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Would Torpor Orb really have been a terrible thing to include in this set?
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Jan 23, 2017 17:33
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Pithing needle is such an easy safety valve in a standard they wanted combo to exist on its loving weird that it wasn't printed. Like this is going to scare them off standard combo forever which is sad because it's not the combos that are a problem, it's the lack of answers to them.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:41
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Skyl3lazer posted:Pithing needle is such an easy safety valve in a standard they wanted combo to exist on its loving weird that it wasn't printed. Like this is going to scare them off standard combo forever which is sad because it's not the combos that are a problem, it's the lack of answers to them. Stoddard at least seemed to understand that the balance of power between threats and answers was at issue in the article he wrote about the bannings. Open question whether they respond by making threats weaker or answers stronger, though.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:42
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The cards they banned were mostly not combo pieces, they've already acknowledged not having good enough answers is the primary cause of the problems right now.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:43
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Skyl3lazer posted:Pithing needle is such an easy safety valve in a standard they wanted combo to exist on its loving weird that it wasn't printed. Like this is going to scare them off standard combo forever which is sad because it's not the combos that are a problem, it's the lack of answers to them. Authority of the Councils is a good answer. Anything that plays white should be packing 2-3.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:44
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TheKingofSprings posted:The cards they banned were mostly not combo pieces, they've already acknowledged not having good enough answers is the primary cause of the problems right now. They're so scared of control being a deck that answers to anything are far and few between and loving difficult to use efficiently. 1BB for destroy target creature or planeswalker is not good enough.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:47
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mcmagic posted:They also made this worse by going back to the longer rotations...This deck is going to be in standard for 2 years and anything that they print that is even decent in a control shell is going to make it more oppressive. What if the control card is also a tribal cat hoser? -2/-2 to all cats? Checkmate. 
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Jan 23, 2017 17:49
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http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=111064 in what world do you play Bant Eldrazi with no Thought-Knot? Trying to avoid Fatal Push?
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Jan 23, 2017 17:49
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ShaneB posted:http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=111064 The fact that a deck like that can top 8 a big event shows how stupid the card "Eldrazi Temple" is. There isn't one good creature in that deck other than 4 Nobles.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:51
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mcmagic posted:The fact that a deck like that can top 8 a big event shows how stupid the card "Eldrazi Temple" is. There isn't one good creature in that deck other than 4 Nobles. 1 land that makes otherwise mostly bulk creatures bad doesn't need a ban. It enables those creatures to be played but at no point has it been oppressive. The deck is actually just boring to play but your reasons for hating eldrazi temple and posting up bant eldrazi as an excuse are weak. Also eldrazi displacer is a great card independent of that deck.
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Jan 23, 2017 17:58
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Fingers McLongDong posted:1 land that makes otherwise mostly bulk creatures bad doesn't need a ban. It enables those creatures to be played but at no point has it been oppressive. The deck is actually just boring to play but your reasons for hating eldrazi temple and posting up bant eldrazi as an excuse are weak. It's not played in non-temple decks anymore. And it sees zero Standard play.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:02
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mcmagic posted:It's not played in non-temple decks anymore. And it sees zero Standard play. It's played in D&T I believe
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Jan 23, 2017 18:05
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mcmagic posted:It's not played in non-temple decks anymore. And it sees zero Standard play. Doesn't make it a bad card. It gets tossed in gw hatebears decks but that's not much argument, I'll admit. It's just that without temple it's not been quite efficient enough to abuse.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:06
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Also if you look closely at that list you'll notice it's 9 short in the maindeck
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Jan 23, 2017 18:06
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mcmagic why haven't we seen you win any opens or pro tours? clearly our magic knowledge is inferior to yours. why aren't we watching you claim victory after victory on the circuit?
80s James Hetfield fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Jan 23, 2017 |
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Jan 23, 2017 18:08
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Count Bleck posted:They're so scared of control being a deck that answers to anything are far and few between and loving difficult to use efficiently. At least they've admitted this is a problem and will be addressing it going forward. Its still going to be too late, and knowing them, probably too little.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:10
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mcmagic posted:Authority of the Councils is a good answer. Anything that plays white should be packing 2-3. Its an okay answer. The problem is that nahiri might be the best artifact/enchantment hoser in standard atm and it can slot into the same deck. Sickening fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Jan 23, 2017 |
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Jan 23, 2017 18:10
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Sickening posted:Its an okay answer. I actually have found the card is just bonkers on the play even aggressive decks in general. The problem is that nahiri might be the best artifact/enchantment hoser in standard atm. Nahiri is great. It's another reason the Cat deck is dumb since it's just another backdoor way to complete the combo a lot of times while also fighting hate. TheKingofSprings posted:It's played in D&T I believe It was for a while but I believe that has fallen out of favor. Fingers McLongDong posted:Doesn't make it a bad card. It gets tossed in gw hatebears decks but that's not much argument, I'll admit. It's just that without temple it's not been quite efficient enough to abuse. I think you're pretty much agreeing with me. It would see fringe play at most without Temple. I just don't think Bant Eldrazi is a deck that promotes fun gameplay to play with or against. mcmagic fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Jan 23, 2017 |
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Jan 23, 2017 18:13
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mcmagic posted:It's not played in non-temple decks anymore. And it sees zero Standard play. Bank Eldrazi standard made the top 64 at the open. It had Thought-Knot in it.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:15
