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Do synthetics count as aliens? Or genemods of your own species with different preferences (you can make those right?)
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Jan 26, 2017 03:43
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Deceitful Penguin posted:Do synthetics count as aliens? Or genemods of your own species with different preferences (you can make those right?) both are half-aliens. xenophobes get -5 happiness with them. it's basically the biggest problem with xenophobe right now imo. if i were more dedicated i would probably try to mod it out. Coolguye fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 03:45
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NoNotTheMindProbe posted:There's Barbarossa where you invade the USSR while trying not to piss of the Nazi bureaucracy. Maybe I'm out of touch with the grognards, but that does not look like a 2-year old game that should cost $50
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Jan 26, 2017 04:07
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SPECIES SUBMISSION Text: http://pastebin.com/LWBEiFRe Listed in order of "what I think is most interesting" to the opposite, so if you get bored after the first 3 it's no big deal.  Images: https://imgur.com/a/nlrse Note that there's an image in there of one I did not submit.
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Jan 26, 2017 04:07
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Ainsley McTree posted:Maybe I'm out of touch with the grognards, but that does not look like a 2-year old game that should cost $50 Like train sims, it's aimed at cashed-up greybeards
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Jan 26, 2017 04:31
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Ainsley McTree posted:Maybe I'm out of touch with the grognards, but that does not look like a 2-year old game that should cost $50 For true grogs the peak of PC simulation perfection was reached circa 1995 and there's no reason to ever move from that. Also, cutting prices over time is for the weak and those pandering to casuals - do you think the Mona Lisa ever went on sale at a discount? edit: GotLag posted:Like train sims, it's aimed at cashed-up greybeards 
Psychotic Weasel fucked around with this message at 04:36 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 04:33
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A game that pretended to be a grand strategy game but you gradually figured out your advisors were lying to you and it's really a backstabbing politics simulator would be awesome but very different.
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Jan 26, 2017 05:17
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this adviser said he was giving me +3 diplo and +1 dip rep... but it was +2 diplo...........
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Jan 26, 2017 05:23
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Arglebargle III posted:A game that pretended to be a grand strategy game but you gradually figured out your advisors were lying to you and it's really a backstabbing politics simulator would be awesome but very different. Also easily spoilered.
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Jan 26, 2017 05:26
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Anticheese posted:Also easily spoilered. Good job spoiling Wiz's geopolitical dating game guys
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Jan 26, 2017 05:35
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Honestly, an option in CK2 you could turn on that would make it so you didn't know the stats of anyone, just had some sort of word of mouth, would be really cool. This brilliant in war games but untested tactician might be a coward on the actual battlefield, or your idiot son might turn out to be a wizard with money, that sort of thing. (the Shakespeare version of) Henry V scenarios would be fun to experience. Definitely optional, though, as a lot of people, grognards especially, would hate it. Probably would be really difficult to design, from a user interface perspective, too.
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Jan 26, 2017 05:36
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Just to throw it out there, one other flaw in AlphaMod is that everything it adds is goddamn hideously ugly.
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Jan 26, 2017 06:09
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ProfessorCirno posted:Just to throw it out there, one other flaw in AlphaMod is that everything it adds is goddamn hideously ugly. Does it add anything outside of those super tiny planetary buildings graphically though? I can't think of much else besides that.
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Jan 26, 2017 06:11
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The only thing that bothers me with AlphaMod is the proliferation of useless "strategic resources" which only exist to give you 8 different kind of farms which are all worse than the base game hydroponic farms. I wish I could get everything from AlphaMod except the water/ice/biomass/actinides/natural fuel resources and buildings.
