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UberVexer
Jan 5, 2006

I like trains

asdf32 posted:

Consider adding the TL431 to your repertoire though.

I bumped into one of these on an industrial LED controller the other day.

I got to feel like a fool, as it took me staring at it for a few minutes to realize it wasn't a straight up NPN.

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Methylethylaldehyde
Oct 23, 2004

BAKA BAKA

asdf32 posted:

You could also look for cheap/broken/used tools of ebay. Though 40V won't be too common so it might be hard.

Yeah, no luck there. Which is a shame because I have the cordless weedwhacker and it's disgustingly awesome, and figured it would save me having to buy or source a 36-40v battery pack for the project.

n0tqu1tesane
May 7, 2003

She was rubbing her ass all over my hands. They don't just do that for everyone.
Grimey Drawer

Methylethylaldehyde posted:

Yeah, no luck there. Which is a shame because I have the cordless weedwhacker and it's disgustingly awesome, and figured it would save me having to buy or source a 36-40v battery pack for the project.

Could always find someone with a 3d printer:

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1270617

Not sure if that will work with the 40v batteries, but should with the 20/60V Flexvolt batteries. Either way, might be able to modify that model to fit.

Sagebrush
Feb 26, 2012

Stabby McDamage posted:

Use two-sided protoboard, or even better, stripboard (which has conductors running the same way), then use a bandsaw, dremel, or nibbler to cut it to size. Install female header topside in the middle two rows and male header bottomside on the outer two rows. Then the ESP can span the ridge in the middle of the breadboard.

Or, ditch the 8-pin ESP8266 and just get a NodeMCU or similar host board with onboard USB, and everything will be 10 times easier.

this is how I handle those dumbass 8-in-a-block headers on things like ESPs or NRF24s



Just two strips of pass-thru stackable female headers with the leads bent out to fit over the middle of a breadboard. I got a bag of 100 8-pin ones for like $4 from China.

I also recommend the NodeMCU or similar because wow so much easier and they still only cost a few bucks on AliExpress.

Jamsta
Dec 16, 2006

Oh you want some too? Fuck you!

I'm using the NodeMCU devboard across two breadboards for prototyping a Fibaro WiFi/Rest API thing for our office lights.



However recently bought a cheap Wemos D1 mini which fits onto a single breadboard. The knockoff I bought doesn't have working USB, so buyer beware :)

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...

Nice precision antenna mod

Stabby McDamage
Dec 11, 2005

Doctor Rope

ate all the Oreos posted:

Just so you know I have the same ESP8266 (-01 I think it's called?) with the dual-header and while I can get it to run and talk to it over serial I have never been able to successfully get it to run a program and I have no idea why not, even the example programs delivered in the exact standard way don't run on it. Maybe it's a counterfeit one or something idk

You have to do tricks with grounding one pin while hitting reset, then uploading. I spun a host board with buttons just for this purpose way back when that board was fairly new. It worked, but was a pain. The modern variants with onboard USB are the way to go.

JawnV6 posted:

Nice precision antenna mod

What does the antenna mod do? Doesn't that screw up the RF moon magic that makes it work?

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

Stabby McDamage posted:

I spun a host board with buttons just for this purpose way back when that board was fairly new.

Yeah I did this too and it still didn't work, though maybe I got something wrong with it? I figured I just got a weird chinese counterfeit since I bought them for suspiciously cheap off ebay :shrug:

Sagebrush
Feb 26, 2012

JawnV6 posted:

Nice precision antenna mod

:cheeky:

Stabby McDamage posted:

What does the antenna mod do? Doesn't that screw up the RF moon magic that makes it work?

In this case, it *is* the RF moon magic that makes it work. I was getting really lovely reliability on this bag of AliExpress NRF24L01 modules and YOSPOS ham radio guy Jonny 290 suggested that whoever cloned it might have hosed up the circuit design and it didn't have enough antenna load on it, or something like that (I don't understand RF either). After soldering the wire on it worked perfectly -- better than 120 feet line-of-sight. Magic.

bred
Oct 24, 2008
From my pringle cantenna days, I remember 32mm is the length for 2.4ghz. There is a relationship between the length and frequency and speed of wave that is similar to intake runner length on race cars.

