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When I see Paissa Hut tower before me from across the sandy beach, I know I am home.
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Feb 19, 2017 00:19
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a crisp refreshing Moxie posted:On the one hand I do agree with your point, but I'm wary because people were saying the same thing about AST being "fine" back in the Gordias Savage era, and they pointed to fact that one or two top-end groups were able to clear A4S with AST on their team to support their point. At the same time, when a class was just flat out trash, they've had no problem getting those buffs to that class. Given the devs' track record, worrying that a class will be in the dumpster is a moot point since they will fix it if it needs to get fixed.
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Feb 19, 2017 00:23
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Paladin has been in the dumpster for all of Heavensward. The buffs it got only put it back on the top layer of the dumpster. It's still a terrible class.
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Feb 19, 2017 00:27
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Fister Roboto posted:Paladin has been in the dumpster for all of Heavensward. The buffs it got only put it back on the top layer of the dumpster. It's still a terrible class. What's your basis for this? Because I'm pretty sure your basis is the same as the poopsocking shitlords who demand meta comps all the time, which doesn't matter.
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Feb 19, 2017 00:56
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:What's your basis for this? Because I'm pretty sure your basis is the same as the poopsocking shitlords who demand meta comps all the time, which doesn't matter. I am not a meta shitlord but the pld class is bad from the top down. It is essentially only fun at 60 when you finally have actual buttons to press instead of rage of halone combo into eternity.This is a subjective opinion and I guess there are probably some people who really pine for the 1-50 pld experience of hitting 1-2-3 over and over but blech.
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Feb 19, 2017 01:08
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Blitzball was fun. I agree that it would suck if it were brought over in its FFX iteration. Was the samurai also Generic Hyur or was that a new dude? Anyone got a link to the design panel? I went to sleep after the keynote, but I saw this album of slides and figure maybe there are some things I want to see out of it: http://imgur.com/gallery/cE7FT MCH AF3 was originally intended to be Revolver Coeurl, it seems. And the Apocalypse seems to have been a rejected AF3 design.
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Feb 19, 2017 01:18
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I like PLD and look forward to seeing how the skill consolidation and revamp affects the experience. I also like Blitzball and look forward to seeing how they integrate it here. Hopefully it has more staying power than Verminion. Unrelated note, I want to give props to folks who beat Thordan EX back in 3.1, because that is a hell of a fight.
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Feb 19, 2017 01:22
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Was the samurai also Generic Hyur or was that a new dude? I'm pretty sure the WoL is Monk this time around.
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Feb 19, 2017 01:25
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check out my Youtube posted:You're all letting this news cloud your judgement of what we really need How about more like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AdTk5m57KQ
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Feb 19, 2017 01:26
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Is the Samurai in the video the same guy that's next to the dark-haired woman on the top of the revealed Stormblood art?
a crisp refreshing Moxie fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Feb 19, 2017 |
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Feb 19, 2017 01:35
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Tortolia posted:I like PLD and look forward to seeing how the skill consolidation and revamp affects the experience. I like to think I'm pretty good with mechanics, but I still can't figure how you're meant to survive the second Faith Unmoving + the stack death unless your party is super competent. Like I can't see just hopping into a PF and getting that right. And the worst thing about mechanics like that is it's a long time before you even get another shot to practice it.
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Feb 19, 2017 01:46
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Was the samurai also Generic Hyur or was that a new dude? Looks like Meteor/Derplander to me. 
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Feb 19, 2017 01:54
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Looks like Meteor/Derplander to me. Those bangs.
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Feb 19, 2017 01:54
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Jandelaine works fast, I guess. =P So, now that SAM/MNK are going to share gear, what job, realistically speaking, would we expect to come in 5.0 that would share gear with DRG?
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Feb 19, 2017 02:02
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The only traditional jobs I can think of that make sense as an armoured strength user would be Viking or Berserker, maybe Mystic Knight. Judge comedy answer.
