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Trin Tragula posted:Not to mention that, even if Cassandra is actually cheating (if he is, which I don't believe for a moment, he's also an exceptional liar and rationaliser), cheating's no good at all if nobody else actually listens to the intelligence you've gained... No point in stealing intel if no one does anything with it. wedgekree posted:Sooo, the French plan is to try and do a night attack into the town that is thier main objective and the German trenches where the Germans are setting up thier artillery and MG's to get a nice crossfire? Well... it is dark...
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Mar 3, 2017 20:52
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| # ? May 9, 2024 23:32 |
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And that is what happens when Calvary charges into a prepared gun line with machine-guns.
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Mar 3, 2017 23:37
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It is now 1am. Germans French Look at that morale bounce on the German side! As I see it: if both sides move forces, the French have a decent chance of pulling this back to at least a stalemate; if only one side moves forces, the Germans probably win more than they are doing at the moment. And now, the action replay. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4NJc7oT-jQ Turn 31  Turn 32  Turn 35  Turn 36  Turn 37  Again, please note that that wire isn't actually there until after Turn 38 ends. edit: the way to win, if there is one, is surely for the French to circle round behind the enemy under cover of darkness and then charge their artillery from behind, but I doubt they have time/will think of it. Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Mar 3, 2017 |
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Mar 3, 2017 23:41
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I'm guessing with Cryodude's HQ gone there's no way for the Germans to directly command those remaining survivors huddling in the dark outside Q-Pots...is there a chance some enterprising Oberst among their ranks decides to take the initiative and see if the Allies have truly left the area?
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Mar 3, 2017 23:59
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The only way those units can be given orders is if another BHQ comes within 8 inches of a leaderless chit, it can attempt to press them into service with its brigade (as happened with the French 97th after the first attack on St C, and the German 77th after the disaster on Dejeuner).
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Mar 4, 2017 00:12
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So if Mon Pere is dead, is My Dad the player disqualified from giving orders? 
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Mar 4, 2017 00:59
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Green Intern posted:So if Mon Pere is dead, is My Dad the player disqualified from giving orders? Yes. Hi guys. Feel free to ask any questions.
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Mar 4, 2017 02:41
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my dad posted:Yes. Hi guys. Feel free to ask any questions. Was it worth personally entering the fray?
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Mar 4, 2017 02:53
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my dad posted:Yes. Hi guys. Feel free to ask any questions. Welcome to the first of many French officers that the legend of Xthetenth is going to get killed.
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Mar 4, 2017 03:04
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Lazyfire posted:Was it worth personally entering the fray? In the gameplay sense? Of course not. It was a straight up malus to our team without a single benefit as result of it. But I hope it provided some entertainment for everyone. After all, I was both a player and a public performer.  Besides, I never liked how most of the lovely generals who sent entire towns to die in the meatgrinder never faced danger themselves, and I figured at least one should put the money where the mouth is and take an actual, almost certainly lethal risk. If you're asking about the final charge, I had a dim hope that the enemy was doing some pointless busywork reorganizing themselves in the middle of the night, and that it might give me a chance to do something other than just being vaporized by concentrated firepower. Notahippie posted:Welcome to the first of many French officers that the legend of Xthetenth is going to get killed. I actually drew the orders before xthetenth's charge, although I didn't post them in the thread until they became relevant. You could have seen Trin's cryptic comment in roll20 about someone's thunder being stolen before the turn result was posted. This is what it was about. e: Well, minor correction. I planned the orders. I expected the deployment to be near la Crepe, and had to make adjustments when Trin posted the deployment zone on roll20. my dad fucked around with this message at 03:12 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 03:06
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my dad posted:Yes. Hi guys. Feel free to ask any questions. Since death has freed you from the confines of time and space, what do you think was your biggest missed opportunity in the battle?