Stabby McDamage
Dec 11, 2005

Doctor Rope

Sagebrush posted:

:cheeky:


In this case, it *is* the RF moon magic that makes it work. I was getting really lovely reliability on this bag of AliExpress NRF24L01 modules and YOSPOS ham radio guy Jonny 290 suggested that whoever cloned it might have hosed up the circuit design and it didn't have enough antenna load on it, or something like that (I don't understand RF either). After soldering the wire on it worked perfectly -- better than 120 feet line-of-sight. Magic.

:aaaaa:

That Jonny 290 is one smart cookie.

Effective-Disorder
Nov 13, 2013

Sagebrush posted:

:cheeky:


In this case, it *is* the RF moon magic that makes it work. I was getting really lovely reliability on this bag of AliExpress NRF24L01 modules and YOSPOS ham radio guy Jonny 290 suggested that whoever cloned it might have hosed up the circuit design and it didn't have enough antenna load on it, or something like that (I don't understand RF either). After soldering the wire on it worked perfectly -- better than 120 feet line-of-sight. Magic.

What if you wanted 'more magic'?

http://catb.org/esr/jargon/html/magic-story.html

Sagebrush
Feb 26, 2012

I like that story but I refuse to click on it cause it's hosted on ESR's site. Read this version instead

https://www.cs.utah.edu/~elb/folklore/magic.html

Kasan
Dec 24, 2006
I didn't see an Electrical megathread so I'll ask here.


I have an electrical issue that I have the knowledge enough to repair, but I can't seem to diagnose the issue. A couple days ago I had an outlet die on me with a lovely pop of blue smoke. (pluged into it was a 1/8 HP motor running at the time, and this outlet has solely been used to power that outlet for about 4 winters now as it's attached to my fireplace insert). I thought no biggie, I'll replace it.

Well, it turns out that when it blew, it took literally 50% of the electrical outlets, lights and ceiling fans with it. Again no biggie, I'll go replace the fuse and reset any circuit breakers that popped.

Now here is the problem. The entire branch that's affected ISN'T attached to a fuse or breaker as far as I can tell. I could go to each outlet in the house and test for voltage, but I have no way of telling if the outlet I'm checking is on that branch or not. I know there's a tool that you can plug into a circuit and it'll tell you roughly where the break is in terms of wire distance, but the name escapes me and I'm not even sure if it would help. There isn't a wiring diagram for the house, and the labels on the ancient fuse box and break box aren't even correct.

Hell the hell do I fix this problem? It's mostly an inconvenience because I no longer have a porch light, living room light or guest bedroom light, but as much of an introvert as I am, I'm not a troglodyte and having only computer monitors for light sources is an eyestrain.

Things I've done:
Checked every fuse and found none dead
Checked every breaker, and all of them are on
Replaced the receptacle that I thought was the issue with a new one (and was horrified to find the ground wire was grounded to the junction, not the receptacle)
Metered a couple circuits I knew were on the same branch due to placement (guessing) and found no voltage.

Things I'm unsure of but willing to test:
Metering every outlet in the house with live current and tagging all the ones that come up dead. Unsure if I find a dead outlet next to a live outlet, does that mean that outlet is the issue or is it a different branch. Would ANY outlet on the branch comeback as having current with the current situation.)
Crawling under the house and looking to see where most of the romex goes and trying to trace the line. A ton of the house has the power lines just under the subfloor going from point A to point B. Since I've been educated in the ways of residential electrical networks I've yet to crawl down there and figure out where everything is going.)

My fear: There might be a junction behind the wall that burned out that I have no way of finding with out tearing out every wall in the house.

Can anybody advise me on what to do? I'm capable enough to do it, and have about 80% of the tools a professional electrician has due to my schooling. I literally can't afford a professional to come out and fix it so I'm pretty much on my own here

coyo7e
Aug 23, 2007

by zen death robot
Everybody needs to love dykes, eventually.

