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IIRC in Persona3/pre-golden 4 there was no way to extend buffs/debuffs, were there? So there will always be 1 turn where you'll be buffed/debuffed, and that is pretty bad.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:44
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ImpAtom posted:Okay. You're using an absurdly inefficient method and the boss is punishing you for it. P3 isn't a particularly difficult game by any means but you're basically an absurdly inefficient way to play it and so you're having abnormal amounts of trouble with a boss. Your protagonist is the best party member you have as well as the most flexible and with access to the strongest attacks. They should absolutely be your primary combat guy because nobody else can come close to matching them. The mere fact they have the ability to swap Persona should make that kinda clear. I'm saying you can't do anything about the turn order and buff duration. Like right now, Aigis will use Matarukaja when Attack up hasn't worn off on anyone but her. because she's going last. The Reaper will go second usually which means his Attack Down will wear off right before he attacks. There's nothing I can do about that except wait for Akihiko to lower it again which means nothing because by that point he could have already wiped out one of my party thanks to their elemental weaknesses. And my damage output is nothing special. Thunder Reign doesn't do any more damage than Mitsuru's Bafudyne or if it does, it's minimal. Far as I am concerned, my best purpose is support because, as you said, I have access to a ton of Personas which means I have access to a ton of support and healing. I mean, I know there are the Severe/Mega/whatever tier spells that are better than high tier spells and I can get those but I don't have any of them right now besides TR and, as I said, it doesn't do anything special in terms of damage. Using my MC for healing was how I played both SJ and Nocturne, too. You get the first action so it simply makes sense.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:46
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Dragonatrix posted:That pissed if you see another girl thing basically means you're now dating her and you have 60 days to go see her again. This gets reduced by 15 every time you do an S.Link scene with any other high school girl. Fail to see her for anything in that time limit or do 4 other girl scenes before? Chihiro instantly Reverses. This is good advice for real life. Doflamingo posted:Persona 3 is.... almost ten years old... *shudder* Yeah I only said almost because of FES coming out the following year.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:47
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NikkolasKing posted:And my damage output is nothing special. Thunder Reign doesn't do any more damage Okay, uh, you don't use Thunder Reign for damage. You use it to stunlock because it has a 100% Shock rate.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:49
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NikkolasKing posted:Thunder Reign doesn't do any more damage than Mitsuru's Bafudyne or if it does, it's minimal. Thunder reign has a 100% shock rate. A melee attack on a shocked enemy will always be a critical hit, which will always knock it down. If you get just the right turn order you can shock him, knock him down (then refuse the all out attack), wait for him to waste a turn getting up, and repeat.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:50
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Dragonatrix posted:Okay, uh, you don't use Thunder Reign for damage. You use it to stunlock because it has a 100% Shock rate. I know that. I was simply addressing how my MC isn't really special in terms of damage output so using him for support isn't really a big deal as far as I can see.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:51
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NikkolasKing posted:And my damage output is nothing special. Then you're doing something wrong to be honest. This isn't like a up-for-debate thing. Your protagonist can get Persona with stronger spells, more passive buffs, higher stats and abilities that the other characters can't. Certain characters in games will be absurdly strong on their own but even then they're basically catching up with your protagonist. (That said Thunder Reign isn't good just for damage but because it WILL Shock the enemy.) Which is another good example actually. Even if they're not doing damage they have access to status effect or other tactics most party members don't. A big example is Alice's Die For Me which is a better mook clearer than anything Mitsuru can ever do because it is a super high chance for instant kill on anything vulnerable to Dark. There are a lot of combat tactics which will, at minimum, let you beat bosses a lot faster and if you're crazy enough to do hard modes become almost necessary. NikkolasKing posted:Using my MC for healing was how I played both SJ and Nocturne, too. You get the first action so it simply makes sense. In SJ it makes sense because SJ has a far less flexible and powerful character. In Nocturne you absolutely were making a mistake. Your protagonist's damage output humiliates most of the cast on both Magic and especially physical builds due to you being able to more specialize him. This is true in a lot of SMT games where the fact you can hyper-pump magic/str/dex/whatever means you'll far outscale the enemies. It isn't true in Persona but makes up for it by you being able to stack special passives you can't on other characters. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 01:53
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And specific to Persona 3 the MC is the only one that can actually intelligently use Mind/Power Charge, which is a pretty big damage boost on its own.
