Doctor Who: THE POWER OF THE DALEKS! Oh, and a Christmas special.

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > Doctor Who: THE POWER OF THE DALEKS! Oh, and a Christmas special.

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Tie-breaker for serial you'd most like to find an episode from This poll is closed.
The Massacre of St. Bartholomew's Eve	33	44.59%
The Highlanders	41	55.41%
Total:	74 votes

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The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

After The War posted:

And while we're at it, is anyone else wondering if Sideburn Guy in the first picture is Douglas Adams?

Possibly, but he doesn't look tall enough.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 14:54

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# ? May 10, 2024 06:17

After The War: Apr 12, 2005; to all of my Architects
let me be traitor

The_Doctor posted:

Possibly, but he doesn't look tall enough.

I know, but I want it to be true! Besides, he's bending over and our main comparison for size is the also-gigantic (if not quite as tall) Tom Baker.

For reference, I'm more like mini-Doctors Patrick and Sylvester, so they're all equal Godzilla height to me.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 15:32

CommonShore: Jun 6, 2014; A true renaissance man

Toby Jones for doctor

# ? Feb 19, 2017 16:00

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

After The War posted:

I know, but I want it to be true! Besides, he's bending over and our main comparison for size is the also-gigantic (if not quite as tall) Tom Baker.

For reference, I'm more like mini-Doctors Patrick and Sylvester, so they're all equal Godzilla height to me.

McGann counts as a mini-Doctor too! He's only a couple of inches taller than McCoy and half an inch on Troughton, he just doesn't look that short.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 16:10

vegetables: Mar 10, 2012

Astroman posted:

A really young Doctor might even have fallen in love with the show right away with Eccleston or even Tennant! It will bear watching.

You could be in your thirties and have this apply to you, as you'd have grown up in the long stretch of time when Doctor Who wasn't really a thing. In fact, this could realistically have applied to Matt Smith in 2009, and that's eight years ago now.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 18:01

After The War: Apr 12, 2005; to all of my Architects
let me be traitor

The_Doctor posted:

McGann counts as a mini-Doctor too! He's only a couple of inches taller than McCoy and half an inch on Troughton, he just doesn't look that short.

I know, I was ready to list him too until I saw that he's definitely taller than me.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 18:06

CommonShore: Jun 6, 2014; A true renaissance man

I'm 35, Canadian, and the original series wasn't on in any reasonably accessible way for me when I was a kid. It was on, but I didn't know anyone who watched it, and so I was always confused by what was happening and why it was black and white sometimes, and why it was in colour others, and why the same people never seemed to be on. I didn't get into the new series at first because it was recommended to me by someone with exquisitely bad taste, though I saw the end of Waters of Mars at a friend's house and thought it was decent. I didn't get into the series in any focused way until I was invited to a 50th anniversary ep party, which I accepted because of the woman who invited me, not because of the show.

So really, John Hurt was my first Doctor. I didn't realize this until now.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 18:11

Wheat Loaf: Feb 13, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

Astroman posted:

As Tennant and RTD scripted into Time Crash, Tennant's was Davison.

Moffat wrote "Time Crash".

vegetables posted:

You could be in your thirties and have this apply to you, as you'd have grown up in the long stretch of time when Doctor Who wasn't really a thing. In fact, this could realistically have applied to Matt Smith in 2009, and that's eight years ago now.

Sure, Colin Baker was a big fan of the show before he was cast, having discovered it as a young law student in the 1960s.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 22:50

Jerusalem: May 20, 2004; Would you be my new best friends?

They're going to cast Peter Cushing (again!), his recent appearance in Rogue One has revitalized a career that seemed to have ended almost quarter of a century ago.

# ? Feb 19, 2017 23:17

Burkion: May 10, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

Jerusalem posted:

They're going to cast Peter Cushing (again!), his recent appearance in Rogue One has revitalized a career that seemed to have ended almost quarter of a century ago.

You know what if Doctor Who got another movie, this is exactly what should happen

# ? Feb 19, 2017 23:25

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

Where's that fan trailer for the Daleks/Mechanoids movie?

