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rchandra posted:Yeah, when Chapel collides with your other buy (even a Silver) usually you trash the other three cards anyway and I don't see a reason otherwise here. Here I might have opened Chapel-Harbinger and pick up a quick Silver or Bureaucrat. Opening Bureaucrat/Silver going for Markets / Gardens could be fun but looks much worse than the engine. I'd agree usually but in this case, I still had not a single silver, and the three cards were all coppers. I would've been left with 4 money in a 9 card deck, and running a significant risk of not being able to get a silver until after the second reshuffle, which seems... tragic.
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Jan 26, 2017 16:43
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But you had Bureaucrat which gains a silver? Like I can see running into a situation where you trash everything and end up with silver-chapel and need to spend a turn buying copper to get back to $3 to buy more silvers. But with Bureau, worst case scenario is you get down to Chapel/Bureau and spend 2 turns gaining a single silver and attacking which isn't terrible
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Jan 26, 2017 16:59
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Dancer posted:Questioning whether I did the right play just now. The correct answer is almost always going to be trash down. Since you have the bureaucrat anyways, you're not going to have much trouble getting money since you'll be able to play it like every turn.
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Jan 26, 2017 17:06
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I think I would Chapel down in that case. What did your opponent open with? Edit: to expand a little bit, dumping your starting cards is going to get harder and harder as the game goes on. When Chapel starts, you're trashing potentially four junk cards for one action. As you add more desirable cards to your deck that's going down quickly. Trashing three junk cards is still very good. Think about what happens to your deck with that bureaucrat play: you get the silver from the attack, and you are probably using your three coppers to buy a silver. You now have three cards out of ten that will conflict with Chapel's ideal scenario (trashing 4 starters). If you hit those three coppers instead, you haven't gained any desirable cards, but you have thinned your deck in nearly the most optimal way possible. Dominion's main resource is time and opportunity, and I think playing Chapel in that situation makes the best use of that resource. sector_corrector fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 19:53
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I would've opened Chapel/Silver or Chapel/Vassal instead of Bureaucrat. Bureaucrat is a weak attack that becomes a liability later in the game. I like Vassal in that kingdom because it can work well with Harbinger by bringing an action from your discard to the top of the deck, and then getting Vassal to play it for you. But Chapel/Silver is straightforward and effective. Even if you draw Chapel/S/C/C/C you can still trash 2 coppers and buy an action or another Silver.
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Jan 26, 2017 20:52
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Just had a game with Mill and Menagerie. Now there's a fun as hell combo. Discard duplicates for sweet cash and then draw back up to a big handsize, no mucking around with villages needed. In fact the board didn't even have any villages, or trashing, and the only +buy was Baron. Beat my opponent's Alchemist stack, so that's cool.
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Jan 27, 2017 23:15
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What do you do when you are dumpstering someone on an interesting board but their pace of play is slothful to the point of madness? Asking for a friend.
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Jan 28, 2017 18:35
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Toshimo posted:What do you do when you are dumpstering someone on an interesting board but their pace of play is slothful to the point of madness? Do you want a useful answer or a lewd answer? I have both prepared.
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Jan 28, 2017 18:50
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jivjov posted:Do you want a useful answer or a lewd answer? I have both prepared. Yes pls.
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Jan 28, 2017 18:51
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Toshimo posted:Yes pls. Take the time to start tracking draws and discards; start predicting exactly what hands you and your opponent will be drawing. Or Open pornhub in another tab and have at it.
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Jan 28, 2017 19:06
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Anyone up for a dominion game on the new site? I can't seem to find an open game that actually starts, and I don't want to start one myself with only the base set. I miss Iso's matchmaking so much. Same username.
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Jan 28, 2017 20:28
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Not playing right now, but I will point out that the matchmaker here is actually fairly okay! Unfortunately there's no way to filter the population (so you'll probably end up with some scrub who only has the base set, which might be a problem for you), but it's really fast.
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Jan 28, 2017 20:34
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hello dominion friends, i just played 3 games of dominion online and lost all 3. one was to a bot. at least i know i can beat my co workers at lunch
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Jan 28, 2017 23:06
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Dancer posted:Not playing right now, but I will point out that the matchmaker here is actually fairly okay! Unfortunately there's no way to filter the population (so you'll probably end up with some scrub who only has the base set, which might be a problem for you), but it's really fast. Yeah, once I gave it a minute or two I got some games pretty quick, and none of them were base set only I don't think.
