|
Groovelord Neato posted:this is such a better premise than jurassic world that i'm angry now. this makes about a billion times more sense. Yeah but it's just the plot of the Lost World
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 17:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 13:15 |
|
|
lost world is the abandoned site b it isn't a reopened park. it's also just one or two bleeding hearts loving up not dinosaur liberation front folks being ecoterrorists like i'd imagine in xeno's treatment.
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 19:31
|
|
|
I always thought it was weird how like the professional sabotage guy who's mission was to cause havoc on this dangerous island full of dinosaurs came equipped with just a bolt cutter.
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 19:37
|
|
|
Neo Rasa posted:I always thought it was weird how like the professional sabotage guy who's mission was to cause havoc on this dangerous island full of dinosaurs came equipped with just a bolt cutter. Didn't you see Fury Road? The bolt cutter was basically a supporting actor!
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 19:47
|
|
|
IMB posted:Yeah but it's just the plot of the Lost World Sorta but not quite. The opening of my idea was set circa 2001, and had Biosyn go to the island from the first movie. It plays out at first like an homage to the beginning of Jurassic Park with Gennarro talking with Hammond as they ride through the jungle to an amber dig site, but once the opening characters come across the trashed Explorer at the base of the tree you realize they're actually on Isla Nublar. They briefly check out a couple other locations from the original movie, all trashed and overgrown, and you're expecting them to get jumped by dinosaurs that survived... and it doesn't happen. All the dinosaurs have died off. Opening credits would be brief news cuts of Biosyn getting the new park up and running and it's a runaway success, brief cameos of Alan Grant and Ian Malcolm getting interviewed by CNN and asked if they're going to visit the new park; Grant says "hell no", Malcolm does "the laugh". Fast forward to the present, and the park is making crazy money but you get hints that the dinosaurs are kinda being exploited (billionaires can pay to have their own personal safari where they go hunt a Stegosaurus or whatever). An animal rights group infiltrates the park on its 10th anniversary with the goal of doing minor sabotage - they genuinely don't want to get people hurt, they just want to make the park less profitable or seem more morally questionable and get public opinion to turn against the park. They sabotage some things, and it totally cascades out of control (chaos theory in action). The dinosaurs are loose and killing people, but instead of 10 people being trapped on the island like in the first movie, you've got thousands. There's three sort of factions - the park staff/corporate suits, the animal rights activists, and the trapped guests, and mob mentality starts to take over once the guests learn that the dinosaurs are loose due to sabotage and not corporate negligence. The story jumps between a group of guests out in the park trying to get back to the visitor's center, and a group in the visitor's center formulating a plan to rescue the guests out in the park and finding a way to contact the mainland for rescue. Other than the Grant and Malcolm cameos, the only other returning character is Vince Vaughn's character from The Lost World (and it's a huge red herring - the guests learn that he's got a past history of sabotage and animal rights stuff and the mob of people is ready to lynch him, and you find out he's totally innocent and was at the park for legitimate journalism reasons). I'd throw in a bunch of scenes from the books that hadn't made it into the movies yet, like chameleon Carnotauruses, the river raft bit, tranquilizing a T-Rex with a bazooka, nerve-gassing a raptor nest, etc. Full disclosure it's been my dream since I was a kid to see a Jurassic Park movie that had a fully functioning park, and this was my attempt at that premise. When Jurassic World revealed that it would have a functioning park, I totally lost my mind. I really enjoyed the movie pretty much because of the premise alone - there are a few specific ideas JW did that I wish I'd thought of, but there's plenty that I prefer from my ideas (but I'm a little biased).
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 19:49
|
|
|
A nostalgic sequel with a functioning park that goes wrong due to human overreach is the most obvious premise for a Jurassic Park sequel imaginable. More interesting would be an adaptation of the Lost World novel and its metaphor of media-driven de-evolution.
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 21:50
|
|
|
Toady posted:A nostalgic sequel with a functioning park that goes wrong due to human overreach is the most obvious premise for a Jurassic Park sequel imaginable. More interesting would be an adaptation of the Lost World novel and its metaphor of media-driven de-evolution.
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 22:04
|
|
|
SimonCat posted:Didn't you see Fury Road? The bolt cutter was basically a supporting actor! The best use of a bolt cutter in the series is when he destroys that dude with one in Mad Max 2: The Road Warrior. It's cut so like you don't even really see the impact/what he's wielding or the guy's knocked out body or anything. It happens fast like it was a casual PG knock out and then he slowly raises the bolt cutter into view and you realize "Wow this guy's skull just got caved in."