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Feb 19, 2017 02:12
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Jandelaine works fast, I guess. =P the 2nd gladiator job, obviously.
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Feb 19, 2017 02:19
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Jandelaine works fast, I guess. =P Templar
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Feb 19, 2017 02:20
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lol if they add 2 more DPS jobs instead of a Healer and a Tank after 4 years of 'We can't add new Healers or Tanks until we fix the ones we have'
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Feb 19, 2017 02:24
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Stallion Cabana posted:lol if they add 2 more DPS jobs instead of a Healer and a Tank after 4 years of 'We can't add new Healers or Tanks until we fix the ones we have' They'll never fix them and someday come clean that they decided to use this as an excuse never to make more.
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Feb 19, 2017 02:33
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SonicRulez posted:I like to think I'm pretty good with mechanics, but I still can't figure how you're meant to survive the second Faith Unmoving + the stack death unless your party is super competent. Like I can't see just hopping into a PF and getting that right. And the worst thing about mechanics like that is it's a long time before you even get another shot to practice it. Everyone just has to run to the centre of the arena once the expanding circles explode then stay still until dragon's rage fires a GCD after the knockback. Like all stack damage stuff you're dependent on the rest of the party moving into range but it's not really that much harder than a stack marker by itself (unless one of the towers didn't get taken in which case paralysis has the potential to screw you over).
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Feb 19, 2017 02:56
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Failboattootoot posted:I am not a meta shitlord but the pld class is bad from the top down. It is essentially only fun at 60 when you finally have actual buttons to press instead of rage of halone combo into eternity.This is a subjective opinion and I guess there are probably some people who really pine for the 1-50 pld experience of hitting 1-2-3 over and over but blech. Oh, I agree fully with you. Leveling up paladin was boring as poo poo and playing it at 50 is almost as bad as playing black mage and bard at 50, but he was referring to paladin being garbage during heavensward, which is only true if you're a poopsocking metalord. Paladin has the worst skill distribution along the levels of any class in the game.
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Feb 19, 2017 02:58
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:What's your basis for this? Because I'm pretty sure your basis is the same as the poopsocking shitlords who demand meta comps all the time, which doesn't matter. Even after the buffs they got to fix them, they still have very glaring problems. They have almost zero AOE damage, and exactly zero before 50, which makes dungeons miserable. Shield blocks are completely useless against magic attacks, and three of their core abilities are based around shield blocks. A lot of their cooldowns are far too long to be effective. Bulwark in particular is hilariously bad. It has a 3 minute cooldown for a buff that is worse than the warrior's Foresight, which has only a 90 second cooldown. They run out of TP after about 3 minutes of uptime and have no way to restore it, a problem that neither of the other thanks have. Their debuff is again completely useless against magic attacks, which are far more prevalent and dangerous than physical attacks. The best you can say in their favor is that you can cheese some mechanics with Hallowed Ground (but warriors and dark knights can do that as well with much shorter cooldowns), and they don't have as much of an issue with threat as dark knights (not a problem if you have a ninja and a warrior, further reinforcing the god comp). I'm not sure why I'm bothering to respond to you, since you've already decided that anyone who disagrees doesn't matter. Shame on me, I guess.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:03