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Jan 29, 2017 10:03
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H2Omelon posted:Just had a game with Mill and Menagerie. Now there's a fun as hell combo. Discard duplicates for sweet cash and then draw back up to a big handsize, no mucking around with villages needed. Yeah, I really love Mill. It does all of the interesting poo poo that Great Hall does (card type interactions, drawing into it with something that pulls victories like Vagrant, and cantripping VP if you choose not to use the discard effect) but it also fills an important role, which is a disappearing silver (minion also does disappearing Silver, but it's a 5-buy). That opens up a lot of cool higher level strategies, such as what you mention with Menagerie, but also Watchtower, Jack, and other Library archetypes. Overdraw decks like that are super satisfying when you pull them off, and powerful to boot. edit: Tactician would also be an interesting combo. Get two (maybe more) Tacticians in your deck, which is made easier with the sifting and Silver properties of Mill, ideally play one a turn, use Mill to generate money while leaving one card for Tactician to discard. The extra buys give you some pepper to help build the engine too. sector_corrector fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Jan 29, 2017 |
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Jan 29, 2017 22:57
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Played a few more in person games with my friends over the weekend. Actually forced another mid-game forfeit with a Shanty Town - Margrave - Masquerade combo. I opened Masq/Expedition (an event that lets you draw 2 more cards for your next turn) so I ended up trashing an estate and buying a Gold on turn 3 which felt pretty good. The Margrave/Masq one-two punch was brutal because they discarded down to their best cards a few times before they realized it was going to keep happening - only for them to intentionally leave a crappy card in hand the first turn my slowed down deck didn't let me draw and play everything. At that point I had half the Provinces in a 3 player game anyway and we were playing with the landmark Museum (2vp for every differently named card you have) and I had the most diversity in my deck. Also, I just want to gush about how great landmarks are some more. They add more paths to victory which means people trying different strategies more often, they breath new life into some older cards, and they just create a whole new dynamic for player interaction and deck timing. We played a game a few weekends ago with Keep (5vp for each treasure you have the most of) and I noticed a nice combo with Artisan and Contraband that let me easily win the Keep bonus for Contraband, Copper (Contra was the only plus buy) and either Silver or Gold. We played with Mountain Pass (starts a bidding war for 8vp when someone buys the first Province) yesterday which I way overbid for which cost me the game, but was still an interesting mid-game intermission thing. We also played a cool game with Basilica (gives you 2vp from a preset pile anytime you have $2 leftover from a buy) and I won another game with Tomb (1vp whenever you trash a card) by going really extreme with Spice Merchant, Develop, and buying Mining Villages just to trash them; an opponent mistakenly bought Swindler not realizing he would be giving us free VP every time he attacked us but used Trader to trash it for 3 silver and a VP, but I still won with the most trash VP (21) despite narrowly losing the Province split. I really hope they don't start to overstay their welcome, I feel like worst case scenario people ignore them, they don't tend to dominate games they are just something else to factor in. One thing I will say is they seem to overshadow at least some of the alt VP cards, which require you to do the strategy while using turns buying the card, while landmarks are always active. We had Silk Road in for a few games and it mostly sat there, although it might not have been the best field for it (well and that in particular might be an alt-VP that clashes with landmarks specifically since you need to maximize the number of victory cards in deck, while landmarks let you ignore them to a greater extent than usual).
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Jan 30, 2017 01:46
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Guy A. Person posted:Played a few more in person games with my friends over the weekend. Actually forced another mid-game forfeit with a Shanty Town - Margrave - Masquerade combo. I opened Masq/Expedition (an event that lets you draw 2 more cards for your next turn) so I ended up trashing an estate and buying a Gold on turn 3 which felt pretty good. The Margrave/Masq one-two punch was brutal because they discarded down to their best cards a few times before they realized it was going to keep happening - only for them to intentionally leave a crappy card in hand the first turn my slowed down deck didn't let me draw and play everything. At that point I had half the Provinces in a 3 player game anyway and we were playing with the landmark Museum (2vp for every differently named card you have) and I had the most diversity in my deck. Yeah, Landmarks and Events are both great. They really change how the game is played. They're almost like mini rule patches that only exist for a round.
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Jan 30, 2017 02:01
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Just discovered the option in dominion.games to force the other player to resign if they take too long during their turn. Nice! Then my very next game, my opponent lurker-sniped me 3 times, but I still beat him because he turned out to be a Village Idiot who let me grab all the Gardens while he filled me with Curses and built his glorious chains to no treasure.