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Jan 26, 2017 06:12
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Zurai posted:The only thing that bothers me with AlphaMod is the proliferation of useless "strategic resources" which only exist to give you 8 different kind of farms which are all worse than the base game hydroponic farms. I wish I could get everything from AlphaMod except the water/ice/biomass/actinides/natural fuel resources and buildings. There's not that many strategic resources that don't offer a direct bonus, really. The resources that have no direct bonus actually do serve a purpose later on in the game. Once you start teching to the mid to late game a fair number of them can be used to either min-max the resource output on a planet via special end of building chain bonuses or unlock some really powerful buildings or techs via converting them over into a super powerful strategic resource that usually requires refining earlier tier resources. That being said the natural fuel sourcer and natural fuel factory could be safely tossed. It's a junk item which only has the "benefit" that it's the only building in the game that gives you both energy and minerals, albeit at a lower rate. It only really has a use early on when you can't or haven't colonized many planets yet. And it costs a strategic resource that's invaluable later on to get microfission cores (Which give colossal bonuses if you know what to do with them.) and generally aren't as good as just speccing directly into either a mine or power plant. I think the only reason it's in is because it lets you harvest almost all the early to mid game resources that can possibly show up on a tile. Which is probably the only way to do that mechanically at the moment. That being said I will say that Alphamod adds a lot more complexity to the game. I really don't recommend it if you're looking for a simplified experience. The idea behind it seems to be to add more depth via new features and increasing the complexity of some currently simple features to be par on par with more hardcore 4x games. It works within Stellaris, however it's probably not for everyone. Archonex fucked around with this message at 06:30 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 06:22
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Archonex posted:There's not that many strategic resources that don't offer a direct bonus, really. Yes, there are. Almost none of the couple dozen resources Alphamod adds provide a bonus directly. They're almost exclusively used as pre-requisites for buildings, which is a pain because sector AI is poo poo at that stuff. quote:The resources that have no direct bonus actually do serve a purpose later on in the game. Once you start teching to the mid to late game a fair number of them can be used to either min-max the resource output on a planet via special end of building chain bonuses or unlock some really powerful buildings or techs via converting them over into a super powerful strategic resource that usually requires refining earlier tier resources. I've completed the entire tech tree in Alphamod. At no point did I feel that any of the resources I listed justified their existence. quote:That being said the natural fuel sourcer and natural fuel factory could be safely tossed. It's a junk item which only has the "benefit" that it's the only building in the game that gives you both energy and minerals, albeit at a lower rate. It costs a strategic resource that's invaluable later on to get microfission cores (Which give collossal bonuses if you can afford to build the cold fusion plants that grant htem.) and generally aren't as good as just speccing directly into either a mine or power plant. The fission/fusion plants produce minerals and energy, actually. Natural fuel does ... nothing that I've determined. Water does nothing interesting. Biomass does nothing interesting. Ice and Actinides only act as fuel for the fission/fusion plants.
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Jan 26, 2017 06:32
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Zurai posted:Yes, there are. Almost none of the couple dozen resources Alphamod adds provide a bonus directly. They're almost exclusively used as pre-requisites for buildings, which is a pain because sector AI is poo poo at that stuff. You must have missed some techs or something somewhere then, because none of that is true. Actinides act as a massive energy generator throughout the game from a 1 per planet building that can be built on water resource tiles that gives about 12 energy per building. Water and ice can be used for a slightly similar bonus (About 10 energy per building I think.) if used to build a Macro Steam Plant on ice tiles. Both decrease planet habitability when built to counter their massive energy bonuses. Both are also obviously massively useful if you do the work to get them set up. Water is also used as a component resource for many buildings. As is natural fuels. Biomass sourcing buildings let you transfer the biomass off planet into a building that can give you somewhere in the range of 6-12 food. I'd need to build one again to check the exact number since the last one I made got demolished about an hour before you made your post. They're very useful for smaller planets where you don't want to waste tiles on too many farms. Natural fuel is used for a bunch of different mid to late game stuff. Of the most important is the fusion plants you mentioned, which if you have enough actinides, water, and natural fuels then can be upgraded to the point where they give you a micro-fission core resource. Which can be used to build buildings that are extremely powerful. We're talking stuff like a building that gives a 20% output bonus to all science types on a planet. Or an expensive one per planet building that increases naval capacity by ten percent and adds another core sector to your max count. Micro-fission cores are basically one of the rewards for playing the Anno style resource refinement game. Fission and their upgraded version cold fusion plants also act as a potential alternate energy generator early on that can be slightly stronger depending on where you take your tech options. Natural fuel factories are what are used to give both minerals and energy at the cost of a 1% habitability decrease per factory. I can say all of that for certain since I am literally looking at the game right now. That includes a low tech empire's planet that has stacked a bunch of natural fuel fueled factories to counter the fact that it has only three planets left. I hate to say it, but it sounds like you didn't really explore the mod's features. Granted, the mod really needs a manual at this point given how much stuff it adds in. Archonex fucked around with this message at 07:30 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 07:19
