Guy Mann posted:Also people take it super personally when a critic gives a bad review to something they like or vice versa, the idea that a critic is Iinvalidated because their opinions don't match your own or go agaist historical consensus is asinine. I see people do this poo poo all the time and it's crazy to me. "They liked Avengers? Dropped!"
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Mar 23, 2017 23:13
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ImpAtom posted:The best critics, I think, enjoy discussing things. They're there to expression their opinion but want to discuss it. Ebert was great for this in that he genuinely had things to say and wanted to say them to you and he had a way with words to go with his critical eye. If you're criticizing just to be snarky, or to call people dumb, or whatever then you're not enjoying discussing things and rarely are able to expand your own knowledge with other's thoughts.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:14
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Palpek posted:The same could be said about posting. If only more people understood the value of actually talking about games vs the worthlessness of presenting their egos through talking about games. This is a really good, concise, clear sentiment that I agree with 100%. Well said.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:16
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Guy Mann posted:Also people take it super personally when a critic gives a bad review to something they like or vice versa, the idea that a critic is Iinvalidated because their opinions don't match your own or go agaist historical consensus is asinine.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:19
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Guy Mann posted:To bring it back to Roger Ebert, he gave a lot of stone-cold classics poor scores at the time of their releases but you almost never see movie people try and disparage him by pointing out that he gave Garfield and the Jack Black Gulliver's Travels higher score than Blue Velvet and Blade Runner, but gamers still think that pointing out that a website hosted two reviews that gave Imagine Babiez a higher score than God Hand objectively invalidates anything it says over a decade later. The God Hand review is an abomination, and only partly because it gave a comically low score to a great game. And when Ebert was alive, I'd sometimes point to him giving completely awful phoned-in children's movies a pass just because of his underestimating the target audience as an example of his weaknesses as a critic. I didn't obsessively make memes about it, though.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:25
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Guy Mann posted:Also people take it super personally when a critic gives a bad review to something they like or vice versa, the idea that a critic is Iinvalidated because their opinions don't match your own or go agaist historical consensus is asinine. I think the reason people freak out over lovely reviews more than other media, well just beyond the typical reason of nerds are the worst about things they like, is that there was that brouhaha several years ago where whatever game got like a 70 on metacritic, and the company refused to give the devs their bonuses because of it. So I think that eventually snowballed into people thinking metacritic matters at all, instead of a game company was just being lovely to their employees.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:26
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Macaluso posted:I think the reason people freak out over lovely reviews more than other media, well just beyond the typical reason of nerds are the worst about things they like, is that there was that brouhaha several years ago where whatever game got like a 70 on metacritic, and the company refused to give the devs their bonuses because of it. So I think that eventually snowballed into people thinking metacritic matters at all, instead of a game company was just being lovely to their employees. Nah, it's been like this forever. Even game companies freak out about low scores going back to the olden days. Rare famously threatened to pull all their ads from Nintendo Power when they gave Battletoads an extremely generous 6/10. And I'd regularly see angry letters from fans of whatever taking issue with the reviews.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:28
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Review scores bear so much of the weight despite being the most meaningless part of any review.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:33
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Macaluso posted:I think the reason people freak out over lovely reviews more than other media, well just beyond the typical reason of nerds are the worst about things they like, is that there was that brouhaha several years ago where whatever game got like a 70 on metacritic, and the company refused to give the devs their bonuses because of it. So I think that eventually snowballed into people thinking metacritic matters at all, instead of a game company was just being lovely to their employees. I suspect you're thinking of what happened to Obsidian for Fallout New Vegas.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:35
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Jay Rust posted:Review scores bear so much of the weight despite being the most meaningless part of any review. But if you don't have a score system people won't even read your review.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:36
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I don't have proof but I bet most people don't read past the scores in general.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:37
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Endorph posted:to be fair, the problem with that ign god hand review isn't that they gave it a low score, it's that the review was extremely poorly written and came from a fundamental lack of understanding of what the game was trying to be. This response to it shows more nuance and understanding about criticism than both IGN and the detractors of the review often display when discussing it. That said, sometimes you just bounce off a game in every possible way, regardless of whatever praises other people sing for it. God Hand isn't a great game for most people, even for those you would consider totally open to that sort of game. Ultimately the most important critic to satisfy when playing any game is the one in your own brain. Other critics are important, no doubt, but I think a pretty clear problem with gamers in general is that they are TOO important to us collectively. Even here on SA, we have people dismissing reviews we don't like often for petty reason, or clamoring behind reviews we agree with for positive reinforcement.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:39
