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Rexides posted:But if you build over Gärdet then Stockholmare will have to cross the tullarna to go to open air festivals! Man, if only we had spent billions of tax-payer money building unproritable but versatile super-arenas so that we had alternatives. What a future that could have been.
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Mar 17, 2017 12:08
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von Braun posted:When was there a festival there last? I only know Kentfest
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Mar 17, 2017 12:27
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I was trying to find one single way Gärdet matters to me, and the only thing I could think of was a metal festival I attended a couple years ago 
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Mar 17, 2017 12:31
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Seriously though can any Stockholmans explain what this is: https://goo.gl/maps/KqRULb4SnC92 Literal empty field of nothing like 2km from the city center
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Mar 17, 2017 12:42
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That is the area we're talking about, Gärdet. Technically it's a much larger area which is partially developed already, but when people say Gärdet they usually just mean the huge emtpy field.
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Mar 17, 2017 13:26
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Since it's right next to the US embassy we should just go for full irony and build asylum centers on all of it.
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Mar 17, 2017 13:34
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So every empty place should be buildings then? Looks at Central Park and Hyde Park.
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Mar 17, 2017 13:42
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Cardiac posted:So every empty place should be buildings then? It's literally just a grass field. EDIT: Not to mention that it's situated right next to the arguably largest and most well-maintained park in Stockholm. MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 13:53 on Mar 17, 2017 |
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Mar 17, 2017 13:47
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Cardiac posted:So every empty place should be buildings then? It would be sweet if it was anything like Central Park. Even like the most boring part of Central Park. But it's not. It's a big empty green nothing. Also it's not like Stockholm is a huge forest of skyscrapers that needs a patch of green right in the middle of it to make it bearable.
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Mar 17, 2017 13:52
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Cardiac posted:So every empty place should be buildings then? Central park is 315 hectares and Hyde Park is 145 hectares by the way. Nobody's talking about building over Humlegården, Vasaparken or Observatorielunden, all of which are large parks in the middle of the city. Or Hagaparken which incidentally is 144 hectares, almost the same size as Hyde Park.
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Mar 17, 2017 14:06
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This all assumes that NIMBY doesn't exist of course.
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Mar 17, 2017 15:29
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"We should do X" "Look at you assuming there aren't people opposing X. Heh."
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Mar 17, 2017 15:48
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We can't even refurbish Slussen without a bunch of panicky Stockholmers making a huge fuss. Opposition is part of the process.
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Mar 17, 2017 16:39
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I mean, I'm all for conserving city legacy and characteristics, but there's room for both that and development in Stockholm City atm. P.S. Don't touch Tanto
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Mar 17, 2017 16:41
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   Södermanlands pansarregemente on parade on the grass field mentioned above, september 1943. The area really hasn't changed much in the last 70 years - the apartment blocks in the background are still there and look more or less the same. Note the huge stacks of firewood in the background in the first photo though - fuel shortages were a very real concern during the war. If we get a new oil crisis maybe we'll get to stack firewood there again within our lifetime 
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Mar 17, 2017 21:54
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Speaking of Sweden and tanks... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx867tE6P4w I bet you lesser Scandinavian countries don't have any majestic action movie remnants that would even be candidates for this 
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Mar 18, 2017 10:17
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Zudgemud posted:Speaking of Sweden and tanks... gently caress the Emil II's sloped turret armor forever. - someone who doesn't own an Emil II
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Mar 18, 2017 10:52
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MiddleOne posted:It's staggering how many poor political decisions in Swedish politics that can be connected to politicians just doing what was trendy in the US at the time. Especially in urban planning.
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Mar 18, 2017 11:29
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Sure, but the reason organized crime tend to flourish in these neighborhoods is because by putting thousands of low-income residency's in one spot you've condensed the target market, working men and recruitment pool of organized crime into one easily monitored area. Income inequality, poverty, segregation and racism all feed into this problem but the fact remains that these neighborhoods are the way they are by design.
