen, and apparently stacking it with your own regen stuff makes you really tanky in combat and makes it almost free to use royal weapons. i haven't gotten it and am wondering if it's worth getting now. The item effect text kinda underrepresents how good the megaphone actually is in game, +10% regen on all characters seems like it'd be a subtle effect but it's night and day in-game.
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Jan 15, 2017 14:19
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people posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UC86yQAzaxg I guess I am in fact garbo.  I am piss poor at dodge-heavy action games like these. It's just really hard to tell when I need to dodge in the middle of battle, when there's a lot going on and I'm already focusing on attacking - plus, some attacks just can't be dodged. Plus, there's a delay in getting dodge started up.Maybe I'll do Gladio's training and practice dodging. Or maybe I'll just put on the Ring and try to Holy everything to death. Also adding onto the "Chapter 13 kinda sucks" pile. Honestly, if it was maybe 1/3rd the length, it would have been much better and actually kind of interesting - but the key searching and forced stealth is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy too padded out, and could have been cut almost completely. I really liked the environmental storytelling, though. It would have been better as somewhat of a story chapter. Pollyanna fucked around with this message at 15:35 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 15:31
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ImpAtom posted:It... is? The developers have actively commented on the chapter and said they plan to try to work it improve it because the criticism of it was so bad. That is as close to objectively bad as you can get. You are intentionally misrepresenting what I said and you know it. I never said it was bad to play, in fact I said the exact opposite. And literally no one has said it's hard to understand why it's bad. All of us who like it have said we understand why people don't, and you're lying whenever you continue to say this. Incidentally, you do this in almost every thread. When someone disagrees with you, you immediately start saying that your opinion is objectively right and that others is objectively wrong. See the RPG thread and any time someone says they don't like Cold Steel. Again, NO ONE IS SAYING YOU HAVE TO LIKE THE CHAPTER OR THAT THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE DON'T LIKE IT. EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS WHY YOU DON'T LIKE IT. And the developers changing the chapter is not the same as them saying it's bad. It's responding to criticism from the players. Most people think it's bad. Many of us don't. You refuse to accept that we have valid reasons for liking it. Its obstinate, and here you're relying on lying about what we're saying... to what end? What are you trying to say here?
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Jan 15, 2017 16:31
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It is the same thing as them saying it's bad. If they didn't agree that it was bad, they wouldn't be changing it as the product is released and paid for. There is no appreciable profit margin in them changing it at this point. They're doing it out of pocket because they want the entire game to be good, and while not all of the game is good and there's nothing they can do to fix that, they have the ability to fix a pointedly bad part and are doing so. See: FFXIV 1.0. They recognised it was bad and swore on their honour that they'd fix it up and make it playable for people who did buy it. It's a much smaller scale, but it's essentially the same thing.
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Jan 15, 2017 16:38
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I couldn't get the dodge-and-zap down from chapter 13 either. I used the tried and true FFXI kiting method to have the mobs trail me and get them to bunch up, then I made sure my MP was max and cut a holy, which usually tossed out 3/4 of the pile. This worked before I had the rest of the bro tribe, and I was getting attacked by the soldiers jumping out of the pods and tons of ghosts and goblins started attacking.
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Jan 15, 2017 16:45
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I finally have a sturdy helixhorn. Today is a good day.
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Jan 15, 2017 16:52
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hagie posted:I couldn't get the dodge-and-zap down from chapter 13 either. I used the tried and true FFXI kiting method to have the mobs trail me and get them to bunch up, then I made sure my MP was max and cut a holy, which usually tossed out 3/4 of the pile. This worked before I had the rest of the bro tribe, and I was getting attacked by the soldiers jumping out of the pods and tons of ghosts and goblins started attacking. The dodging is actually super eay. Just hold square and don't let it go. If you have MP, it'll automatically cast holy when you dodge. You can clear that entire section literally just by holding square and walking into the enemies and maybe topping off with an ether every so often.
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Jan 15, 2017 16:59
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Josuke Higashikata posted:It is the same thing as them saying it's bad. If they didn't agree that it was bad, they wouldn't be changing it as the product is released and paid for. There is no appreciable profit margin in them changing it at this point. They're doing it out of pocket because they want the entire game to be good, and while not all of the game is good and there's nothing they can do to fix that, they have the ability to fix a pointedly bad part and are doing so. They're responding to fan criticism. It's a good thing for them to do it, and clearly more people think it's bad than think it's good. They're humble enough that they can admit "people don't like this and we should fix it so they do". They do stand to benefit monetarily because 13 has such a bad reputation that I'm sure it's keeping people from buying the game.
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Jan 15, 2017 17:04
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So wait, how are people getting spells with like 70 casts? Are you pouring like 30 of an enhancing item in, or is there some way to stack flasks of the same spell that I'm missing?