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 22:07
|
|
|
Xenomrph posted:Sorta but not quite. The opening of my idea was set circa 2001, and had Biosyn go to the island from the first movie. It plays out at first like an homage to the beginning of Jurassic Park with Gennarro talking with Hammond as they ride through the jungle to an amber dig site, but once the opening characters come across the trashed Explorer at the base of the tree you realize they're actually on Isla Nublar. They briefly check out a couple other locations from the original movie, all trashed and overgrown, and you're expecting them to get jumped by dinosaurs that survived... and it doesn't happen. All the dinosaurs have died off. I mean that's cool and all but you literally already had a sequel at that point where a major plot point was "hippies see dinosaurs being exploited and break in and free them." Just because it happens in a park in your idea and it happened on the island in the thing that was already made doesn't matter. It's like Vanilla Ice throwing one more beat in his song or whatever and claiming that makes it different. No. Anyway, I don't mean to poo poo on your idea because i think it's fun when people come up with their own stuff, but if your idea was made for some reason, everyone would have just gone "didnt we just see this"
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2017 23:42
|
|
|
I'd argue there's a little more to it than that, movies share major plot points all the time while still being their own movie and saying different things. But to go back towards Alien movies, ADI (the special effects group that did the effects for Alien 3, Resurrection, and the two AvP movies) just posted a video on their YouTube channel where they talk about the design process behind Alien Resurrection. https://youtu.be/e7T2s0yDWWQ
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 01:06
|
|
|
IMB posted:I mean that's cool and all but you literally already had a sequel at that point where a major plot point was "hippies see dinosaurs being exploited and break in and free them." that isn't really what happens in lost world though.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 01:18
|
|
|
Xenomrph posted:Well it was less "human overreach" and more "chaos theory" (you know, like in the original book). In the book, chaos theory was the explanation for the gradual disintegration of order attributed to the hubris of attempting to predict a complex dynamical system. For example, the tracking system was configured to count no more than the expected number of animals, which kept hidden the fact that the dinosaurs were breeding. Instead of accounting for possible failures, they assumed success. Lost World depicts disintegration of a different sort, using Isla Sorna as an analogue for cyberspace, revealing that Levine's supposedly free society is overpopulated with predators and infected by destructive memes that will kill all the dinosaurs on the island.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 01:46
|
|
|
Groovelord Neato posted:that isn't really what happens in lost world though. You should watch it again (not really it's pretty bad)
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 02:58
|
|
|
i know what happens but it's nothing like xenomoph's scenario.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 04:29
|
|
|
It would be like going to Jurassic World 2 and having another dinosaur that surprisingly camouflages. "It's not the same! That was the Indominous and this is an entirely different dinosaur!"
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 04:35
|
|
|
Give the humans in the film camouflage also.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 06:49
|
|
|
IMB posted:I mean that's cool and all but you literally already had a sequel at that point where a major plot point was "hippies see dinosaurs being exploited and break in and free them." Just because it happens in a park in your idea and it happened on the island in the thing that was already made doesn't matter. It's like Vanilla Ice throwing one more beat in his song or whatever and claiming that makes it different. No. It's possible for a good sequel to iterate on things that other sequels have done, rather than going in a different direction off the original movie. It sounds like the idea expands on what Lost World did with the ecoterrorists pretty well, honestly.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 07:10
|
|
|
lost world is my favourite jurassic park film, although it is one hundred percent super odd
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 07:47
|
|
|
alf_pogs posted:lost world is my favourite jurassic park film, although it is one hundred percent super odd I appreciate Lost World for in many ways being Speilberg's own weird King Kong remake. It's better than pretty much all the actual remakes, too. Not that that is saying much.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 10:16
|
|
|
IMB posted:It would be like going to Jurassic World 2 and having another dinosaur that surprisingly camouflages. "It's not the same! That was the Indominous and this is an entirely different dinosaur!" hmmm not really. things like scale and intention matter. for instance there's a difference between "we recreated this dinosaur and it naturally camouflages" and "we created this ultra super smart giant strong dinosaur because attendance is down which makes zero sense as people would line up for a century to visit a dinosaur park full of 'real' dinosaurs".
