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Hot Diggity! posted:A dude I went to college with got fired from the school newspaper for a similar take (except the entire piece was "black people are more athletic because of slavery...did it open with a Chris Rock bit? YOU BET). Its actually not that far off, you just have to be careful how you talk about it. Slaves were treated like livestock, they were "bred" to make bigger, stronger offspring. The problems with that thinking though are numerous. Not all black people are descended from slaves. Its also difficult to demonstrate that on a relatively short time scale (say 200 to 300 hundred years) that the type of selection we are talking about would predominate the population in way such that it would continue to predominate without selective breeding. This goes to yet another problem with that thinking, which is that slave descendants pick their mates based on the same principles that the slave masters did. Its one of those concepts that superficially has some modicum of sense, but under the tiniest bit of scrutiny falls apart real fast.
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Mar 3, 2017 17:32
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https://twitter.com/bomani_jones/status/837678040968736768swickles posted:Its actually not that far off, you just have to be careful how you talk about it. Slaves were treated like livestock, they were "bred" to make bigger, stronger offspring. The problems with that thinking though are numerous. Not all black people are descended from slaves. Its also difficult to demonstrate that on a relatively short time scale (say 200 to 300 hundred years) that the type of selection we are talking about would predominate the population in way such that it would continue to predominate without selective breeding. This goes to yet another problem with that thinking, which is that slave descendants pick their mates based on the same principles that the slave masters did. Its one of those concepts that superficially has some modicum of sense, but under the tiniest bit of scrutiny falls apart real fast. Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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Mar 3, 2017 17:42
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swickles posted:Its actually not that far off, you just have to be careful how you talk about it. Slaves were treated like livestock, they were "bred" to make bigger, stronger offspring. The problems with that thinking though are numerous. Not all black people are descended from slaves. Its also difficult to demonstrate that on a relatively short time scale (say 200 to 300 hundred years) that the type of selection we are talking about would predominate the population in way such that it would continue to predominate without selective breeding. This goes to yet another problem with that thinking, which is that slave descendants pick their mates based on the same principles that the slave masters did. Its one of those concepts that superficially has some modicum of sense, but under the tiniest bit of scrutiny falls apart real fast. 
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Mar 3, 2017 17:47
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i hope the Bengals get some well bred offensive linemen
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Mar 3, 2017 17:50
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swickles posted:Its actually not that far off, you just have to be careful how you talk about it. Slaves were treated like livestock, they were "bred" to make bigger, stronger offspring. The problems with that thinking though are numerous. Not all black people are descended from slaves. Its also difficult to demonstrate that on a relatively short time scale (say 200 to 300 hundred years) that the type of selection we are talking about would predominate the population in way such that it would continue to predominate without selective breeding. This goes to yet another problem with that thinking, which is that slave descendants pick their mates based on the same principles that the slave masters did. Its one of those concepts that superficially has some modicum of sense, but under the tiniest bit of scrutiny falls apart real fast. 
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Mar 3, 2017 17:54
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If you guys are reading that as anything other than a debunking of the original claims, then you need to work on your reading comprehension skills.
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Mar 3, 2017 17:56
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I don't think there is much actual evidence that slaveowners in the antebellum South - who were largely Southern Baptists with no grasp of genetics or even evolutionary theory - were pursuing an consistent program of selective breeding across multiple generations of slaves. It just seems like a stretch to think that people whose entire argument for slavery was "God said so because look at Bible verse mumble mumble" were also running this big eugenics enterprise across multiple generations. Especially since they were breaking up families and shuffling the people between owners willy-nilly to pay off their gambling debts or whatever. Also, kind of important, they were raping the women on an unknown but probably massive scale. Which of course throws a huge monkey wrench into the whole selective breeding idea by throwing random human garbage white people genes into the mix at random. vvv Yup. sean10mm fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Mar 3, 2017 |
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Mar 3, 2017 17:57
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They just read "not that far off" which seems like a bad way to start a paragraph the directly contradicts that sentence.