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Jan 30, 2017 03:54
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What's the Big Money baseline for turns for a Colony game? I usually play against the Big Money bot in .NET so that it's challenging, but this time it got distracted by a few early buys of useless Missions. I wound up getting 6 Colonies and a Duchy in my 19th turn to end the game, and it seemed like a good deck. I used two Altars to drain Cities and Hamlets early, and used Horse Traders with Libraries to generate money and redraw my discards. 2 Golds, 3 Silvers for hard money and 2 Gears to enable the deck early.
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Feb 1, 2017 00:05
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Toshimo posted:What do you do when you are dumpstering someone on an interesting board but their pace of play is slothful to the point of madness? Just ask them to speed up a bit, you big goon. I played a Rebuild game the other day. It's pretty boring if you realise how powerful it is - almost like big money. Maybe it should be "trash a Victory card for one worth up to $2P more", which lets you trash Estates and interacts with alt-VP better. Or "trash a Victory card for a non-Victory card".
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Feb 1, 2017 02:33
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Safety Biscuits posted:Just ask them to speed up a bit, you big goon. It is very powerful. The meta-game comes in playing it well, meaning balancing Rebuilds with other VP and the money to get them both. Other VP, trashing attacks, and pile draining can also be effective counters. For example, realizing your opponent is going Rebuild and stealing the Duchies out from under them leaves them with a crippled deck that can only trash Estates.
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Feb 1, 2017 04:15
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sector_corrector posted:It is very powerful. The meta-game comes in playing it well, meaning balancing Rebuilds with other VP and the money to get them both. Other VP, trashing attacks, and pile draining can also be effective counters. For example, realizing your opponent is going Rebuild and stealing the Duchies out from under them leaves them with a crippled deck that can only trash Estates. It seemed to me that the game turned into "Who can use Rebuild best?" with the other cards more or less irrelevant.
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Feb 2, 2017 07:14
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Safety Biscuits posted:It seemed to me that the game turned into "Who can use Rebuild best?" with the other cards more or less irrelevant. Yeah, some cards are like that. Goons also. I think having a few game warping cards in the full set is useful, because it helps to mix up strategies.
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Feb 3, 2017 19:32
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Transmorgifying Peddlers into in-hand Platinums is very, very fun.
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Feb 3, 2017 19:33
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sector_corrector posted:What's the Big Money baseline for turns for a Colony game? I usually play against the Big Money bot in .NET so that it's challenging, but this time it got distracted by a few early buys of useless Missions. I wound up getting 6 Colonies and a Duchy in my 19th turn to end the game, and it seemed like a good deck. Based upon this simulator, basic big money appears to get 4 colonies by turn 19-20: http://rspeer.github.io/dominiate/play.html#BigMoney/BigSmithy This version of basic big money plays as follows: Buy cards using this priority: I) "Colony" if my.getTotalMoney() > 32 II) "Province" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 6 III) "Duchy" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 5 IV) "Estate" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 2 V) "Platinum" VI) "Province" if state.countInSupply("Colony") <= 7 VII) "Gold" VIII) "Duchy" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 6 IX) "Silver" X) "Copper" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 2
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Feb 3, 2017 21:35
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golden bubble posted:Based upon this simulator, basic big money appears to get 4 colonies by turn 19-20: Ah, cool, thanks! It seems like my deck beat the baseline, then. That always feels good.
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Feb 3, 2017 21:41
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Has anyone noticed people who just stall out instead of resigning? I'm not sure if it could also be glitchiness but multiple times I've gotten to end game either in the lead or poised to win and people will just stop playing.
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Feb 9, 2017 03:08
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Guy A. Person posted:Has anyone noticed people who just stall out instead of resigning? I'm not sure if it could also be glitchiness but multiple times I've gotten to end game either in the lead or poised to win and people will just stop playing. Network connections are still pretty common, but people could be trying to wait you out. The "force resignation" option pops up after a few minutes, though. It's weird that people would cheat to avoid a loss, because there's no visible ranking and they'd just face tougher competition.
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Feb 9, 2017 14:02
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CaptainRightful posted:Network connections are still pretty common, but people could be trying to wait you out. The "force resignation" option pops up after a few minutes, though. Yeah this is what I thought at first too but then the timing made me skeptical. And looking through dominion strategy and the Shuffle IT forums it's totally a thing Which yeah blows my mind because I'm not even sure there's much of a ranking system yet but to the extent there is you're intentionally skewing results. Also this seems like a good way to make Dominion a boring slog for yourself in addition to your opponent (who can at least just tab out and watch netflix until the "force resignation" or their next turn pops up).
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Feb 9, 2017 20:16
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I don't even think there's a way to block someone who does this so you don't have to play them anymore.
