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The flex time announcement did roll out today. There's 2 things about it I don't like - "There is no established procedure for requesting time off. Please consult with your manager" - "You may be required to work on your time off if business needs dictate it" Those were 2 of the 37 questions listed on the announcement... there was no mention of what to do if, for example, your manager just straight refuses to give you any time off ever, or if they are just generally a dick about it. My boss is pretty decent and has already made me a pretty generous offer, but I feel weird not having a system to log my request in. I dunno. I remain hopeful, but I have been wrong before
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Mar 9, 2017 01:48
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My Rhythmic Crotch posted:- "You may be required to work on your time off if business needs dictate it" Haha I don't even think that is legal under federal law. That is one of those "engaged to wait" kind of situations.
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Mar 9, 2017 02:19
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The Fool posted:I'm in the US, so the joketruth is that neither is true. I've found it's 3-4 weeks plus 8-10 federal holidays for established companies. Anything less than that and they better be making up for it elsewhere.
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Mar 9, 2017 03:10
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My Rhythmic Crotch posted:The flex time announcement did roll out today. There's 2 things about it I don't like You should have spoke up at step 1. "I will just mail my manager and the head of HR for each request. Now there's a procedure and tracking of it."
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Mar 9, 2017 04:05
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Vulture Culture posted:It's best to always remember that a company's culture is defined by its actions, not its management's words. Truer words were never spoken.
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Mar 9, 2017 07:31
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My Rhythmic Crotch posted:- "You may be required to work on your time off if business needs dictate it" "And YOU may be required to answer a strongly-worded letter by the labor board, or a court summons. JUST SAYIN" j/k I'd never say that I'd just refuse to work if I were taking time off.
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Mar 9, 2017 07:53
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Che Delilas posted:"And YOU may be required to answer a strongly-worded letter by the labor board, or a court summons. JUST SAYIN" Yep. "Sorry, I went camping and turned my phone off since I had no way to charge." At that point they can either deal with it or fire me.
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Mar 9, 2017 15:11
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Blue Footed Booby posted:Yep. "Sorry, I went camping and turned my phone off since I had no way to charge." At that point they can either deal with it or fire me. But the server had an error message about our dick counting widget! The most important dick counting time in the calendar year!
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Mar 9, 2017 15:21
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I've had unlimited sick days at this job and my previous job, and was literally never questioned about it. This job has unlimited vacation, and I've literally never been questioned about it. I've seen a couple of low-level employees take a month of vacation in a year, sometimes three weeks at once People get (jokingly) yelled at if they show up on slack during their vacations. So I guess what I'm trying to say is... 
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Mar 9, 2017 15:40
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revmoo posted:Haha I don't even think that is legal under federal law. That is one of those "engaged to wait" kind of situations.
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Mar 9, 2017 16:38
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My Rhythmic Crotch posted:I'd love to see the statute if you know more about this. I was under the impression that companies basically can do whatever the gently caress they want since vacation is not mandated by law.
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Mar 9, 2017 19:24
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darthbob88 posted:From this I'd guess it's something about your not being completely relieved from duty, since the company still considers you available to work as needed. That only matters for non-exempt employees. It's saying that if your office tells you to stand by in case of emergencies for the next 80 hours, then you are working for those hours (even if nothing happens). If that triggers OT, you get OT. However, if you're an exempt salaried employee (you are) then the fact that DoL considers you to have worked 80 hours doesn't mean anything because you are exempt from OT. There's no maximum amount that your employer can force you to work.
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Mar 9, 2017 20:08
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darthbob88 posted:From this I'd guess it's something about your not being completely relieved from duty, since the company still considers you available to work as needed. Obviously software development is a bit different, but I just make sure those things are explicit in contracts ...
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Mar 9, 2017 20:14
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As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo?
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Mar 9, 2017 20:20
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Mniot posted:That only matters for non-exempt employees. It's saying that if your office tells you to stand by in case of emergencies for the next 80 hours, then you are working for those hours (even if nothing happens). If that triggers OT, you get OT. However, if you're an exempt salaried employee (you are) then the fact that DoL considers you to have worked 80 hours doesn't mean anything because you are exempt from OT. There's no maximum amount that your employer can force you to work. I know a radtech who used to be on-call for a hospital. She got paid a small amount per hour just to carry a pager, and a got overtime every time the pager went off, rounded up to one hour increments. Whereas I, as an exempt programmer, carried a pager for years that rang off the hook with false-positives, and I didn't even get a pat on the back at my annual reviews for it.
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Mar 9, 2017 20:23
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? Obviously it's because we're better than you and working to death is a privilege and a right.
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Mar 9, 2017 20:23
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? you're right, let me just take all my things and move over to england. wow that was easy
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Mar 9, 2017 20:28
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? "I'll be a multimillionaire aaaany day now" - 
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Mar 9, 2017 21:00
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Munkeymon posted:"I'll be a multimillionaire aaaany day now" -
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Mar 9, 2017 21:05
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? Simple. "I" don't. That's the point of most of my posts in this thread. Don't put up with that poo poo and push back. If you get fired you'll have a better job tomorrow. If you don't you've improved the company culture.
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Mar 9, 2017 21:05
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Hughlander posted:If you get fired you'll have a better job tomorrow. While that is likely true for most people in this thread, it's definitely not true for a large number of the population as a whole.
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Mar 9, 2017 21:09
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Polio Vax Scene posted:you're right, let me just take all my things and move over to england. wow that was easy I laughed at this, but I don't think it's what Xarn was suggesting.