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Jan 26, 2017 01:58
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ImpAtom posted:Then you're doing something wrong to be honest. This isn't like a up-for-debate thing. Your protagonist can get Persona with stronger spells, more passive buffs, higher stats and abilities that the other characters can't. Certain characters in games will be absurdly strong on their own but even then they're basically catching up with your protagonist. Auto-buffs wear off in no time. They make random encounters easier but not boss fights. I don't know what I could be doing wrong though. I have a few maxed SL's and I make Personas with them and I use the right attacks. But I don't see me doing way more damage than anyone else. quote:Which is another good example actually. Even if they're not doing damage they have access to status effect or other tactics most party members don't. A big example is Alice's Die For Me which is a better mook clearer than anything Mitsuru can ever do because it is a super high chance for instant kill on anything vulnerable to Dark. There are a lot of combat tactics which will, at minimum, let you beat bosses a lot faster and if you're crazy enough to do hard modes become almost necessary. I mean, I use status effects when applicable. Charm helped me beat a few Tartarus bosses. They just haven't been necessary in a long time. The game has gotten a lot easier in the second half or so. quote:In SJ it makes sense because SJ has a far less flexible and powerful character. In Nocturne you absolutely were making a mistake. Your protagonist's damage output humiliates most of the cast on both Magic and especially physical builds due to you being able to more specialize him. This is true in a lot of SMT games where the fact you can hyper-pump magic/str/dex/whatever means you'll far outscale the enemies. It isn't true in Persona but makes up for it by you being able to stack special passives you can't on other characters. Well my Tornado spamming Demifiend was how I cleared most every fight in Nocturne. I guess I was just mainly thinking of the endgame where I started to have a more physical team and they were better than me because, sadly, Nocturne preferred physical builds to my Magic one. As such, I was most useful healing them because all their best skills consume HP.
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Jan 26, 2017 02:11
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NikkolasKing posted:Auto-buffs wear off in no time. They make random encounters easier but not boss fights. You're thinking too small. Remember that your protagonist has access to elemental Boost/Amp, in addition to equipment that can further boost elements and Mind Charge. You can also set up Personas with absurdly high magic stats with items and such. You're already specializing Mitsuru that way for example, but are you doing the same for your protagonist? Keep in mind that your protagonist can do that for any element, not just Ice. An important thing to note is that (at least in Persona 3) there's nothing your teammates can do that your protagonist can't and can't do better. You have access to everything they have and you can do it better than they can. This stands out a lot more with damage (which benefits from specialization) than healing and buffs/debuffs because buffs are more limited in how they grow stronger (mostly through multi-application) and while healing benefits from boosts all your healers tend to be specialized well enough and Mediarahan is full heal no matter what. You don't really need to specialize to beat the main game (though you may hate the final boss if you don't) on Normal. It isn't a hard game, but that is the reason why you're having trouble. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 02:19 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 02:16
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ImpAtom posted:You're thinking too small. Remember that your protagonist has access to elemental Boost/Amp, in addition to equipment that can further boost elements and Mind Charge. You can also set up Personas with absurdly high magic stats with items and such. You're already specializing Mitsuru that way for example, but are you doing the same for your protagonist? Keep in mind that your protagonist can do that for any element, not just Ice. Well I don't deny I've been on autopilot for several hours now. I enjoyed specialization and mixing-and-matching skills in SJ and Nocturne but here I haven't seen much reason to bother. As such, I don't have a lot of the Boosts or any of the Charge abilities. There's also the fact the whole Social Link thing keeps me from making a lot of fusions.I never want to create any Personas that won't receive SL bonus EXP because it feels like a huge waste. It probably means I've missed out on a good majority of Personas and good abilities though. I dunno, maybe I'll try harder for Persona 4. I've already been told Gold makes the game so easy that I have to put it on Hard just to receive a "Normal experience."
