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Tiler Kiwi posted:Oh, neat. Some factions start out with it but from your account maybe they can gain and lose it as other modifiers can change. Perhaps having high relations with the undead makes them more likely to get the modifier, in the same way that I've seen Empire electors lose 'Imperial Distrust' once relations with the Empire get high enough.
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Feb 23, 2017 12:06
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Dezztroy posted:Wait, I thought the map editor only let you make maps for custom battles? Or am I just reading your post wrong? It's being implemented for campaign maps as well now.
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Feb 23, 2017 12:48
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You can also offer to join their wars with other people, you can totally tell the Dwarfs you'll join their war with some dipshit orcs at the rear end end of nowhere who you'll never see and get on better terms with them. I dunno if there is some glaring flaw to this other than making other orcs more hostile to you though, someone can maybe clarify that?
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Feb 23, 2017 13:53
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HerraS posted:You can also offer to join their wars with other people, you can totally tell the Dwarfs you'll join their war with some dipshit orcs at the rear end end of nowhere who you'll never see and get on better terms with them. I dunno if there is some glaring flaw to this other than making other orcs more hostile to you though, someone can maybe clarify that? There's no real downsides. If you don't actually attack them then there's not that much diplomatic benefit, though. If you peace out later it hurts your trustworthiness rating. Also if they are somehow friendly with your neighbours they can ask one of them to join the war if they didn't like you. Even orcs can did this... Somehow.
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Feb 23, 2017 14:00
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Fangz posted:There's no real downsides. If you don't actually attack them then there's not that much diplomatic benefit, though. If you peace out later it hurts your trustworthiness rating. I imagine it isn't hard to convince orcs to join a war, just hard to convince them not to attack both sides, or to stop eventually.
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Feb 23, 2017 14:06
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Night10194 posted:I imagine it isn't hard to convince orcs to join a war, just hard to convince them not to attack both sides, or to stop eventually. No, I mean orcs can encourage humans and the like to join a war on their side....
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Feb 23, 2017 14:14
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Fangz posted:No, I mean orcs can encourage humans and the like to join a war on their side.... When I played Empire I attacked a Bret minor, who called in Karak Ziflin, who called in Karak Norn, who called in the loving Savage Orcs. A shameful dawi.
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Feb 23, 2017 15:07
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Karak Norn seem to always be dicks in my games, too. Is it in the lore?
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Feb 23, 2017 15:24
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This guy drones on and on but he definitely knows his warhammer lore https://youtu.be/ArgCIDta6Lo
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Feb 23, 2017 15:34
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Beastmen kinda own. actually managed to win the Eye for an Eye campaign, 23 wins-2 losses. fought Bringer of Tod with 420 units against 1100 of theirs and won a Close Victory, sealing the short victory condition. I think it's my first actual campaign seen through to the end. granted it's a mini, but still.
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Feb 23, 2017 15:34
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Fangz posted:Karak Norn seem to always be dicks in my games, too. Is it in the lore? Grey Mountain dwarfs are pretty much the american midwest of warhammer dorfs who live in a lovely mountain region with no metals in it and those who don't have the brains to leave become bitter assholes even by dwarf standards.
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Feb 23, 2017 15:42
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So I found 12-year-old me's complete collection of 6th ed warammer army books, if anyone wants lore/faction roster rundowns/etc. These were the high-point books for me, they're a pretty cool mix of art, "word of god" lore and short stories and manage to take themselves seriously without getting toooo into the dumbass power fantasy of later editions or losing the tongue-in-cheek style of the earlier ones. Of course that was when I was a kid and actually played/painted so the nostalgia goggles are focused on 6th ed for me. I think Wood Elves are the only faction I am missing. Also the books are long OOP so would it be kosher to just post scans? There's some cool art and pics of models, especially in the VC book there's this massive like 6' by 6' diorama table of an undead horde taking an Empire town.
