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Balance chat: was watching some guy stream as an Orochi. The whole time he was complaining that Orochi is very bad must be buffed. When asked why he didn't play another character he said "I'm gonna get pro as Orochi while they are weak, then once once Ubisoft buffs them I will be a GOD because I'll be the only one who practiced with them!!!" Had a little chuckle.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:24
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Psycho Society posted:Yeah the beta's over for now. More games really need to do something like that, made me really want to get a game that otherwise wouldn't have even been on my radar other than "oh another mount and blade type game" Most games aren't confident enough in their core gameplay to do a fully open, no-embargo beta. Last major game I remember doing it was Overwatch. Most major publishers would rather just ride on pre-release hype for preorders, using the brand/IP of the game as the spearhead. Seeing as this is a new IP with a unique style of gameplay that most people haven't seen before, I think it was pretty important that they do it in this case. I it likely earned them far more word-of-mouth advertising and pre-orders than they otherwise would have gotten.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:24
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Beta is over! As of this posting the Steam Review for the For Honor Beta is showing 46% of the 6,927 user reviews are positive. From a quick glance at the first few negative reviews the main complaints seem to be: -Lack of dedicated servers -Class balance -High price point Personally I played about 10 hours, solo queueing for everything. I did not have many connection issues, but seeing people drop out mid-match was not a rare occurrence. I have no way to tell if they were rage quits or connection drops. The only time I ever disconnected was when a host migration was happening. I'm sure that dedicated servers would make things better but I had a great time without them. I did not experience many bugs. One of my orders displayed in german and for one Dominion match my screen was blurry the entire time. I decided to pretend I was a blind swordsman and my team ended up winning. I barely played 1v1. My daily orders pushed me into 4v4 Dominion and Elimination most of the time. I mostly played Kensei and I really enjoyed the class. I never felt like I was helpless in any situation but I did feel like I made plenty of mistakes that I could work on in the future. I don't feel like I played for long enough to get a feel for class balance, and that is going to get shaken up at release with three new classes and whatever changes the developers make anyway. I really enjoyed the chaos of the 4v4 modes. People complaining about getting "ganked" need to realize that it's 4v4, not four individual 1v1s. The match starts out that way but you can easily get an advantage if you're up against a slow class that can't stop you from reaching a power up. There's also a lot of tactical play you can make simply by choosing where to fight. I'd always try not to fight anywhere I could get pushed into something fatal, for example. As for the price point, I agree that it feels steep. I'm taking the plunge on Valentines day because I had a great time and clearly I haven't learned anything from when I got burned on The Division (a game that is now cool and good as opposed to the poorly designed mess it was at release). I really enjoy the aesthetics and the action and I hope to play this game for a long time.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:31
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For(get) Honour 
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Feb 12, 2017 23:32
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Chomp8645 posted:Balance chat: was watching some guy stream as an Orochi. The whole time he was complaining that Orochi is very bad must be buffed. When asked why he didn't play another character he said "I'm gonna get pro as Orochi while they are weak, then once once Ubisoft buffs them I will be a GOD because I'll be the only one who practiced with them!!!" Orochi is good with their little feints and dash slashes and deflects and double high-slash poo poo but if you do it too often people just block high at all your poo poo. Went against a team that had like 3 Orochis and I just casually held Up and matrix-blocked all their poo poo. I haven't thought any character is tremendously better than all others yet since I've been hosed up by all of them at some point but also did well with those same heroes. Nobushi and Peacemaker are loving annoying though since many players just wimp out and waste everyone's time by running in circles, even when the rest of their team was executed. If I had to say one thing that pissed me off more than most it would be the shouldercharges from Warden or freight train charge from Conquerer. If you don't see that guy coming then you're getting pushed on your rear end and stabbed forever.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:34
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Posting this for the new page: you can still pick up For Honor at GMG for $48. They also have the higher tiered versions for the same 20% off discount. I highly recommend them to anyone looking to buy the PC version.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:35
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A decent Warlord with competent parry skills is a frightening thing. This beta was good, I'll probably buy this game. thats my hot take.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:35
