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Tested goes on a test ride to test the Chevy Bolt. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ir4y2JwbEw No major reveals, but interesting to get someone's personal take and a very interesting observation from about 19:30 regarding the eyes' focal distance. When you look straight ahead, then glance in the mirror, your eyes don't have to change focus - even though the mirror is just a few inches from your face. They eyes stay focused at infinity (which I think is 20 feet or so) due to the magic of optics. However, if you are looking at a rear view video screen ten inches from your face, your eyes have to come down all the way from infinity to a very close focus, then back to infinity to watch the road. Since a mirror check like that only lasts a fraction of a second, it will be very irritating on long drives. I've been annoyed by this in other contexts, having to glance around a big room frequently while paying attention to a laptop screen, and I can safely say I will not buy a car which has only video screen rear view instead of glass mirrors. Since you flip between the two modes on the Bolt, I wouldn't mind that at all. Nice to have a rear view video when backing out from a spot with a fully shopping loaded car for instance - but the rear view video may as well be on the dash monitor.
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Jan 19, 2017 19:16
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People that don't adjust the steering wheel down drive me insane.
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Jan 19, 2017 19:30
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In a followup to my EV adventures, it turns out Fiat can't move any 500e even with super cheap lease rates so now they are advertising $50 a month + tax with 0* down. This is bonkers. Fine print: $49 a month + taxes for 36 months, 10k miles per year. 1st payment, TTL, and $2,500 down payment (same cost as the state rebate) required at signing. $8,500 factory rebate, up to $4,500 in clear air rebates, must qualify for lease conquest or $1,000 extra due at signing.
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Jan 19, 2017 22:19
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How is there a $2,500 downpayment when $49 * 36 months is $1,800?
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Jan 19, 2017 22:38
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kimcicle posted:In a followup to my EV adventures, it turns out Fiat can't move any 500e even with super cheap lease rates so now they are advertising $50 a month + tax with 0* down. This is bonkers. There has got to be a way I can lease one of these in Nevada. Arrgh.
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Jan 19, 2017 22:48
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blugu64 posted:How is there a $2,500 downpayment when $49 * 36 months is $1,800? The downpayment is in addition to your monthly payments. He is going to have to pay $2500 + Tax title and licence as well as his first payment up front. Then $49 each month after for 35 more months. It will probably cost somewhere around $6000 over the course of the lease which is around $166/mo of actual cost. E: Plus anything he doesn't qualify for like the lease conquest rebate.
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Jan 20, 2017 01:49
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You can buy a used one with 20k miles for 6 grand. how terrible are they?
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Jan 20, 2017 01:53
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kill me now posted:The downpayment is in addition to your monthly payments. He is going to have to pay $2500 + Tax title and licence as well as his first payment up front. Then $49 each month after for 35 more months. It will probably cost somewhere around $6000 over the course of the lease which is around $166/mo of actual cost. Pretty much hit it on the nose, except there is a rebate of $2,500 from the state of California for getting an electric car. They are saying it's $0 down since the $2,500 down payment would be coming back to you after the car has been registered and you completed the paperwork for the rebate. Powershift posted:You can buy a used one with 20k miles for 6 grand. After my last test drive, I came to the conclusion that it's not half bad. It does all the things a small city car needs to do (transport 1 or 2 adults around, maybe some small luggage) without using gas. In comparison to a regular 500 I drove back to back, it seems quieter and smoother (might be due to the extra weight of the batteries). The ergonomics leave a bit to be desired, but then again with only a 80 mile range you probably won't be sitting in this thing for more than 30 minutes at a time.
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Jan 20, 2017 02:10
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Ciaphas posted:There has got to be a way I can lease one of these in Nevada. Arrgh. Same thought but in Ohio. My DD is a Fiesta ST and my gas is paid for by my company, I have absolutely no need for another small hatchback, but $4-6 grand to have an EV for three years is interesting.
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Jan 20, 2017 03:38
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If I didn't already have two fiat 500s and two plug in hybrids I would be all over the 500e. It's quick, and arguably the best looking 500. Thooooouugh there is the issue that my wife takes our two kids to daycare on her way to work, and I pick them up on the way home. As someone who has indeed put two car seats in the back of a fiat 500, I can attest that it is not pleasant for anyone involved. My 500 is a convertible, and the easiest way to get my infant in the car is to lower him into his seat through the open roof.
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Jan 20, 2017 03:45
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Ola posted:No major reveals, but interesting to get someone's personal take and a very interesting observation from about 19:30 regarding the eyes' focal distance. When you look straight ahead, then glance in the mirror, your eyes don't have to change focus - even though the mirror is just a few inches from your face. They eyes stay focused at infinity (which I think is 20 feet or so) due to the magic of optics. However, if you are looking at a rear view video screen ten inches from your face, your eyes have to come down all the way from infinity to a very close focus, then back to infinity to watch the road. Since a mirror check like that only lasts a fraction of a second, it will be very irritating on long drives. I've been annoyed by this in other contexts, having to glance around a big room frequently while paying attention to a laptop screen, and I can safely say I will not buy a car which has only video screen rear view instead of glass mirrors. It’s not like other car marker haven’t solved this problem: bury the display in the dash and use optics to put it in focus at some suitably large distance.
