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I have a thread question - In my super brief but unfinished run at BJJ attempt two, I encountered a move I knew nothing about. I asked the coach and he said it came from a visiting black belt who taught it to the gym. But he couldn't think of the name. It was an escaped from full mount and the best anyone could come up with was a, "Forward momentum shift" but it basically resulted in the person in mount getting hurled. Anyone here have any light and videos to shed on this move? Also I omitted something from my broken foot story - I messed up my right ankle, which I drive with. The very first person to volunteer to drive me to my apartment to pick up my pops and take us back to the gym was Hoss McBigguns himself, who I talked to the thread about being a gym rear end in a top hat. I asked him about when we rolled and he said he literally couldn't remember anything. Apparently a few nights a week the higher belts stay after their advanced class to roll in the fundamentals class. He says when he does this he is operating on reflexes and desperation. He was a very nice guy and I was thrilled to be proven wrong. I still didn't appreciate getting knuckle dragged across my lip but understanding why he acted that way makes plenty of sense.
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Mar 13, 2017 01:30
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Captain Log posted:I have a thread question - In my super brief but unfinished run at BJJ attempt two, I encountered a move I knew nothing about. I asked the coach and he said it came from a visiting black belt who taught it to the gym. But he couldn't think of the name. It was an escaped from full mount and the best anyone could come up with was a, "Forward momentum shift" but it basically resulted in the person in mount getting hurled. Anyone here have any light and videos to shed on this move? Be more specific about execution, but I'm not aware of any escape that allows you to just straight up toss someone off of you from full mount if they're competent. Closest I can think of is the double under escape where you slip both arms under one of their legs and do a reverse shrimp towards your feet which ends up them going to either side control if they're aware or you getting top if they're not.
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Mar 13, 2017 04:52
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Double hip lift bump to sneak legs inside their legs?
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Mar 13, 2017 10:25
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Is it the self-defense one (or anti-striking one) against someone in a high posture? You bump your knee up to send them forward get their hands on the mat, and then you entangle their arm and foot on the same time to kill both posts as you bridge? This is loosely similar - the idea is that you get them to come forward, and in the bridge you send them up. The real key is what he's doing with the foot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tK5-HLPZqPw
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Mar 13, 2017 14:57
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Is it just a bridge and roll escape?
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Mar 13, 2017 15:02
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CommonShore posted:Is it the self-defense one (or anti-striking one) against someone in a high posture? You bump your knee up to send them forward get their hands on the mat, and then you entangle their arm and foot on the same time to kill both posts as you bridge? Does this one have a name? I hate explaining it, like yeah the sweep where you trap a leg and same side arm and roll sweep. In regards to the original question, the only one that I've seen that can really throw someone are escapes at the moment someone is about to mount you. The two that can do that I'm aware of, that again don't have standard names would be the escape where you'd use both hands on their hips, with a bridge to make space where you'd usually shrimp out to re-establish guard, which if hit at the exact right moment takes their momentum and can really send them away, and a reversal when they try to go from side control to mount, where you have your hand on their hip in side control, using it to give them a shove as they try to mount, and roll them right off the other side as you come up.
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Mar 13, 2017 19:41
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Dazzleberries posted:Does this one have a name? I hate explaining it, like yeah the sweep where you trap a leg and same side arm and roll sweep. It's literally called the Rickson escape. It's just a modified bridge and roll. I *think* the escape Captain was talking about is where you frame on your opponents hips with your arms, bridge, shove their hips and bring your legs in to recover. But I could be wrong it could literally just be bridge and roll.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:27
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JaySB posted:It's literally called the Rickson escape. It's just a modified bridge and roll. Phone posting so I'll be brief but it's more like the videos posted. I'll try to think how to Jiu Jitsu phrase it when I'm next to a keyboard. One of the gyms two big guys showed it to me and it was a bizarre ah hah moment of, "I gotta learn this."
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Mar 13, 2017 20:32
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It pains me that you had to have a visiting instructor teach one of the most basic mount escapes.