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Mar 18, 2017 11:56
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evil_bunnY posted:It's not just the US, western europe was all about that poo poo at the time. Turns out if you put people in subpar affordable housing but continue to discriminate/punish them in every other aspect of society, those places turn horrible regardless of where you are. Eh, if it wasn't for immigrants, miljonprogrammet would have been torn down a long time ago. Also, apparently spending a whole lot of money on an area is discrimination? The areas in Sweden with a lot of immigrants have in general gotten more money compared to other areas in the same city. The composition in those areas have also always been generational, in that immigrants move out when they can.
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Mar 18, 2017 11:59
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MiddleOne posted:Sure, but the reason organized crime tend to flourish in these neighborhoods is because by putting thousands of low-income residency's in one spot you've condensed the target market, working men and recruitment pool of organized crime into one easily monitored area. Income inequality, poverty, segregation and racism all feed into this problem but the fact remains that these neighborhoods are the way they are by design. I would doubt if this wasn't also the case for many other of these kinds of areas in Europe, because people really believed that what they were creating was the perfect mix of urban comfort and wide open spaces for the modern man. That their ideas turned out to be bunk and the areas through accident and/or design became what they are today doesn't really change the fact that this wasn't the original intent.
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Mar 18, 2017 13:04
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Let Stockholm stagnate and rot from within. When the employers are forced to to move jobs elsewhere due to lack of office space and affordable living, then politicians might feel motivated to both fix the rotten mess that is Stockholm housing and acknowledge that there is more to Sweden than the three big cities.
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Mar 18, 2017 14:18
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Noshtane posted:Let Stockholm stagnate and rot from within. When the employers are forced to to move jobs elsewhere due to lack of office space and affordable living, then politicians might feel motivated to both fix the rotten mess that is Stockholm housing and acknowledge that there is more to Sweden than the three big cities. Cities are where the people, goods and culture are. The complaints in this thread are legitimate, but there really is not much to our countries outside the major cities. What is your ideal world, one where we all live in small communes and have to drive for hours to get to the goth club / asian food import store / concert venue / good restaurant? gently caress that, I wanna be able to jump onto public transport for a few minutes if I am going to work or if I need something.
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Mar 18, 2017 15:03
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Amen. I like the comforts of the big city. Screw landsbygden, bunch of bigots and yokels
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Mar 18, 2017 15:22
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Biomute posted:Cities are where the people, goods and culture are. The complaints in this thread are legitimate, but there really is not much to our countries outside the major cities. What is your ideal world, one where we all live in small communes and have to drive for hours to get to the goth club / asian food import store / concert venue / good restaurant? gently caress that, I wanna be able to jump onto public transport for a few minutes if I am going to work or if I need something. You are perfectly able to do those things in Umeå for example and for a fraction of the cost of living compared to Stockholm. It is not a human right to live in Stockholm, if you are unable to live there, Norrland is capable of sustaining life and it is not to be considered cruel and unusual treatment to live there as much of a surprise it may seem to many of you. My proposal is to let Stockholm rot and focus on improving the smaller cities, they would actively support it unlike the population of Stockholm who seems to disdain any kind of change or attempt to improve anything.
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Mar 18, 2017 16:02
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McCloud posted:Amen. I like the comforts of the big city. Screw landsbygden, bunch of bigots and yokels Landsbygden looks great though, too bad about the "no job prospects for 95% of people with university degrees" thing.
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Mar 18, 2017 16:07
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Noshtane posted:Norrland is capable of sustaining life and it is not to be considered cruel and unusual treatment to live there as much of a surprise it may seem to many of you. and never know the sweet touch of the sun for a few months
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Mar 18, 2017 16:26
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Noshtane posted:You are perfectly able to do those things in Umeå for example and for a fraction of the cost of living compared to Stockholm. The general job opportunities are pretty bad in Umeå region compared to the Stockholm region though, especially if you are two adults with university degrees. And it is only logical that companies locate themselves close to sources of labor and logistics hubs unless they are directly involved in natural resource extraction. The fact that the bulk of the population will have no established social network in place and might have an issue with the whole "more cold and darkness" will also contribute in making it a harder sell in Umeå's case.
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Mar 18, 2017 16:35
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Biomute posted:goth club / asian food import store / concert venue / good restaurant You're not supposed to do those things. Find a nice decrepit barn, drink home-made spirits and maybe hang yourself. A good time!