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Jan 26, 2017 02:26
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You being able to control your party alone makes the game way easier.
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Jan 26, 2017 02:27
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P4 is also not a hard game, no, and Golden basically makes it trivial to create the most absurdly overpowered Persona.
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Jan 26, 2017 02:28
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So Persona 4 is easier than 3?
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Jan 26, 2017 02:32
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NikkolasKing posted:The weakness system in this game is so hosed up because there's nothing you can do about it except stack equipment on the person and then pray. That's not actually true, IiRC. I think you can get elemental resist weapons via persona/weapon fusion.
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Jan 26, 2017 02:35
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Does max social link not fix weakness in p3? Or is that just a p4 thing?
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Jan 26, 2017 02:38
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S.Links for party members in P3 is relegated to Yukari, Fuuka and Mitsuru in vanilla. Aigis gets added for FES and the rest of the team are FeMC exclusive. They have no benefits outside of the usual bonus EXP that gives levels equal to half S.Link (round down if x.5) and a new MC persona at max rank. Upgrades for your team are gated by plot and not whether you like someone enough to talk to them, and just give them more skills basically.
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Jan 26, 2017 02:41
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NikkolasKing posted:So Persona 4 is easier than 3? Honestly? Yeah. Your cast is stronger and has more options in Persona 4 default, let alone Golden where you absolutely have to pump the difficulty up to not sleepwalk over 90% of the game's enemies
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Jan 26, 2017 02:41
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ImpAtom posted:Honestly? Yeah. Your cast is stronger and has more options in Persona 4 default, let alone Golden where you absolutely have to pump the difficulty up to not sleepwalk over 90% of the game's enemies Well I mean, is it actually more fun to play? Do I want a challenge? Harder doesn't always mean better.
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Jan 26, 2017 02:44
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I think it's more fun by allowing you to control your team from the start. The first, uh, real Shadow fight is probably the hardest part of the game, and good strategy can walk over it. https://twitter.com/Martymatsu/status/824208108482334720
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Jan 26, 2017 04:05
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Bogart posted:aha Okay, but to be fair, she had three seconds to convey an idiom with no direct parallel, and the sentence she was given was "Aha, is this our chance?" Which is absolutely bonkers from a cadence perspective. She did a bad job, but it wasn't a trivial task. Personally, I would have gone with, "Hey! This is our chance!" even if it abandons the interrobang intent of the original idiom.
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Jan 26, 2017 05:10
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Been replaying the P1 PSP remake and noticed that not only does it have 1/4 the music, it also removed most of the sound effects. I wish I knew programming so I could fix this, it fucks up so much of the mood and style.
