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NutritiousSnack posted:I have to say I just caught up on season 2 and it's weird to have a good gundam again that isn't a reboot/remake like Gundam: The Origins Hey, Gundam Build Fighters only ended slightly less than three years ago!
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Mar 8, 2017 03:04
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Ok so anyone got bets on the final episodes fight? 3 way brawl between Mika, McG and Gali?
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Mar 8, 2017 07:11
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c'mon Isurugi I know you were kind of a non-character but that doesn't mean you decide the best way to not get your boss killed is to shove your cockpit in the way. like you're in a burly-rear end muscleman robot with massive shoulders, why not one of those
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Mar 8, 2017 07:48
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I thought they were going to do an amusing/unexpected reversal of that trope like they sometimes do, like McGillis would stab through him in the other direction to hit Galileo, interrupting his self-sacrifice speech. I guess doubling down on it is funny in its own right though
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Mar 8, 2017 09:12
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Gridlocked posted:Ok so anyone got bets on the final episodes fight? That would be less of a three way and more of an extremely violent and short-lived 2v1. There would need to be some major event that breaks Tekkadan from McGillis because despite Orga coming ever so close to escaping the Sunk Cost Fallacy Vortex he got yelled at by Yamagi and now he's once again all in on getting more people killed so that the lives of those who have already died will have meaning. The funny thing is that Tekkadan could probably get out of this entire mess relatively intact if Orga was allowed to drop the King of Mars poo poo by his subordinates. If Tekkadan sent a message on the downlow to Rustal offering to abandon McGillis in exchange for a pardon, Rustal would probably grant it in a nanosecond because that would leave McGillis's already horribly depleted forces minus a battleship and a bunch of AV-equipped mobile suits, including two Gundam Frames. Iok is the only one in Arianhrod who still has a personal beef with Tekkadan and Iok is currently a powerless ornament.
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Mar 8, 2017 13:10
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Kanos posted:That would be less of a three way and more of an extremely violent and short-lived 2v1. There would need to be some major event that breaks Tekkadan from McGillis because despite Orga coming ever so close to escaping the Sunk Cost Fallacy Vortex he got yelled at by Yamagi and now he's once again all in on getting more people killed so that the lives of those who have already died will have meaning. Worried about a Kyujo incident, maybe? Seriously, Tekkadan as Imperial Japan has become an increasingly compelling read to the show.
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Mar 8, 2017 13:26
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Show needs more robo-angels.
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Mar 8, 2017 14:34
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Darth Walrus posted:Worried about a Kyujo incident, maybe? Seriously, Tekkadan as Imperial Japan has become an increasingly compelling read to the show. We actually almost had that happen back in S1 when Mika went crazy on Orga on the train, come to think of it.
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Mar 8, 2017 14:59
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At this point i just hope that Mika goes berserk and kills Rustal and also literally everyone else in his faction before the inevitable bad end.
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Mar 8, 2017 18:54
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Kanos posted:That would be less of a three way and more of an extremely violent and short-lived 2v1. There would need to be some major event that breaks Tekkadan from McGillis because despite Orga coming ever so close to escaping the Sunk Cost Fallacy Vortex he got yelled at by Yamagi and now he's once again all in on getting more people killed so that the lives of those who have already died will have meaning. In this case I can see Iok launching against Tekkadan in his own attempt to give his dead subordinates' sacrifice meaning.
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Mar 8, 2017 19:44
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Midjack posted:In this case I can see Iok launching against Tekkadan in his own attempt to give his dead subordinates' sacrifice meaning. I think Rustal has pretty clearly learned that he can't trust Iok with any latitude whatsoever as evidenced by Iok's place in the battle being "standing uselessly on the bridge with Rustal", so I doubt he'll ever be given enough autonomy to do something like that again.
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Mar 9, 2017 02:01
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Kanos posted:I think Rustal has pretty clearly learned that he can't trust Iok with any latitude whatsoever as evidenced by Iok's place in the battle being "standing uselessly on the bridge with Rustal", so I doubt he'll ever be given enough autonomy to do something like that again. But if Rustal is tragically incapacitated and/or distracted during the final battle, Iok suddenly finds himself the ranking Gjallhorn official with a vendetta!