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Jan 20, 2017 03:59
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eyebeem posted:My 500 is a convertible, and the easiest way to get my infant in the car is to lower him into his seat through the open roof. The mental image of this killed me.
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Jan 20, 2017 06:15
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eyebeem posted:If I didn't already have two fiat 500s and two plug in hybrids I would be all over the 500e. It's quick, and arguably the best looking 500. Thankfully I only got one kid in a carseat so in a pinch I think we can toss him in the back seat with a car seat, but I can totally see coming from the back area being easier to get the kid in the seat. You're probably the best person for two questions about the fiat 500 I didn't get to test: 1. can you fit the bugaboo stroller in the back, and 2. can you fit a road bike in the car with the seats down?
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Jan 20, 2017 06:26
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kimcicle posted:Thankfully I only got one kid in a carseat so in a pinch I think we can toss him in the back seat with a car seat, but I can totally see coming from the back area being easier to get the kid in the seat. Bugaboo? Come on, man. We have a Stokke Xplory. Also... also... a Bugaboo Donkey. And no, neither of them fit in the 500s. As for road bikes? Only in my wife's hatchback 500. Assuming you aren't asking for humor purposes only, I'll say that I believe the 500e has a smaller trunk area than the regular 500, and a 56cm road bike barely fits in the 500 as it is. 
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Jan 20, 2017 07:07
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Ciaphas posted:There has got to be a way I can lease one of these in Nevada. Arrgh. Everyone not in CA/OR is playing the used market, unfortunately.
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Jan 20, 2017 15:10
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eyebeem posted:Assuming you aren't asking for humor purposes only Nope, I was serious. Thanks for the helpful replies. I'm seeing stupid good E-Golf deals in NorCal though, that for the same price as the Fiat 500e I could have a 2016 E-Golf. I know the ranges are very similar, but I think the E-Golf would be a gazillion times easier to live with.
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Jan 21, 2017 00:37
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kimcicle posted:Nope, I was serious. Thanks for the helpful replies. As a Fiat fanboy and apologist that really likes the 500e, you'd be stupid to buy a 500e over an E-Golf if pricing is anywhere near similar.
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Jan 21, 2017 01:19
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Yeah, the E-Golf is a really nice car with DC fast charging, adjustable regen that enables one pedal driving (up to a certain level) and optional adaptive cruise control. It can charge from the same stations as the Bolt, which might get a lot more stations built for it in the coming years. On the other hand, VW is probably not far from announcing a new model with more range, maybe that's why they're so cheap.
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Jan 21, 2017 10:25
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eyebeem posted:As a Fiat fanboy and apologist that really likes the 500e, you'd be stupid to buy a 500e over an E-Golf if pricing is anywhere near similar. Not to mention that the Fiat 500 will probably be noisy as hell compared to the E-Golf. Edit: According to something called "Auto Decibel Database" the current leaf is louder than my current small loud ICE car. If that's true, that's terrifying. MrOnBicycle fucked around with this message at 10:52 on Jan 21, 2017 |
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Jan 21, 2017 10:47
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MrOnBicycle posted:Edit: According to something called "Auto Decibel Database" the current leaf is louder than my current small loud ICE car. If that's true, that's terrifying. How could that possibly be?
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Jan 21, 2017 14:29
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Subjunctive posted:How could that possibly be? lovely sound dampening combined with thin metal and loud Eco-tyres sounds plausible. I forgot to mention that it's at 60-70mph. Even the Model S(that has decent dB-values) well has (for some reason) lots of threads on various forums about sound dampening it. Maybe the lack of engine sound makes the road noise more apparent, or maybe the sound dampening doesn't live up to the price tag. No idea, never been in one.
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Jan 21, 2017 15:33
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MrOnBicycle posted:lovely sound dampening combined with thin metal and loud Eco-tyres sounds plausible. I forgot to mention that it's at 60-70mph. I'm sure in a quest to squeeze out as many miles of range as possible the brands are building their EV's at light as possible and sound deadening material can be fairly heavy. The model S isn't bad for an average car when it comes to road noise but its awful compared to other $100k + sedans.
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Jan 21, 2017 15:48
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kill me now posted:I'm sure in a quest to squeeze out as many miles of range as possible the brands are building their EV's at light as possible and X can be fairly heavy. The model S isn't bad for an average car when it comes to Y but its awful compared to other $100k + sedans. The Model S story.