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Jan 15, 2017 17:07
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ImpAtom posted:It... is? The developers have actively commented on the chapter and said they plan to try to work it improve it because the criticism of it was so bad. That is as close to objectively bad as you can get. I, too, get mad at other people's opinions about SquareEnix's smash hit rpg Final Fantasy 15 that differ from the ones I personally hold.
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Jan 15, 2017 17:45
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I keep seeing people talking about forced stealth in Chapter 13 but I don't remember that shut at all. I saw there were tons of wall corners to hide in, but the enemies were easy enough to just drop a black hole on then not need to worry.Bruegels Fuckbooks posted:The item effect text kinda underrepresents how good the megaphone actually is in game, +10% regen on all characters seems like it'd be a subtle effect but it's night and day in-game. It's definitely useful, but gets less so when the megabosses just deal 9999 damage anyways.
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Jan 15, 2017 19:19
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The "stealth" didn't work. Every time I "hid" I got yanked out and combo'd
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Jan 15, 2017 19:21
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Is the Megaphone easy to find?
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Jan 15, 2017 19:38
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CAPT. Rainbowbeard posted:Is the Megaphone easy to find? Very easy to find, it's right there in the Playstation Store under "FFXV Season Pass"
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Jan 15, 2017 19:46
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Flint_Paper posted:I finally have a sturdy helixhorn. Today is a good day. I got it off my first Duplicorn from the hunt. Papa and baby rice FTW. (You have to break the horn). I think I got a second from the other Duplicorn, but didn't care.
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Jan 15, 2017 20:50
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Flint_Paper posted:I finally have a sturdy helixhorn. Today is a good day. I think I got mine the first time I did the hunt because I already had one when he asked for it.
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Jan 15, 2017 20:58
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The Pirate Captain posted:You refuse to accept that we have valid reasons for liking it. I'm sure you like it. I just think you're incapable of separating "I like it" from "it's well designed." Because A does not equal B. I like a lot of things that are badly designed because they hit some emotional or mental trigger in me which makes me overlook their fuckups. That doesn't mean they don't exist or I'm unwilling to recognize them. You on the other hand are just wringing your hand and going "Oh well I like it so that must mean it's good" because... I don't know, you apparently think everything you like is also good? I've said repeatedly there is nothing wrong with liking the chapter. And again this entire stupid goddamn conversation started not because I said it was wrong to like the chapter but that it is easy to understand why people didn't like the chapter. Something you agree with. Yet for some reason you want to twist that into "you're wrong and bad for liking it!" The Pirate Captain posted:See the RPG thread and any time someone says they don't like Cold Steel. The thread where I've repeatedly criticized Trails of Cold Steel? Or go take a look in the Falcom thread where I actually criticized it a lot and had people telling me I was being too critical about it? Hell, I can criticize ToCS right here if you want. Do you want me to talk about its lovely over-reliance on unwinnable boss battles? It's basically nil difficult curve? It's crappy-even-for-a-JRPG graphics that somehow manage to have terrible framerate problems? It's weird goddamn sister-lusting plotline? The fact that it's maybe a game and a half of plot spread over three games? It's got a boatload of flaws and someone disliking it isn't wrong for doing so. I still like it despite those flaws but I'm not going to pretend they don't exist. Millennial Sexlord posted:I, too, get mad at other people's opinions about SquareEnix's smash hit rpg Final Fantasy 15 that differ from the ones I personally hold. I don't care that people have different opinions, I do care that I got goddamn leapt on out of nowhere because I dared to mildly criticize a segment in response to someone's comment about that segment which has somehow turned into me claiming people are Wrong for Liking It or something. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 21:11
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:Is any of the friend specific equipment good for trying out endgame? The Ignis potion / hi potion / elixir accessories are only useful for the costlemark menace dungeon. The 50% extra damage to large enemies acc for Gladio is useful all game and by far the best one. The Prompto version for small enemies is worthless because Prompto's damage is worthless. CAPT. Rainbowbeard posted:Is the Megaphone easy to find? It's in the Myrlwood so yea it's easy to find.
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Jan 15, 2017 21:11
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I really liked Chapter 13 but it wore out its welcome. If you cut out the backtracking and made it much shorter than it would have been a fantastic chapter. As it stands it's a really cool idea that is just implemented poorly. I really loving loved Ardyn talking poo poo over the intercom along with the environment in general. The ring would be way better if it were useful outside of that chapter. By the time you leave that chapter, most of the enemies you fight are immune to the black hole and they're either immune to death or it takes too long to be useful. It would have been nice if I could have used it in Castlemark because gently caress those demon pits.