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Jan 26, 2017 07:17
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Bogart posted:I think it's more fun by allowing you to control your team from the start. The first, uh, real Shadow fight is probably the hardest part of the game, and good strategy can walk over it. This picture makes me realize how much we need Megaten Go. As far as P4 difficulty compared to P3, another thing to keep in mind is that the dungeons are a bit shorter and work differently than Tartarus... In Tartarus you had to climb tons of floors just to get to the next checkpoint, and if you ran out of SP / items and had to leave early, you'd have to start from the beginning of the area and have to attempt the long climb all over again. In Persona 4, when you use an item to exit the dungeon, when you enter again you can always start from the highest floor you reached. Also there's no sick / tired conditions in the game if I recall. So it's easier to make progress in the dungeons. Even though Tartarus was very bland and barely connected to P3's story, I kind of missed the risky feeling and need for resource management.of P3's dungeon exploration. Neeksy posted:Been replaying the P1 PSP remake and noticed that not only does it have 1/4 the music, it also removed most of the sound effects. I wish I knew programming so I could fix this, it fucks up so much of the mood and style. That is why I will never play P1 PSP, even if it's objectively better in most other ways. Also I kind of love the campiest stuff in P1 like the original Philemon FMVs. Item Getter fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 07:31
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Neeksy posted:Been replaying the P1 PSP remake and noticed that not only does it have 1/4 the music, it also removed most of the sound effects. I wish I knew programming so I could fix this, it fucks up so much of the mood and style. Someone beat you to it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIi4qRzVOpA
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Jan 26, 2017 07:36
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MonsieurChoc posted:Someone beat you to it: I tried it out earlier, it simply substitutes some ild for the new so it's still only a fraction of the library. For example the school music is the same track no matter what part of the story you're in. So it ends up being tonally even worse because it's using "Monochrome" when things are still bright and normal. You would have to go in and change the coding to call for specific tracks for scenes than the existing protocols, plus re-integrating the SFX into the battles and navigation. I don't know how to code, but I could figure out the substitution pretty easily when switching between the versions with a shared save file. Really wish I knew how to code at times like this, it'd be a fun restoration project. Neeksy fucked around with this message at 09:30 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 09:24
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Neeksy posted:I tried it out earlier, it simply substitutes some ild for the new so it's still only a fraction of the library. For example the school music is the same track no matter what part of the story you're in. So it ends up being tonally even worse because it's using "Monochrome" when things are still bright and normal. drat, that's disappointing. Persona 1 is really one of those games where the soundtrack is integral to the experience.
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Jan 26, 2017 10:55
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Item Getter posted:In Tartarus you had to climb tons of floors just to get to the next checkpoint, and if you ran out of SP / items and had to leave early, you'd have to start from the beginning of the area and have to attempt the long climb all over again.
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Jan 26, 2017 11:03
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NikkolasKing posted:Well I mean, is it actually more fun to play? Do I want a challenge? IMO P4G was more fun because in the beginning of a dungeon, the enemies are kind of challenging and you need to think about how to approach them, but once you figure them out, you can instablast them and you start outpacing them all the way to the next dungeon. Some boss fights are noticeable spikes in difficulty (Specifically, the second boss fight after the tutorial and then one in the mid game) but I never felt like I hit an actual brick wall. It was just "oh oops, this guy has some tricks. I might have to adjust my approach a bit" and then finishing them on my third try or so. If you actually want a challenge, you can totally toy around with difficulty, xp gain, money gain etc. in NG+ but honestly there's not much point to that unless there were some S-links you want to see but never got around to in your first playthrough. And even then you'll probably put XP and money gain on max and blaze through the combat segments to get to the story. P4's combat isn't fantastic by any means but it's serviceable and the dungeons are a lot more inspired than differently-coloured floors in Tartarus, so at least they're pretty to look at during your time there.
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Jan 26, 2017 11:39
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At the very least P4's dungeons have some kind of thematic connection to the characters and plot. Hell, the idea of television and mass communications as an entry point into the collective unconscious is at least a somewhat interesting concept. The how and why of Tartarus is prettymuch "i dunno we needed a dungeon and boss location", and visually imparts no appreciable meaning to the story. P3 was a new scenario writer for the series and is not as cohesively developed as their later entries.
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Jan 26, 2017 11:46
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Neeksy posted:At the very least P4's dungeons have some kind of thematic connection to the characters and plot. Hell, the idea of television and mass communications as an entry point into the collective unconscious is at least a somewhat interesting concept. The how and why of Tartarus is prettymuch "i dunno we needed a dungeon and boss location", and visually imparts no appreciable meaning to the story. P3 was a new scenario writer for the series and is not as cohesively developed as their later entries. They really go whole hog on the thematic dungeons for P5, but then also have a Tartarus-like randomly generated dungeon where all the side mission targets are(you can't revisit plot dungeons after you've finished them).
