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Well to be fair, how many minority groups have actually gotten reparations, apologies, or hell even just a few convictions of the people who were in charge of the atrocities committed against those minorities?
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Mar 12, 2017 02:54
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coyo7e posted:Well to be fair, how many minority groups have actually gotten reparations, apologies, or hell even just a few convictions of the people who were in charge of the atrocities committed against those minorities? Most of the time they're lucky if it's even acknowledged. Off the top of my head all I can think of is the Nuremberg trials. I think the UK apologized for their treatment of India, but only like, within the last few years.
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Mar 12, 2017 03:44
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Yeah that was my point. To my awareness the Jews are the only group who EVER got anything back in anything resembling a satisfactory level. And three generations later they are turning into that which they most feared. I mean holy gently caress, watch "The Act of Killing" if you want to know how it has been in pretty much every other instance of genocide and war atrocities, well, for all of history.
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Mar 12, 2017 04:49
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coyo7e posted:To my awareness the Jews are the only group who EVER got anything back in anything resembling a satisfactory level. And three generations later they are turning into that which they most feared. 
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Mar 12, 2017 05:00
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empty baggie posted:From the way his face looked during that interview, it seems that John may have gotten a bit sunburned on the walk to see the Dalai Lama. He's British, he's lucky if he doesn't burst into flame in NYC on a cool midsummer's day.
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Mar 12, 2017 05:04
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He's right though? Read much on I&P?
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Mar 12, 2017 22:24
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Yeah, I honestly struggled making that initial post for like three iterations because, no matter how I carved it up, there is one very fortunate son in what seems to be all of the history of atrocities that I'm aware of. I'm not saying that anyone profited by being Jewish and surviving the loving nazis but seriously, three generations later and their grandchildren are totally stoked to admit that "all palestinians must die" to reporters. And settlements I mean come on. I know an older palestinian woman who keeps trying to put up a pro-BDS table at the local hippy saturday faire, and a group of big jewish dudes ALWAYS show up within an hour or two, surround her table with israeli flags (like, you cannot even see her table), and call her an anti-semite. I mean that's not the tactics of the oppressed being enacted for the betterment of everyone, intimidating an old lady handing out pamphlets about lifting sanctions on stuff going into Palestine. I mean "concrete" is one of the things you cannot import, and I'm sorry but without concrete, people are going to basically be forced to live in third-world conditions. coyo7e fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Mar 12, 2017 |
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Mar 12, 2017 22:56
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Die Sexmonster! posted:He's right though? Read much on I&P? It is a subject that any answer is the equivalent of stepping on a landmine that trips off several other landmines that also have landmines built inside of them
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Mar 13, 2017 01:04
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Servaetes posted:It is a subject that any answer is the equivalent of stepping on a landmine that trips off several other landmines that also have landmines built inside of them So essentially the Palestinian Experience.
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Mar 13, 2017 01:08
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Oh Snapple! posted:So essentially the Palestinian Experience. too real
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Mar 13, 2017 01:10
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Oh Snapple! posted:So essentially the Palestinian Experience. 
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Mar 13, 2017 01:15
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Die Sexmonster! posted:He's right though? Read much on I&P? "Jews" and "Israelis" aren't the same exact thing. And even then there's a difference between I&P and people centuries ago blaming the plague on Jews because they didn't die in massive enough numbers to satisfy people. And besides, both sides are right to be scared as gently caress of our current assholes ascendant, who hate both of them because that means base voters.
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Mar 13, 2017 01:49
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The exploding Samsungs have me in stitches.
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Mar 13, 2017 04:13
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Was the voiceover in the Samsung commercial Justin Roiland from Rick and Morty?
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Mar 13, 2017 04:33
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lifts cats over head posted:Was the voiceover in the Samsung commercial Justin Roiland from Rick and Morty? No, it was Rob Cordry.
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Mar 13, 2017 05:42
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I loving loved this episode. TAKE IT DOWN. Better.
