|
I think the biggest problems with closed primaries were states like New York which have traditionally had their registration date for the election too far out. I think they are mostly okay as long as you can register close to the election. Caucuses are way worse than closed primaries though when it comes to being anti-democratic.
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 21:13 |
|
|
Gorelab posted:I think the biggest problems with closed primaries were states like New York which have traditionally had their registration date for the election too far out. I think they are mostly okay as long as you can register close to the election. Caucuses are way worse than closed primaries though when it comes to being anti-democratic. Yeah, and the problem with like NY is that's all well out of the DNC's control, but tbh the NY State Dem Party is hilariously awful.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:04
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:Yeah, and the problem with like NY is that's all well out of the DNC's control, but tbh the NY State Dem Party is hilariously awful. Serious question, what state parties don't suck for the Democrats? If I get into my state's party, who am I looking at for "state party that is cool and good?"
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:06
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:Serious question, what state parties don't suck for the Democrats? If I get into my state's party, who am I looking at for "state party that is cool and good?" I mean it depends on what you mean by suck. The NY State Party is pretty good at getting Democrats elected. It's odious when it comes to be free, open and not relatively corrupt and machine like. Compare that to say, Florida, where the state party is just loving terrible at everything.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:07
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:Serious question, what state parties don't suck for the Democrats? If I get into my state's party, who am I looking at for "state party that is cool and good?" I'd assume the CA one is in pretty good shape, but then again I just pretend that Jerry Brown is the God-King of the CA democratic party at this point
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:08
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:I mean it depends on what you mean by suck. The NY State Party is pretty good at getting Democrats elected. It's odious when it comes to be free, open and not relatively corrupt and machine like. Compare that to say, Florida, where the state party is just loving terrible at everything. Is "getting people consistently elected but also being corrupt and lovely and your candidates suck" and "not routinely getting people elected but being not corrupt and having good candidates" mutually exclusive? 
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:09
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:Is "getting people consistently elected but also being corrupt and lovely and your candidates suck" and "not routinely getting people elected but being not corrupt and having good candidates" mutually exclusive? Yeah, I'm sure we have some states that fit into the "not routinely getting people elected but also being corrupt and lovely and your candidates suck" section of that bit
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:10
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:Is "getting people consistently elected but also being corrupt and lovely and your candidates suck" and "not routinely getting people elected but being not corrupt and having good candidates" mutually exclusive? How important is winning to you.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:11
|
|
|
The Glumslinger posted:Yeah, I'm sure we have some states that fit into the "not routinely getting people elected but also being corrupt and lovely and your candidates suck" section of that bit Not everyone can be Florida. Florida is special. BI NOW GAY LATER posted:How important is winning to you. gently caress. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:11
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:How important is winning to you. Why do you think Perez has the key to "winning" more than Ellison does?
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:19
|
|
|
mcmagic posted:Why do you think Perez has the key to "winning" more than Ellison does? I don't at all. I was talking about the NY State Party being really corrupt, but able to produce Dems who reliably vote Dem in House and Senate. Again, I signed Bern Bern Revolution's petition for Ellision and would vote for him if I were a voting member of the DNC.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:21
|
|
|
Has this been posted yet?