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I know this is gonna sound pretentious but I've fallen into this trap myself so hopefully it comes off as understanding and not judgement: "Hype" is the closest thing to nerd religion and if you temper it in any way you've committed heresy.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:41
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somebody legit wrote a gigantic thesis on jontron this is embarrassing poo poo https://www.icze4r.org/e/00/jon.html
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Mar 23, 2017 23:42
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The last review I remember getting worked up over was the IGN Double Dragon Neon review, which was also a 3/10, and did the following: -opened by saying beat-em-ups were an awful genre that was dead for a reason -got several facts about the combat completely wrong -got several facts about the history of the series completely wrong -incorrectly claimed the game had no changes to the classic Double Dragon formula when it was a huge departure in almost every way -failed to mention any of the game's unique mechanics -had the reviewer run crying to his colleagues for backup when literally everyone screamed at him in the review Like.. it wasn't even that he was giving a game I loved and looked forward to for months an incredibly low score based on apparently just hating the genre, he just got so much wrong and was so dismissive in his review, like it was such a huge chore for him to even try to engage with the game and it wasn't even worth the effort for him to look up any of his factually incorrect sweeping claims. MinibarMatchman posted:somebody legit wrote a gigantic thesis on jontron this is embarrassing poo poo lmao
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Mar 23, 2017 23:46
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MinibarMatchman posted:somebody legit wrote a gigantic thesis on jontron this is embarrassing poo poo quote:It took me years to realize that I wasn't better than anybody intrinsically. It took me nearly a decade to realize that the racists, sexists, homophobes, even the Neo-Nazis I hated so much, had families, and hopes, and dreams, and feelings. 
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Mar 23, 2017 23:50
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weird how he didn't realize that the people the neo-nazis hate and want dead also have those things
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Mar 23, 2017 23:52
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Me, as I feebly raise my emaciated arms to ward off another blow from the camp guard: "I know you have a family, hopes, dreams, and feelings." Edit: I decided to read that and "19 gigabytes of saved Jontron videos" is the new "R'yleh!" I don't think my sanity can take this.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:53
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So the tl;dr seems to be "neo-Nazis are human too, judge not lest ye be judged  " ??
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Mar 23, 2017 23:57
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Me, as I feebly raise my emaciated arms to ward off another blow from the camp guard: "I know you have a family, hopes, dreams, and feelings." my favorite line was probably "There are hundreds upon hundreds of millions of people with actual problems in their lives, and you're mad on the Internet. You are not the well-adjusted one here" written with zero self-awareness about a youtube funnyman who is being crucified so we may live
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Mar 23, 2017 23:58
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no seriously the cognitive dissonance there is powerful. like 'saying mean things to jontron is terrible' when people are saying mean things to jontron because he said blacks are genetically predisposed to commit crimes and that the mexicans are plotting to ruin america with their inferior genes. like if saying mean things is always bad then why isn't jontron also bad.
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Mar 23, 2017 23:59
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MinibarMatchman posted:my favorite line was probably "There are hundreds upon hundreds of millions of people with actual problems in their lives, and you're mad on the Internet. You are not the well-adjusted one here" written with zero self-awareness about a youtube funnyman who is being crucified so we may live LMAO I'm imaging this person sitting Masterpiece Theater style in front of a bookcase but it's just full of DVD cases hand labeled in sharpie "JONTRON VOL 322" or w/e
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Mar 24, 2017 00:00
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Jay Rust posted:So the tl;dr seems to be "neo-Nazis are human too, judge not lest ye be judged I had some genius compare my unwillingness to meet nazis halfway with the oppression of homosexuals in the early 1900s.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:01
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Yeah, I mean sometimes reviews are just lovely, not because the reviewer has a different opinion but because it's a bad review with a poor foundation and bad writing. I brought up John Walker's review of Hollow Knight ages ago as an example of a review that maybe has a thesis somewhere in there (Hollow Knight isn't as good as Ori and the Blind Forest, for whatever value that statement has) and couches it in a bunch of meandering, lovely writing and lack of actual good critical examination (for example there are some definite weak spots to Hollow Knight's design that he completely brushes over which I would consider to be important to note in a critical sense, in favor of him complaining about things like how you can't equip every powerup at once). I don't take umbrage with the review because HOW DARE HE INSULT THY FAIR MAIDEN HOLLOW KNIGHT because I don't care nearly that much about the game, it's not a transcendent revelatory experience, but I take umbrage with it because it's poorly written for the sake of John Walker trying to pretend like he's a better