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hillary clinton, ghost of elections past and future
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Feb 13, 2017 17:48
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| # ? May 26, 2024 20:53 |
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Philip Rivers posted:I'm not comparing across party lines though, I'm saying Hillary got much more support in a state like, say, Ohio than Bernie did and lost that state to Trump in the GE. What evidence is there that Bernie, having gotten less support than Hillary in the primary, would have gotten more than she did in the GE? If the answer is independent voters, remember that Ohio has an open primary. An open primary still has a different set of voters than the general election, in that the vast majority of people don't bother voting in the primary but a decent chunk of them will vote in the general imagine if you will more clap emojis docbeard posted:Are you seriously asking why the AP would want to be the first to report arguably the biggest piece of American political news at the time? I thought the media loves horse-race narratives. Why not keep people glued to their seats all of the next day watching and reading coverage of a primary, rather than finding out it doesn't matter right beforehand?
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Feb 13, 2017 17:48
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I dont think we shall ever be able to move on from the primaries and heal
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Feb 13, 2017 17:49
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Proud Christian Mom posted:she can't lose, It's Her Turn! right? i mean rep voters would never vote full fascism and dem voters won't stay home when the alternative is full fascism
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Feb 13, 2017 17:50
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this election was a gut punch to the nation, and we're not gonna stop talking about it anytime soon
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Feb 13, 2017 17:50
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loquacius posted:I thought the media loves horse-race narratives. Why not keep people glued to their seats all of the next day watching and reading coverage of a primary, rather than finding out it doesn't matter right beforehand? it was called by the AP, who makes money from people re-publishing their stories. not the networks, who were expecting to call after NJ i mean regardless, if the clinton campaign could tell the ap what to do she would have had a much easier time in this election
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Feb 13, 2017 17:51
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logikv9 posted:I can't tell how much of this is joking and how much of it is not reading the article in the grand scheme of things, only two things really matter: death and quote:Buttigieg. bootedgeedg-- yeah, that.
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Feb 13, 2017 17:51
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Serf posted:this election was a republican voters are antifa, and america is richard spencer right now we're walking away from the cameras crying
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Feb 13, 2017 17:52
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Philip Rivers posted:God just 6 me now please I hate getting pulled into primary salt chat every time I say anything about how Hillary isn't the devil. She's not the devil She's a run of the mill corporate oligarch who ran a huge patronage network and outside of that has a weird and devoted personality cult. And she lost a general election to Donald J Trump, pissmonkey.
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Feb 13, 2017 17:52
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Concerned Citizen posted:it was called by the AP, who makes money from people re-publishing their stories. not the networks, who were expecting to call after NJ My argument wasn't that they were telling them what to do so much as leaking info at exactly the right time to take all the wind out of Sanders' sails And I still say the timing was highly suspect, but even if it WAS just a completely random confluence of natural forces or whatever, the race was still pretty much over by California anyway and IMO it was impressive that Bernie managed to get so many votes there even after being mathematically eliminated from contention
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Feb 13, 2017 17:53
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You know who has a real cult of personality? Bernie
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Feb 13, 2017 17:53
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Darkman Fanpage posted:bernie and trump: the nation is broken we must fix it!
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Feb 13, 2017 17:54
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Philip Rivers posted:You know who has a real cult of personality? Bernie Oh jeez
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Feb 13, 2017 17:55
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Philip Rivers posted:You know who has a real cult of personality? Bernie yes, actually. Which points to one of the major problems with the way Democrats conduct business. Politics, like the vast majority of things in life, cannot be reduced to looking at 2 columns in a spreadsheet and making the best choice. Politics is necessarily personal and human: we don't vote for proposals, we vote for people. I caution not to hero worship anyone, least of all a politician, but it's to Bernie's credit that people have a strong vision of the kind of world he wants. I have no idea what Hillary's world would've looked like, but I guess it's my fault because I didn't view her website.
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Feb 13, 2017 17:56
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Philip Rivers posted:You know who has a real cult of personality? Bernie speaking as someone who was in that cult of personality, to someone who is in the other one: both of them do
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Feb 13, 2017 17:56
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Philip Rivers posted:You know who has a real cult of personality? JEB!
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Feb 13, 2017 17:56
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Philip Rivers posted:You know who has a real cult of personality? Bernie  that you think that     just
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Feb 13, 2017 17:57
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Penisaurus Sex posted:yes, actually. did you know there are people who vote who do not have access to the internet weird i know
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Feb 13, 2017 17:59
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anime was right posted:did you know there are people who vote who do not have access to the internet robbie mook assured me it would be fine
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Feb 13, 2017 18:00
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All successful presidential candidacies rely on a rabid cult of personality. It's called "your base" Also in good news, some rear end in a top hat that pulled a gun on a BLM rally got convicted http://koin.com/2017/02/12/man-who-pulled-gun-on-crowd-guilty/
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Feb 13, 2017 18:02
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zegermans posted:All successful presidential candidacies rely on a rabid cult of personality. It's called "your base" im sure his 3 months of probation will sting
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Feb 13, 2017 18:04
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is there ever been, in teh history of america, a black man who has drawn a gun with police around and survived
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Feb 13, 2017 18:05
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Hey Newton. For a while, at least.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:06
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Al! posted:is there ever been, in teh history of america, a black man who has drawn a gun with police around and survived it doesn't even have to be a gun!