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Mar 9, 2017 02:22
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Kanos posted:That would be less of a three way and more of an extremely violent and short-lived 2v1. There would need to be some major event that breaks Tekkadan from McGillis because despite Orga coming ever so close to escaping the Sunk Cost Fallacy Vortex he got yelled at by Yamagi and now he's once again all in on getting more people killed so that the lives of those who have already died will have meaning. Tekkadan wouldn't try for a deal with Rustal unless they could get something more than just a pardon and continued existence. Zack's the only one who sees their course as foolish, but he's also the only one who really doesn't have to be there.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:10
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Kuroyama posted:Tekkadan wouldn't try for a deal with Rustal unless they could get something more than just a pardon and continued existence. Zack's the only one who sees their course as foolish, but he's also the only one who really doesn't have to be there. Eh, Tekkadan has had the ability to potentially move on for some time once they really hit it big, but that is also when they swapped from 'we want to survive and be happy" to "KING OF MARS" and that's been a big factor in their problems. They are ambitious (which isn't bad) but are remaining ambitious even when it involves pushing well and beyond the point of breaking.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:14
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Orga forgets that the crown lies heavy on the King, should that eventuality come to pass, he will need to spend more lives to defend his throne.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:20
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Phobophilia posted:Orga forgets that the crown lies heavy on the King, should that eventuality come to pass, he will need to spend more lives to defend his throne. At this point I think all/most of Tekkadan are going to pave the way to Orga's throne with their lives whether he wants them to or not, because the damned bastards believe in him.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:26
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Phobophilia posted:Orga forgets that the crown lies heavy on the King, should that eventuality come to pass, he will need to spend more lives to defend his throne. Orga very clearly has no idea what "King of Mars" means.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:28
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Me, I'm just wondering whether they actually are going to push hard on those Imperial Japan parallels, with Tekkadan fighting on out of idiot pride well after McGillis's defeat until Orga finally brute-forces through a surrender. Remember, the real-life Iron-Blooded Orphans did not fare well, and we've already had one symbolic kamikaze with Norba's death. It all depends on Kudelia now.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:31
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ImpAtom posted:Eh, Tekkadan has had the ability to potentially move on for some time once they really hit it big, but that is also when they swapped from 'we want to survive and be happy" to "KING OF MARS" and that's been a big factor in their problems. They are ambitious (which isn't bad) but are remaining ambitious even when it involves pushing well and beyond the point of breaking. I don't think you could say that Tekkadan has truly "hit it big". Edmonton was a massive victory, yes, but the situation overall does not allow them to settle down yet. The "King of Mars" path is the only one that has truly been presented to them, of course they are going to clamp on to it.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:38
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Kuroyama posted:I don't think you could say that Tekkadan has truly "hit it big". Edmonton was a massive victory, yes, but the situation overall does not allow them to settle down yet. The "King of Mars" path is the only one that has truly been presented to them, of course they are going to clamp on to it. Being a Teiwaz subdivision with several profitable ventures like the farms and the mines was earning them tons of money. They just gave those up to help McGillis. As Mika said they have money it's the status they don't really have a ton of.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:45
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Orga could play it smart and use Edmonton to grab a bunch of really nice contracts and use that to solidify his and Naze's position within Teiwaz but he decided to go straight to the top and try and gently caress the princess.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:46
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Phobophilia posted:Orga could play it smart and use Edmonton to grab a bunch of really nice contracts and use that to solidify his and Naze's position within Teiwaz but he decided to go straight to the top and try and gently caress the princess. Hell if it was not for their alliance with McGillis their earth branch never would have been messed up. Everything was going well there for a while. Though they really should have managed it better. Maybe send Eugene to run the place instead of having the Chain of Command go Chad > Takaki. (Takaki's main job was being a courier and taking charge of the younger kids he was largely a non combatant. They really should have have sent someone better for command between him and Chad.)
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Mar 9, 2017 04:49
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MonsterEnvy posted:Hell if it was not for their alliance with McGillis their earth branch never would have been messed up. Everything was going well there for a while. The Earth Division got hosed by their Teiwaz rep being a traitor. Eugene would've fallen for the same trick, because the orders seemingly came from Orga.
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Mar 9, 2017 05:04
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Neddy Seagoon posted:The Earth Division got hosed by their Teiwaz rep being a traitor. Eugene would've fallen for the same trick, because the orders seemingly came from Orga. I don't think Eugene would have been quite as gullible. Added on Eugene would have been in charge in the first place. (Plus they were only involved due to the fact they were allied to McGillis.) The biggest issue is that Chad was taken out and Takaki was not suited for leadership. They really should have had someone else there.
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Mar 9, 2017 05:42
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In other news we got more info on Bael including what it can do.  It does not really do anything. It has nothing other then the swords and a pair of canons on its wings. Every other Gundam in this show is way better then it. It is purely a symbol. McGillis had no plan what so ever.
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Mar 9, 2017 06:21
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A tale of two seasons. End of season 1, McGillis felt like a true Char successor. End of season 2 (so far), he's been an absolute joke.
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Mar 9, 2017 06:41
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and the swords aren't even that special, they're the exact same ones he had when he was running around pretending to be Char
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Mar 9, 2017 06:43
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Gyra_Solune posted:and the swords aren't even that special, they're the exact same ones he had when he was running around pretending to be Char It appears he was actually pretending to be Agnika as he uses those swords. Some people still think McGillis has stuff up his sleeves. But honestly I think they are just buying into his silver tongue and charisma like everyone else was on the show for a while.