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Jan 15, 2017 21:13
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ImpAtom posted:I'm sure you like it. I just think you're incapable of separating "I like it" from "it's well designed." Again you are misrepresenting what I said, it seems like that's the only thing you can do. IN MY OPINION it is well designed. IN YOUR OPINION it is not. I never once said it was good either, every single time I said that in my opinion, it was good, or at least implied that that was my opinion and not an objective fact. For like the thousandth time, I fully understand that in your opinion it is not well designed, and I invite you to count the number of times I said your opinion was wrong. Spoiler: it's zero. I never said everything I like was good, and if you think I did I invite you to quote me. If you can't, you should probably work on your reading comprehension. Every one of your replies had been a strawman, arguing against things no one ever said. There is no contradiction, no one doesn't understand why people dislike the chapter, and I never once said or implied that something is good just because I like it. The problem is that you keep saying that your opinion is OBJECTIVELY the right one, which is obviously wrong. When you say stuff like that it makes you sound like an egotist and kiiiiiinda like an rear end in a top hat. There is no objective right when it comes to opinions about video games. The main point, which I've reiterated a bunch of times, is that people are allowed to have different opinions about things and no one is objectively right when it comes to a creative art. Why is that so hard for you to understand? You've never once addressed this point even though I've mentioned it in almost all of my posts. If you want to argue, argue about this paragraph because 100% of my argument boils down to this. ImpAtom posted:The thread where I've repeatedly criticized Trails of Cold Steel? Or go take a look in the Falcom thread where I actually criticized it a lot and had people telling me I was being too critical about it? Edit: Missed your edit. I don't care about Cold Steel, I played the first hour and it was waaaayyy too anime for me. I don't even hate anime, but that game was just too over the top. What I was saying is that you've pulled this same thing in regards to Cold Steel, I think when people were saying that the game bored them and you said stuff like that it was objectively not boring. You throw around words like objective, indefensible, etc in lots of threads when what you're saying is just, like, your opinion, maaaaan. In the creative arts there is no objectivity. Everything i up for interpretation and personal tastes. Is fallout boy objectively bad? I think they suck but not objectively so. Is chapter 13 objectively bad? You think it sucks but that's not an objective fact. The Pirate Captain fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 21:26
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The Pirate Captain posted:There is no objective right when it comes to opinions about video games. Sure there is. Opinions are not magical barriers that mean everything is right. You can certainly disagree on things but there are plenty of places where no amount of liking something goes hand-in-hand with it being considered good. If a move, for example, crashed the game or corrupts your save file no amount of "Well, it's a really cool move and that bug doesn't come up that much" will change the fact it's an objectively badly designed move. (And this isn't a hypothetical example, it has happened before in Final Fantasy.) I don't think my opinions are flawless or always right but I also don't think my opinions are the same thing as discussion what is and isn't well designed. I can personally like something and tear apart its massive design flaws even if those design flaws actually lead to something I liked or enjoyed. I can dislike something a ton and still point out what it does well or what I think is well executed even if it isn't well executed for me personally or I wish they hadn't done that. There are certainly times when design decisions are mutually exclusive and neither side is necessarily bad so much as aiming at different design decisions but that doesn't make them immune to criticism either. Even when discussing art you're not immune to contradictions in quality. Something being good from an artistic perspective doesn't inherently mean it is good from a gameplay perspective and almost everything I've said about FFXV is about its gameplay perspective. You'll recall I even agreed with you on what it was doing from a thematic perspective and merely disagreed that it was well executed gameplay-wise, something which is about as uncontroversial an opinion as possible considering they have openly said it has problems with gameplay. You seem to think that I'm going "heh, my opinion is right, all the stuff I like is good and all the stuff I don't like it bad" which is helluva false. Most of the stuff I like is pretty lovely and I only like it because it hits an emotional or mental beat for me and if I wanted to genuinely criticize it then I'd be talking more about how lovely it is. Hell, I do that all the time. I criticize the hell out of FF as a franchise and still love it despite its many, many, many flaws. My opinion is that Final Fantasy 6 is great. If you want to actually discuss Final Fantasy 6's mechanics then it is kind of a garbage fire held together by strong presentation and my opinion is probably heavily tainted by nostalgia. Edit: This isn't to say there aren't plenty of times or places where opinions are just opinions. v  v I'm not remotely arrogant or dumb enough to claim that all opinions have an objective right answer and there's plenty of places to discuss things even when it comes to gameplay design because there are different schools of thought on what is good gameplay design. I'm certainly not dumb enough to claim that the gameplay design I like is inherently the same as good design. In some cases it's exactly the opposite.The Pirate Captain posted:
And if you want a lie, how about this one? The current speedrun including skipping cutscenes for that chapter is a little under an hour. Yet you're pulling out "oh well I finished it in less than one hour." If you're going to call me a liar who is making stuff up then you shouldn't be doing it yourself. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:04 on Jan 15, 2017 |
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Jan 15, 2017 21:49
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