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Chomp8645 posted:Not gonna quote the whole thing cause I don't wanna fill up the thread with a semi-relevant discussion but I wanted to respond. Just to be clear I don't really have skin in the game, I've been around long enough that I can generally shrug off most things, especially when we're just talking about something as low-stakes as what video game we like. Rather, I was defending the guy you responded to, in that a fair amount (certainly not all) of the recent "criticism" of the game in the thread has just been hyperbolic hot-takes and I think it's natural to be frustrated with those kind of posts if you enjoy the thing in question. Of course "I don't like this thing and here's why" will generally not have an implication in it but "THIS THING IS SHITE" often does, simply because of the lack of context innate to a text post on the internet and the apparent negativity with which it was posted. As to your further post, I agree that the value of SA largely comes from the quality of discussion and certainly criticism should be allowed and even encouraged. However it's disingenuous to imply that some or even most of the "criticism" posted, even here on SA, is much more than an emotional hot-take instead of something that has value to a discussion. I know that's holding this comedy forum on the interbutts to a high bar but I do enjoy those rare occasions when a thread manages to achieve it. I'd imagine other people do as well and that wraps back around to why offhanded negative comments about a game can be understandably frustrating for someone. Certainly SA is better about this than Reddit, where the For Honor Reddit (for example) is literally nothing more than a meme-repository (although some of them are pretty Spicey, to be fair).
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Feb 12, 2017 23:35
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Nechronic posted:As of this posting the Steam Review for the For Honor Beta is showing 46% of the 6,927 user reviews are positive. Wow you're right, I'm actually pretty surprised.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:36
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Nechronic posted:
Yeah 60 is rough for even this which is why I'll probably be dumping some trade in stuff to cut it down to 40. If you can't get the game for around 45 dollars and/or have less than 3 friends to play with then I'd say it's a rough sell.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:37
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Chomp8645 posted:Wow you're right, I'm actually pretty surprised. Almost every single negative review is someone complaining about p2p  .This is why Trump is president.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:40
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Chomp8645 posted:Wow you're right, I'm actually pretty surprised. To be a fair some of those thumbs down reviews are "beta is over! dont like it!" or "I only started playing the beta 3 hours before it ended! you assholes!"
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Feb 12, 2017 23:40
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AttackBacon posted:Just to be clear I don't really have skin in the game, I've been around long enough that I can generally shrug off most things, especially when we're just talking about something as low-stakes as what video game we like. Rather, I was defending the guy you responded to, in that a fair amount (certainly not all) of the recent "criticism" of the game in the thread has just been hyperbolic hot-takes and I think it's natural to be frustrated with those kind of posts if you enjoy the thing in question. Of course "I don't like this thing and here's why" will generally not have an implication in it but "THIS THING IS SHITE" often does, simply because of the lack of context innate to a text post on the internet and the apparent negativity with which it was posted. Yeah that's true, a lot of it is drive by "this sucks welp cya later". But I feel like for every one of those there is an equivalent "game good I preordered welp cya" post that is equally uninformative cheer leading. imo that's just part of the business and both are ultimately inoffensive albeit annoying. Also both sides will naturally spike in frequency and severity right around release.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:40
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Nechronic posted:Beta is over! As of this posting the Steam Review for the For Honor Beta is showing 46% of the 6,927 user reviews are positive. Is that low? seems a bit low to me. Hopefully a lot of people enjoy the game but i guess it is a little tough to get into and takes a bit of time and effort to get to grips with.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:41
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"spear chick is op" *thumbs down* lol
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Feb 12, 2017 23:42
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Wasn't really interested in the game before the beta but the duel mode made me buy it. The whole fighting game-lite with with swords and axes is really enjoyable to me, and I'm pretty sure there will be an active 1v1 community even if the game is less than successful. The price is definitely a bit high, 60€ on Steam? It's a lot cheaper on gmg though, thanks brexit.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:42
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Psycho Society posted:To be a fair some of those thumbs down reviews are "beta is over! dont like it!" or "I only started playing the beta 3 hours before it ended! you assholes!" WE NEED FREE TO PLAY WITH DINATIONS!!!