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Feb 13, 2017 18:06
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Al! posted:is there ever been, in teh history of america, a black man who has drawn a gun with police around and survived I'm p sure there's black cops
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Feb 13, 2017 18:06
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loquacius posted:Devil's Advocate here: let's say the opinion Philip Rivers has most recently moved the goalposts to is 100% correct, and Hillary only lost because of decades of smear campaigns of misogynist origin. Take that as a given for a second. I think the general answer to this is that they assumed that everyone could see the 30 years of Republican lies/the emails/etc for what they were, and that everyone could see Donald Trump for what he was. And really, I think they were probably right about that, but wrong about how much difference it would make. This election didn't turn solely on desperate people (from the demographic breakdowns I've seen it was basically rich old people that hosed us all, as per usual), but they were absolutely a factor, and Trump was the only GE candidate who (astonishingly) was convincing about giving a poo poo about their problems. Hillary's premise of Let's Hold On To The Good Things We've Got In The Face Of People Who Want To Take Them Away isn't actually awful, but it's not a message that, on its own, was going to resonate with people who are wondering where the gently caress any of their promised good things are. I'm more skeptical than many about whether Bernie could have out-populisted Trump the Televangelist, but in retrospect attacking Trump as a failed politician was a losing strategy.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:09
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Al! posted:is there ever been, in teh history of america, a black man who has drawn a gun with police around and survived Negromancer has a story of beating up cops and getting only a year.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:10
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Philip Rivers posted:You know who has a real cult of personality? Bernie All successful national politicians have a cult of personality. Ted loving Cruz has true believers, for some reason. What does that have to do with anything?
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Feb 13, 2017 18:12
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do you know who you get if you want a politician without a cult of personality? You get John Kerry. Even fuckin Gore got some Clinton cult spillover and then when he got all beardy and stuck his tongue down his wife's throat on stage folks were all 'haha ok'. Kerry was a black hole of personality and if you tell me you know any one genuine Kerry fan, not just a Kerry voter but someone who was eager to go vote for him in a not 'well yea fuckin Bush is gonna wreck us otherwise' context I'll call you a liar. The worst part is Clinton totally did have her cult of personality. She just completely failed to use it because she somehow forgot after near three decades in national politics that you still need to preach to the chior.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:18
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Concerned Citizen posted:it was called by the AP, who makes money from people re-publishing their stories. not the networks, who were expecting to call after NJ ThndrShk2k posted:"No" cried the DNC in a lackluster monotone voice as the media repeatedly says Hillary is destined to win due to her massive lead of 500 super delegates
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Feb 13, 2017 18:20
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Tatum Girlparts posted:do you know who you get if you want a politician without a cult of personality? You get John Kerry. I was a member of the Kerry Kult. I was super happy when he became SoS.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:22
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zegermans posted:I was a member of the Kerry Kult. I was super happy when he became SoS. what the gently caress, i almost gave u a probation just for that
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Feb 13, 2017 18:23
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zegermans posted:I was a member of the Kerry Kult. I was super happy when he became SoS. there's so many jokes to make here but I just genuinely want to settle on '...why though' in hopes to get some insight.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:24
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Tatum Girlparts posted:do you know who you get if you want a politician without a cult of personality? You get John Kerry.  except I think Clinton's campaign focused TOO much on preaching to the choir and running up the score in California etczegermans posted:I was a member of the Kerry Kult. I was super happy when he became SoS. jesus christ zegermans
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Feb 13, 2017 18:25
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I've used Kerry as an example for a politician without a 'cult of personality' plenty of times and this is the first time a dude has been all 'nah I liked Kerry tho' and it's like having someone go 'uh excuse me I like to get my nuts kicked' when someone says 'that was a real kick in the balls huh'. It's not that I didn't know there's a literal non-zero population into that, it's just that I didn't expect to actually encounter one in the wild.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:26
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He wasn't Bush, that was enough for me. Also the Iran Nuclear Deal was a shining example of what he could have been as president, a man who's willing to put in 25 hour days to get a deal done to save lives.
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Feb 13, 2017 18:28
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Oh, that's why I said "In a not 'well bush is gonna gently caress us' context". Like, if you were voting in the primary would you pick Kerry as choice #1?
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Feb 13, 2017 18:29
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Tatum Girlparts posted:Oh, that's why I said "In a not 'well bush is gonna gently caress us' context". Like, if you were voting in the primary would you pick Kerry as choice #1? i thought john kerry was just mac tonite's name offstage
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Feb 13, 2017 18:31
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Al! posted:i thought john kerry was just mac tonite's name offstage man I'd vote for Mac Tonite in a primary no question. America's ready for our first moon man president
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Feb 13, 2017 18:32
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Tatum Girlparts posted:man I'd vote for Mac Tonite in a primary no question. America's ready for our first moon man president i guess jerry brown is kinda too old now
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Feb 13, 2017 18:33
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