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Mar 9, 2017 06:46
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Tekkadan would never have been unstoppably wealthy god-kings but they were doing well. Ironically what they needed most of all and have needed for a season is Biscuit. Biscuit was an incredible moderating factor on Orga and if he hadn't gotten ganked he probably would have been able to talk Orga into a plan that didn't involve near-constant insanity and over the top ambition. Instead Orga's been going for ages with the closest thing he has to a voice of reason (that he'll listen to) being... god, I don't know. Eugene?
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Mar 9, 2017 06:55
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MonsterEnvy posted:Being a Teiwaz subdivision with several profitable ventures like the farms and the mines was earning them tons of money. They just gave those up to help McGillis. That's the thing. Tekkadan had the means to live prosperous lives that don't require sending child soldiers out to die, but they weren't sure that someone wouldn't try and gently caress them over. McGillis is the only person who has really offered a path that would end with them being un-gently caress-with-able. I said this earlier Kuroyama posted:Something that could have kept Kudelia in the narrative more would have been making the story more about taking things further from the end of the first season. If I remember, all Kudelia did with her speech then was get a better price for Martian imports. If the story was not stating that only one group can be in power, the second season could have been about getting total independence for Mars. The end would have Makanai and other economic bloc leaders gaining more legislative control of Earth, and Gjallhorn withdrawing its range and ceding powers to become the military force of Earth and the moon. Kudelia and a few others would do the same on Mars, and Tekkadan could be modified to be the start of the Martian military. We could even have McMurdo out at Jupiter wondering if he should legitimize Teiwaz to become the same out there. If Kudelia had come to Orga between seasons and said something along the lines of "My next step is to make Mars an independent state. I want to hire Tekkadan to be my bodyguards until that happens, and then afterwards you will be the seed for the Martian military. But we gotta do something about your child soldier percentage", then maybe Tekkadan wouldn't have sided with McGillis in the hope of becoming "KING OF MARS". But no one except McGillis is explicitly offering a future where Tekkadan's members would be able to live without fear of being taken advantage of.
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Mar 9, 2017 06:57
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Let's be honest, Kudelia is Hillary Clinton, McGillis is Donald Trump, and Tekkadan are "middle-class" (actually poor) Americans. Looking at the situation objectively, from the outside, we all know that Kudelia is the best hope for Tekkadan and others like them. But McGillis was able to sway Tekkadan to his side by promising a ton of bullshit that would only happen at their expense, and Kudelia didn't really present her side in a way that would make Tekkadan wanna side with her anymore.
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Mar 9, 2017 07:05
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Kudelia is Joe Biden because she hasn't offered any alternatives this season.
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Mar 9, 2017 07:12
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i wish there was an alternative to having read that post
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Mar 9, 2017 07:14
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Shinjobi posted:A tale of two seasons. Reminder that McGillis walked into the middle of a battlefield in s2 and almost got merked by Tekkadan.
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Mar 9, 2017 07:32
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MonsterEnvy posted:It appears he was actually pretending to be Agnika as he uses those swords. That's pretty much the whole point of his arc. He's become a parallel for Orga inside Gjallarhorn, in that all his followers sincerely believe he has something up his sleeve and that he'll make the world a better place for them. When in fact he's likely going to see them all die vehemently believing it's for a good cause. McGillis' entire future from childhood was centered on waving Bael in front of the Seven Stars and having them fall into line out of jingositic patriotism, when the way Agnika likely made that work was to step on anyone who disagreed with his Gundam (I assume). He has blown his main plan at least twice over due to Gaelio surviving and outing his past antics, and now he's just trying to fumble a victory out of his rear end.
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Mar 9, 2017 08:04
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I don't see any way for this to happen without some awful asspull, but it'd be neat if Tekkadan and McGillis somehow won in the end, because that would mean that we watched 2 seasons of the origin story for a villain and his elite henchmen.
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Mar 9, 2017 10:32
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I'm fine with Mcgillis plan being naive, since it's established early on that he's obsessed with Bael and the show's been clear that he's while he's smart he's got a simplistic worldview. Also it'd be difficult in his position to reform Gjallajorn since he's one around many. Nice little parallel with both McGillis and Orga trying to rush to their end goal and loving themselves.
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Mar 9, 2017 17:34
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Kuroyama posted:Let's be honest, Kudelia is Hillary Clinton, McGillis is Donald Trump, and Tekkadan are "middle-class" (actually poor) Americans. Looking at the situation objectively, from the outside, we all know that Kudelia is the best hope for Tekkadan and others like them. But McGillis was able to sway Tekkadan to his side by promising a ton of bullshit that would only happen at their expense, and Kudelia didn't really present her side in a way that would make Tekkadan wanna side with her anymore. sir this is a mcdonald's drive thru
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Mar 9, 2017 20:59
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MonsterEnvy posted:In other news we got more info on Bael including what it can do. How often is the first prototype Gundam really just a barebones proof of concept like this hah
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Mar 9, 2017 21:06
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Booourns posted:How often is the first prototype Gundam really just a barebones proof of concept like this hah The RX-0 from 00?
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Mar 9, 2017 21:07
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