Rexxed
May 1, 2010

Dis is amazing!
I gotta try dis!

Kasan posted:

I didn't see an Electrical megathread so I'll ask here.

<scary house wiring issue>

I have no idea but you should definitely ask in this thread:
Don't burn your house down: the wiring thread.

Kasan
Dec 24, 2006

Rexxed posted:

I have no idea but you should definitely ask in this thread:
Don't burn your house down: the wiring thread.

Thanks! I'll cross post it over there and hopefully somebody can help.

peepsalot
Apr 24, 2007

        PEEP THIS...
           BITCH!

Kasan posted:

I didn't see an Electrical megathread so I'll ask here.


I have an electrical issue that I have the knowledge enough to repair, but I can't seem to diagnose the issue. A couple days ago I had an outlet die on me with a lovely pop of blue smoke. (pluged into it was a 1/8 HP motor running at the time, and this outlet has solely been used to power that outlet for about 4 winters now as it's attached to my fireplace insert). I thought no biggie, I'll replace it.

Well, it turns out that when it blew, it took literally 50% of the electrical outlets, lights and ceiling fans with it. Again no biggie, I'll go replace the fuse and reset any circuit breakers that popped.

Now here is the problem. The entire branch that's affected ISN'T attached to a fuse or breaker as far as I can tell. I could go to each outlet in the house and test for voltage, but I have no way of telling if the outlet I'm checking is on that branch or not. I know there's a tool that you can plug into a circuit and it'll tell you roughly where the break is in terms of wire distance, but the name escapes me and I'm not even sure if it would help. There isn't a wiring diagram for the house, and the labels on the ancient fuse box and break box aren't even correct.

Hell the hell do I fix this problem? It's mostly an inconvenience because I no longer have a porch light, living room light or guest bedroom light, but as much of an introvert as I am, I'm not a troglodyte and having only computer monitors for light sources is an eyestrain.

Things I've done:
Checked every fuse and found none dead
Checked every breaker, and all of them are on
Replaced the receptacle that I thought was the issue with a new one (and was horrified to find the ground wire was grounded to the junction, not the receptacle)
Metered a couple circuits I knew were on the same branch due to placement (guessing) and found no voltage.

Things I'm unsure of but willing to test:
Metering every outlet in the house with live current and tagging all the ones that come up dead. Unsure if I find a dead outlet next to a live outlet, does that mean that outlet is the issue or is it a different branch. Would ANY outlet on the branch comeback as having current with the current situation.)
Crawling under the house and looking to see where most of the romex goes and trying to trace the line. A ton of the house has the power lines just under the subfloor going from point A to point B. Since I've been educated in the ways of residential electrical networks I've yet to crawl down there and figure out where everything is going.)

My fear: There might be a junction behind the wall that burned out that I have no way of finding with out tearing out every wall in the house.

Can anybody advise me on what to do? I'm capable enough to do it, and have about 80% of the tools a professional electrician has due to my schooling. I literally can't afford a professional to come out and fix it so I'm pretty much on my own here
I would super extra double/triple check those breakers. Sometimes when they throw, especially older ones, they will open the circuit but the switch will move an imperceptible amount. It's not always obviously flipped all the way in the other direction. You might have to wiggle or toggle each one before you actually notice the one that flipped.

Sagebrush
Feb 26, 2012

My multimeter (Extech EX330) has started loving up. It doesn't read voltages correctly any more, reporting a AAA battery to be 2.5 volts, a 5v AT PSU line to be 8.9v, and just beeping a lot when I try to measure a 12v motorcycle battery. It's not a power issue -- I have replaced the batteries (2xAAA) with brand new ones, sanded the contacts to remove corrosion, and wired the meter directly to a 3.3v power supply (which should be a reasonable voltage to represent 2x fully charged 1.6v AAAs). Both of the fuses are good, too. Same problems every time.