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Feb 12, 2017 23:44
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panda clue posted:"spear chick is op" *thumbs down* 
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Feb 12, 2017 23:45
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Chomp8645 posted:Wow you're right, I'm actually pretty surprised. I'm not. Games has a lot of issues and some people don't understand that its a beta meant to iron them out. Or they think that the game will still have them on release, which TBH isn't an unfair assumption. Plus the game just has brutal combat where someone can very easily get completely destroyed by something if they don't know the counter. To a more casual player, its easy to dismiss that stuff has OP rather than learn how to deal with it. Or they try to learn how to deal with it and get frustrated by the games lack of feedback about what they are doing wrong. Guardbreaks are probably the chief offender here; not knowing how to counter them means you'll get trashed by people using them. Even knowing how to counter them, actually pulling it off seems really finicky. There's no sort of timing tutorial that tells you exactly what you did wrong, so it just feels like you're mashing your head against a wall.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:45
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Chomp8645 posted:Balance chat: was watching some guy stream as an Orochi. The whole time he was complaining that Orochi is very bad must be buffed. When asked why he didn't play another character he said "I'm gonna get pro as Orochi while they are weak, then once once Ubisoft buffs them I will be a GOD because I'll be the only one who practiced with them!!!" I mean, I wouldn't put Orochi in the top tier or anything, but on the whole he does seem perfectly solid. Very fast attacks, good dodging, a 2-hit combo on a top light attack (which is guaranteed after a parry), and a good followup after a deflect. He doesn't have any standout moves like the Peacekeeper or Nobushi, but the general kit is so solid that you can easily make him work with just regular attacks and deflects.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:49
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Internet Kraken posted:I'm not. Games has a lot of issues and some people don't understand that its a beta meant to iron them out. Or they think that the game will still have them on release, which TBH isn't an unfair assumption. If someone defends a game by saying "its a beta" and that beta is occurring months before release, then that is reasonable (well, to a degree). But a "beta" that occurs less than a week before the full release of the game is just a promotional demo that's been renamed to deflect criticism. Anyone playing a "beta" that immediately precedes retail release should assume that any issues they have will not be resolved in the release version.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:55
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Nechronic posted:Beta is over! As of this posting the Steam Review for the For Honor Beta is showing 46% of the 6,927 user reviews are positive. From a quick glance at the first few negative reviews the main complaints seem to be: Coming from doing a fair amount of PvPing in Dark Souls 3 I was extremely leery of p2p hosting in For Honor but I was pleasantly surprised by the beta. I primarily played on PS4 so I can't speak to the PC experience (the hour or two I played were fine) but in around 12 hours of play on PS4 I only had three complete drops (where the game dropped back out to the menu) and a handful of host-replacements. Lag was not an issue in any match that I played except for one in which the host quickly disconnected. I didn't become good enough to comment on class balance but I didn't feel any matchup was impossible (the roughest that I found was Berserker into Conqueror but I feel like that is a fairly natural counter). I think that a couple classes may have too many tools (the Nobushi, Peacemaker, and Warlord) but it's close enough that the game remained fun for me and the vast majority of my deaths I felt to be my fault. The price point complaint is understandable to me, $60 is high in this day of f2p but I'll reserve judgement until I see the entirety of the game. I think that Ubisoft's new DLC model is great and does a lot to counterbalance the initial sticker shock. Price point complaints are a good sign in my opinion, as that means that all of those are people who want to buy the game but simply may not be able to initially. Chomp8645 posted:Yeah that's true, a lot of it is drive by "this sucks welp cya later". But I feel like for every one of those there is an equivalent "game good I preordered welp cya" post that is equally uninformative cheer leading. imo that's just part of the business and both are ultimately inoffensive albeit annoying. Also both sides will naturally spike in frequency and severity right around release. Oh certainly, I'd