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Meldonox posted:They'll never fix them and someday come clean that they decided to use this as an excuse never to make more. Well, not like they can do much more with tanks/heals? There's a shield healer, a direct healer, a healer that does one or the other, but with cards. Maybe a full on heal over time class would be neat, but there's mechanics in this game that just hit 80% of the entire group's hp twice in a row because they can, and that's not gonna go over well when all your heals combined only heal for 10k per tick (the best aggro magnet tho) Same with tanks, there's a barbarian, a 2h knight and a sword+board knight. Maybe a caster that uses MP shield instead of tank armour to boost defenses could work. Evasion tank, same as hot only healer, isn't happening though, tankbuster hitting an evasion tank is going to squish them, unless they emulate evasion by just having you take less damage from everything, in which case enjoy another tank that plays and heals exactly the same way as the other 3. fake edit: ^^^^ How the gently caress do you run out of TP as PLD? It's TP positive during your normal rotation now, isn't it? Unless you're constantly spaming fracture or stun there's no way to run out. Granted I never tanked outside normal play and some of the easier ex primals but I just don't see a situation where I'd run out.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:06
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Truga posted:Well, not like they can do much more with tanks/heals? I've been over this one a bunch though maybe not in this thread but I think the paradigm where AST has to be able to replace either Healer at any time in any comp is part of the reason healers are not balanced, and will probably remain the same, because AST is either better then the healer it's replacing (Then it's mandatory, or rather, because people keep getting itchy about saying Meta, it is simply 'better', because it also has the cards) or it's worse then the healer it's replacing (Then it's worse then them and will never be used when you can just bring that healer). An idea would be to make it so AST can't do both barriers and regen, and then make a fourth healer that does the thing you removed from AST.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:12
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Truga posted:fake edit: ^^^^ How the gently caress do you run out of TP as PLD? It's TP positive during your normal rotation now, isn't it? Unless you're constantly spaming fracture or stun there's no way to run out. Granted I never tanked outside normal play and some of the easier ex primals but I just don't see a situation where I'd run out. A paladin's standard rotation is 530 TP over 9 GCDs, or 58.9 TP/GCD. You regenerate 60 TP every 3 seconds, or 20 TP/sec. In order to be TP neutral you'd need a theoretical GCD of 2.94 seconds. Without any skill speed at all, you run dry in about 4.5 minutes. Having any skill speed at all, as well as fairy haste or arrow cards, will significantly reduce that. This problem is also magnified if the paladin dies. Fister Roboto fucked around with this message at 03:20 on Feb 19, 2017 |
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Feb 19, 2017 03:18
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Truga posted:Well, not like they can do much more with tanks/heals? There are tanking and healing paradigms that simply don't exist in 14 right now. If we take a peek at nearest neighbor WoW, off the top of my head they have: Tank that builds a resource in chunks and spends it on healing or doing damage Tank that builds a resource in a less discrete manner and spends it on damage or one of two kinds of mitigation Tank that self-heals and self-shields based on the amount of damage they took recently Tank that passively reduces incoming damage by a percentage, and the reduced damage is applied as a stacking DoT effect that they can spend resources to dispel And then we really only have two types of healing spells present, the direct heal and the HoT. There's also chain heals, HoTs that hop targets, HoTs that aren't a constant heal value, heals that interact with HoTs, channeled heals, smart heals, etc. Like FR said, PLD runs out of TP really fast. I don't think DRK is actually much better off than PLD is though, especially if you're in a situation where you can't drop grit. WAR is the only tank that literally has a "give me some TP" button. It'd be nice if they just excised the TP system or completely changed how its used but I'm thinking that's unlikely.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:28
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Fister Roboto posted:Even after the buffs they got to fix them, they still have very glaring problems. They have almost zero AOE damage, and exactly zero before 50, which makes dungeons miserable. Shield blocks are completely useless against magic attacks, and three of their core abilities are based around shield blocks. A lot of their cooldowns are far too long to be effective. Bulwark in particular is hilariously bad. It has a 3 minute cooldown for a buff that is worse than the warrior's Foresight, which has only a 90 second cooldown. They run out of TP after about 3 minutes of uptime and have no way to restore it, a problem that neither of the other thanks have. Their debuff is again completely useless against magic attacks, which are far more prevalent and dangerous than physical attacks. The best you can say in their favor is that you can cheese some