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TwistedNails posted:Bank Eldrazi standard made the top 64 at the open. It had Thought-Knot in it. Did not see that. OK it sees fringe standard play.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:17
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mcmagic posted:I think you're pretty much agreeing with me. It would see fringe play at most without Temple. I just don't think Bant Eldrazi is a deck that promotes fun gameplay to play with or against. Kinda agreeing but also disagreeing. I think displacer is a good card by itself, it's just much more abuseable with temple. I tried bant eldrazi and found it boring to play, but I don't think it's hurting the format and other people do find it fun. If personal opinions about "fun gameplay" were metrics to ban something, we'd have nothing to play. At least I'd never have to play against ad nauseum, valakut, or tron again.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:25
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I personally really dislike temple. I think the decks that rely on it are broken when its available or bad when its not. Bant eldrazi really feels like a deck that only has a good matchup against b/g/x and not much else. Its a deck that wants to pump b/g/x decks out of a tournament while not making the top 8 itself.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:29
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Sickening posted:I personally really dislike temple. I think the decks that rely on it are broken when its available or bad when its not. I mean.... I'm good with that. gently caress b/g/x for not axtually having a "bad" matchup. E: N.B. i do not play eldrazi, I'm nuat glad those who do take out gbx
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Jan 23, 2017 18:35
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mehall posted:I mean.... G/B/X has plenty of bad matchups that aren't bant eldrazi.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:38
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Sickening posted:I personally really dislike temple. I think the decks that rely on it are broken when its available or bad when its not. Except it's not pushing them out of the format at all. Jund/abzan are the top 2 percentage wise on mtggoldfish and in the upper percentages on mtgtop8. Eldrazi just isn't good enough in a wide meta to have any effect on anything and meanwhile it let's people play with their eldrazi dudes that they like.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:46
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Fingers McLongDong posted:Except it's not pushing them out of the format at all. Jund/abzan are the top 2 percentage wise on mtggoldfish and in the upper percentages on mtgtop8. Eldrazi just isn't good enough in a wide meta to have any effect on anything and meanwhile it let's people play with their eldrazi dudes that they like. I am not saying its pushing it out of the format. Jund/Junk is so heavily played right now because of push.
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Jan 23, 2017 18:47
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TheKingofSprings posted:It's played in D&T I believe Lists that are running recruiter probably aren't running displacer
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Jan 23, 2017 19:30
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mcmagic posted:It's not played in non-temple decks anymore. And it sees zero Standard play. It saw play in the great Tier 2 U/W Panharmonicon deck, until that deck got hellbanned out of the format. 
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Jan 23, 2017 19:46
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Mezzanon posted:It saw play in the great Tier 2 U/W Panharmonicon deck, until that deck got hellbanned out of the format. The point is that the card's raw power on it's own isn't enough for it to see a lot of play without synergy.
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Jan 23, 2017 19:51
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Well gently caress, Walking Ballista spiked. I think I need to pick some up for MUD.
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Jan 23, 2017 19:57
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Incitatus posted:Well gently caress, Walking Ballista spiked. I think I need to pick some up for MUD. When all the mythics in a set are terrible it opens it up for random 15 dollar rares...
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Jan 23, 2017 20:00
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Better a 15 dollar rare than a 50 dollar mythic
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Jan 23, 2017 20:04
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mcmagic posted:The point is that the card's raw power on it's own isn't enough for it to see a lot of play without synergy. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, I'm just complaining that my dumb T2 standard deck got banned because it was incredibly fun to play, and now I have to find a new weird deck to troll standard with. On that note: I am open to any suggestions for T1.5/T2 weird standard decks. Previous random history of standard decks: - U/R Flash (SOI before eldritch moon came out) - U/B Aristocrats (Khans) - Temur Knucks (THE-Khans) - R/B Humans (RAV-THE) (This deck was actually really good) - Predator Ooze Aggro (INN-RAV) (This deck was easily T1 but nobody else played it) Edit: I think I want a Tezzeret Control Deck to be decent. Please let that happen!
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Jan 23, 2017 20:04
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Mezzanon posted:I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, I'm just complaining that my dumb T2 standard deck got banned because it was incredibly fun to play, and now I have to find a new weird deck to troll standard with. I saw a terrible deck online that played bad vehicles with the red aura that turned them on and the 1UB one that made them into 5/5s. It could steal games for sure...
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Jan 23, 2017 20:06
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Saffi Eriksdotter is spiking and I would like to thank whoever the poster was that suggested buying them. I got a playset for like 6 bucks because I am addicted to buying old janky modern stuff. Green gearhulk is almost 20 bucks. Puresteel Paladin is 12. 
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Jan 23, 2017 20:07
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Glad the Verdurous Greenhulks I ordered Friday shipped. I'm so used to being told stores "can't find the cards" any time something I order spikes right afterward.
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Jan 23, 2017 20:08
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Incitatus posted:Well gently caress, Walking Ballista spiked. I think I need to pick some up for MUD. Same. I at least got my Hangarbacks at a decent price back in the day.
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Jan 23, 2017 21:14
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Incitatus posted:Well gently caress, Walking Ballista spiked. I think I need to pick some up for MUD. Entropic posted:Yeah the more I look at the card, the less excited I am about it being anything but a solid Limited card. The Shortest Path posted:At first I thought this was better than Triskelion but you can't reanimate it so it kind of just sucks rear end, since Commander infinite combos are what accounts for like 90% of its play. mcmagic posted:The MUCH worse Hangerback Walker
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Jan 23, 2017 21:28
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Yes, this thread sucks at card evaluation, we know.
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Jan 23, 2017 21:30
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It's all about context... Because the Snake and Verderous Gearhulk seem very good in this format, (which we couldn't have known) that is what is making Ballista good.
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Jan 23, 2017 21:33
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