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Secular Humanist posted:I'm pretty sure the new progression server is no boxing? Or did I misunderstand: One account per machine It is one account per machine, but there's still people who get around it in a variety of ways - multiple physical computers, VMs, etc. The 2-3 months I dinked around on Phingel I still occasionally saw some botted mage herds but they were a rarity (certainly no worse than bards making GBS threads up zones on P99). A lot of people will log on a friend's accounts on a laptop or whatever to duo, but groups were pretty easy to come by, and the raid scene was amazingly less toxic than P99 due to the instancing (note, there's still plenty of dickhead behavior, especially if you are trying to be among the first to get anything in normal zones). If you are someone who is game to sink some solid time into the game and really want to see raids, I can recommend the progression servers for sure. Starting on a fresh server is always fun and exciting regardless of the rule set, and there will be plenty of other old school EQ nerds around to enjoy the game with. That said, it makes a relatively weak attempt to recreate a classic experience. There's lots of spells, zones, mobs, mechanics, items, and conveniences that are more in line with contemporary EQ than the respective classic eras - some see these as improvements, some don't. You have to pay, and, if you want to actually take advantage of the progression/new server aspect, you have to keep up on levels and progress before whole swathes of zones become abandoned wastelands and mudflation takes over. P99 is definitively better for someone who is thinking about dabbling, doesn't want to deal with the progression factor, doesn't want to pay, or who is really interested in maxing out nostalgia. On a side note, P99 pop tends to dip when new progression servers get released. If you've been stagnating on P99 and have the time/money to commit to the progression server, definitely check it out. If you want to get in on P99 when it's less crowded, it will be a good time to do that as well.
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Mar 20, 2017 01:49
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I think Phinegal had the best set of rules for enjoying EQ. It controlled boxing, guaranteed access to content through instancing and the expansion timers funneled players into areas otherwise unused areas. I had a blast leveling in Befallen and I'll definitely take up round 2 if they go through with in the summer.
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Mar 20, 2017 02:20
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P99 is definitely worth trying out for a while, if anything for the nostalgia. A lot of really like it was in 2000, the old Freeport, the tough starting out, corpse runs, no free lunch, etc. It's free to try and your char won't get wiped, so give it a try and see. You'll probably burn out at lvl 3 though, if you don't have some discipline. 
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Mar 20, 2017 09:33
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Pilsner posted:That's precisely what they learned from their first slew of prog servers; boxing ruins it, because some people apparently have no problem paying $100 per month just to grind old poo poo in EQ (or maybe the ability to RMT items offsets it, I dunno). The latest prog server, Phinigel, only allows one active account per player per computer, and since Fippy/Ragefire, they have done quite a bit of tuning to players and NPCs, in order to make it more balanced. They have also introduced raid instancing even on old stuff like Vox and Naggy, which you may or may not like, but for the majority of players, it's a godsend. Bosses are also available in the open world, for those who want to race. That's why I'm thinking about trying the new progression server out when it launches. Some people are of the opinion that luclin ruined EQ forever, and while I can see that from that point on some of the old charm starts leaking out of the game, I certainly had a ton of fun raiding in luclin and PoP back in the day. I recently started on p99 and while I'm having fun so far, I do eventually want to raid if I keep playing, and from all accounts the raid scene on p99 is a total poo poo show. Limited instancing for raid bosses or spawn tokens or however they decide to implement it is a major plus for me, I don't care that's not how it was in classic.
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Mar 20, 2017 11:22
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Instancing is the one thing I just can't get past. I don't know why. I'm not a roleplayer, I generally don't give a poo poo about immersion and stuff, but something about choosing "WHICH PERMAFROST WOULD YOU LIKE TO ENTER #1 or #2 or #4??" feels so god drat wrong. I dunno if that's how they handle instancing, I just remember that's what it was like in EQ2 and it felt so cheap. But I know it's a godsend for a lot of people. I'm not even among the people who generally raid and get high end content locked down; I'm just another person who always gets shut out of it but damnit.... that's how it's supposed to be! 
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Mar 20, 2017 16:01
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Secular Humanist posted:Instancing is the one thing I just can't get past. I don't know why. I'm not a roleplayer, I generally don't give a poo poo about immersion and stuff, but something about choosing "WHICH PERMAFROST WOULD YOU LIKE TO ENTER #1 or #2 or #4??" feels so god drat wrong. My first guild in EQ1 was called "The Silent Majority" (your AV just reminded me of that). Instancing does take away a bit of the immersion, which sucks, but it also cuts down on a lot of the fighting and time their support personnel (if they have any) have to deal with bullshit like Guild_001 trained Guild_002 for the umpteenth time.
