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OK adding the DS and 3DS numbers together is pretty disingenuous, because it's not like that hides that massive contraction in the dedicated handheld market or anything.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:38
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Bass Bottles posted:"Sell the Switch without the dock" is going to become the new "Sell the Wii U without the gamepad." The difference is that the gamepad was necessary. The dock isn't at all.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:38
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3 of your last 4 consoles combining for 300m+ units is pretty good if you ask me.Pureauthor posted:OK adding the DS and 3DS numbers together is pretty disingenuous, because it's not like that hides that massive contraction in the dedicated handheld market or anything. The 3DS has outsold all other current gen systems (PS4, XB1, Wii U, and Vita) so that's hardly a poor showing
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Jan 17, 2017 07:39
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The Pirate Captain posted:Their handheld division is hugely profitable for them. Their console division, right now, is not, and as a console the Switch looks no more appealing than a WiiU. Combined, the DS and 3DS have sold well over 200 million units. Have any consoles sold that well? Do you think the Switch, as a console, would get even close to that? Apple cannibalizes themselves to keep people entrenched in their ecosystem, which just so happens to have the largest library of digital content (movies, games, apps, music, etc) on earth. Nintendo has nothing even close to approaching that. They'd be committing suicide by killing off their only means of profit. (Doubly so, when you count the amiibos)
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Jan 17, 2017 07:40
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Philip Rivers posted:If you don't like the dock then I don't get you tbh. $300 is eminently reasonable and packing it in with the console opens up design space for games that are optimized for either mode instead of relegating screencasting to a gimmick that probably won't see widespread adoption. BotW on a handheld is cool, but really, I mostly want to play it on the TV. There will also certainly be games that are good to play on your TV, but are better portable titles. It's a bit of a gamble but I think overtly aiming towards a unified home console/portable platform is smart and good. Developers other than Nintendo are going to prioritize one version over the other. Meaning that the Handheld version will be really good and the TV version look like a cheap HD remake, or that the TV version will look really good and the handheld one will look like a cheap XBone port. This is going to happen no matter what, under either the handheld priority or the TV one. And who cares if TV gets widespread adoption It's there for the people who want it, the device is cheaper for people who don't want it. There were a loooooot of people earlier in the thread who said they would buy it if it was $250 but not if it was $300.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:42
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Andrast posted:The Wii sold over 100 million units. So literally less than half as much as the DS family.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:42
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The Pirate Captain posted:So literally less than half as much as the DS family. That's only below PS1 and PS2 all time for home consoles, and also nearly 2x what the 3DS has sold?? 100m is very good.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:44
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The Pirate Captain posted:So literally less than half as much as the DS family. You are comparing the sales of two consoles to sales of one console. Playstation and Playstation 2 sold 255 million combined.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:46
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Mahoning posted:Nintendo has nothing even close to approaching that. That's not true, if the opened up the VC options they would have the best gaming library any console has ever seen.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:46
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Maybe nintendo wants to keep making money long into the future instead of chasing market share and short term profits?