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Feb 23, 2017 15:46
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Free Cheese posted:This guy drones on and on but he definitely knows his warhammer lore I like Arch Warhammer too
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Feb 23, 2017 15:56
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OK so I was on ambush with an army, and an enemy warherd, on their turn walked right up to my army and ambushed me on my turn. What the gently caress is that all about? I actually lost thanks to being in complete disarray from being ambushed. What is this bullshit?
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Feb 23, 2017 15:58
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Plavski posted:I like Arch Warhammer too Arch was an unrepentant whiny pissbitch last time i saw his videos so thanks but no thanks!
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Feb 23, 2017 15:59
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lazorexplosion posted:OK so I was on ambush with an army, and an enemy warherd, on their turn walked right up to my army and ambushed me on my turn. What the gently caress is that all about? I actually lost thanks to being in complete disarray from being ambushed. What is this bullshit? you were detected so they attacked you and every time a beastman army attacks they have a chance of triggering an ambush.
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Feb 23, 2017 16:01
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Yeah beastmen dont have a "no stance", their default movement stance is beastmen ambush, always has a chance to trigger one.
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Feb 23, 2017 16:15
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Thanks for the diplomacy tips! I've been going down the Lahmia research tree for vampiric corruption, so going for diplo boosts sounds good. My plan to cozy up with the dwarves by trouncing orc raiding parties had an unexpected turn when the orc faction leader showed up with some unique (?) units. It led to a really entertaining battle where tough orcs hacked their way through a horde of zombies before finally succumbing to the tide, while skeleton knights and boar cavalry duked it out on the flanks. Occasionally a suicidal bat-suited goblin would crash into friend and foe alike. CA has done a good job with this game.
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Feb 23, 2017 16:24
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Lizardmen will have an ok amount of shooting. Clouds of skirmishing skinks can throw out either javelins or blowpipe darts. They have a few fliers that can throw out some limited shooting in addition to dropping rocks like dwarves drop bombs. The monsters will give some heavier shooting. The bastiladon has the mentioned laser crystal on its back. The troglodon has a very meh poison shot. They have a pair of very mobile weapon dinosaurs. Salamanders might operate as fairly mobile flame cannons and I could see razordons be mobile canister-shot throwers.
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Feb 23, 2017 16:25
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Ahahaha, new Bretonnia video shows off a few fun things. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlxrhB4DvEE They get the reverse tech of the Wood Elves +Diplo bonus techs: you issue a decree that's essentially "YO [race x] YOU AINT poo poo" which gives you bonuses for fighting them, but utterly tanks your relationship with those factions. -50 for most everything except Chaos, which gets -100. It also counters attrition, so you can go north and kick Norsca into the dirt for being smelly curs. Gejnor posted:Arch was an unrepentant whiny pissbitch last time i saw his videos so thanks but no thanks! yeah he came up a bit ago for me when he was kvetching about how the diplomacy aversion thing wasn't good enough because you could still get CROSS RACIAL ALLIANCES THAT VIOLATED CANON its one thing to like the lore of a game and care about consistency in setting/characterisation, but whenever i read/hear people start complaining about how hypothetical x is an affront to canon, its usually a sign of a person that... idk, is a weird dumb pissbaby. overly binary thinking and a severe lack of creativity or imagination, generally. Tiler Kiwi fucked around with this message at 16:36 on Feb 23, 2017 |
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Feb 23, 2017 16:28
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Tiler Kiwi posted:yeah he came up a bit ago for me when he was kvetching about how the diplomacy aversion thing wasn't good enough because you could still get CROSS RACIAL ALLIANCES THAT VIOLATED CANON also the point of the entire warhammer fantasy canon is to be able to justify an alliance of Literally Anyone with Literally Anyone against Literally Anyone depending on the situation. a Dwarf who fights alongside Greenskins against Tomb Kings is a shameful-rear end Dwarf, but sometimes the Grobi decide they are going to charge the legions of the Skeleton Pope and it would be in the High King's best interests if the cannons lined up to massacre the greenskin filth intentionally miss high the first few rounds of shooting.