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Mar 13, 2017 09:15
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Okay the newswoman from the weeping angel clip was on-point, and the best they could come up with is "john wanks a lot and she'd sounds cray-cray on another day." Nice. "She should deliver all of the news" - and Oliver should stop taking cheap misogynist shots when there are larger issues at play. I mean the carpenter thing was so out of date I was like "wait, what? Haven't you seen one of those videos about japanese woodcutters and their crazy dovetail joints? seriously? I couldn't be that expensive to insert one of those videos instead of a loving dollhouse" coyo7e fucked around with this message at 10:23 on Mar 13, 2017 |
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Mar 13, 2017 10:20
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coyo7e posted:Well to be fair, how many minority groups have actually gotten reparations, apologies, or hell even just a few convictions of the people who were in charge of the atrocities committed against those minorities? Not that it's substantive or particularly meaningful, but Australia and Canada have both formally apologized for "stolen generation" / "forced adoption" policies those countries enacted against Aboriginal Australian and First Nations communities (100 years too late, clearly.) I'm not aware of any reparations or actual, meaningful action that's resulted from those statements, but it's an answer to your question.
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Mar 13, 2017 12:38
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coyo7e posted:Well to be fair, how many minority groups have actually gotten reparations, apologies, or hell even just a few convictions of the people who were in charge of the atrocities committed against those minorities? Well. I mean, define minority group. I've heard argument over there being such a thing as an ethnic Jew at all. But hey, if you mean religious minority, historically the Christians have done remarkably well since their humble beginnings in the Roman empire. My point being that the whole conversation is so sticky (as previously mentioned) that it should probably just be avoided outside of D&D entirely.
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Mar 13, 2017 13:21
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hah, oh yeah, the whole thing is erroneous anyways since israel is still a proxy state of the US.  e: woka waka
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Mar 13, 2017 13:25
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You get that... right? Right? Right?
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Mar 13, 2017 15:03
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coyo7e posted:Well to be fair, how many minority groups have actually gotten reparations, apologies, or hell even just a few convictions of the people who were in charge of the atrocities committed against those minorities? you are actually doubling down on this
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Mar 13, 2017 15:06
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coyo7e posted:Yeah that was my point. To my awareness the Jews are the only group who EVER got anything back in anything resembling a satisfactory level. And three generations later they are turning into that which they most feared. Japanese Americans received reparations of something like $1.5 billion for the WWII internment camps atrocity. Now whether you think that's really enough or money can make up for what was done or if taking 50 years to do anything is ok is another story, but it's certainly an example. Probably one of very few as it's such a comparatively small group, so making amends isn't as costly as doing so for, say, slavery.
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Mar 13, 2017 15:12
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Okay, let's say for a moment you are totally correct. What's your point or the usefulness of that little nugget of information? Example: Climate is changing for the worse -> We should acknowledge this in our policymaking and planning Coyote: The jews are privileged -> __________ e: If we are yo fill in the blank with "Grant Palestinian land and rights more firmly" or some other solution that helps Palestinian interests, that in itself is possibly good. Focusing on jewish privilege or whatever term you're fishing for to arrive at Palestinian needs is needlessly roundabout. Drawing comparisons between how different groups live now has nothing to do with how they got there if the true goal of discourse and political action is equality and justice for all. It is not expedient to invite the kind of pitfalls that come with saying, "Well, the Jews had their chance, just look at all the reparations they got." Palestine is in a poo poo place, its people are in a poo poo place. If we truly value all people equally, that's the bottom line right there and all that is needed to justify modification of our foreign policy. There is nothing served by mixing in ancillary messages that so easily and often are hijacked by antisemitic coding. e2 vvvvvvvvvvvv exactly my brainwave here. We run the risk of getting distracted by messages of destruction if we build arguments on the wrong foundations Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 15:29 on Mar 13, 2017 |
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Mar 13, 2017 15:17
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Potato Salad posted:Okay, let's say for a moment you are totally correct. What's your point or the usefulness of that little nugget of information? Jews must be put back in their place. WAIT poo poo NO THAT WASN'T MEANT TO BE OUT LOUD
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Mar 13, 2017 15:26
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Yknow when I mentioned the it probably should have just let it be left with that
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Mar 13, 2017 15:42
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(ignores everything above) So anyways, John Oliver brought up Samsung's past problems, and didn't even mention its mess with South Korea's president. Also, it's kind of telling (and flat out encouraging if you're rooting against Donald) that Trump has deferred so much to Paul Ryan and congressional republicans with health care. Months ago, I thought Trump would do more lip service when it comes to pivoting against GOP orthodoxy on welfare before capitulating to it. But that capitulation to Paul Ryan happened much quicker than I imagined. I've been thinking a lot about the "regime" model of understanding the history of the presidency, and I'm kind of hoping Trump ends up being a disjunctive president. If the GOP's confusion with health care holds (though there's still a good chance it won't), it'd be a clear sign that Republicans are still a mess even though they're in power all across the country.