agree. As an optimist myself I tend to gloss over the positive no-content posts (since they have innate value to me simply by being positive) but it's certainly not very different. Your final point is also exactly correct. Internet Kraken posted:Plus the game just has brutal combat where someone can very easily get completely destroyed by something if they don't know the counter. To a more casual player, its easy to dismiss that stuff has OP rather than learn how to deal with it. Or they try to learn how to deal with it and get frustrated by the games lack of feedback about what they are doing wrong. Guardbreaks are probably the chief offender here; not knowing how to counter them means you'll get trashed by people using them. Even knowing how to counter them, actually pulling it off seems really finicky. There's no sort of timing tutorial that tells you exactly what you did wrong, so it just feels like you're mashing your head against a wall. I think this is a major contributor to what Chomp and I have been going back and forth about. At it's core this is a fighting game and like all fighting games, if you don't put in your homework and go up against someone who has, you are going to get destroyed in ways you can't even comprehend (see: the random group I got invited to yesterday having people screaming about their unblockable being blocked, getting one shot [in dominion], etc). This isn't Overwatch where the core mechanics are very straightforward and intuitive (see man/woman/robutt: shoot man/woman/robutt). A lot of people have an active dislike for putting in their homework on a game and this is the kind of game that is just going to be miserable for them.
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Feb 12, 2017 23:56
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Chomp8645 posted:Balance chat: was watching some guy stream as an Orochi. The whole time he was complaining that Orochi is very bad must be buffed. When asked why he didn't play another character he said "I'm gonna get pro as Orochi while they are weak, then once once Ubisoft buffs them I will be a GOD because I'll be the only one who practiced with them!!!" Were you watching Scottjund? I enjoyed watching him pvp in the Dark Souls games and I enjoy watching him duel in For Honor. He is sticking with Orochi. His main criticism seemed to be "name one thing the Orochi does well and I'll name a class that does it better." He also said that the Warden outclasses Orochi in every way. On a general note, I think this game obviously has a lot of appeal to the Souls fan base and I expect a lot of people to jump ship to this game since DS3 PVP was so disappointing with instant heals and extreme amounts of dodge rolling. Internet Kraken posted:Plus the game just has brutal combat where someone can very easily get completely destroyed by something if they don't know the counter. To a more casual player, its easy to dismiss that stuff has OP rather than learn how to deal with it. Or they try to learn how to deal with it and get frustrated by the games lack of feedback about what they are doing wrong. Guardbreaks are probably the chief offender here; not knowing how to counter them means you'll get trashed by people using them. Even knowing how to counter them, actually pulling it off seems really finicky. There's no sort of timing tutorial that tells you exactly what you did wrong, so it just feels like you're mashing your head against a wall. I had a lot of fun playing Bushido Blade as a kid and I appreciate the feeling of lethality that this game shares. Even if you're down to a sliver of health it feels good to know that you can definitely outplay your opponent. AttackBacon posted:I think this is a major contributor to what Chomp and I have been going back and forth about. At it's core this is a fighting game and like all fighting games, if you don't put in your homework and go up against someone who has, you are going to get destroyed in ways you can't even comprehend (see: the random group I got invited to yesterday having people screaming about their unblockable being blocked, getting one shot [in dominion], etc). This isn't Overwatch where the core mechanics are very straightforward and intuitive (see man/woman/robutt: shoot man/woman/robutt). A lot of people have an active dislike for putting in their homework on a game and this is the kind of game that is just going to be miserable for them. I've never been into playing fighting games but I have enjoyed watching them for a long time. I like For Honor because it has similar mind games but without the complicated inputs. As for doing homework, For Honor could definitely benefit for a fighting game style training mode so you can really break down individual moves and combos and learn exactly what moves are best in specific situations. I should start recording myself so I can review my own play. I need to work on my feints (I usually forget they exist) and I also forget to use my zone attack a lot. Diephoon fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Feb 13, 2017 |