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I'm aware of everything you mentioned. Where we're differing is the point where I said "they don't justify their existence". Very little of what you mentioned is actually very impressive to me. Oh boy, a building that generates 12 energy. That's good, don't get me wrong, but it's not interesting. It's just slightly higher numbers for increased pain-in-the-rear end-ness. That's what most of AlphaMod's strategic resource stuff adds. Take Frontier Provisioners, for example. They require water and energy, make an infinitesimal amount of food and generate nutrient bars (a strategic resource that does nothing by itself, IIRC). You can use those nutrient bars to make pointless station modules or to make Frontier Towns in colonies; Frontier Towns are pretty good (and upgrade into some really cool poo poo) but can only be built on ... planets that already have a Frontier Provisioner anyway. Biomass can be used to make freeze-dried ultra-dense biomass, sure, and those can be used to essentially transport food from one planet to another. That's a really terrible solution to the problem of transferring food from one planet to another which has already been solved better by other mods. Food is by far the least useful resource in the game, so making an entire supply chain to provide food where just the colony hub and one farm can do the same job seems pretty much completely pointless to me. I already run complete 25 tile planets with just the hub and one farm in the base game, I don't see a need for a complex supply chain to do the same in Alphamod. That's the thing: it adds a fuckton of utterly pointless complexity. It also adds some fun complexity, even within its strategic resource system (microfission cores, for example, can be used in a few different very powerful buildings/station modules, but you can only make one per planet so you have to be a bit picky with using them). I wish I could get rid of the first without losing the second. Since that isn't an option, I grudgingly trudge through the first to have the second. EDIT: Also, seriously, just loving call it water (or H2O, that's fine too). "Dihydrogen Monoxide" as a strategic resource just makes it sound like you have your head up your own rear end. EDIT2: Again, I like Alphamod overall. The only part I dislike is what I regard as complexity for complexity's sake with the strategic resources. They could drop half the resources and the mod would be 100% improved. Zurai fucked around with this message at 07:40 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 07:30
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Zurai posted:I'm aware of everything you mentioned. Where we're differing is the point where I said "they don't justify their existence". Very little of what you mentioned is actually very impressive to me. Oh boy, a building that generates 12 energy. That's good, don't get me wrong, but it's not interesting. It's just slightly higher numbers for increased pain-in-the-rear end-ness. That's what most of AlphaMod's strategic resource stuff adds. Take Frontier Provisioners, for example. They require water and energy, make an infinitesimal amount of food and generate nutrient bars (a strategic resource that does nothing by itself). You can use those nutrient bars to make pointless station modules or to make Frontier Towns in colonies; Frontier Towns are pretty good (and upgrade into some really cool poo poo) but can only be built on ... planets that already have a Frontier Provisioner anyway. If the argument is that it's not interesting then i'm not sure what I can say. Special buildings and resource chains like that make it so that the various empires actually have a reason to squabble over resources. Since having them gives a fairly large bonus if you know how to use them. The resource system as a whole ought to be considered flawed by that logic though. Since the stuff you mention is just as present in the vanilla game. It's just that the amount of bonuses you can get out of a planet are capped at a much lower rate due to the lower complexity of the economy game on planets without a mod to add some more depth to it. It's a choice between the generic "there are only buildings that give +1 more energy at each tier" system that vanilla offers or something that actually lets you dicker about and try to get more involved in that portion of the game.. I have to disagree that it's pointless complexity however. It does alter the way the game is played along with how you and the AI interact with each other. I've had empires try to snatch up worlds from me that had vital resources we both needed, something I wouldn't let them take without as much of a fight in vanilla since the only real resources are mostly one off "you get one of these and you have a global bonus forever" sort of deal. The really, really, really, rare resources you didn't mention like sandworm spice and it's refined variants can give pretty huge buffs too. The former gives you more trait points for genetic engineering. Which is huge if you use them right. The refined version can super charge your empire's FTL capability depending on the FTL type letting you hop straight into an empire. They don't break the game over your knee but they are pretty big bonuses if you can find a planet that has them and get your hands on them. The result of all these new resources that act as a sort of pseudo minerals or energy resource instead of a buffing resource means that Alphamod actually adds more on the inter-empire end of things due to needing to plot your expansion properly and play a more complex game of grabbing planets than just "colonize everything forever in an outward circle and only give a poo poo at what the size of a planet is". Archonex fucked around with this message at 07:57 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 07:40
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Empires aren't going to squabble over water, ice, natural fuels, biomass, or actinides, since those are all extremely plentiful and can be generated on-planet and by mining stations (except Biomass for the latter). My empires tend to have literally dozens of water, ice, and fuels, and that's without specifically building resource generators for them. I didn't mention worm spice because that's one I don't object to. I also didn't mention marks of caste, hivemind implants, intelligence, the warrior house resources, etc. Those I'm cool with (although the hivemind buildings should be limited to the hivemind government IMO because they're way too good for general use).