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Mar 9, 2017 21:16
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The Fool posted:While that is likely true for most people in this thread, it's definitely not true for a large number of the population as a whole. Right, which is the actual answer to the question: unconscionable treatment of workers is so thoroughly normalized in America, sometimes even professionals who are highly in demand at the moment will expect and accept unfavorable terms. The micro solution is to use whatever leverage you have to demand more, and to help others demand more. The macro solution is to build a new generation of labor institutions.
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Mar 9, 2017 21:20
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As another European: stop voting for idiots if you really want that. But thanks for the western culture I guess?
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Mar 9, 2017 21:32
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I'd argue that the *real* answer is that labor economics is a complex (and fun) topic. Saying that it's as simple as "government guaranteed benefits is better" is ignoring a lot of that complexity.
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Mar 9, 2017 22:00
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? There is a growing leftist/socialist movement here at least, so expect the Jacobin to hit sometime soon. 
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Mar 9, 2017 22:01
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Hughlander posted:If you get fired you'll have a better job tomorrow. That must be nice. After I got laid off from my last job due to my team being downsized I was unemployed for a bit over 3 months, Which no real savings and a wife who can't work made rather difficult.
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Mar 9, 2017 22:04
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? The USA has a higher material standard of living than Europe. This includes metrics like poor USA households' dwelling size being bigger than average Europeans', whether you have laundry machines or a dishwasher, average number of unexploded bombs buried underneath your backyard, etc. How do Europeans put up with their poo poo?
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Mar 9, 2017 22:44
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State provided health care, reasonable social safety net, 37 hour work week, five weeks paid leave as standard?
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Mar 9, 2017 23:01
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Sure you're one hospital visit from being homeless, but have you considered that that home you'll be kicked out of contains cheap appliances?!
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Mar 9, 2017 23:01
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sarehu posted:The USA has a higher material standard of living than Europe. This includes metrics like poor USA households' dwelling size being bigger than average Europeans', whether you have laundry machines or a dishwasher, average number of unexploded bombs buried underneath your backyard, etc. How do Europeans put up with their poo poo? We are smugly secure in not getting bankrupted by a hospital visit.  Real talk: If you are a skilled professional in a high demand field (which you probably are, if you post here), then you are in a strong bargaining position and should use it to improve working conditions of you and your peers. This might, or might not, include collective action. For some reason though, americans seem to be strongly opposed to actually doing so, and what is really sad, my peers here are catching the same FYGMish attitude -- "why should they pay taxes, when they aren't using unemployment benefits?" they ask, as they graduate completely debt free (in fact, state was helping them pay for housing), use local infrastructure and free healthcare...
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Mar 9, 2017 23:11
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What would be fair is for everybody to pay the same amount of taxes. If we want to better society through taxation a good start would be to tax dynamic typing.
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Mar 10, 2017 00:22
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? For a lot of people there just isn't a choice. This is true the further down the economic ladder you go. The poor literally can't afford to rock the boat without worrying about getting tossed off. Granted I'm also doing to repeat "I don't" in a "we" sense. There have been a lot of economic protests over the past few years for things like a $15 minimum wage and things circulating Facebook about how hosed things have gotten. The middle class is shrinking and those left are feeling the pinch enough that they're getting antsy. The other side of it is a lot of people don't put up with it by doing their job really half-assed. It just so happens that if you pay people starvation wages with no benefits they give zero shits about their job and are highly unlikely to bother doing it well. It doesn't reach to programmers all that much because there's such a shortage of them. Yeah you get some horror stories but programmers that are competent are not likely to get stuck enough. If you're above junior you'll have recruiters bothering you anyway and you can just "lol nah" to a place that is obviously trying to dick you over. If you do land at a lovely place it won't take long to get out of it, especially in tech hubs. That being said yes, America's labor laws are god awful.
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Mar 10, 2017 00:39
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Xarn posted:As an european, work rights in USA chat always amuses me... How do you put up with this poo poo? To complement the other posts: Here it's not about how much work you can get done, but how much it appears you've suffered in the process. This applies whether you're a construction worker or a financial analyst. Over 2/3's of the USA's GDP is services, so the only thing that keeps the American narrative going at this point is the plight of the wretched laborer.
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Mar 10, 2017 00:43
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Hey, I got told to post in this thread instead of the projects thread I've been working on a weird dealio for predicting how long github issues will take (like a super small version of COCOMO, but not a giant piece of poo poo and with no human input). Weirdly complicated as a machine learning dealio. It's not incredible but it's not bad either, and I've been wondering if it was better than humans. Would any of you be up for a small head-to-head to see if you're better than the machine? PM me if interested, or hlee.howon at the google mail service if you don't have pms
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Mar 10, 2017 00:50
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sarehu posted:What would be fair is for everybody to pay the same amount of taxes. Yeah, the Social Security contribution cap, Javascript and 10% capital gains tax are all pretty lovely.
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Mar 10, 2017 03:22
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curufinor posted:Hey, I got told to post in this thread instead of the projects thread Issues? On GitHub? Infinite time. Where do I collect my paycheck?
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Mar 10, 2017 14:12
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curufinor posted:Hey, I got told to post in this thread instead of the projects thread
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Mar 10, 2017 16:15
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Vulture Culture posted:My instinct is that you've created a tool that will allow terrible managers to make even worse decisions So the next great silicon valley startup?
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Mar 10, 2017 16:22
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Well, if you look at how people used COCOMO, they typically expand a lot of underestimates by 2x or more, despite the objective accuracy still being poo poo (within 25% range for 80% of things), so it may also be a viable tool to tell manager to go gently caress off for 4 days instead of 1
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Mar 10, 2017 16:23
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