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Mar 13, 2017 20:36
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Alright, I hobbled over to the keyboard. We were in fundamentals and I was drilling with a heavyweight. We were doing mount escapes but transitioning them into different moves. I'm about two bills, so I don't often get tossed without playing along. This dude was able to bridge up and shuck me forward, then hurl me into a bad position. I asked him what that specific move was called after class and he asked the instructor, who said that specific part of the move was taught by a visiting black belt. He couldn't think of a name for it but gave me a lot of phrases I could youtube. I was going to open mats specifically to "figure out" this probably simple move but then my ankle exploded. I know this is a problem with class sizes and making everything accessible to everyone, but jesus it would be better if there was beginner, intermediate, and advanced classes. The fundamental/intermediate classes I have taken at both my old and new gym have been pretty over my head because of the absolute lack of eyesight I have while watching instruction. Because of my MMA/Muay Thai experience I know them terminology, but gently caress if I know how to get from point A to E without loving up B, C, and D a bunch. God I want my leg healed now.
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Mar 13, 2017 21:37
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What are you defining as "hurling you into a bad position"? Where do you end up after he escapes mount and how exactly does he go from mount to having you in a bad position.
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Mar 13, 2017 21:41
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JaySB posted:What are you defining as "hurling you into a bad position"? Where do you end up after he escapes mount and how exactly does he go from mount to having you in a bad position. Got'cha. We ended up (if things went right) face to face with our asses on the mat but the point was to go further from that point to mount. It was like a mount...reversal...thing. Let's see from mount - shoulder shimmy back as far as possible, shrimp a few times, dig elbows towards self and grab opponent's belt, bridge hard enough to lift your opponent in the air with your feet in their hips, then roll yourself and your opponent into a fully reversed position. I couldn't figure out how to make the momentum work and wanted to watch some videos. It was the first time in my life I've thought, "I need to work on my core." Maybe I should google that.
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Mar 13, 2017 21:46
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How do you get your feet to their hips?
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Mar 13, 2017 21:49
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JaySB posted:How do you get your feet to their hips? gently caress me, you zeroed in on the part I couldn't figure out. You were supposed to link together the belt pull, bridge, and shrimp into pulling your feet on their hips in what I think of as sweep position. There was supposed to be a moment of the opponent being totally airborne. (I used to have to practice a lot of sweeps in "MMA Class")
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Mar 13, 2017 21:52
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What you're describing is exactly the mount escape I described before. Minus the belt grab because that anchors your opponent to you. Frame on their hips with your hands, bridge, push on the hips, bring your knees in, sit up, grab the belt, butterfly sweep.
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Mar 13, 2017 22:09
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JaySB posted:What you're describing is exactly the mount escape I described before. Minus the belt grab because that anchors your opponent to you. Frame on their hips with your hands, bridge, push on the hips, bring your knees in, sit up, grab the belt, butterfly sweep. Sorry if I came off as contrary. There is the correct terminology I'm learning, then the hackneyed terms thrown together in my head. I think it was an "Ah hah" moment because I was rolling with a significantly bigger guy and I realized more factors were at play then gritting my teeth and pushing.
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Mar 13, 2017 22:27
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Sounds like a mermaid mount escape. I can't find it online but it kinda sounds like an escape where you frame on the guys hips and lift him up a bit and ''swim'' your legs back and end up either in butterfly or you could go single-leg X and go for leglocks or something.
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Mar 13, 2017 22:35
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Odddzy posted:Sounds like a mermaid mount escape. I can't find it online but it kinda sounds like an escape where you frame on the guys hips and lift him up a bit and ''swim'' your legs back and end up either in butterfly or you could go single-leg X and go for leglocks or something. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzVF_uXk3EY&t=406s Like that?
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Mar 13, 2017 22:43
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Exactly like that.
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Mar 13, 2017 22:47
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This is the mount escape I was describing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2iB5nlIeZR8&t=410s
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Mar 13, 2017 22:50
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JaySB posted:This is the mount escape I was describing: Literally spot on. Thank you.