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Mar 4, 2017 03:09
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Terrifying Effigies posted:Since death has freed you from the confines of time and space, what do you think was your biggest missed opportunity in the battle? None, really, considering the fog of war and the uncertainties of the scenario. Not counting the initial brigadier lazyness in setting up basic alternative orders in case things don't go as planned, there's a lot of things we could have done better in small ways, but nothing that stand out too much. Had we known everything you guys did? Of course. There's probably a perfect set of orders that wins us the game within the first 12 turns or so via casualties, or just having the cavalry swing around to our main objective while the rest of the army digs in in just the right places. Still, looking at the full scenario, it was a German game to lose rather than a French game to win, and unfortunately for us, the German team only shot themselves in the foot, followed by shooting themselves in the dick, rather than straight up comitting suicide. I'm absolutely proud of my team for what they did and how they worked together, and would feel confident in any team position if it involved working with them again. (late edit: Well, on account that they'd all actually follow orders this time, instead of the commander needing to explain later that yes, this order you disobeyed was important, and no, you can't go back and change it, that ship has sailed) I feel a bit lovely for loving them up with my insane personal charge, but again, looks like it didn't really change anything. Flanking the Germans right now is a pipe dream if you aren't reading the German thread and don't have a way of knowing what they intend to do with their brigades. I'm glancing over the German thread, and I have to give my props to Hey Gail for the general sense of chivalry. Would gladly get killed by your pixelmans again in another game. As an aside, I'm sort of weirded out by all you guys saying that we weren't aware of the German team taking Quatreprouts. We figured what was about to happen when the Germans attacked the hill. We just didn't worry about it too much, because what exactly could we do to stop it? It's not like DOOOM AND GLOOOM would have helped us. We instead planned to retake it, and did so successfully. Sucks that we didn't fully understand the nature of the objectives, but c'est la guerre. e: Made an edit, put it at the wrong place, lmao, fixed that my dad fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 03:43
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my dad posted:In the gameplay sense? Of course not. It was a straight up malus to our team without a single benefit as result of it. But I hope it provided some entertainment for everyone. After all, I was both a player and a public performer. Well, you got to have fun with it. I don't really think you were going to be able to change the nature of the game no matter what by the time you got into the fray, but the Charge of the Light Brigade re-enactment was still probably not what you had anticipated here.
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Mar 4, 2017 04:54
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Lazyfire posted:Well, you got to have fun with it. I don't really think you were going to be able to change the nature of the game no matter what by the time you got into the fray, but the Charge of the Light Brigade re-enactment was still probably not what you had anticipated here. No, it was obviously one of the possible outcomes. Even if I had failed to take it into account myself, I had Bacarruda repeatedly telling the likeliest result of charging St. Croissant head on, namely a bunch of dead cavalry. I gambled, and I lost. As simple as that. I just made sure that there's something to make the failure worth it, even if it's outside the game. Much of the decisionmaking process wasn't about certainties, it was about weighing the odds and the risks, making a plan, and hoping for the best. I chewed out my Chief of Staff for constantly assuming that the German team can somehow simultaneously perform several contradictory worst case scenarious for us without making any mistakes in the process. No. You need to leave room in your plans for enemy fuckups and a way for you to try to exploit them. For example, the German team may be able to exploit one of our team's mistakes if they send someone the long way to Quatreprouts, even though the rational thing for us to do is to garrison it. Whether they do so or not is up to them. There seems to be a massive misunderstanding about the nature of our plans here. I understand why this thread makes it, since most of that discussion was on roll20, but it's weird that Trin seems to have missed it completely, considering he was reading it as it was discussed. We had a completely different interpretation of the mission objectives than what they actually were. As given, the scenario is about the massive armies of Germany and France clashing... somewhere, for something. We were sent to seize a critical objective in an important part of the front, as a part of this larger battle. So, on the map, we're told to take and hold Saint Croissant and Faibleimpot, with the information that seizing Faibleimpot will send a messenger who will start a countdown until the main force of the French Army arrives and the battle ends, with the note that the army will be pissed off if we don't actually hold the objective. Putting the above together, our assumption was that taking the objective, getting the runner through and notifying command, and then failing to hold it, was actually worse than never getting to it in the first place. We've told our army to commit a huge force to a place that isn't properly prepared to support their advance, and have hosed up the whole army's effort to win the greater fight. If you want proof, consider Operation Guillotione. Instead of sneaking in a cavalry unit to our main objective as fast as possible, we were setting up an artillery line capable of holding off a desperate final attack by the entire German force. We were going to have the reinforcements set up a killzone, and then take the place with the BEF to ensure that there's almost no chance for Faibleimpot to be taken back by the enemy. When we figured out that the enemy objective was Quatreprouts, we were actually glad that they're making a desperate push for it. Knowing that we had incoming reinforcements, we knew that we'll have enough of a force to recapture it relatively quickly, and that the enemy corps was semi-paralyzed by our forces on Clemenceau. So we'd kick them out, and then send someone to take Faibleimpot since the enemy just wasted most of their force on this attack and voila! The Germans army commits to a place where they not only fail to control the main objective, we're in control of our main objective, and the French army is coming to kick them in the nuts hard. In short, we weren't even playing the same game as the German team. my dad fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 05:22
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So now that you have access to the German thread and Observer thread discussions, what is your impression of the forever ignored CrazyCryoDude? A lot of us here seem baffled that despite being correct over and over again, the rest of his team never listen to him.