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Jan 26, 2017 07:45
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Zurai posted:Empires aren't going to squabble over water, ice, natural fuels, biomass, or actinides, since those are all extremely plentiful and can be generated on-planet and by mining stations (except Biomass for the latter). My empires tend to have literally dozens of water, ice, and fuels, and that's without specifically building resource generators for them. Except they do. Once empires stabilize (or if they start cramped together) some of the personality types start eyeing up their neighbors depending on their resource allotment. I've instantly obtained some nightmarish border friction penalties because I ganked two systems out from under another empire with a frontier station. One had living metal in it and the other was loaded to the gills with various minor strategic resources alphamod adds. They declared war on me a month or two later and beelined to the nearby planet I had set up so I could remove the station. Archonex fucked around with this message at 07:52 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 07:48
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Archonex posted:If the argument is that it's not interesting then i'm not sure what I can say. Special buildings and resource chains like that make it so that the various empires actually have a reason to squabble over resources. Since having them gives a fairly large bonus if you know how to use them. Is there a full on Dune mod out there? I'm thinking a bunch of bickering factions (Bene Geserits, Tleilaxu, Ix) with the synchronized worlds way out on the fringes of the galaxy building their poo poo up far away from the other factions. That'd be pretty cool.
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Jan 26, 2017 07:54
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THE loving MOON posted:Is there a full on Dune mod out there? I'm thinking a bunch of bickering factions (Bene Geserits, Tleilaxu, Ix) with the synchronized worlds way out on the fringes of the galaxy building their poo poo up far away from the other factions. That'd be pretty cool. There used to be one that was in development. I have no idea if it's up to date or not however. It's pretty easy to check either way. Stellaris's main mod community is pretty much located on the Workshop. So you can just type Dune in there and see what comes up.
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Jan 26, 2017 07:56
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Archonex posted:There used to be one that was in development. I have no idea if it's up to date or not however. Welp, doesn't look like there is. Mostly names and stuff. I need to figure out how to make custom maps. I really want that to be a thing now lol
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Jan 26, 2017 07:59
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I'd like to see some expansion of the XCom event chains in this game, that could eventually end up with a new, hostile to you stellar nation forming.
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Jan 26, 2017 08:00
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Sun Wu Kampf posted:I'd like to see some expansion of the XCom event chains in this game, that could eventually end up with a new, hostile to you stellar nation forming. So basically what would happen if XCom: Interceptor got crossed with Stellaris? 
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Jan 26, 2017 08:06
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Dev diary out, about orbitals. Looks like next diary might be the announcement one...
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Jan 26, 2017 12:34
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Them requiring an Ascension Perk makes sense. Going to need to put in the effort to get them, though. Being able to make your own (small) Gaia worlds is probably worth it, though. Also, I find it interesting that habitats are the opposite of slavery when it comes to production; good at energy and research, bad at food and minerals. (Which makes sense, considering what they are.) Also are more easily available to non-slaving empires, since they require you to complete at least one Tradition tree to get the perk, and that's easier as someone who, among other things, doesn't use slaves. Kind of disappointed we didn't get a look at other habitat models, though. I really want to see what the remaining five types look like.