mechanics with Hallowed Ground (but warriors and dark knights can do that as well with much shorter cooldowns), and they don't have as much of an issue with threat as dark knights (not a problem if you have a ninja and a warrior, further reinforcing the god comp). Those are all reasons for paladin not being as good as warrior/dark knight, but you haven't shown me where they can't do the content, either. That's the issue I have with this bullshit people keep spewing on the thread about X class being poo poo, like that guy who was convinced 2-3 pages ago that monk will be trash in SB, and is not good right now. It's dumb meta baby bullshit that only matters if you're pushing for world first clears. Any random assortment of classes can do any of the content in the game, including savage, if you play your class correctly. Even a group of 2 paladins, 2 white mages, and 4 monks. And I like that you're the one telling me that I've already decided poo poo so why bother. You're an endless fount of terrible opinions, so I guess the real fault was on me for thinking you wouldn't have another one. gently caress I miss belzac.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:34
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Josuke Higashikata posted:Sorry for discussing design decisions and potential pitfalls Final Fantasy XIV in this, the Final Fantasy XIV thread. Hey dude, I don't think there's a really polite way to say this, but you really loving suck
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Feb 19, 2017 03:35
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Klades posted:Tank that self-heals and self-shields based on the amount of damage they took recently I really like this concept for a Dancer class. Strange Samba to convert part of the Tank Buster damage to a big regen on yourself to survive the follow up and then swap to Mystery Waltz to convert part of incoming damage to shields.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:42
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:Those are all reasons for paladin not being as good as warrior/dark knight, but you haven't shown me where they can't do the content, either. That's the issue I have with this bullshit people keep spewing on the thread about X class being poo poo, like that guy who was convinced 2-3 pages ago that monk will be trash in SB, and is not good right now. It's dumb meta baby bullshit that only matters if you're pushing for world first clears. Any random assortment of classes can do any of the content in the game, including savage, if you play your class correctly. Even a group of 2 paladins, 2 white mages, and 4 monks. I never said that paladins can't do the content, in fact I said the exact opposite. The problem is that they're worse than the other available options, and including a paladin in your raid in lieu of a dark knight or warrior can potentially impede your progress. You don't have to be a "poopsocking metalord" or whatever for that to be true. You're not even bothering to read people's legitimate complaints. Please stop posting.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:46
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Klades posted:There are tanking and healing paradigms that simply don't exist in 14 right now. If we take a peek at nearest neighbor WoW, off the top of my head they have: WAR and DRK respectively are sort of like this, but they're not quite as impactful as WoW's active mitigation paradigm that they've been doing for several expansions now. There's also not as many (interesting) things to spend the resources on. But yeah, there's a lot of room for tanks and healers with different gimmicks.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:47
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Klades posted:Like FR said, PLD runs out of TP really fast. I don't think DRK is actually much better off than PLD is though, especially if you're in a situation where you can't drop grit. WAR is the only tank that literally has a "give me some TP" button. Dark knights are definitely better off. Assuming zero skill speed, they can go for about 9 minutes before running dry if they use blood weapon on cooldown (napkin math, so I could be incredibly wrong). Even without blood weapon they can last about 6 minutes.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:49
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I don't really understand the point of jobs running dry on TP just by doing their normal rotations. I can certainly understand AoE abilities costing huge amounts of TP, but it was incredibly frustrating when I was MTing A9 the other day and ran out of TP because our DPS was poo poo. We didn't have an AST, NIN, or support DPS so there wasn't anything I could've done about it.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:57
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Any MCH want to inform me about Grenado vs Spread? When should I use one over the other in AOE?