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Mar 4, 2017 06:00
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Yeah, if the German attack on Dejeuner had continued instead of pulling back to St. C then your charge would have probably rolled them up straight through the town. Honestly I think both sides have played a good hard-fought game throughout, gotta tip my hat to all involved for keeping it a close game.
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Mar 4, 2017 06:04
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ViggyNash posted:So now that you have access to the German thread and Observer thread discussions, what is your impression of the forever ignored CrazyCryoDude? A lot of us here seem baffled that despite being correct over and over again, the rest of his team never listen to him. I haven't really read the German thread beyond a casual glance. If you're asking me if I think he's cheating, no, I'm assuming that everyone is playing fair, since cheating in a game like this is a ridiculously petty, and ultimately meaningless thing to do, and from what I've seen of him elsewhere, he doesn't seem like that kind of person. I'd like to congratulate on for being so good at guessing our plans that well. If you're asking me what I think about the clusterfuck... Hm... CCD's failure is that of communication. He needs to learn how to present his views without pissing people off too much, it's a rather important skill for working in teams. As for his team, some goddamn growing up is in order for some of them, holy loving poo poo. For a counterpart on our side, I disagreed with some of Loel's ideas, but his assumptions were pretty much constantly on the money, and we learned to pay close attention to them. Jesus Christ, acknowledging that someone on your team is on to something is not supposed to be that hard of an achievement.
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Mar 4, 2017 06:20
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Will you be returning in round 2? Would you be allowed to?
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Mar 4, 2017 07:36
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Flesnolk posted:Will you be returning in round 2? Would you be allowed to? That's up to Trin, although I'd certainly love to. Even with some of the difficulties we had, I really like my team, and would enjoy tackling another challenge with them, as a leader or a subordinate, doesn't matter.Although before that, there's some anvils that I need to drop on Trin's foot with regards to this scenario, and his opinion may change after that. I'll wait for him to show up here before doing that, though.
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Mar 4, 2017 07:39
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For my money, I think giving someone else time to shine would be better. I say we should mix things up with each game. New setups, new strategies. Not that you shouldn't play at all, but maybe not the head honcho. my dad posted:Although before that, there's some anvils that I need to drop on Trin's foot with regards to this scenario, and his opinion may change after that. I'll wait for him to show up here before doing that, though. Is it about the scenario layout orientation being obfuscated? e: Here's a eulogy of sorts for the fallen French leader: Slim Jim Pickens posted:
ViggyNash fucked around with this message at 08:22 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 08:18
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From the observer thread it has been interesting reading and very fun to see how folks plan tactics adn contingencies and I enjoy the perspecitve you add in saying how you handled things!
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Mar 4, 2017 08:41
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I've personally been very impressed by my dad's leadership, and I think it had a massive impact on their success.
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Mar 4, 2017 09:45
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Such as it is, given I'm pretty sure the Germans would have to lose on purpose at this point.