I might just take the opportunity to finally splurge on a Fluke, but what else could I look at to try and fix this one?

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS
Most of the important stuff in a modern multimeter happens all in one chip. If something went wrong in that chip, nothing you can do will fix it.

What you can do is open up the meter and check for shorts, magic smoke residue, and bad solder joints. Anything visibly wrong.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YM--cxT6X3k

A bunch of weird issues in this meter were caused by one bad capacitor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJuvhqfO4Rk

A bad diode is suspected initially, but after four sessions it turns out to be a fault in the main IC. He does work around it, but it’s totally not worth the effort spent.

vermin
Feb 28, 2017

Help, I've turned into a manifestation of mental disorders as viewed through an early 20th century lens sparked by the disparity between man and modern society and I can't get up
I've decided that building my own pinball machine would be a cool project to complete over the next ten years. Gonna try reading Lessons in Electric Circuits and see how far that gets me.

I'm up to Ohm's Law so I'll probably zone out and give up on it in the next few days.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five
Potentially stupid question: Does an electrolytic capacitor used to decouple an IC need a bleeder resistor if everything is running at 5V?

Most of what I've seen is for systems running at high voltage or where there's no parallel IC, which my gut tells me is sufficient to discharge the capacitor when power is disconnected.

Splode
Jun 18, 2013

put some clothes on you little freak
It does not need a bleeder resistor. There's gently caress all energy stored in a cap at 5V. An electrolytic cap for decoupling an IC is an unusual choice, a ceramic cap (usually 100nF) is usually all you need. Is this for a really powerful processor IC or something?

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

I tried using a transparency / UV etch resist thing to make a homemade board the other day and it wound up coming out with a bunch of half-exposed area where the toner let through a little bit of the UV. I knew toner had microscopic holes but I had no idea it was this bad. Anyone have a tip to fix this, or do I need an inkjet, or what?

Aurium
Oct 10, 2010

ate all the Oreos posted:

I tried using a transparency / UV etch resist thing to make a homemade board the other day and it wound up coming out with a bunch of half-exposed area where the toner let through a little bit of the UV. I knew toner had microscopic holes but I had no idea it was this bad. Anyone have a tip to fix this, or do I need an inkjet, or what?

You may just need less uv.

Also, make sure you have contrast as high as you can go.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

Splode posted:

It does not need a bleeder resistor. There's gently caress all energy stored in a cap at 5V. An electrolytic cap for decoupling an IC is an unusual choice, a ceramic cap (usually 100nF) is usually all you need. Is this for a really powerful processor IC or something?

A ceramic cap was insufficient in the prototype. The ICs are 16 channel PWM controllers sinking 20 mA per LED, so each IC's sinking about a third of an amp at times, and I was getting some nasty low-frequency flicker at certain duty cycles. From what I've been able to find, it looks like the solution to that is putting an electrolytic in parallel to the ceramic cap, and the ceramic cap will handle the high frequency noise that would disrupt the IC functioning while the electrolytic will help with what I assume are current availability issues. The visible flicker was decreased with shorter cable lengths (which would have less line loss) so I'm hoping the caps will fix the problem and I can go back to slightly longer cables.

ante
Apr 9, 2005

SUNSHINE AND RAINBOWS

ate all the Oreos posted:

I tried using a transparency / UV etch resist thing to make a homemade board the other day and it wound up coming out with a bunch of half-exposed area where the toner let through a little bit of the UV. I knew toner had microscopic holes but I had no idea it was this bad. Anyone have a tip to fix this, or do I need an inkjet, or what?

Usually you stack a couple sheets of transparencies on top of each other to make sure there are no holes.

Splode
Jun 18, 2013

put some clothes on you little freak

poeticoddity posted:

A ceramic cap was insufficient in the prototype. The ICs are 16 channel PWM controllers sinking 20 mA per LED, so each IC's sinking about a third of an amp at times, and I was getting some nasty low-frequency flicker at certain duty cycles. From what I've been able to find, it looks like the solution to that is putting an electrolytic in parallel to the ceramic cap, and the ceramic cap will handle the high frequency noise that would disrupt the IC functioning while the electrolytic will help with what I assume are current availability issues. The visible flicker was decreased with shorter cable lengths (which would have less line loss) so I'm hoping the caps will fix the problem and I can go back to slightly longer cables.