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Mar 13, 2017 16:32
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Well their problem is that they put themselves in this mess, because "who would have thought healthcare would be complicated?!" To lower people's premiums you need to do one of two things, subsidize healthcare costs in some way (the sane way is single payer, the unsustainable dumb way is the mandate), or cut costs but not covering sick and poor people. As republicans, the former is anathema, and as it turns out, taking away healthcare makes people angry. So it's pretty much what was predicted 7 years ago. People will come to like obamacare once they have healthcare and it becomes a real shitshow for republicans now that they can actually repeal it like they said they wanted to.
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Mar 13, 2017 16:45
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Echo Chamber posted:(ignores everything above) Might be waiting the week for her to actually get arrested. That'll be the coup du grace of that shitshow of a story.
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Mar 13, 2017 17:32
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Anybody else a little peeved about how dismissive John was about the CIA stuff? I mean, he's probably right about it being overblown, but of course we should be wary of CIA overreach. It doesn't have to be a left vs. right issue.
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Mar 13, 2017 19:30
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El Jeffe posted:Anybody else a little peeved about how dismissive John was about the CIA stuff? I mean, he's probably right about it being overblown, but of course we should be wary of CIA overreach. It doesn't have to be a left vs. right issue. It isn't. but he is also right. None of what was leaked is anything you don't want the CIA to be doing, provided they are following the law which, as John correctly points out, prevents them from doing so domestically. It's kind of their job. And if anyone thinks the FSB et al. aren't doing the same they're being awfully naive.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:20
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Yeah, that's essentially it. This is what we are paying the CIA to do and nothing in the leaks point to then using these programs domestically. This is what intelligence does. That said, when it comes to compromising software, the cat is out of the bag now and their techniques could be used by actors that aren't constrained by the law. So that portion of it is troubling.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:30
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Solvent posted:Well. I mean, define minority group. I've heard argument over there being such a thing as an ethnic Jew at all. But hey, if you mean religious minority, historically the Christians have done remarkably well since their humble beginnings in the Roman empire. Abrahamic religions get paid. Everybody else gets hosed.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:33
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IRQ posted:Japanese Americans received reparations of something like $1.5 billion for the WWII internment camps atrocity. Now whether you think that's really enough or money can make up for what was done or if taking 50 years to do anything is ok is another story, but it's certainly an example. Probably one of very few as it's such a comparatively small group, so making amends isn't as costly as doing so for, say, slavery.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:35
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coyo7e posted:You mean the aggressors who bombed pearl Harbor? Yeah not the same thing as being a minority who suffered genocide or pogroms etc Sending a huge group of people off to camps, without bringing charges against them in a court of law, is a huge violation of human rights. That it wasn't AS BAD as loving genocide doesn't make it okay. And honestly some of those camps weren't the paradises the government made them out to be. Japanese Americans also didn't bomb Pearl Harbor.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:42
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coyo7e posted:You mean the aggressors who bombed pearl Harbor? Yeah not the same thing as being a minority who suffered genocide or pogroms etc You can't be serious.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:43
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I know I'm bandwagoning on the coyote the train here but   On the subject of lwt itself, what's HBO's monetization scheme here? I can see all the good 20min segments on Youtube shortly after they air. Ad money?
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Mar 13, 2017 20:56
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Potato Salad posted:I know I'm bandwagoning on the coyote the train here but John himself has said that nobody has been able to adequately explain it to him so it's entirely possible that nobody knows. For some reason the latest season videos on YouTube are not visible outside the US now, which wasn't the case for previous seasons.
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Mar 13, 2017 21:08
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notthegoatseguy posted:Japanese Americans also didn't bomb Pearl Harbor. Everyone knows it was the Germans
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Mar 13, 2017 21:17
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Potato Salad posted:On the subject of lwt itself, what's HBO's monetization scheme here? I can see all the good 20min segments on Youtube shortly after they air. Ad money? HBO's finances are based on some kind of voodoo ritual that tells them that a show drives subscriptions. Nobody can figure out their reasoning but it's clearly working.
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Mar 13, 2017 21:22
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