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Mar 13, 2017 23:54
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I can't remember if I posted this video or not before but I like it and I hit this sequence a few times. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6R4hlTfrFKA
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Mar 14, 2017 00:43
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I'm pretty sure I completely destroyed a training partner's knee tonight and I'm wondering how much responsibility I bear. We're both blue belts, I've been training a little over 2 years he's been training a little over 3. I single leg x sweep him to my left/his right. I've been working this sweep and x-guard sweeps a lot for the past few months. As I sweep him to his right, towards the end of the fall as I'm on my left side he just spins wildly with all his might to his right with his leg trapped and *POP* goes his knee. As he was spinning I tried to lift my hips to free his leg but his lower right leg was pinning my left hand to his body and lock his leg in place. I actually had a different blue belt try to spin out the other day while I had them in single leg x but I was able to let go as I was on sitting flat on my rear end, not lying my side, and I told them right after that is not the appropriate way to escape that position and if I was holding they could have hosed up their knee.
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Mar 15, 2017 03:33
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From what you've explained it sounds to me like it's his unfortunate fault but it's hard to be sure as we weren't there. Why did he spin? Were you doing Heelhooks? Was your arm wrapped around his ankle?
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Mar 15, 2017 04:02
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Odddzy posted:From what you've explained it sounds to me like it's his unfortunate fault but it's hard to be sure as we weren't there. Why did he spin? Were you doing Heelhooks? Was your arm wrapped around his ankle? Not a heel hook. I train at an IBJJF heavy gym so we don't even bother with them. Arm was more around the achilles as my plan was to go for a straight ankle lock once the position was established. I was not in the process of applying the lock when he spun. I fell pretty much like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rux8Qf9eskE&t=79s and then he just spun towards his right on to his stomach. I suspect he spun as this gym doesn't do a ton of instruction on leg entanglements and he didn't know the proper way to escape. I mean this guy flung himself into the spin. It's not like I was even trying to hold him there and he attempted to turn with control. I let go of poo poo all the time if I have an inkling a training partner may injure themselves with what they're doing, especially if they're my junior. Anytime I've managed to sweep a purple belt with a single leg x they all escape the proper way and in a controlled manner. I rolled with the head instructor after this happened tonight and he kept ankle and estima locking me but I would defend/attempt to defend by going straight up to my foot, not twisting my knee as I attempted to come up, grab his head/hands/block his leg in an attempt to keep his hips from driving forward. And most importantly tapping when I couldn't get out and he applied the lock. WayneCampbell fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Mar 15, 2017 |
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Mar 15, 2017 04:14
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I've heard of people doing that when they're in a serious leg entanglement like inside sankaku or something, blowing their own knee out, and I'm always prepared to abandon the position instantly if it looks like they're going to hurt themselves. But from SLX? I wouldn't think you even *could* hurt yourself from there.
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Mar 15, 2017 04:22
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02-6611-0142-1 posted:I've heard of people doing that when they're in a serious leg entanglement like inside sankaku or something, blowing their own knee out, and I'm always prepared to abandon the position instantly if it looks like they're going to hurt themselves. But from SLX? I wouldn't think you even *could* hurt yourself from there. I do the same thing usually but this guy just flung himself into a spin without warning instead of taking the fall. Because I was on my side his lower leg had my body weight it so as he spun, the tibia stayed put and the knee gave out.
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Mar 15, 2017 04:29
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Yeah, i'll let others chime in but i'm pretty sure none of that is your fault really. You don't spin if the guy has an ankle lock grip on your leg. Legally I don't know where you are standing on stuff like that but it sounded fair game to me.
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Mar 15, 2017 04:42
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Possessing empathy and introspection about events is a drat good quality. But in my "combat sports" experiences from fourteen years of age to almost thirty-three, I'm always more concerned for the person that hurts me. When my shoulder popped I emailed the instructor to tell him, "This injury is my fault, not the guy's" because the dude seemed pretty shook up at making a big guy yelp. If someone hurts you being a dick or vice versa, that's an entirely different issue. Same with ranked competition.