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Feb 12, 2017 23:58
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All i know is i got to cosplay as a Skull Mask Triple H viking with a huge gently caress-off axe for the few days this beta was available and wrecked weebos who called me NO HONORABU on quick chat
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Feb 13, 2017 00:03
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Nechronic posted:Were you watching Scottjund? I enjoyed watching him pvp in the Dark Souls games and I enjoy watching him duel in For Honor. He is sticking with Orochi. His main criticism seemed to be "name one thing the Orochi does well and I'll name a class that does it better." He also said that the Warden outclasses Orochi in every way. Scott is a great player but he is the king of hot-takes and once he has taken a position he becomes extremely ego-invested in defending it (not to say that in a mean way, I certainly was as bad or worse at his age), so he's a really bad place to go to for unbiased commentary. He also tends to only look at things from a single point of view (which in For Honor will presumably be high-skill 1v1 duels) which further limits the value of his critiques for the general public. I'm generally very leery of his comments on balance in any game. His narrated thought duels are an excellent bit of content however and a great place to learn the mentality needed for DS3 dueling.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:04
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Nechronic posted:Were you watching Scottjund? I enjoyed watching him pvp in the Dark Souls games and I enjoy watching him duel in For Honor. He is sticking with Orochi. His main criticism seemed to be "name one thing the Orochi does well and I'll name a class that does it better." He also said that the Warden outclasses Orochi in every way. I don't the remember the name and it wasn't anyone I follow. But he was bitching about the Warden a lot so yeah it was probably him lol. Also I think we had a productive exchange AttackBacon, you are good people 
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Feb 13, 2017 00:06
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super macho dude posted:All i know is i got to cosplay as a Skull Mask Triple H viking with a huge gently caress-off axe for the few days this beta was available and wrecked weebos who called me NO HONORABU on quick chat I don't find much appeal in the viking classes which is unfortunate because they have the coolest skull cosmetics.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:08
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Chomp8645 posted:If someone defends a game by saying "its a beta" and that beta is occurring months before release, then that is reasonable (well, to a degree). But a "beta" that occurs less than a week before the full release of the game is just a promotional demo that's been renamed to deflect criticism. Anyone playing a "beta" that immediately precedes retail release should assume that any issues they have will not be resolved in the release version. I think server load issues are a pretty reasonable thing to occur in an open beta that could be resolved by release. Anything else though, yeah, that poo poo isn't getting fixed until at least the first patch. I was having a hell of a time with their party system breaking in various ways; I hope that poo poo gets resolved fast because it really kills the fun quickly.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:14
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Also how stable is this game for everyone else? It runs perfectly fine for me most of the time. Running it on max settings without frame drops or anything. However, it has a tendency to crash seemingly at random. Most of the crashes occur in the menus of all places. If I leave a lobby, sometimes the game will freeze up and stop loading. Have to force close the game.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:18
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Nechronic posted:Were you watching Scottjund? I enjoyed watching him pvp in the Dark Souls games and I enjoy watching him duel in For Honor. He is sticking with Orochi. His main criticism seemed to be "name one thing the Orochi does well and I'll name a class that does it better." He also said that the Warden outclasses Orochi in every way. As someone who played Orochi for a while and switched to Peacekeeper and then eventually Warden, can confirm. My biggest complaint about Orochi is that he doesn't seem to have any one thing he does particularly well or that you need to take into special consideration when playing against one. Peacekeepers have the bleed-out guardbreak attack, Nobushi has different stances and you need to know what stance leads into what combo, Conqueror has fullguard and also a chargeable attack you have to anticipate, but what does Orochi have? Like poo poo, uh oh, he's really good at dodging to the side!