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Feb 23, 2017 16:58
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I mean just about the only group most people wouldn't willingly ally with is Chaos, and that's why Chaos has a bunch of guys devoted to tricking and deceiving people into helping them out anyway, so they can still show up with anyone.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:00
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Tiler Kiwi posted:yeah he came up a bit ago for me when he was kvetching about how the diplomacy aversion thing wasn't good enough because you could still get CROSS RACIAL ALLIANCES THAT VIOLATED CANON Its that and he was making GBS threads on the game constantly before it was launched because it was missing some units and this was AN ATROCITY or something. I think he also railed on about the chaos dlc and when that was changed into an early adopters bonus he was super loving smug and like "see it pays to complain  " and was just an insufferable twat all the way through.Then later i saw a video of his complaining about FEMINISTS and i realised hes one of THOSE people confirming for me even more i was right to never give him another view. Gejnor fucked around with this message at 17:11 on Feb 23, 2017 |
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Feb 23, 2017 17:08
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Gejnor posted:Its that and he was making GBS threads on the game constantly before it was launched because it was missing some units and this was AN ATROCITY or something. I think he also railed on about the chaos dlc and when that was changed into an early adopters bonus he was super loving smug and like "see it pays to complain Wonder if he started the whole review bombing on Steam.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:19
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TheLastRoboKy posted:It took me all of one game to figure out how to deal with this and has never been a problem since. I'm honestly still surprised it's a thing. Pay for the wall upgrade in every village and install the +50% movement in own territory mod?
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Feb 23, 2017 17:20
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Ambush stance
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Feb 23, 2017 17:23
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Gejnor posted:to never give him another view. This. Give me your strats for dealing with Welves as Beastmen. I was going in on a few units of hounds or other fast cav to block the fuckers so that my infantry that are literally half-goat can catch them. Later game cygors and being creative with multi army ambushes would let me pin them on the map to kill them. Even then their kiting would still gently caress me in situations where I thought I had it locked down. Also their monstrous infantry doesn't help with the low moral of my units.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:25
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You've got a bunch of units with Stalk, that makes them invisible to the AI until they get close. Surround them and rush them.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:31
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Jesus christ, dealing with the endless chaos army whack a mole was annoying enough when I though ambushing was at least semi reliable. I was enjoying the campaign when I was on the offensive but wow everything about defending is irritating as hell.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:38
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I'm actually not convinced the AI can't see units with stalk tho :P Sometimes they beeline out of their normal pathing straight for hidden units. Might be coincidence
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Feb 23, 2017 17:43
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lazorexplosion posted:Jesus christ, dealing with the endless chaos army whack a mole was annoying enough when I though ambushing was at least semi reliable. I was enjoying the campaign when I was on the offensive but wow everything about defending is irritating as hell. Ya Fangz posted:Ambush stance
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Feb 23, 2017 17:44
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Ammanas posted:I'm actually not convinced the AI can't see units with stalk tho :P Yeah I've had units hidden in woods on opposite sides of hills from where the enemy is so they especially shouldn't have been able to see them and instead of marching to my army they send all their cavalry straight at where my units are supposed to be hidden.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:46
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the AI can't see hidden units. It is very bad at it. You can hide a unit in a corner of trees and hit 3x speed to win defense draws against full stacks.Trujillo posted:Yeah I've had units hidden in woods on opposite sides of hills from where the enemy is so they especially shouldn't have been able to see them and instead of marching to my army they send all their cavalry straight at where my units are supposed to be hidden.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:48
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Ammanas posted:I'm actually not convinced the AI can't see units with stalk tho :P I've done some pretty good flanking attacks with full-stalk armies as Skarsnik, so...