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Mar 15, 2017 04:53
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Captain Log posted:Possessing empathy and introspection about events is a drat good quality. But in my "combat sports" experiences from fourteen years of age to almost thirty-three, I'm always more concerned for the person that hurts me. When my shoulder popped I emailed the instructor to tell him, "This injury is my fault, not the guy's" because the dude seemed pretty shook up at making a big guy yelp. Oh I feel absolutely loving awful about it. The guy is like me and makes a living with his body, he has 2 young kids.... I feel like poo poo and this only happened like 2 hours ago so I'm still pretty shook up. But I also feel like maybe it wasn't my fault and just wanted to get some outside perspective.
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Mar 15, 2017 04:59
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfXpRn8uFL8
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Mar 15, 2017 05:30
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WayneCampbell posted:Oh I feel absolutely loving awful about it. The guy is like me and makes a living with his body, he has 2 young kids.... I feel like poo poo and this only happened like 2 hours ago so I'm still pretty shook up. But I also feel like maybe it wasn't my fault and just wanted to get some outside perspective. Yeah it sucks he got injured but it's not really your fault and you're grown adults playing a combat sports game. Injuries can happen and as long as you're not being malicious I wouldn't blame yourself for injuries that occur especially ones where your opponent does something that gets himself injured
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Mar 15, 2017 06:28
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I did my second tournament as a dumb white belt on Saturday. This time went much better! eight matches, five wins three losses. Three wins by submission, got bronze in gi, silver in nogi. The most gratifying thing was actually being able to hit some of the stuff I had been practicing. Also arm triangling a dude until his nose gushed blood and ruined my gi. WORTH IT 
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Mar 15, 2017 15:02
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WayneCampbell posted:Oh I feel absolutely loving awful about it. The guy is like me and makes a living with his body, he has 2 young kids.... I feel like poo poo and this only happened like 2 hours ago so I'm still pretty shook up. But I also feel like maybe it wasn't my fault and just wanted to get some outside perspective. I feel like the adult man wagering his family's livelihood by violently pirouetting his entire frame on his acl is at fault here
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Mar 15, 2017 16:01
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Mr. Pool posted:I did my second tournament as a dumb white belt on Saturday. This time went much better! eight matches, five wins three losses. Three wins by submission, got bronze in gi, silver in nogi. The most gratifying thing was actually being able to hit some of the stuff I had been practicing. Also arm triangling a dude until his nose gushed blood and ruined my gi. WORTH IT That's a ton of matches. How was your cardio? How did your adrenaline dump compare to your first tournament? Congrats.
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Mar 15, 2017 17:47
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JaySB posted:That's a ton of matches. How was your cardio? How did your adrenaline dump compare to your first tournament? Congrats. Yeah, I'd like to hear how you paced yourself. Congrats, man.
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Mar 15, 2017 18:55
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Mr. Pool posted:I did my second tournament as a dumb white belt on Saturday. This time went much better! eight matches, five wins three losses. Three wins by submission, got bronze in gi, silver in nogi. The most gratifying thing was actually being able to hit some of the stuff I had been practicing. Also arm triangling a dude until his nose gushed blood and ruined my gi. WORTH IT Incredible, congrats.
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Mar 15, 2017 19:19
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Mr. Pool posted:Also arm triangling a dude until his nose gushed blood and ruined my gi. WORTH IT Awesome. Also throw hydrogen peroxide on those blood stains and it will come right out assuming you haven't laundered it yet.
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Mar 16, 2017 02:24
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Wangsbig posted:I feel like the adult man wagering his family's livelihood by violently pirouetting his entire frame on his acl is at fault here If you believe that nobody should train that isn't a desk jockey. If you do, fair enough but I bet you're awfully boring. WayneCampbell posted:Awesome. Keep your blood stains, you earned em! I still wear the white belt I got in 2008 from a gym that was in hindsight pretty lovely. All its marks are important to me. (Bleach works if that gi is white)
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Mar 16, 2017 02:31
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Captain Log posted:If you believe that nobody should train that isn't a desk jockey. If you do, fair enough but I bet you're awfully boring. You dont have to be hostile, he just means that you shouldnt feel at fault because the dude should know the risks of doing this as a hobby
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Mar 16, 2017 02:41
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