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Jan 17, 2017 07:48
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NecroMonster posted:Maybe nintendo wants to keep making money long into the future instead of chasing market share and short term profits? *looks at how Nintendo systems have continuously declined in sales except for the DS/Wii generation* Yes, I see now. Clearly they are playing the long game.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:49
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Andrast posted:You are comparing the sales of two consoles to sales of one console. Combine the sales of the Wii, and the WiiU. You know they are going to have multiple revisions of the Switch. And the Playstation comparison is not fair, on three out of four console the PS has vastly outsold whatever Nintendo put out, and the one where Nintendo did better is not nearly enough to make up for the difference. Of two our of two portable generations, Nintendo vastly outsold PS. It's apples and oranges, We're talking of the Nintendo here, not its competitors.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:50
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Pureauthor posted:*looks at how Nintendo systems have continuously declined in sales except for the DS/Wii generation* Wow, if you take away their successes, they've only had failures, what a profound statement
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Jan 17, 2017 07:51
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Philip Rivers posted:The 3DS has outsold all other current gen systems (PS4, XB1, Wii U, and Vita) so that's hardly a poor showing This is my entire point. Nintendo portables sell well.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:51
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Pureauthor posted:*looks at how Nintendo systems have continuously declined in sales except for the DS/Wii generation* Maybe you should look at microsoft gamings profits and sony's situation over the last handfull of years
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Jan 17, 2017 07:51
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Nintendo home consoles sell poorly so I would think replacing your home console with a sick portable that screencasts is pretty much the exact right way to go about things.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:52
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The Pirate Captain posted:Combine the sales of the Wii, and the WiiU. You know they are going to have multiple revisions of the Switch. The 3DS is not a revision of the DS and the Wii U loving bombed. I don't even disagree with you that the handheld division is what makes Nintendo money, your arguments have just been weird.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:52
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Lest we forget the all important dumb consumer. If they're showing commercials on tv of people popping the thing on and off the dock, and little Johnny's mom goes to buy him a Switch for his birthday only to either a) get home and find out little Johnny can't play on their 65" tv, or b) that she's gotta shell out another $80 just to make it do what it's doing in the commercial (and in the loving NAME OF THE PRODUCT). Either way it turns into bad press for Nintendo. They don't need that.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:52
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I don't think anyone is arguing that Sony has owned the console market for all but a tiny fraction of their life in video games.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:53
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Handhelds have always sold more than home consoles. That's because they're typically cheaper. There's something off in how you're comparing the numbers.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:53
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NecroMonster posted:Maybe you should look at microsoft gamings profits and sony's situation over the last handfull of years Yeah, the console market is shrinking significantly. Which only exacerbates Nintendo's problem, which is that they are repeatedly unable to deliver the experience that the remaining console audience expects w/r/t online/social features, third party support, and GRAPHIX. iPads and iPhones stole the casual audience and it's never coming back.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:54
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Bass Bottles posted:Yeah, the console market is shrinking significantly. Which only exacerbates Nintendo's problem, which is that they are repeatedly unable to deliver the experience that the remaining console audience expects w/r/t online/social features, third party support, and GRAPHIX. Isn't the PS4 selling really well?
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Jan 17, 2017 07:55
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Modus Pwnens posted:Wow, if you take away their successes, they've only had failures, what a profound statement I'll elaborate. The Wii/DS explosion was due to Nintendo specifically targeting the people who would never buy a game system and enticing them to buy a game system. The software produced was given the derogatory title of 'non-games' because gamers and Internet. These people are still there. They still play those 'nongames' . But they do it on mobile phones and tablets and Nintendo is not getting those people back. At least, not with the Switch. And once those people are accounted for, Nintendo's decline in sales continues.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:57
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Andrast posted:Isn't the PS4 selling really well? Yeah its doing great, consoles are still a powerhouse and they probably always will be. Never got the logic of the narrative of oh for sure this is the last console generation!!
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Jan 17, 2017 07:57
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Andrast posted:Isn't the PS4 selling really well? it's selling pretty well and making sony dick all money
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Jan 17, 2017 07:58
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Andrast posted:Isn't the PS4 selling really well? It is getting more of the pie compared to last gen when PS3 was a garbage disaster for most of its life. But the pie itself has most likely shrunk.
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Jan 17, 2017 07:58
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Andrast posted:The 3DS is not a revision of the DS and the Wii U loving bombed. Look, if you want to compare numbers one to one, the 3DS, the most recent handheld, has sold roughly 60 million units. The latest console, the WiiU, has sold roughly 14 million units. In the previous generation, the Wii sold around 100 million units. The DS sold roughly 150 million units. No matter which way you slice it, the handhelds do better than the consoles do. But if you prefer, go back and change everything I said from 100(14) million units vs 200 million units to 14 million units vs 60 million units. I think you'll find the numbers look better for consoles when you do it the way I did, but going forward I'll use the second number since so many people seem to have a problem with it. So, in the last generation, Nintendo's handhelds sold four times as much as their consoles did. Why would they ever try to market something as primarily a console ever again?