Righto, fair enough. You still shouldn't need a bleeder resistor though, even if you need a decent array of decoupling caps. Bleeder resistors are only really necessary for higher voltages that can hurt people.

KnifeWrench
May 25, 2007

Practical and safe.

Bleak Gremlin

poeticoddity posted:

Potentially stupid question: Does an electrolytic capacitor used to decouple an IC need a bleeder resistor if everything is running at 5V?

Most of what I've seen is for systems running at high voltage or where there's no parallel IC, which my gut tells me is sufficient to discharge the capacitor when power is disconnected.

I have a co-worker who swears by bleeders on everything, as a way to make sure upstream power control circuitry can reliably hard-boot the microcontrollers (I.e. if a short pulse turns off power, the capacitance won't keep the MCU alive). If that's not something you need, you're fine, and he's probably paranoid anyway.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

Splode posted:

Righto, fair enough. You still shouldn't need a bleeder resistor though, even if you need a decent array of decoupling caps. Bleeder resistors are only really necessary for higher voltages that can hurt people.

I assumed that the IC will end up bleeding off whatever little bit of charge is present, but I wanted to check. This is a laboratory instrument where the board can't be enclosed, so I figured I'd check.

KnifeWrench posted:

I have a co-worker who swears by bleeders on everything, as a way to make sure upstream power control circuitry can reliably hard-boot the microcontrollers (I.e. if a short pulse turns off power, the capacitance won't keep the MCU alive). If that's not something you need, you're fine, and he's probably paranoid anyway.

My ICs are controlled by an Arduino which gets serial reset, and this is a lab instrument where it'll be very obvious if it didn't work correctly, so I don't think that's a problem here, but I'll keep that in mind for future projects.

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

So I just tried out this geiger tube, first one I've used with a clear mica window, and I think I may have been giving it far too much voltage because it was, uh, glowing. Not constantly, but when I'd hold my little vial of uranium over it it would very dimly flicker in different areas, like an almost-but-not-quite lit neon. The oscilloscope showed normal-looking peaks like any other tube so it seems like it's behaving correctly but I'm worried that I'm going to burn it out or something. Is it supposed to do this?

Sagebrush
Feb 26, 2012

I don't know about Geiger-Muller tubes specifically, but it's common for vacuum tubes to glow gently when they're powered up (gotta get that thermionic emission going) and it's usually harmless.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Are you running it at the rated voltage? If you are then you're probably seeing ionization from the avalanche discharges that happen following an interaction inside the tube and it's probably okay. I've never seen or heard about visible discharges because the radiation given off by the ionization is into the UV end of the spectrum but depending on the gas mix I guess it could be visible.

If you don't know what the rated voltage is and you have a variable supply and a way to measure the count rate you can figure it out pretty easily. Put a source near the tube and starting at 0 volts increase the voltage until you start seeing counts. Taking note of the count rate start increasing the voltage in steps of 25 or 50 volts at a time and you should see a count rate versus voltage relationship like this:


(ignore the numbers on the axes because they will be different for any given tube)

Once you figure out where the plateau is you want to operate the tube at about 1/3 to 1/2 of the way between its start and end voltages.

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

BattleMaster posted:

Are you running it at the rated voltage? If you are then you're probably seeing ionization from the avalanche discharges that happen following an interaction inside the tube and it's probably okay. I've never seen or heard about visible discharges because the radiation given off by the ionization is into the UV end of the spectrum but depending on the gas mix I guess it could be visible.