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Mar 3, 2017 17:57
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sean10mm posted:I don't think there is much actual evidence that slaveowners in the antebellum South - who were largely Southern Baptists with no grasp of genetics or even evolutionary theory - were pursuing an consistent program of selective breeding across multiple generations of slaves. I agree that there's no actual evidence of a consistent program of selective breeding for Southern slavers. Your argument about why is specious, though. Farmers, however, were performing selective breeding long, long before Mendel. It's not necessary to know even the slightest bit about genetics or evolutionary theory to decide to only take the offspring from the plants/livestock that have desirable traits.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:05
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SKULL.GIF posted:I agree that there's no actual evidence of a consistent program of selective breeding for Southern slavers. Your argument about why is specious, though. Well thank God you cleared that up.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:09
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No Butt Stuff posted:They just read "not that far off" which seems like a bad way to start a paragraph the directly contradicts that sentence. Yeah, I guess I was just trying to emphasize the superficiality of that statement. Its basically an example of how a little knowledge is sometimes more dangerous than no knowledge at all. I am used to teaching through the Socratic method, asking leading questions which let the students come the conclusion on their own, even though its very guided. Sometimes that involves going down the "wrong" path and then resulting in accepting the antithesis. I won't edit the post, but I think I started down one line of thinking and switched to another, resulting in a weird preface. My main point though, to be clear, was that the idea that black people are better athletes because of slavery is one that if you think about for only a second makes sense, but if you think about it more than that, absolutely does not for a lot of reasons. Its a superficial truth, which reminds me of a quotation that is also superficially related: "If you don't know anything about the Civil War, it was about slavery. If you know a little about the Civil War, it was about states rights, if you know a lot about the Civil War it was about slavery."
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Mar 3, 2017 18:12
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My thinkpiece on why Bill Romanowski's ancestors fought Mandingo fights in blackface:
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Mar 3, 2017 18:13
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SKULL.GIF posted:I agree that there's no actual evidence of a consistent program of selective breeding for Southern slavers. Your argument about why is specious, though. Yeah, I doubt the thinking went beyond "you are big and she is big too!". It undoubtedly did happen, and records were written in a similar way to livestock, that much is fact. They may not have been efficient or correct in their selection, but it still happened. My main point is that even though this happened, it could not have happened on a large enough scale to influence the genomics of slave descendants today.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:17
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swickles posted:Yeah, I doubt the thinking went beyond "you are big and she is big too!". It undoubtedly did happen, and records were written in a similar way to livestock, that much is fact. They may not have been efficient or correct in their selection, but it still happened. My main point is that even though this happened, it could not have happened on a large enough scale to influence the genomics of slave descendants today. The best way to make these arguments is saying "assuming, for the sake of argument, x" because what you're trying to say is it does not matter if "it still happened". What you're saying is it doesn't matter if it happened, so you don't get bogged down arguing the very thing you're saying doesn't matter. It is dumb to pick a fight on a point you're saying doesn't matter.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:23
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Came across these looking for news on Tyrod because I saw a report earlier that the Bills were leaning towards cutting him https://twitter.com/LateRoundQB/status/837686191512293377 https://twitter.com/GrahamBarfield/status/837693108469006339 The Jets should be all over him, man
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Mar 3, 2017 18:28
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The "make two big people sex" idea doesn't explain how black people dominate in sports everywhere from 5'5" to 7'+ and like 140-400 lbs or something. There is no common thread there unless you're appealing to some kind of magical sci-fi conspiracy poo poo where they're breeding in some extra tendons over 200 years or some poo poo.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:28
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Alex Marvez, Sirius XM Host, claims Cooks will be an Eagle. For their second round pick. Dunno how respectable he is. Also, I can't get twitter to post on here with the formatting. I post the URL and it just posts a URL. https://twitter.com/alexmarvez/status/837666412491653121?s=09 https://mobile.twitter.com/alexmarvez/status/837667677342732289 Nm it worked 89 fucked around with this message at 18:36 on Mar 3, 2017 |
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Mar 3, 2017 18:31
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so I haven't been playing attention, why are the Saints trading him anyway?
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Mar 3, 2017 18:46
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Kalli posted:so I haven't been playing attention, why are the Saints trading him anyway? Apparently Cooks asked for it, he wants out of the offense. (I mean, Brees probably only has 2 years left and Cooks is only 23 years old). Also, the general idea is that the Saints are rich in WRs (Thomas, Snead) but need defense bad. I could see Barwin and Kendricks getting thrown into this trade easily. They are great 3-4 LBs playing in the Eagles 4-3. Barwin playing as a DE.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:49
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schweens posted:Came across these looking for news on Tyrod because I saw a report earlier that the Bills were leaning towards cutting him I don't really agree. He's fine but he isn't going to be a franchise cornerstone for the next 5 years. I'd rather the Jets tear it all down and not give him multiple years and a big guarantee.