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Jan 17, 2017 08:00
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Pureauthor posted:It is getting more of the pie compared to last gen when PS3 was a garbage disaster for most of its life. How were the sales of previous gen consoles compared to the current consoles at the time point?
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Jan 17, 2017 08:00
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Mahoning posted:Lest we forget the all important dumb consumer. If they're showing commercials on tv of people popping the thing on and off the dock, and little Johnny's mom goes to buy him a Switch for his birthday only to either a) get home and find out little Johnny can't play on their 65" tv, or b) that she's gotta shell out another $80 just to make it do what it's doing in the commercial (and in the loving NAME OF THE PRODUCT). Either way it turns into bad press for Nintendo. They don't need that. You can still run that exact commercial if you market it as a handheld. And I don't know how much worse Nintendo's press can get after the Switch unveiling.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:01
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Andrast posted:Isn't the PS4 selling really well? It's selling quicker, but Sony expects this generation to be shorter because the amount of people to sell consoles to has shrunk. This is almost definitely a reason they just released a more powerful PS4. Tons of their customers are now double-dipping.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:01
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I return to my original point that a pack-in Super Game Boy rules, and that's a cold hard fact.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:02
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TFRazorsaw posted:Handhelds have always sold more than home consoles. That's because they're typically cheaper. There's something off in how you're comparing the numbers. In my scenario, the handheld IS sold cheaper.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:03
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The Pirate Captain posted:In my scenario, the handheld IS sold cheaper. Your scenario is confusing to the average consumer. The last two times Nintendo confused the average consumer the WiiU and 3DS launch happened.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:04
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It's really simple: if they market the Switch as a pure handheld, they're going to ruin their 3DS cash cow and there's no guarantee they'll make up for it in Switch sales. The 3DS still has a lot of life left in it. Don't confuse people by coming out with a competitor or sending the message that you're abandoning the 3DS.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:07
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Hey guys, it's me again. The guy who doesn't know or understand anything. So, if I'm taking this thing on the go but I want to charge it as I play it I'll just need a USB-C thing, right? I'll be able to both charge it and play it at the same time? It might sound like a silly question but sometimes products are made to not work that way like the Mac mouse that has to be upside down or whatever while you charge it. Alright, thanks. Love you.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:07
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I can't find my 3DS and I got Triforce Heroes as a present for Christmas 
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Jan 17, 2017 08:07
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NecroMonster posted:Your scenario is confusing to the average consumer. No its not? It's exactly what they're doing now only in reverse? HEY! DS LOVER! HERE'S THIS AWESOME HANDHELD THAT'S LEAPS AND BOUNDS BETTER THAN ANYTHING WE'VE HAD BEFORE!!!!! Also, for free, you can play it on your TV!!! Or, for a low price, you can make that even more convenient! My way, they sell to the largest market first, and market separately to the smaller one. Nintendo is doing that only backwards. In what world does that make sense?
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Jan 17, 2017 08:09
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Philip Rivers posted:I can't find my 3DS and I got Triforce Heroes as a present for Christmas My Hyrule Edition is on SA Mart!
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Jan 17, 2017 08:09
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Mahoning posted:It's really simple: if they market the Switch as a pure handheld, they're going to ruin their 3DS cash cow and there's no guarantee they'll make up for it in Switch sales. The 3DS still has a lot of life left in it. Don't confuse people by coming out with a competitor or sending the message that you're abandoning the 3DS. We've already been over that, but cannibalizing your own business is what made Apple so successful. And, if they had waited a year and used that time to improve the battery, they'd be able to launch with way more than 5 games.
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Jan 17, 2017 08:11
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Mahoning posted:My Hyrule Edition is on SA Mart! Did you steal it from me you monster?! 
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Jan 17, 2017 08:11
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