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Feb 13, 2017 00:18
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Played an obscene amount, pretty much all day every day since Thursday. Prestiged Warden and Nobushi and I feel like these are the strongest heroes. God tier: Peacekeeper, Orochi High tier: Warden, Nobushi, Warlord Okay tier: Kensei, raider average: Conqueror, Berserker A good PK & Orochi will completely loving wreck anything you try to bring to the table. The tools they have are better than anyone else combined with instant heavy feints and the fastest light attacks in the game.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:19
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Internet Kraken posted:Also how stable is this game for everyone else? It runs perfectly fine for me most of the time. Running it on max settings without frame drops or anything. However, it has a tendency to crash seemingly at random. Most of the crashes occur in the menus of all places. If I leave a lobby, sometimes the game will freeze up and stop loading. Have to force close the game. Pretty much my exact experience on the PC. The game runs wonderfully actually in the game, but the UI/menu system is prone to all sorts of bugs and issues. Pretty sure the two were worked on by entirely different teams because holy moley can you tell the difference in quality between the two. Really a drat shame that such stupid bullshit has to get in the way of a good game.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:19
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Sultan Tarquin posted:Played an obscene amount, pretty much all day every day since Thursday. Prestiged Warden and Nobushi and I feel like these are the strongest heroes. This guy loving gets it. The thing about PK for me is that if she just throws out random lights, it's basically impossible to consistently block them even for a good player. Compare to the Berserker whose light attacks can be parried by particularly quick enemies. Plenty of salt from me this beta. Also consider this another shitpost complaining about how no goons would come play with me for the beta. But seriously, the game is very fun with a group. Even a group of internet weirdos. Dueling with someone you're actively talking to is a really good way to learn about game mechanics and strategies. Gangbanging pubbies and harvesting honorific tears is also a blast. Fresh Shesh Besh fucked around with this message at 00:25 on Feb 13, 2017 |
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Feb 13, 2017 00:19
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Yeah, Peacekeepers biggest strength isn't her guaranteed 50% HP bleed on guard break (although that is completely broken) it's the fact that she can attack with lights faster than you can move your guard. Against a good Peacekeeper you can never get the chance to attack and it puts you on the constant defensive. Her dashing heavy lunge has obscene range and combos into a bleed. Her heavy feints are instantaneous and cancel into a bleed. Her deflects combo into bleed and then you have a barrage of light attacks from every direction which are almost impossible to block or predict. I'd probably rate Peacekeeper above Orochi purely because of the bleed. Orochi has pretty much exactly the same tools except his attacks do more damage to make up for no having a bleed.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:24
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I think if people know what they're doing, the warden(and to a lesser extent kensei)'s cancel game is absolutely ridiculous and probably could use a nerf. You should not be able to cancel any unblockables, period. Also I don't know why as a warlord my heavies were getting stuffed by guard breaks.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:26
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As far as balanced is concerned, I really think those 1v1 maps that are just narrow corridors are absolute garbage that favor some classes way more than others. Playing a berserker without room to maneuver suuuuuuuucks. I like how there's one map that is just a loving 2 feet wide bridge. Most of the time when I get the map, the person with the little arena on their side will just walk into it and wait for the other player to join them. Cause fighting on that lovely little bridge is so stupid.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:26
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maybe it's just because my friends and I picked Conqueror/Warlord combos a lot but Nobushi and Peacekeepers routinely couldn't keep up the bleed damage with the super-armor beefcake haymakers we were throwing out. The tiny healthpools were no match for fullguard followed by leaping superman punches, which are the best punches
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Feb 13, 2017 00:27
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Yeah Warden is very good but they have a couple of weaknesses that the assassins just don't have. Wardens side light attacks are really slow, you can't parry guard break a nobushi because of her range and your dashing and doges are slow so you can't get in on a fast hero. Once you start a shoulder bash mixup though you can easily blow the gently caress out of anyone if they're not careful.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:29
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Panzeh posted:I think if people know what they're doing, the warden(and to a lesser extent kensei)'s cancel game is absolutely ridiculous and probably could use a nerf. Canceling those unblockables still sucks down a huge amount of stamina, its not a totally free feint on their end.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:29
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I had a great time during Beta and the Nobushi was my jam. I felt that a lot of people didn't respect her ability to stab faces which made it easier for me to dominate bitches. That hidden stance has so many uses.
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Feb 13, 2017 00:30
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