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Mar 3, 2017 18:53
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89 posted:Apparently Cooks asked for it, he wants out of the offense. (I mean, Brees probably only has 2 years left and Cooks is only 23 years old). Also, the general idea is that the Saints are rich in WRs (Thomas, Snead) but need defense bad. Yeah, he's so young which is why I was wondering. But if you have a wealth at the position, I can see moving him for at least a 2nd to try and do something with that defense.
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Mar 3, 2017 19:00
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If we get Cooks for a second consider me his personal Hype man and my spiritual mancrush successor to Darren Sproles, my favorite player in the NFL since he was a charger.
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Mar 3, 2017 19:16
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Imagine if Philip Rivers ever had a #1 WR. Come to LA, Marshall
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Mar 3, 2017 19:22
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It's the new KKK legal defense! "Sir, why did you lynch that man? Couldn't help myself, it was ancestral muscle memory."
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Mar 3, 2017 19:24
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Tyrod Taylor is a franchise QB.
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Mar 3, 2017 20:11
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89 posted:Alex Marvez, Sirius XM Host, claims Cooks will be an Eagle. For their second round pick. Everything I've seen says Stills is currently stuck between Miami hometown Discount or getting paid by Tennessee. Cook isn't as good as Brees makes him look but for a 2nd that's a good trade. Personally I'd be thrilled with it over Stills @ 12m
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Mar 3, 2017 20:12
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fsif posted:Tyrod Taylor is a franchise QB. How do you want to define that?
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Mar 3, 2017 20:14
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mcmagic posted:How do you want to define that? That with an average team around him, he's good enough to get you in the playoff mix, and that with a good team around him, he's good enough to win a Super Bowl.
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Mar 3, 2017 20:17
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fsif posted:That with an average team around him, he's good enough to get you in the playoff mix, and that with a good team around him, he's good enough to win a Super Bowl. I think that is like one notch above what he is.
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Mar 3, 2017 20:25
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mcmagic posted:I think that is like one notch above what he is. he's joe flacco with worse coaching and supporting cast and before the Flacco hot streak. tyrod taylor is elite
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Mar 3, 2017 20:29
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mcmagic posted:I think that is like one notch above what he is. This implies the Rex Ryan Bills were carrying him to .500
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Mar 3, 2017 20:30
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a patagonian cavy posted:he's joe flacco with worse coaching and supporting cast and before the Flacco hot streak. tyrod taylor is elite I think I'd rather have Flacco but he's not much worse. I can agree with that.
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Mar 3, 2017 20:35
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Haven't heard anything about the Titans being interested in Stills.
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Mar 3, 2017 20:36
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Has it been mentioned that Josh Gordon filed for reinstatement on March 1st? If it's approved, I'm guessing the Browns just release him, but I wonder how many teams would take a shot at him on a "prove it" deal.quote:"Josh is living with me and is in the best place mentally that he has been in dating back years before entering the NFL," Michael Johnson said. "He has taken the proper steps to treat his issues and has followed a very strict protocol that the league and our team here has laid out for him. Joey Freshwater fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Mar 3, 2017 |
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Mar 3, 2017 20:38
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"He's also in the best shape of his life
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Joey Freshwater posted:Has it been mentioned that Josh Gordon filed for reinstatement on March 1st? If it's approved, I'm guessing the Browns just release him, but I wonder how many teams would take a shot at him on a "prove it" deal. The Bucs. But I think the Bucs should sign every available WR.
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Mar 3, 2017 20:40
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wandler20 posted:The Bucs. But I think the Bucs should sign every available WR. Same page
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Mar 3, 2017 20:41
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Goff to Gordon all the way to the Superbowl
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Mar 3, 2017 20:54
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DariusLikewise posted:Goff to Gordon all the way to the Superbowl 
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Mar 3, 2017 21:00
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Joey Freshwater posted:Has it been mentioned that Josh Gordon filed for reinstatement on March 1st? If it's approved, I'm guessing the Browns just release him, but I wonder how many teams would take a shot at him on a "prove it" deal. Patriots.
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Mar 3, 2017 21:36
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Brandon Marshall is so used to having to circus catch Fitzpatrick's poo poo throws so much that he's gonna make a normal QB look like a God.
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Mar 3, 2017 21:54
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