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:21
|
|
|
At least 5 times, yes.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:34
|
|
|
Aurubin posted:Why would Biden's endorsement be a big tipping point? The man isn't in office anymore and always had O'Malley numbers when he ran for president. Most of the DNC members are sitting politicians or party chairs, wouldn't they be the ones most likely to know how badly the Obama years hosed them? Or is that indicative of the institutional rot? Biden is now popular, both inside the party and outside of it. Being vice president took him from gaffe-prone also-ran to legitimate presidential contender. It wasn't just Clinton that cleared the deck for Presidential candidates in 2015. Everyone was getting out of the way of both Clinton and Biden, until Biden removed himself from the running because of Beau's death (and because most likely because his health isn't that great). However you feel about Obama as a president, there is a distinct Obama wing of the party, and Biden's endorsement of Perez was clearly seen as a signal of support from it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 22:52
|
|
|
I think the biggest issue right now is just building a bench for the Dems. Take a look at how much State House and State Senate members make. It's pathetic. A VA House of Delegates member makes less than $25k a year. When you're not the party of big business and can't rely on tons of "gifts" from big business that let you get the operating cash you need, how is the next Obama going to get started? A friend of mine has considered running for local office out here but he can't do it because even if he won the salary would leave him destitute, much less the personal expense he'd incur by running. The Dems need a shitload of money and they need it now so that they can start building a bench at the state level. The good news is that this isn't that hard to fund. You'd only need a few million to fund a candidate for every open seat in the VA House and VA Senate this year. If the Dems could build a $200m warchest and apply it to only state-level races they'd be in great shape by 2018. If Ellison as DNC chair brings in the Bernie folks and motivates them to donate, I say go hog wild. If Perez can bring union $$$ to accomplish the same thing, then bully for him. If one of them (or someone else) can do both then that person should win. Building a bench so the party doesn't do crazy poo poo like not running candidates in Congressional Districts that Hillary won should be the goal. That's also why I really like this organization and I hope they do well: https://www.runforsomething.net/. The party has to start courting Millennials not just as a voting or donor bloc but as an actual candidate bloc. edit: it would also be nice if Democratic organizations would stop sending me 5+ fundraising emails a day. I'm not giving you money every single time Trump does something stupid, I'm not that rich. axeil fucked around with this message at 23:13 on Feb 10, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:07
|
|
|
axeil posted:I think the biggest issue right now is just building a bench for the Dems. Take a look at how much State House and State Senate members make. It's pathetic. A VA House of Delegates member makes less than $25k a year. When you're not the party of big business and can't rely on tons of "gifts" from big business that let you get the operating cash you need, how is the next Obama going to get started? A friend of mine has considered running for local office out here but he can't do it because even if he won the salary would leave him destitute, much less the personal expense he'd incur by running. VA House of Delegates is 60 days.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:10
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:VA House of Delegates is 60 days. Right, but presumably you'd still need some income for the other 305 days a year. Plus, that still doesn't account for how much it costs to run a campaign, even a small local one and the opportunity cost of switching your career from "whatever you're doing now" to "politician". When your campaign manager is your mom, you're not going to do as well as if your campaign manager is someone with at least some level of experience (but who requires money so they don't starve).
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:11
|
|
|
axeil posted:Right, but presumably you'd still need some income for the other 305 days a year. Plus, that still doesn't account for how much it costs to run a campaign, even a small local one and the opportunity cost of switching your career from "whatever you're doing now" to "politician" virtually everyone who serves in a part-time legislature has another job. for years my delegate in WV worked for the rail roads.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:13
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:virtually everyone who serves in a part-time legislature has another job. for years my delegate in WV worked for the rail roads. I'm curious if that fact isn't well-known and might be suppressing interested candidates. I mean, my friend would probably have to quit his job if he ran because he's a federal employee and I am pretty sure being an elected Delegate is an issue if you're also an employee of the Executive branch. But even 60 days a year you can't do your job is an issue. I imagine there are lots of people where if they told their employer "hey I need to take the next 2 months off" they'd be shown the door. Maybe the party should push for full-time state legislatures to allow younger folks to run? Lightning Knight posted:Serious question, what state parties don't suck for the Democrats? If I get into my state's party, who am I looking at for "state party that is cool and good?" Virginia's seems pretty good. They have found candidates for every single State House/State Senate district that Hillary won that is currently held by the Republicans and managed to hold off the 2014 slaughter. Not taking down Comstock hurts but I'm pretty sure she's going to get crushed in '18. axeil fucked around with this message at 23:29 on Feb 10, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:18
|
|
|
axeil posted:Right, but presumably you'd still need some income for the other 305 days a year. Plus, that still doesn't account for how much it costs to run a campaign, even a small local one and the opportunity cost of switching your career from "whatever you're doing now" to "politician". When your campaign manager is your mom, you're not going to do as well as if your campaign manager is someone with at least some level of experience (but who requires money so they don't starve). "Bob can't be in the office for 60 days out of the year, I guess we should fire him since that's better than having direct access to the state government. They definitely wouldn't be able to retaliate against us in any way either." Maybe some companies are staffed/owned by people stupid enough to do so but the vast majority aren't.