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Feb 9, 2017 20:21
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code:
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Feb 9, 2017 20:48
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I keep playing against people who seem to be going for what you're doing--massive chains meant to produce a huge multiple buy to win the game in one fell swoop--but they end up with something like 7 or 15 coins and it was just a huge waste of time.
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Feb 9, 2017 22:01
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CaptainRightful posted:I keep playing against people who seem to be going for what you're doing--massive chains meant to produce a huge multiple buy to win the game in one fell swoop--but they end up with something like 7 or 15 coins and it was just a huge waste of time. My favourite games in a recent match have been where I decide the engine will be bad, and win with a money-based or sloggy deck against my opponent's engine. I think good players tend to overvalue engines these days - of course great players will just make them work through black magic instead.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:05
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rchandra posted:My favourite games in a recent match have been where I decide the engine will be bad, and win with a money-based or sloggy deck against my opponent's engine. I think good players tend to overvalue engines these days - of course great players will just make them work through black magic instead. Yeah I swear it always boggled my mind how some people just can get to an engine where they draw their entire deck every single turn no matter what, they never run into colliding terminals or anything, ever. I feel like to get to that point I need to have a super refined deck, no starting cruft at all, an overwhelming number of villages and drawers; and even then I have at least a couple "2 terminal draw, 3 money" situations per game
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Feb 9, 2017 23:34
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If there are good sifters and good gainers available to cap off the engine I can pull stuff like that off, but without those most of my engines sputter out as soon as I start greening.
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Feb 9, 2017 23:44
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So I've been teaching one of my daughters to play Dominion. We tried Prosperity tonight and went with a Prosperity only game. We used the "Beginners" board from the manual which consists of Bank, Counting House, Expand, Goons, Monument, Rabble, Royal Seal, Venture, Watchtower, and Workers Village. ITs been a while since I played regularly. What do you guys see when you look at that board. Goons+Watchtower is pretty obvious, but what else? What do you do with different opening splits?
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Feb 11, 2017 06:14
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Goons/Rabble is a pretty brutal combo since you narrow their hand and ensure they draw crap, but there are a few counters. Watchtower/royal seal set up for a good hand by putting all the good poo poo you gain directly on top (and drawing it during cleanup). Watchtower helps goons but also counters it with its "draw to" mechanic. A counting house + bank combo could be hilarious (if ill advised) and another decent counter to rabble putting all your treasures in the discard anyway. Venture and Bank are also natural combos (a venture gets you an additional treasure in play) and venture is a hard combo to rabble as long as you don't play actions before it. Monument I feel would be hard to use here again because of Rabble/Goons making a decent monument chain hard to pull off, but it's a decent opener for getting up to higher costs while getting a little extra benefit from vp tokens. The trick is getting up to those higher cost cards quickly and getting enough of them to start moving. I think I'd open silver/monument and hope to get up to a goons or rabble, ideally goons then start buying workers villages on my first goons play. It's an interesting board, there's multiple combos and I guess it would depend on what my opponent was trying to do.
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Feb 11, 2017 07:18
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Workers Village + Goons + Watchtower sounds ridiculous. If I wanted to lose to that, I'd go Venture + Bank Big Money. That board sounds nuts in general. Open Silver + Watchtower. WV on 4, Goons on 6. Pick up an Expand as early as possible, turn your Estates into Worker's Villages/Venture and your Coppers into nothing (reveal Watchtower)/Silver, prioritizing the first choices. If an opponent Goonses you, WV + Wt let you use that as a filtering opportunity. Endgame goal would be something like 3 points per Buy with 5+ Buys per turn and a Watchtower to filter the Buys as necessary. Don't ever green; you'll score more without it than you can afford by doing it. edit: If you 5/2, RIP open Venture/Nothing? Broken Loose fucked around with this message at 07:31 on Feb 11, 2017 |
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Feb 11, 2017 07:29
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I'd open rabble on 5. Wouldn't you eventually need those anyway to draw your multi-goons every turn without trashing? It's not a great buy order but it would slow down your opponent. You're right about watchtower tho, there's no point wasting a turn buying something that's not going to be part of your engine.
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Feb 11, 2017 07:47
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Rabble wouldn't hurt, but I wouldn't lose a WV split over it. 1 Rabble should be enough to draw Expand regularly enough to trash your opening deck in a decent amount of time. Once that's out of the way, you're guaranteed to be holding all of your Goons and a Watchtower every turn, albeit with a varying number of actions and buys.
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Feb 11, 2017 07:52
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