# ? Feb 20, 2017 00:13

Astroman: Apr 8, 2001

Wheat Loaf posted:

Moffat wrote "Time Crash".

True, but I'm pretty sure the "Your were my Doctor" speech was written specifically for Tennant and 5 literally was his Doctor. Moffat is older, and is more likely to be a T Baker man. Maybe even Pertwee.

Wheat Loaf posted:

Sure, Colin Baker was a big fan of the show before he was cast, having discovered it as a young law student in the 1960s.

Now that I think of it, didn't he originally want to play the Doctor as more gruff like Hartnell? Or am I just misremembering?

# ? Feb 20, 2017 02:23

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

Astroman posted:

True, but I'm pretty sure the "Your were my Doctor" speech was written specifically for Tennant and 5 literally was his Doctor. Moffat is older, and is more likely to be a T Baker man. Maybe even Pertwee.

He's a Peter Davison man. In the nineties he even said that everything else was poo poo.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 09:49

Burkion: May 10, 2012; by Fluffdaddy

Which is utterly rich coming from him.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 09:51

Trin Tragula: Apr 22, 2005

MrL_JaKiri posted:

He's a Peter Davison man. In the nineties he even said that everything else was poo poo.

https://drwhointerviews.wordpress.com/2009/12/16/steven-moffat-1985/

quote:

Q: How many of the New Adventures have you read?

A: I�ve read quite a few, but not so many of them anymore. There�s 24 of them a year. That�s too bloody many. I�ve never wanted 24 new Doctor Who adventures a year. Six was a perfectly good number.

Q: But Doctor Who was on 40 weeks of the year in the Hartnell era.

A: Yes, but did you see the pace of those shows? They were incredibly show. Hideous. I dearly love Doctor Who, but I don�t think my love of it translated into it�s being a tremendously good series. It was a bit crap at times, wasn�t it?

Q: You�ve pointed out in the past that there�s a certain camp value to it sometimes.

A: If you judge it on what they were trying to do, which is create a low budget, light-hearted children�s adventure serial for teatime, it�s bloody amazingly good. If you judge it as a high class drama series, it�s falling a bit short. But that�s not what it was trying to be.

Q: I think Doctor Who in the 60�s was simply of its time.

A: Even for the 60�s, it was slow. If you look at the first episode of Doctor Who, that betrays the lie that it�s just the 60�s, because that first episode�s really good. The rest of it�s poo poo.

Q: They had months of lead-up time to it. After that, it was weekly.

A: That�s fair enough, but the rest is still bad.

Q: The fans tend to try to compare it to I, Claudius. There�s a certain macho quality to some fans that makes them say it�s up there with Shakespeare.

A: I, Claudius had a brilliant script and a cast of brilliant actors. These are two things we can�t say, in all forgiveness, about some periods of Doctor Who. Much as I love it�

Q: You�re willing to recognise its limitations?

A: Yes. I still think most of the Peter Davison era stands up.

Q: I hated the Davison era.

A: How could you? When I look back at Doctor Who now, I laugh at it fondly. As a television professional, I think �How did these guys get a paycheque every week?�. Nothing from the black and white days, with the exception of the pilot episode, should have got out of the building. They should have been clubbing those guys to death. You�ve got an old guy in the lead who can�t remember his lines. You�ve got Patrick Troughton, who was a good actor, but his companions � how did they get their Equity card? They�re unimaginably bad. Once you get to the colour stuff, some of it�s watchable, but it�s laughable. Mostly now, looking back, I�m startled by it. Given that it�s a teatime show, a children�s show, I think most of the Peter Davison stuff is well-constructed, the directors are consistent.

Q: They�re consistently crap.