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 13:53
|
|
|
alf_pogs posted:lost world is my favourite jurassic park film, although it is one hundred percent super odd A lot of it is really satirical as well, with Malcom basically being an outside person watching the film as opposed to an actual character. It's not as obvious as Starship Troopers, but it's still there. And it has great effects/scenes.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 19:05
|
|
|
The Lost World book was my first Crichton as a kid and I liked how run-down and nasty it got. The villains are pathetic people who die in stupid ways, the heroes' equipment and preparations are inadequate, the old Ingen facilities are a great setting with all the wrecked hubris, and the dinosaur ecosystem is pathological and hosed. I liked the first half of Sphere a lot too but the squid scared the poo poo out of me.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 19:42
|
|
|
It takes quite a while until the dinosaurs actually show up in Jurassic Park 1, and then there are too many shots of the cast staring slack-jawed in awe at the majesty of the dinosaurs while the music swells. When's the dino mayhem gonna start already? I like Lost World, it's funnier, and it's dino mayhem from the get-go.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 20:38
|
|
|
Neo Rasa posted:All this dream sci-fi horror talk reminds me...if anyone here was part of the Exorcist fan community, there was a person that earned massive hate for his absolutely bizarre script treatment for an Exorcist sequel called The Exorcist: Synchronized. If you posted on CaptainHowdy or C.H.U.D. at the time it was legendary. Anyway like with The Zybourne Clock on SomethingAwful, a few people had made some dorky photoshopped images of scenes from previous Exorcist films and other art based on this script as a joke, but the person loved them and made them part of his website where he details the plot and stuff. It was crazy. Anyway this guy, Dave IIRC, had a Wiseau-esque flair for not understanding how anything works but being super passionate about it. But either way they were OBSESSED with the synchronizer dream machine thing in Exorcist II: The Heretic and the plot revolves around using it a lot and he would regularly try to contact Linda Blair and other people who would have like no real ability to make a new Exorcist movie happen. lol I remember this. I was actually on the CHUDs board when this happened, and the sheer angry confusion felt by everyone was amazing. And the way the guy just brushed off everyone's advice just snowballed, just perfect.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 20:50
|
|
|
General Battuta posted:I liked the first half of Sphere a lot too but the squid scared the poo poo out of me. Did you have to stop reading after that part?
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 21:01
|
|
|
Sir Nose posted:It takes quite a while until the dinosaurs actually show up in Jurassic Park 1, and then there are too many shots of the cast staring slack-jawed in awe at the majesty of the dinosaurs while the music swells. you'd do the same thing tho.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 21:19
|
|
|
Kingtheninja posted:Did you have to stop reading after that part? No I read the whole thing (and had childhood nightmares for months!) I wish I'd stopped, though, the back half of that book is pretty weak.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 21:20
|
|
|
Doesn't the Lost World book end with the voice of reason character arguing that, like, protons aren't real because we can't see them? Edit: And yeah Sphere gets way less interesting once it turns out they're not talking to an alien. Also, I always thought it was funny, even as a kid, how quickly they lose interest in the time traveling spacecraft. Like, I get that the titular sphere is interesting too, but it's pretty clear that Crichton did not want to expend the research and writing effort to build a semi-plausible black hole traversing 21st century spacecraft or the future that would have given rise to it. I feel like he did the "LOL China owns Coke now" bit and that was that. porfiria fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Feb 13, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 21:23
|
|
|
porfiria posted:Doesn't the Lost World book end with the voice of reason character arguing that, like, protons aren't real because we can't see them? Thorne talks about the evolution and intangibility of scientific beliefs and contrasts it with the immediate reality of the sea around them.
|
|
#
?