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Mar 18, 2017 17:04
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Sweden is like all countries urbanizing more and more... Not without disadvantages!.
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Mar 18, 2017 17:13
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I know I'm very unlikely to move far away from Copenhagen. Maybe to a smaller town along the s-train lines, but never ever back to Fyn or Jylland. (Aarhus, maaaaybe, but probably not). I like being able to do just about anything, and it's less than 20 minutes on public transport.
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Mar 18, 2017 17:26
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Zudgemud posted:Landsbygden looks great though, too bad about the "no job prospects for 95% of people with university degrees" thing. Zudgemud posted:The general job opportunities are pretty bad in Umeå region compared to the Stockholm region though, especially if you are two adults with university degrees. And it is only logical that companies locate themselves close to sources of labor and logistics hubs unless they are directly involved in natural resource extraction. The fact that the bulk of the population will have no established social network in place and might have an issue with the whole "more cold and darkness" will also contribute in making it a harder sell in Umeå's case. That depends on what your degree is. There is an endless demand for engineers, doctors, nurses, teachers, social workers and what have you. Economists, gender science, philosophy and other types of studies that lends itself better to research, not so much. Of course you won't have the same buffet of opportunities as in Stockholm, not by a long shot but you won't go hungry either. What you will have is a large house with a garage, 20 minutes drive from the city for the same price of what you would pay for a decent apartment in Stockholm. The social bit can be a bit hard but it hasn't stemmed the tide of people moving to Stockholm. If a yokel from the northern frontier can survive socially in Stockholm, why can not a Stockholmer survive in Umeå? As it is, the prospects of a pair of students with fresh exams wanting to start a family is Stockholm is poor. Personally I believe that not a market crash nor a building boom will solve the housing situation. There are untold numbers of people stashed away in parents basements, guest rooms, on sofas, in third hand contract apartments or heaven forbid even in Norrland, saving up cash desperately waiting for either to happen. They hopelessly believe that when the crash/boom happens they will be the one to snag one of those delicious four room apartments at Östermalm or wherever. Then we have rich Europeans dreaming of a home in the socialist paradise of Stockholm competing for the living space and poor refugees that also has to be placed in the big city region because it is apparently cruel and unjust to place them elsewhere if the posters of this thread are to be believed. There is simply not enough housing available, nor is it feasible to outbuild the demand. The only real answer is to make the rest of Sweden more attractive to live in or Stockholm less attractive. That would relieve the current pressure on the Stockholm housing market. Failing that you could force snobby stockholmers at the point of a bayonet to live ten years in Glommersträsk. That would free up some housing. skipThings posted:and never know the sweet touch of the sun for a few months That would put some steel into your body. The soft luxury of constant access to sun has made you weak. Noshtane fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Mar 18, 2017 |
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Mar 18, 2017 18:02
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Noshtane posted:What you will have is a large house with a garage, 20 minutes drive from the city Cars are murder.
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Mar 18, 2017 18:20
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Biomute posted:Cars are murder.
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Mar 18, 2017 22:49
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Thlom posted:This is correct. And most politicians knows this is correct and their stated goal is to decrease or stabilise car driving rates, but their actual policies is encouraging more and more driving. Murderers they are. Cars are good. All you Swedes (I believe that's who's talking now) have brainrot.
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Mar 19, 2017 14:11
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Cars are good, public transport is better.
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Mar 19, 2017 15:01
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skipThings posted:and never know the sweet touch of the sun for a few months Beats overcast days with mud and slush.
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Mar 19, 2017 15:02
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MiddleOne posted:Cars are good, public transport is better.
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Mar 19, 2017 15:02
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Randarkman posted:Cars are good. All you Swedes (I believe that's who's talking now) have brainrot. Look, I am sure there are some good cars out there, we are just saying that you should be wary around them as a precaution.
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Mar 19, 2017 15:26
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Randarkman posted:Cars are good. All you Swedes (I believe that's who's talking now) have brainrot. cars killed rural sweden
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Mar 19, 2017 18:49
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