If you don't know what the rated voltage is and you have a variable supply and a way to measure the count rate you can figure it out pretty easily. Put a source near the tube and starting at 0 volts increase the voltage until you start seeing counts. Taking note of the count rate start increasing the voltage in steps of 25 or 50 volts at a time and you should see a count rate versus voltage relationship like this:


(ignore the numbers on the axes because they will be different for any given tube)

Once you figure out where the plateau is you want to operate the tube at about 1/3 to 1/2 of the way between its start and end voltages.

The voltage it's supposed to run at is 400V but my lovely makeshift circuitry is putting out a lot of ripple that seems to be rippling from 370V to 500V at its worst. Honestly the glow really does look like a dim neon that's just barely powered up enough to flicker, it's a faint reddish orange color. It's weird though because I'm definitely not far enough north that I get a continuous reading on the output, there's still very clear, well-defined spikes, the dead time seems to be about 10 microseconds and there's no DC as far as I can tell.

It's an old soviet SBT-11A which doesn't have too much info available online but these two sites have some basics:
http://www.sovtube.com/x-ray-and-geiger-tubes/610-sbt-11.html
http://www.terranimpact.com/site/radiation/detector_specs/SBT-11A/SBT-11A-detector-specs.php


e: So to be clear, it's safe to run it up to the point where it outputs continuously for a brief period of time just to establish where its limits are? I was really worried I'd get some spalling or something that would ruin it.

Shame Boy fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Mar 5, 2017

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

ate all the Oreos posted:

e: So to be clear, it's safe to run it up to the point where it outputs continuously for a brief period of time just to establish where its limits are? I was really worried I'd get some spalling or something that would ruin it.

Yeah you mainly just stop when the count rate suddenly jumps after you step the voltage up, you don't go deep enough into the continuous discharge region to get arcing or whatever that can damage the tube. This is such a standard calibration procedure that they even taught us how to do it as students and let us do it on real (expensive) equipment without issue.

I just went and ran some old soviet end window tube I had (forgot the model) that operates at a very high voltage of around 2500 volts or so with my polonium-210 disc source and I wasn't seeing any visible glowing or arcing. It's not something that should be expected either. With the information you added either the voltage spikes are too high for the tube or maybe you're letting too much current flow through it. What does your circuit and component values look like?

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Mar 5, 2017

huhu
Feb 24, 2006
Does anyone have experience seeking out a cheap-ish PCB manufacturer that's RoHS compliant? I currently have 10cm*10cm boards that I'm getting made for ~$2 each but they can't guarantee it's RoHS compliant so now I'm looking elsewhere.

JawnV6
Jul 4, 2004

So hot ...
http://pcbshopper.com ?

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013

⚡POWER⚡

huhu posted:

Does anyone have experience seeking out a cheap-ish PCB manufacturer that's RoHS compliant? I currently have 10cm*10cm boards that I'm getting made for ~$2 each but they can't guarantee it's RoHS compliant so now I'm looking elsewhere.

WHy do you want it to be RoHS compliant?

UberVexer
Jan 5, 2006

I like trains

CarForumPoster posted:

WHy do you want it to be RoHS compliant?

PRobably to ship it to other countries.

I'm pretty sure that SeeedStudio is RoHS compliant with their lead free finishes, but I've asked them to confirm.

UberVexer fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Mar 7, 2017

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Zero VGS
Aug 16, 2002
ASK ME ABOUT HOW HUMAN LIVES THAT MADE VIDEO GAME CONTROLLERS ARE WORTH MORE
Lipstick Apathy
Has anyone used one of these analog voltmeters before? Was thinking of installing one in my EV:

https://www.amazon.com/Baomain-Analog-Voltmeter-0-500V-Rectangle/dp/B01HM2G4J4/

I was wondering a couple things:

- It only uses 2 terminals right? Negative and Positive, nothing else?

- How many watts does it use when on? If it's just a watt or two I'll probably have it on 24/7

- Is it sensitive to movement? i.e. would driving my vehicle make the needle waver all over the place or does it tend to stay in place?

- If I put some very low amp fuses on this at it's own terminals and the terminals where it connects to the battery pack, that should keep things safe, right?

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