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Mar 4, 2017 15:34
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Since the Germans aren't going to move any time soon, the French just need to find a position from where they can just casually start lobbing bombs until either the Germans move or get splattered. Edit: Cryodude has spoken: Crazycryodude posted:Ok, I've slept on it and think I can be a bit more civil now. ViggyNash fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 16:59
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ViggyNash posted:Since the Germans aren't going to move any time soon, the French just need to find a position from where they can just casually start lobbing bombs until either the Germans move or get splattered. Except the German reinforcements arrive in the morning, instantly winning the game whatever the French do.
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Mar 4, 2017 18:23
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Oh good, I was afraid Team Germany would listen to the person who has been consistently right for once. Glad we avoided that scenario.
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Mar 4, 2017 19:00
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They're going to win instantly when dawn breaks, so they might as well. The funny thing is how the French are planning a morning attack, not knowing it's game over as soon as morning comes.
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Mar 4, 2017 20:30
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the possibility of the scenario ending before the french attack is actually one of slim jim's defenses for his attack plan (and did those orders get sent yet?) in the entente thread:Slim Jim Pickens posted:The boche runner reached St. Croissant some time near 2100. If their battle end timer is also 12 hours, the battle will be over at 0900, before our last attack begins. If they receive on-map reinforcements, we are still in a position to spot them, and that will also cancel the attack, if the brigadiers get those conditional orders. and the germans snuck in the orders to head toward Q before adjudication, i think. both sides might end the scenario with a token force in the objective towns. does that cancel out? presumably both reinforcing armies would be similarly delayed by these speedbumps
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Mar 4, 2017 20:40
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From what I understand, the German runner went out first, meaning German reinforcements will arrive first, meaning German victory. Now that raises the question of why even have the timer and such, instead of the game ending immediately when one side's runner gets to corps command first.
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Mar 4, 2017 20:47
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Ending the battle does not automatically equal a victory. If Mon Pere had pulled off a miracle and ended up in control of St Croissants and Quatreprouts as well as Faibleimpot when the timer expired, the result would almost certainly be no better than a stalemate, and possibly a French victory of some sort, since they would have been in control of their objectives at the end of the battle and the Germans would not be.
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Mar 4, 2017 20:54
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Fair enough. Now to decide what side to join in round two.
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Mar 4, 2017 21:28
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It's now 5am, and it's almost certainly all over bar the shouting. French Germans Instant replay:      [Turn 43 absent, apologies]   edit: just been in Roll20 and it seems almost certain that we have a consensus for knocking the final six turns on the head and proceeding to the end of the battle, update pending Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 22:16
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I can't wait 
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Mar 4, 2017 23:10
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The last six turns have been played. Full analysis in each team's thread: in short, this battle is a minor German victory and there will be another battle here in 1915 on the same map, with the following approximate trench line. French End German End  All threads are now open to all players.Signups for 1914 Part 2: From La Dand to Effyaders, will begin on Monday, with the battle hopefully beginning the Monday after that, 13 March. We're going to need plenty of players, so don't get discouraged if there are already 20 other signups before you. Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 23:36
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Well that was certainly interesting
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Mar 4, 2017 23:39
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Congrats from the peanut gallery to everyone on both sides! Definitely an entertaining and close fought match, here's hoping the same for the next round!
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Mar 4, 2017 23:41
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I think I speak for everybody when I say that despite the nominal outcome, the French certainly played a better game than us, and that we were literally saved by the bell. That being said - suck it, you disgusting frogs!
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Mar 4, 2017 23:41
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Well, that was fun. For the record, the reason for my swing from extreme pessimism to a degree of optimism was finding out that we no longer had to worry about the loss limit. With that still in place, we'd have been attritioned to defeat by any major French attack, or so I assumed. Also, wow. Those failed morale rolls on our part at the beginning really were devastating; I didn't appreciate quite how badly we hurt the French during that exchange.
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Mar 4, 2017 23:43
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 Parisians Celebrating Flags (On the Same Day as the Battle of St. Croissant) Cheers to the Germans for taking their hits and powering through a pretty unfortunate opening deployment. Slim Jim Pickens fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Mar 4, 2017 |
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Mar 4, 2017 23:43
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:
I suppose they're saving the German ones for 1915.
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Mar 4, 2017 23:44
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