A: Peter Davison is a better actor than all the other ones. That�s the simple reason why it works better. There�s no complicated reason why Peter Davison carried on working and all the others disappeared into a retirement home. I recently watched a very good Doctor Who story, one I couldn�t really fault. It was Snakedance. Sure, it was cheap, but it was beautifully acted, well-written. There was a scene where Peter Davison has to explain what�s going on. The Doctor always has to. Now, some old actor like Tom Baker would come to a shuddering halt in the middle of the set and stare at the camera, because he can�t bear the idea that someone else is in the show. But Peter Davison is such a good actor, he manages to panic on the screen for a good two minutes, which has you sitting on the edge of your seat because you�re thinking �God, this must be really bad�. He�s got the most awful lines to say, but he�s doing it brilliantly. My memory of Doctor Who is based on bad television that I enjoyed at the time.

It could get me really burnt saying this, but Doctor Who is aimed at eleven year olds. Don�t you think it�s fair to say that Doctor Who was a great idea that happened to the wrong people? I think the actual structure, the actual format is as good as anything that�s ever been done. The character of the Doctor, the TARDIS, all that stuff is so good, it can actually stand not being done terribly well. There was some very good stuff spread over the twenty-five years, but that wasn�t enough.

Q: We were having a dinner party when the documentary Resistance is Futile was first shown. Everyone loved it, but as soon as the 60�s episode The Time Meddler came on, people turned away within thirty seconds. Remembrance of the Daleks, when it was first on, we thought it was fast-paced. Now it looks slow and staid.

A: None of this is true. We�ve had an absolute perception of pacing for a very long time. Some of Shakespeare is pretty pacy.

Q: Shakespeare has people standing around on stage spouting for ten minutes at a time.

A: Okay, I agree. Shakespeare is not as good as Doctor Who.

Q: When it comes to Shakespeare, the perception of pace changes with the times.

A: Doctor Who wasn�t limited by the times or the style that were prevalent then. It was limited by the relatively meagre talent of the people who were working on it.

Q: And yet the people who were working on it turned over on a regular basis. Are you saying they were all mediocre?

A: Mostly they were middle of the range hacks who were not going to go on to do much else. Over 26 years, the hitrate is not high enough. There are people who have worked on Doctor Who and gone on to great things, like Douglas Adams. I just think most people thought this was going to be the big moment of their lives, which is a shame. As a television format, Doctor Who equals anything. Unless I chose my episodes very carefully, I couldn�t sit anyone I work with in television down in front of Doctor Who and say �Watch this�.

Q: What episode would you show them? I�d go for good old reliable Robert Holmes, a man who knew what drama was. The Talons of Weng Chiang part 1, a very good hack.

A: How could a good hack think that the BBC could make a giant rat? If he�d come to my house, when I was fourteen, and said �Can BBC Special Effects do a giant rat?�, I�d have said no. I�d rather see them do something limited than something crap. What I resented was going to school two days later, and my friends knew I watched this show, and they�d say �Did you see the giant rat?�, and I�d have to say I thought there was dramatic integrity elsewhere.

He has since admitted that yes, he sounds like a gigantic pompous prat; but suddenly it makes a lot more sense how he could be moved to bellow "YOU ARE ERASED FROM DOCTOR WHO" at people in public.

Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 12:24 on Feb 20, 2017

# ? Feb 20, 2017 12:20

Jerusalem: May 20, 2004; Would you be my new best friends?

To be fair didn't he do a later interview where he basically said,"God what a stupid loving thing to say?" re: badmouthing everybody before Davison?

# ? Feb 20, 2017 12:27

Attitude Indicator: Apr 3, 2009

Moffat's wording in that interview is harsh and really disrespectful towards people who apparently did a good and inspiring enough job that he can make a living based on their effort over 50 years later. But he's not wrong.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 13:49

Fair Bear Maiden: Jun 17, 2013

Jerusalem posted:

To be fair didn't he do a later interview where he basically said,"God what a stupid loving thing to say?" re: badmouthing everybody before Davison?

IIRC, some people have argued that he was drunk during that interview too. Mostly, though, it just comes off as someone being an edgelord back then, versus being overly congratulatory of the show now because he's involved with it. Without wanting to slip into the golden means fallacy, I don't find either position particularly sympathetic.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 13:56

Forktoss: Feb 13, 2012; I'm OK, you're so-so

It's a good thing I will most likely never hold any position of influence over Doctor Who, some of the things I've posted here would probably haunt me to my grave

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:01

Jerusalem: May 20, 2004; Would you be my new best friends?