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Jan 21, 2017 16:47
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kill me now posted:I'm sure in a quest to squeeze out as many miles of range as possible the brands are building their EV's at light as possible and sound deadening material can be fairly heavy. The model S isn't bad for an average car when it comes to road noise but its awful compared to other $100k + sedans. Yep, and to be honest it's not worth the range. I've come to realize that having a quiet car is probably one of the most important features I'd want. At least when it's a car that's intended to be a cruiser / GT car. Having a "noisy" car is fine for town driving since it's never especially loud at town speeds. But boy is it draining when driving for more than 30 minutes at 60-70mph. As a comparison, I drove for 6-7h straight (well one quick stop for diesel) in a Volvo V70 and didn't feel tired at all. I drive for 40 minutes in my current car and I feel shattered. All because of the noise. I tolerate it because the car was cheap and I drive in the city 90% of the time. Hopefully it'll quiet down a bit when it's time to buy summer tyres.
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Jan 21, 2017 17:14
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kill me now posted:I'm sure in a quest to squeeze out as many miles of range as possible the brands are building their EV's at light as possible and sound deadening material can be fairly heavy. The model S isn't bad for an average car when it comes to road noise but its awful compared to other $100k + sedans. The RWD first gens are pretty noisy, due to as you say, little sound deadening material used and also the frunk acting as a resonance chamber. The newest gen with the big HEPA filter up front plus more deadening material is a lot better. Glass roof doesn't help, particularly in tunnels, but that's true for most cars I guess.
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Jan 21, 2017 17:20
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kill me now posted:I'm sure in a quest to squeeze out as many miles of range as possible the brands are building their EV's at light as possible and sound deadening material can be fairly heavy. The model S isn't bad for an average car when it comes to road noise but its awful compared to other $100k + sedans. Yeah, there's a fair bit of noise at 75, but I've never been in a $100K ICE car at speed so I can't compare. All that focus on weight and a huge glass roof...
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Jan 21, 2017 17:34
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Electric cars are nice standing still in that you get the "holy poo poo it's quiet" effect that you also get with start-stop equipped regular cars, but road noise is the main thing I notice above maybe 30 mph unless you are flooring it. If you come to phoenix you can enjoy the rubberized asphalt though!
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Jan 21, 2017 17:36
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hifi posted:Electric cars are nice standing still in that you get the "holy poo poo it's quiet" effect that you also get with start-stop equipped regular cars, but road noise is the main thing I notice above maybe 30 mph unless you are flooring it. The Soul EV is just as quiet as the regular gas Soul when it comes to tire and wind noise. Not that the Soul is paragon of silence but its decent in its class and when you subtract the engine noise its pleasant enough.
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Jan 21, 2017 20:00
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My Cmax Energi is nice and quiet in ev mode, and has the loudest, most intrusively unnapealing engine noise as soon as the ICE kicks in. 75mph on the highway is unpleasantly loud. Hooray for Atkinson cycle. And I own a loving Abarth 500.
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Jan 21, 2017 20:49
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On coarse seal road surfaces I can't hear the petrol engine in my car at all, it's easily drowned out by tyre noise. This is pretty typical, it's only on really low geared cars like my mum's Suzuki Swift that engine becomes at all noticeable.
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Jan 22, 2017 04:56
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The worst thing about winter is the engine kicks on a lot more even when charged because batteries hate cold, so my car vibrates till I reach speed, it's really noticeable in my fusion plug in
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Jan 22, 2017 15:08
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eyebeem posted:My 500 is a convertible, and the easiest way to get my infant in the car is to lower him into his seat through the open roof.
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Jan 22, 2017 15:29
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Collateral Damage posted:What if it's raining? Put child in car, put car in $1200 stroller.
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Jan 22, 2017 15:35
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Collateral Damage posted:What if it's raining? Probably wouldn't be one of the days I drive the convertible. I live in southern California and I still only drive it a few days per month.
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Jan 22, 2017 21:48
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I was under the impression that model s is pretty quiet even at speed because of all the batteries insulating from road noise, is it actually pretty loud?
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Jan 23, 2017 00:48
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Stefan Prodan posted:I was under the impression that model s is pretty quiet even at speed because of all the batteries insulating from road noise, is it actually pretty loud? It's quiet compared to just about every other car I've driven at speed, keeping in mind it's also the only $100k car I've driven for more than a couple minutes.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:39
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Stefan Prodan posted:I was under the impression that model s is pretty quiet even at speed because of all the batteries insulating from road noise, is it actually pretty loud? It's really wind noise more than road noise, I think.
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Jan 23, 2017 01:49
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Subjunctive posted:It's really wind noise more than road noise, I think. And more wind noise coming from the owner than coming from the air.
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Jan 23, 2017 02:26
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Powershift posted:And more wind noise coming from the owner than coming from the air. ?
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Jan 23, 2017 02:28
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Subjunctive posted:It's really wind noise more than road noise, I think. Depends on the road surface and tyres in use.
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Jan 23, 2017 04:40
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