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Feb 19, 2017 03:59
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:Those are all reasons for paladin not being as good as warrior/dark knight, but you haven't shown me where they can't do the content, either. That's the issue I have with this bullshit people keep spewing on the thread about X class being poo poo, like that guy who was convinced 2-3 pages ago that monk will be trash in SB, and is not good right now. It's dumb meta baby bullshit that only matters if you're pushing for world first clears. Any random assortment of classes can do any of the content in the game, including savage, if you play your class correctly. Even a group of 2 paladins, 2 white mages, and 4 monks. The problem is not that they can't do the content. Any job can do the content. Any non-standard party setup that still includes two healers, two tanks, and four DPS can clear A12S, and they can do it while still skipping Communion at the very end. This is, in fact, the problem. FFXIV, despite the behaviour of pubbies in DF/PF, is not a particularly challenging game. If you can watch a youtube video, react to mechanics, and are half good at your job's particular skill rotations then the entire game is open to you; if not immediately, then when you find a group of like-minded people, who do exist. The issue is that you are basing your reasoning on a false premise. PLD (and WHM, and MNK) are not gathering a bad reputation because the classes can't do content, they're gathering a bad reputation because they can't do content as well, as fast, as effective, as other classes. No one gives a poo poo about classes being able to clear A12S anymore and they didn't give a poo poo on week one of 3.4 either. They care about speed kills, about raid synergy, about which jobs help everyone else do their own jobs better. Because there's nothing in the endgame right now which demands anything other then that. "Well that's just the same meta baby bullshit I'm talking about, man," you say, and you are completely right to say that. But opinions on the meta and at the very tip-top of the raid scene are not just happening in a vacuum. They're being spread to everyone else with every opinion offered by top teams, or every speedkill posted to reddit, or in the mind of every player who cares enough to spend time on fflogs seeing what the good groups are doing because they themselves want to improve.
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Feb 19, 2017 03:59
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Fister Roboto posted:A paladin's standard rotation is 530 TP over 9 GCDs, or 58.9 TP/GCD. You regenerate 60 TP every 3 seconds, or 20 TP/sec. In order to be TP neutral you'd need a theoretical GCD of 2.94 seconds. Without any skill speed at all, you run dry in about 4.5 minutes. Having any skill speed at all, as well as fairy haste or arrow cards, will significantly reduce that. This problem is also magnified if the paladin dies. OK yeah that is bad, the only things I run as PLD are dungeons if the heal queue is bad, and I tanked sophia a couple times and sophia has tons of downtime constantly, so I guess just I never hit the 4 minutes of dps barrier. I read somewhere in here that they're supposed to be tp positive now cause most of their skills are 50 tp, guess not. Meiteron posted:This is, in fact, the problem. FFXIV, despite the behaviour of pubbies in DF/PF, is not a particularly challenging game. 
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Feb 19, 2017 04:26
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Caeks posted:Any MCH want to inform me about Grenado vs Spread? When should I use one over the other in AOE? When you've got buffs rolling, use Grenado to maximize the amount of damage they increase.
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Feb 19, 2017 04:27
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Truga posted:OK yeah that is bad, the only things I run as PLD are dungeons if the heal queue is bad, and I tanked sophia a couple times and sophia has tons of downtime constantly, so I guess just I never hit the 4 minutes of dps barrier. I read somewhere in here that they're supposed to be tp positive now cause most of their skills are 50 tp, guess not. It's not too bad for most fights, because they tend to have more downtime (which unfortunately fucks monks pretty badly), but it's particularly noticeable for the few fights like A9 which have 100% uptime or close to it. I think A3 was also really bad for it, but that was before the TP fixes when paladins couldn't even last for two minutes.
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Feb 19, 2017 04:36
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He's right, though. As someone who was one of his server's top 10 progression rogues in WoW, nothing in FFXIV is even remotely as difficult as something like Mythic Gorefiend, let alone current Nighthold content. Now, that doesn't mean it's less fun, mind you. If anything, it's kind of the appeal of the game. I like being able to hop into raids without devoting 9+ hours a week or relying on RNG legendary drops to clear content. Pubbies are bad in every game, of course, but I assume most of the Savage/EX content people are discussing here are using statics, not random pugs.
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Feb 19, 2017 04:42
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He may be right, but remember the last 2 patches when poo poo was properly hard? Everyone just stopped raiding instead.
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Feb 19, 2017 04:45
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