writer than he is. I similarly recall there being at least one or two of Ebert's reviews where he flat-out got things about a movie wrong, complaining about things that didn't happen or something, which stood out because most of his body of work wasn't like that but you're still justified in saying "man this is poo poo." I don't really envy people who decide to review video games for a living (or for a "living") because the average movie is like 2-3 hours and, not to knock film critics, but there's a lot less effort involved on the watcher's part, meanwhile video games can be anywhere from 15-60+ hours worth of content to go through and you have deadlines you have to hit so you can't actually really dig into them as much as you might like, plus you have to layer being a good critic with also being a good video game player or else you wind up with situations like Polygon Plays Doom, or various reviews of Platinum games where it's clear that the person playing the game simply doesn't know what they're doing with a technically demanding, slightly obtuse combat system, which opens up even further arguments about game criticism because should you be reviewing a game for fans of the genre, for Joe Everyman, etc.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:03
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Lurdiak posted:I had some genius compare my unwillingness to meet nazis halfway with the oppression of homosexuals in the early 1900s. lol jesus this whole site is batshit, here have an article about befriending KKK members because "love trumps hate" https://www.icze4r.org/a/20/25.safe.html
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Mar 24, 2017 00:04
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Lurdiak posted:I had some genius compare my unwillingness to meet nazis halfway with the oppression of homosexuals in the early 1900s. He's right in that we should sterilize all nazis
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Mar 24, 2017 00:03
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MinibarMatchman posted:lol jesus this whole site is batshit, here have an article about befriending KKK members because "love trumps hate" https://www.icze4r.org/a/20/25.safe.html
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Mar 24, 2017 00:05
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tap my mountain posted:He's right in that we should sterilize all nazis So we don't think about their families anymore, agreed.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:08
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MinibarMatchman posted:lol jesus this whole site is batshit, here have an article about befriending KKK members because "love trumps hate" https://www.icze4r.org/a/20/25.safe.html https://twitter.com/tweeterisawful/status/845051252379717632
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Mar 24, 2017 00:16
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LOL had no idea homosexual people were responsible for almost wiping out an entire race through war and genocide. must have skipped that history lesson
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Mar 24, 2017 00:24
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Lurdiak posted:I heard someone call Helldivers a "strat-em-up" and that's such an accurate term for the game. Man, I forgot about Helldivers. I should pick that up again for a while. I loved that music they used for the main theme and during evacuations.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:25
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Spring Breakers is really good
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Mar 24, 2017 00:32
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bloodychill posted:Role-play-em-up No More Heroes: slash 'em up Killer 7: nightmare assassin sim Nier Automata: historical revision action Resident Evil 7: in-laws survival horror
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Mar 24, 2017 00:32
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MinibarMatchman posted:lol jesus this whole site is batshit, here have an article about befriending KKK members because "love trumps hate" https://www.icze4r.org/a/20/25.safe.html Maybe not the best example to use, considering he's actively caused a ton of white supremacists to leave the Klan with that method. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...s-a7489596.html
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Mar 24, 2017 00:33
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MinibarMatchman posted:No More Heroes: slash 'em up Lollipop Chainsaw/God Hand: Cheese 'Em Up
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Mar 24, 2017 00:34
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Man, speaking of God Hand, the Mad Midget Five are probably pretty offensive to little people, which is really unfortunate for me because I loving love them. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQeAxxKcqmQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0TmwLeUuBw
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Mar 24, 2017 00:41
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Hey can anyone answer this question: In Super Mario RPG is the only actual missable item the Frog Coin in the castle where you have to jump on Toad's head?
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Mar 24, 2017 00:48
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GobiasIndustries posted:Hey can anyone answer this question: In Super Mario RPG is the only actual missable item the Frog Coin in the castle where you have to jump on Toad's head? According to my player's guide, yes.
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Mar 24, 2017 00:49
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I didn't realize Persona 5 is less then 2 weeks away. A friend on Facebook posted a pic of the english copy that they are playing now. So the American version is out in the wild now.
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Mar 24, 2017 01:12
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I said come in! posted:I didn't realize Persona 5 is less then 2 weeks away. A friend on Facebook posted a pic of the english copy that they are playing now. So the American version is out in the wild now. Likewise, the new and final Dark Souls 3 DLC is like....four days away. Yay for working all the time, making the weeks blur into an unrecognizeable mess? Idk either way I am loving pumped
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Mar 24, 2017 01:19
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