Feb 13, 2017 23:32
|
|
|
Sir Nose posted:It takes quite a while until the dinosaurs actually show up in Jurassic Park 1, and then there are too many shots of the cast staring slack-jawed in awe at the majesty of the dinosaurs while the music swells. When's the dino mayhem gonna start already? One of my favourite things about Jurassic Park is how sparingly it uses dinosaurs, especially the raptors. You don't fully see an adult raptor until the kitchen scene (or is it the power station?) but the film does everything it can to keep them in your mind. They're total slasher villains. Of course, just as Jaws is not a film about a shark, Jurassic Park is not a film about dinosaurs. Party Boat fucked around with this message at 01:13 on Feb 14, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 01:08
|
|
|
Toady posted:Thorne talks about the evolution and intangibility of scientific beliefs and contrasts it with the immediate reality of the sea around them. Nah man it's some real proto climate change denial bullshit. I went and looked it up: quote:"Are you listening to all that?" Thorne said. "I wouldn't take any of it too seriously. It's jist theories. Human beings can't help making them, but the fact is that theories are just fantasies. And they change. When America was a new country, people believed in something called phlogiston. You know what that is? No? Well, it doesn't matter, because it wasn't real anyway. They also believed that four humors controlled behavior. And they believed that the earth was only a few thousand years old. Now we believe the earth is four billion years old, and we believe in photons and electrons, and we think human behavior is controlled by things like ego and self-esteem. We think those beliefs are more scientific and better." Woof.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 01:32
|
|
|
porfiria posted:Nah man it's some real proto climate change denial bullshit. I went and looked it up: Wow. Man, gently caress Crichton. As well as being really offensive, it's also just really stupid.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 01:37
|
|
|
Snowman_McK posted:Wow. Man, gently caress Crichton. It's funny how aggressive he is about making sure you don't take him somewhat metaphorically. Like, "Oh he's just saying we just focus on lived experience and not worry too much about the precise..." No. Photons are made up dude, it's all just invented bullshit. Even as stupid little fat kid in the 90s I remember reading that and going, "Wait what the gently caress?" porfiria fucked around with this message at 01:48 on Feb 14, 2017 |
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 01:44
|
|
|
Mans got a point. I've never seen a photon.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 01:50
|
|
|
porfiria posted:It's funny how aggressive he is about making sure you don't take him somewhat metaphorically. Like, "Oh he's just saying we just focus on lived experience and not worry too much about the precise..." No. Photons are made up dude, it's all just invented bullshit. Do you actually believe Crichton was denying the existing of photons, electrons, and self-esteem?
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 02:01
|
|
|
Toady posted:Do you actually believe Crichton was denying the existing of photons, electrons, and self-esteem? Well, that's literally what "A hundred years from now, people will look back at us and laugh. They'll say, 'You know what people used to believe? They believed in photons and electrons. Can you imagine anything so silly?' They'll have a good laugh, because by then there will be newer and better fantasies." means.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 02:05
|
|
|
Snowman_McK posted:Well, that's literally what "A hundred years from now, people will look back at us and laugh. They'll say, 'You know what people used to believe? They believed in photons and electrons. Can you imagine anything so silly?' They'll have a good laugh, because by then there will be newer and better fantasies." means. You may believe that Crichton didn't believe in electrons, but the fictional character Thorne's statement is based on his backstory as a former professor of applied engineering who was increasingly at odds with academia. He's a foil for Malcom the theoretical mathematician, who criticized engineers in the first book ("They don’t have intelligence. They have what I call ‘thintelligence.’ They see the immediate situation. They think narrowly and they call it ‘being focused.’"). His final statement comes after Malcolm theorizes that humanity's function is to kill everything.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 02:50
|
|
|
Toady posted:You may believe that Crichton didn't believe in electrons, but the fictional character Thorne's statement is based on his backstory as a former professor of applied engineering who was increasingly at odds with academia. He's a foil for Malcom the theoretical mathematician, who criticized engineers in the first book ("They don’t have intelligence. They have what I call ‘thintelligence.’ They see the immediate situation. They think narrowly and they call it ‘being focused.’"). His final statement comes after Malcolm theorizes that humanity's function is to kill everything. This would make sense if he were only talking about theory in the colloquial sense though--you have to be tremendously stupid to conflate the theory of photons with the theory of self-esteem (or teleological stuff like "humans will kill everything"). Like, Malcolm's point about thintelligence is meant to be somewhat lucid even if he's an arrogant jerk. There's absolutely no way to read what Thorne's saying as anything but total insanity. I mean, there's a good chance Crichton's just not a great writer and he was trying to give Thorne a somewhat controversial and not meant to be taken entirely at face value but nevertheless thought-provoking statement. But at the end of the day not believing in global warming is pretty frikin' close to not believing in photons so...
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 03:20
|
|
|
Toady posted:You may believe that Crichton didn't believe in electrons, but the fictional character Thorne's statement is based on his backstory as a former professor of applied engineering who was increasingly at odds with academia. He's a foil for Malcom the theoretical mathematician, who criticized engineers in the first book ("They don’t have intelligence. They have what I call ‘thintelligence.’ They see the immediate situation. They think narrowly and they call it ‘being focused.’"). His final statement comes after Malcolm theorizes that humanity's function is to kill everything. This is also regularly floated as an explanation for the outsize importance of engineers in pseudoscience and conspiracy theory. Chrichton's climate change opinion is more of a Dunning-Kruger thing, where he's able to read and understand evidence as presented but not expert enough to distinguish well presented bullshit from robust research, but he doesn't realize it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 04:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 13:15 |
|
|
Toady posted:You may believe that Crichton didn't believe in electrons Because that's specifically what he said, yes.
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2017 04:32
|
|