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:29
|
|
|
Evil Fluffy posted:"Bob can't be in the office for 60 days out of the year, I guess we should fire him since that's better than having direct access to the state government. They definitely wouldn't be able to retaliate against us in any way either." I mean, yes, it'd be valuable to have that access but then at the same time that is borderline corruption. You don't think a company would lean on someone to vote "the right way" or risk being found to be "not a team player"?
|
|
#
?
Feb 10, 2017 23:33
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:Again, I think Ellison is a much more telegenic person who I think is better suited to be the de facto face of the party for two years until we hit 2020 primary bullshit. He's obviously a more natural communicator. MD Gov: Perez DNC Chair: Buttigieg 2020 Nominee: Ellison tbqh
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 01:49
|
|
|
I love it, a few months ago I literally got probated for saying that the DNC rigged it against Bernie and today Perez says the same thing. Glad to see the worthless mod who probated me was eliminated in the recent purges.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 03:42
|
|
|
NathanScottPhillips posted:I love it, a few months ago I literally got probated for saying that the DNC rigged it against Bernie and today Perez says the same thing. Glad to see the worthless mod who probated me was eliminated in the recent purges.  Just came in to see what was going on with Buttgieg.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 04:31
|
|
|
stone cold posted:
He went on Morning Joe yesterday.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 04:37
|
|
|
WhiskeyJuvenile posted:MD Gov: Perez I like this a lot, but only if Warren doesn't run in 2020.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 06:48
|
|
|
Cease to Hope posted:Biden is now popular, both inside the party and outside of it. Being vice president took him from gaffe-prone also-ran to legitimate presidential contender. It wasn't just Clinton that cleared the deck for Presidential candidates in 2015. Everyone was getting out of the way of both Clinton and Biden, until Biden removed himself from the running because of Beau's death (and because most likely because his health isn't that great).
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 07:04
|
|
|
Dr. Fishopolis posted:I like this a lot, but only if Warren doesn't run in 2020. Gonna have to be ageist here
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 15:30
|
|
|
A Buttery Pastry posted:Really, they were all quite smart to leave the deck, considering the price Biden paid for not doing so immediately. What are you suggesting here
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 16:22
|
|
|
NathanScottPhillips posted:I love it, a few months ago I literally got probated for saying that the DNC rigged it against Bernie and today Perez says the same thing. Glad to see the worthless mod who probated me was eliminated in the recent purges. Well, it wasn't. So the mod was right. That was a rumor that Wikileaks helped to legitimize by cherry picking a bunch of emails, as it later came out. Also even if the electoral vote was rigged Hillary still won the popular vote in the primary. And if you try to discount that then all of a sudden Donald loving Trump of all people gains legitimacy, so i'd advise to be careful what you wish for.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 17:16
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:What are you suggesting here
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 17:45
|
|
|
WhiskeyJuvenile posted:Gonna have to be ageist here wow holy gently caress I didn't even realize she was 67. She looks easily 10 years younger.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 17:49
|
|
WhiskeyJuvenile posted:Gonna have to be ageist here She'll still be younger in 2020 than Bernie was in 2016.
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 18:23
|
|
|
Zerilan posted:She'll still be younger in 2020 than Bernie was in 2016. Won't she be younger than Trump is now?
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 19:58
|
|
|
A Buttery Pastry posted:You know what I'm suggesting. Youre suggesting Hillary had Beau Biden killed?
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 20:43
|
|
|
BI NOW GAY LATER posted:Youre suggesting Hillary had Beau Biden killed? With brain cancer! 
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 21:44
|
|
|
vince foster was only a test run !!!!
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 21:56
|
|
|
It's typical for serial killers to perfect their methods over their career. Clinton probably had a lot of messy attempts back in the day, had evolved into a more skilled killer by the time she convinced Vince Foster to kill himself, and has now perfected her craft to the point where she is not even suspected by a suspicious public, even when she has the most obvious of motives.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 22:17
|
|
|
A Buttery Pastry posted:It's typical for serial killers to perfect their methods over their career. Clinton probably had a lot of messy attempts back in the day, had evolved into a more skilled killer by the time she convinced Vince Foster to kill himself, and has now perfected her craft to the point where she is not even suspected by a suspicious public, even when she has the most obvious of motives. failure to mention the foul assassin Benjamin Ghazi 0/10
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2017 22:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 21:13 |
|
|
Man, never thought I'd see the day when we'd have the Hillary assassination theories coming from within our threads.
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 00:05
|
|