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Jan 26, 2017 11:48
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My favorite thing about Tartarus is the one big section of it late in the game which randomly looks like a disco. I swear they also skipped over that one when recycling all the Tartarus tile sets for The Answer. irlZaphod posted:In P3P at least, if you warp back to the Tartarus entrance to heal, you can re-enter on the highest floor you've reached by going through the door at the top of the stairs. I don't confirm it at the moment but I think in original P3 and FES, the entrance only ever goes to Thebel 1F, making it useless outside of the very beginning of the game. Item Getter fucked around with this message at 11:56 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 11:53
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Tarezax posted:They really go whole hog on the thematic dungeons for P5, but then also have a Tartarus-like randomly generated dungeon where all the side mission targets are(you can't revisit plot dungeons after you've finished them). My understanding is Mementos is at least a somewhat similar phenomenon as the others, but with people who have a less defined ego/power, or are the tangled up collective anxieties of people in Tokyo. Plus, if you're messing with someone's psyche and reforming them, it kinda makes some sense they don't maintain the same domain they did when they were on top of the world and monstrously pathological. Or at least that's what I've gleaned from the information in the run-up to the original release.
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Jan 26, 2017 11:54
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Using your MC as a healer in P3 is probably a waste... But whatever, play how you want to. My MC is FES spammed Die For Me! against regular enemies until I got to the point in the game where there was nothing for me to do at night. At this point I was always in great condition, made Siegfried with Vorpol Blade (extra chance to crit when you are in great condition) and used one of the things at the mall to get Siegfried to 100 strength. Spamming vorpol bladed cheesed the rest of the random battles in the game.
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Jan 26, 2017 15:05
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New Confidants are up https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQdHazFk4_8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHsFh9lM8Bk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohCMU1B8nGI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhLx-G2jf5E e; i like everybody's voice but Ichiko's. She's the only one that doesn't "sound" good to me Luna Was Here fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 16:50
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Lol they got Yukiko's VA to voice Ichiko, that's awesome. Everyone else sounds pretty solid too. I think Shinya sounds a bit weird, but I guess I'm just way too used to Barbara Goodson sounding like Laharl when she's not voicing old women or Rita Repulsa. I think Chihaya is Mela Lee too, but something about it sounds a bit off that makes me think it's not her.
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Jan 26, 2017 16:58
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Why are all the women in the game hot and dateable? It bothers me that they doubled the harem size by eliminating most male co-ops and virtually all older/younger/unavailable women. The sexual politics of Persona have always been a little problematic, but now it's like there's no place at all for women unless you can gently caress them.
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Jan 26, 2017 17:20
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epenthesis posted:Why are all the women in the game hot and dateable? It bothers me that they doubled the harem size by eliminating most male co-ops and virtually all older/younger/unavailable women. ... what? There are 10 co-ops who are not party members or Velvet Room people and half of them are guys. Edit: And 'doubled the harem size' compared to what? Your party is made up of 5 dudes and 4 ladies (including Futaba) and the amount of datable characters is almost identical to Persona 4's. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 17:24
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The first thing that popped into my head: the are some repetitive cadences that seem really stuck in the declarative in these trailers; there isn't enough variation in timing and emphasis to give it any sense of naturalism or emotional variation. The emphasis seems to have this 1-2-1-2 set pattern of word stress with each line one after the other. Not sure if this is the best way to explain, but it sounds in my head a bit like: "I love this. It is great!" To break it up at least a little one would instead try "I love this. It is great!" and further you could add a very short non-verbal stop or bleed out of one word into the next as if they're looking for the right adjective, etc. Essentially you give the line an emotional choice behind it. When I look at a line or block of text, I look for moments where you can shift tempo or hinge an emotion so it feels like the character is thinking while they are talking and are almost reacting to their own lines. Otherwise it feels like they are just reading. Of course, I'm no pro or anything so my sense of it might be off. I just tend to cold-read quickly and analyze a lot.
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Jan 26, 2017 17:26
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Captain Baal posted:Lol they got Yukiko's VA to voice Ichiko, that's awesome. If it is Mela Lee I'm impressed because it would be the first time I haven't just heard Rin when hearing her and it's always weird.
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Jan 26, 2017 17:28
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Also older women are hot, praise be to the dateable onee-sans
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Jan 26, 2017 17:56
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