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Jan 26, 2017 12:59
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canepazzo posted:Dev diary out, about orbitals. Looks like next diary might be the announcement one... Or, given "very big," megastructures.
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Jan 26, 2017 13:05
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Megastructures would be very welcome if that is indeed the case. Alternatively, a series of circular space colonies linked together by spunnels in the shape of a Spathi Eluder.
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Jan 26, 2017 13:11
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Next week's dev blog just a shot of various Developer Dillz
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Jan 26, 2017 13:14
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I'm actually guessing something that allows either the transfer of resources or global food, which would tie in nicely with the orbitals.
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Jan 26, 2017 13:22
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Orbitals look pretty cool. It seemed weird that there weren't any ways to actually have your people live in space beyond spaceports. There needs to be a mobile equivalent of an orbital, some kind of spaceship that functions like a planet.
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Jan 26, 2017 13:41
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I think Wiz is just going to troll everyone and make a post full of huge.jpg images while elaborating on nothing in particular. That sounds like something he would do. At the very least he started this diary out by saying Banks is a ways away so I don't think they would officially announce it just yet. It also sounds like orbitals are a paid feature of that expansion and not just something they're adding to the base game; which is hardly surprising.
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Jan 26, 2017 13:43
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Can I destroy enemy habitats?
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Jan 26, 2017 15:23
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Azuth0667 posted:Can I destroy enemy habitats? I've read the dev diary. Answer: No you can't, habitats are handled like planets in space and since there aren't ways to destroy a planet, there also aren't ways to destroy a space habitat. You can take them over and murder all former inhabitants with a purge, though.
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Jan 26, 2017 15:26
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Space habitats under the current requirement (research level 5 spaceports) is just going to be a mineral inflation mechanic in the mid game that translates into broken levels of economic dominance in the lategame. We already rush up that particular tech tree to get battleships and there is literally no reason not to spam habitats everywhere you can because the research multiplier changed to settled systems rather than individual planets so you'll always be rewarded for filling out systems you've already colonized. I'm going to liken it to the trade system in Sword of the Stars because Wiz himself made a mod to reduce that tedium but now he's putting it into Stellaris. The argument is basically this. You can ignore orbitals if you want but it means you lose to someone who doesn't because it gives you an immediately effective and cascading economic advantage.
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Jan 26, 2017 15:30
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Demiurge4 posted:Space habitats under the current requirement (research level 5 spaceports) is just going to be a mineral inflation mechanic in the mid game that translates into broken levels of economic dominance in the lategame. We already rush up that particular tech tree to get battleships and there is literally no reason not to spam habitats everywhere you can because the research multiplier changed to settled systems rather than individual planets so you'll always be rewarded for filling out systems you've already colonized. I'm going to liken it to the trade system in Sword of the Stars because Wiz himself made a mod to reduce that tedium but now he's putting it into Stellaris. You're right, if you make multiple logical leaps and assumptions then things will turn out exactly as those logical leaps and assumptions predicted.
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Jan 26, 2017 15:32
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Wiz posted:You're right, if you make multiple logical leaps and assumptions then things will turn out exactly as those logical leaps and assumptions predicted. I am right because so far you haven't implied a strategic resource cost to limit the number of orbitals an empire can support. If they are spammable 12 pop planets then they are effectively no different from SotS broken trade system. I'd love to be wrong of course.
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Jan 26, 2017 15:36
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Demiurge4 posted:I am right because so far you haven't implied a strategic resource cost to limit the number of orbitals an empire can support. If they are spammable 12 pop planets then they are effectively no different from SotS broken trade system. We do dev diaries on features long before balancing/iteration on those features are done. We're going to be testing, evaluating, and if needed, putting limits in place. It's fine to be concerned about the balance of a feature, it's just tiring when people make 100% certain predictions about how something is going to turn out when that something isn't even done yet. (Also, you're basing your understanding on the game as it stands right now, without considering other limiting factors to population spam such as consumer goods, and how orbitals being bad at mineral production plays into that)
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Jan 26, 2017 15:38
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