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Feb 23, 2017 17:51
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The AI pretty reliably moves at a diagonal to flank your army, sometimes it veers a bit in an odd manner, or orients it's center line to a hidden unit. Here's a quick experiment. Make a beastmen army in quick battle without artillery against any faction without artillery or ranged. Line up your main army with ungor archers hidden and flanked. Turn off fire at will and move your archers within range of any AI unit. Are they still hidden and does the AI army suddenly march forward to engage you?
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Feb 23, 2017 17:54
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Ammanas posted:The AI pretty reliably moves at a diagonal to flank your army, sometimes it veers a bit in an odd manner, or orients it's center line to a hidden unit. The range at which you lose stealth with the ungor raiders is a bit further than the range they can shoot at, IIRC, so that's no surprise. Stalk isn't 'can't be seen', it just reduces the range they can be seen from by a lot.
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Feb 23, 2017 18:00
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Something interesting shown in the Lets Play released today is that you can actually mouse over Lord traits to see HOW they got it. Don't know if that's a Brettonia only thing though, since those matter more to them than other factions from what I can tell, having a building to counteract bad ones and all.
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Feb 23, 2017 18:17
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ZoninSilver posted:Something interesting shown in the Lets Play released today is that you can actually mouse over Lord traits to see HOW they got it. Don't know if that's a Brettonia only thing though, since those matter more to them than other factions from what I can tell, having a building to counteract bad ones and all. They said in the streams it's Bret only since + and - traits play into their core mechanics and campaign victory. That said, I hope they go back and add it to other factions, or at least start adding it going forward.
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Feb 23, 2017 18:22
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Dammit page didn't refresh nvm
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Feb 23, 2017 18:56
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So for the next game Malekith as leader and Morathi for the alternate standard start are a Dark Elf shoe-in, but for the High Elves, Lizards, and Skaven who do we expect as faction leaders? IIRC phoenix king Finubar didn't have tabletop rules and was way overshadowed by Tyrion and Teclis, while Skaven and dinos just don't have a single ruler. I guess they could all be multi-start. Would certainly suit Skaven. Thanquol in Skavenblight, Skrolk out west by the lizards, Queek Headtaker perhaps in Eight Peaks to interact with Belegar and Skarsnik? Runner ups would be Throt up by the chaos guys, Snikch and Ikit Claw... somewhere, to rep the other 3 main clans. For those not in the know, the main skaven clans were: Skryre, who specialize in bizarro steampunk weapons, cannons and gatling guns and flamethrowers and poo poo, led by cyborgish Warlock Engineers, their main character was Ikit Claw, a high-tier wizard with power armor and a flamethrower claw. Moulder, who make crazy frankenrat monsters like rat ogres, led by Packmasters with prods and whips and poo poo, main character was Throt the Unclean who was really tanky and good at killing monsters Pestilens, they makes poisons and cause plagues and poo poo and are the main foe the lizards. Their characters were good at both melee and magic.Leader was Lord Skrolk, who had a good melee weapon and his main benefit was making Plague Monks (basically frenzied poisonous clanrats with flails) core. He was a wizard too. Eshin, who were ninjas with throwing stars and all, main character was Deathmaster Snickh who was a super good ninja. Their generic heroes were assassins. Then there was Thanquol, a cowardly wizard with a rat ogre buddy, and Queek, who lives in Karak Eight Peaks and is the standard badass melee lord. They might also use the Verminking for variety, a giant rat daemon character. I hope they do something with the Skaven Council of Thirteen. They'll need some kind of unique playstyle. The old lists where you had to choose one specific clan to play was cool. If the Skaven are the lizardmen antagonists then Skrolk is a shoe-in. Skaven also have two unique magic lores, a warlock engineer lightning-based one and a disease-based one for plague lords. Dark Elves used Dark Magic which was like a buffed combo of all the eight human lores, and High Elves and Lizards had high magic which was basically that but used responsibly, imagine a prism emitting a rainbow vs the muddy black-brown that results when you mix every color. This game is making me hella nostgalgic for all the dumbass warhammer lore. vintagepurple fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Feb 23, 2017 |
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Feb 23, 2017 19:56
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