Forktoss posted:

It's a good thing I will most likely never hold any position of influence over Doctor Who, some of the things I've posted here would probably haunt me to my grave

Head of BBC Drama: Why should we hire you, considering some of these things we've found in your post history?
Forktoss: If you don't hire me you have to hire Ian Levine
Head of BBC Drama: Uhhh actually you don't get to dictate our opti-
Moffat: We can't risk it, welcome aboard Fortktoss!

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:08

FreezingInferno: Jul 15, 2010; THERE.
WILL.
BE.
NO.
BATTLE.
HERE!

What terrors would we see from an Ian Levine-ran series, though?

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:22

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

FreezingInferno posted:

What terrors would we see from an Ian Levine-ran series, though?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_ONXNSufZ4

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:31

Neddy Seagoon: Oct 12, 2012; "Hi Everybody!"

Doctor Spaceman posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_ONXNSufZ4

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:32

Forktoss: Feb 13, 2012; I'm OK, you're so-so

FreezingInferno posted:

What terrors would we see from an Ian Levine-ran series, though?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4650h76xLk

:getin:

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:34

Tomtrek: Feb 5, 2006; I've had people walk out on me before, but not when I was being so charming.

FreezingInferno posted:

What terrors would we see from an Ian Levine-ran series, though?

# ? Feb 20, 2017 14:39

Fil5000: Jun 23, 2003; HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

FreezingInferno posted:

What terrors would we see from an Ian Levine-ran series, though?

UNIT dating would finally be explained.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 15:03

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

Fil5000 posted:

UNIT dating would finally be explained.

Benton and Liz Shaw went out briefly and Mike Yates had a brief tryst with a young private.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 15:12

Trin Tragula: Apr 22, 2005

Doctor Spaceman posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_ONXNSufZ4

I will never, ever, ever get bored of pointing out that the music for this comes courtesy of one Hans Zimmer (of Going for Gold theme tune fame) and his brand spanking new Fairlight Series II.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 16:28

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

Attitude Indicator posted:

Moffat's wording in that interview is harsh and really disrespectful towards people who apparently did a good and inspiring enough job that he can make a living based on their effort over 50 years later. But he's not wrong.

Apart from being totally wrong. You can't look at things like Power, or Spearhead from Space, or The Robots of Death and say "Man everyone involved is poo poo aren't they"

# ? Feb 20, 2017 19:39

The_Doctor: Mar 29, 2007; "The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."

In the same way we see a bad episode of modern Who, but our own good boy echoplex did sterling work on it. To tar everyone with the same brush is incredibly disingenuous.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 19:42

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

The_Doctor posted:

In the same way we see a bad episode of modern Who, but our own good boy echoplex did sterling work on it. To tar everyone with the same brush is incredibly disingenuous.

You have to be incredibly myopic.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 19:47

Wheat Loaf: Feb 13, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

FreezingInferno posted:

What terrors would we see from an Ian Levine-ran series, though?

Doctor quits time travelling full-time and retires to Blackpool in the 1970s, where he becomes infatuated with a certain northern soul DJ at the Mecca.

# ? Feb 20, 2017 20:30

Wheat Loaf: Feb 13, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

As far as that Moffat interview goes, were the episodes he was slagging off available widely on home video at the time? Was he going from 10-20 year old memories of the show or would he have been able to go home, pop a tape in the VHS recorder and go, "Yep, that's a bit rubbish."

# ? Feb 20, 2017 20:34

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

Wheat Loaf posted:

As far as that Moffat interview goes, were the episodes he was slagging off available widely on home video at the time?

Yes

(Well, clearly not all of them - but in 1995 you could have copies of, among others, Talons, Genesis, Tomb, The Azteks, The Robots of Death, The Dalek Invasion of Earth, The War Games, The Time Warrior, The Ark in Space, Spearhead from Space, Pyramids of Mars, Brain of Morbius, etc etc etc)

MrL_JaKiri fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Feb 20, 2017

# ? Feb 20, 2017 20:47

Trin Tragula: Apr 22, 2005

Wheat Loaf posted:

Doctor quits time travelling full-time and retires to Blackpool in the 1970s, where he becomes infatuated with a certain northern soul DJ at the Mecca.

"Do you know what the sad part is, Doctor? I'm a very good Northern Soul DJ..."

# ? Feb 21, 2017 01:52

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

MrL_JaKiri posted:

Yes

(Well, clearly not all of them - but in 1995 you could have copies of, among others, Talons, Genesis, Tomb, The Azteks, The Robots of Death, The Dalek Invasion of Earth, The War Games, The Time Warrior, The Ark in Space, Spearhead from Space, Pyramids of Mars, Brain of Morbius, etc etc etc)

Yeah, I remember borrowing a bunch of those specific ones from the library when I was growing up. Or taping them from ABC reruns at 4:30AM or whatever.

# ? Feb 21, 2017 04:44

Rhyno: Mar 22, 2003; Can't post for 10 years!

I had an enormous collection of DW episodes I'd taped off PBS. Every Christmas and Birthday my dad would buy me a few packs of VHS tapes so I didn't have to record over anything. I hung onto them for years despite starting to collect the DVDs.

# ? Feb 21, 2017 04:48

EdBlackadder: Apr 8, 2009; Lipstick Apathy

MrL_JaKiri posted:

Yes

(Well, clearly not all of them - but in 1995 you could have copies of, among others, Talons, Genesis, Tomb, The Azteks, The Robots of Death, The Dalek Invasion of Earth, The War Games, The Time Warrior, The Ark in Space, Spearhead from Space, Pyramids of Mars, Brain of Morbius, etc etc etc)

1995 my family got Sky TV for the first time. A channel called UK Gold showed Doctor Who repeats in a block on a Sunday morning. There would usually be an episode of Blakes 7 or the Survivors then they'd run a serial all the way through and next week you'd get the next serial. When they ran out, back to the start. I believe they showed everything available up to the TV Movie. I used to get up early so I could catch it all, hell of a step up from the odd VHS serials I had before that.

So even the serials that weren't on VHS could be viewed.

# ? Feb 21, 2017 09:30

cargohills: Apr 18, 2014

If you're going to claim that only one Doctor has any stories worth watching I'd think you'd want to do it with Tom Baker instead of Peter Davison given the amount of absolute garbage Davison got.

# ? Feb 21, 2017 09:44

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# ? May 10, 2024 06:17

Fil5000: Jun 23, 2003; HOLD ON GUYS I'M POSTING ABOUT INTERNET ROBOTS

EdBlackadder posted:

1995 my family got Sky TV for the first time. A channel called UK Gold showed Doctor Who repeats in a block on a Sunday morning. There would usually be an episode of Blakes 7 or the Survivors then they'd run a serial all the way through and next week you'd get the next serial. When they ran out, back to the start. I believe they showed everything available up to the TV Movie. I used to get up early so I could catch it all, hell of a step up from the odd VHS serials I had before that.

So even the serials that weren't on VHS could be viewed.

I'm pretty sure BBC2 also used to run everything from Pertwee to Colin Baker in the mid to late 90s. I think it was sunday mornings, but I don't quite recall. I'm nearly 100% sure they never showed any McCoy, as I was waiting for it but it never arrived.

Edit: Apparently it was early 90s, wasn't at lunchtime at all, DID include some McCoy and wasn't a full run at all, just serials chosen seemingly at random.

http://gallifreybase.com/w/index.php/Airdates_in_the_UK_(BBC_repeats)

Starts at row 111.

Fil5000 fucked around with this message at 09:56 on Feb 21, 2017

# ? Feb 21, 2017 09:53

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > TV IV > Doctor Who: THE POWER OF THE DALEKS! Oh, and a Christmas special.

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