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Mar 20, 2017 19:44
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Pilsner posted:P99 is definitely worth trying out for a while, if anything for the nostalgia. A lot of really like it was in 2000, the old Freeport, the tough starting out, corpse runs, no free lunch, etc. It's free to try and your char won't get wiped, so give it a try and see. You'll probably burn out at lvl 3 though, if you don't have some discipline. That said, hit up some goons in-game and you'll generally be showered in plat and decent gear which'll make the 1-10 experience massively less painful. Secular Humanist posted:Instancing is the one thing I just can't get past. I don't know why. I'm not a roleplayer, I generally don't give a poo poo about immersion and stuff, but something about choosing "WHICH PERMAFROST WOULD YOU LIKE TO ENTER #1 or #2 or #4??" feels so god drat wrong. I get you, and I agree, and at the same time I disagree. Because having instances kinda ruins the magic, I know, it feels less "real" at that point. That's a big part of the appeal of EQ, no instances, having to do all the phone trees and poo poo when bosses spawn, it felt more grounded. But at the same time, having to organize schedules for the top guilds to have ownership of certain bosses is kinda stupid, but even if you do that or not either way the top guilds are going to control the spawns and that kinda sucks. And as much as instances can ruin that feeling of realism... I dunno, having multiple servers kinda does the same thing to me. 1999 mostly gets around this because there's just one blue and one red and they aren't the same, and they're enough to hold most of the retro EQ crowd these days. But back in EQ's hayday, there were a good 20+ servers, so even if you were doing something on one server, the other servers had their own boss spawns and were almost like their own instances. I guess the fact that your characters were locked in to one limits that a bit, but IDK. I really like the idea of having a single global server like EVE Online, so that events in the mmo world can become news. If you have instances or even multiple servers, that doesn't really happen. But it requires really embracing a sandbox environment and building the infrastructure to support that, which EQ was too early for.
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Mar 20, 2017 19:55
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I haven't played p99 in almost a year, but I guess some things never change.
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Mar 20, 2017 20:26
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Zaphod42 posted:That said, hit up some goons in-game and you'll generally be showered in plat and decent gear which'll make the 1-10 experience massively less painful. phone trees and calls at 5am to raid because emp ssra or whatever spawned were great and all when I was 16 with nothing better to do with my life, but now that I'm 31 and have a job and bills to pay, that poo poo is dumb.
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Mar 20, 2017 20:47
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Yeah I don't really have fond memories of dealing with progression choke-points like Trakanon, Emperor Ssraeshza, and Rallos Zek The Warlord. On a chill server like Brell was, we had it to a minimum but I remember absolute horror stories from other servers which would make me re-roll instead of subscribe to that idiocy. They got Emperor down to 5 percent, let's do the zone crash bug!! They are about to trigger the Cursed cycle, lets gently caress it up for em!! No thanks, ever.
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Mar 20, 2017 20:55
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Herv posted:Yeah I don't really have fond memories of dealing with progression choke-points like Trakanon, Emperor Ssraeshza, and Rallos Zek The Warlord. Yeah... xegony was a shitshow for this stuff. Ssra spawned during euro time? Better get monks/druids/wizards online to cockblock them with exodus/fd trains and anything else you can think of until they get frustrated and log off and then the rest of our guild wakes up to do it. By the time PoP was around it chilled out somewhat because those guilds disbanded and people quit, but it still happened a bit. Trains not so much, but guilds waking up rear end early to cockblock magnetic behemoth, Zek and then rathe counsel. MF_James fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Mar 20, 2017 |
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Mar 20, 2017 21:07
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Zaphod42 posted:But back in EQ's hayday, there were a good 20+ servers, so even if you were doing something on one server, the other servers had their own boss spawns and were almost like their own instances. I guess the fact that your characters were locked in to one limits that a bit, but IDK. EQ actually had approximately 43 active servers (both PvE and PvP) in 2001. I've been nerdy enough to do a complete list (except the latest prog servers) and history overview of all EQ servers here: http://www.zlizeq.com/Game_Information-Servers_and_Versions
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Mar 20, 2017 21:21
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Povar '99 bitches. I was in Triton for like a month, that's my claim to fame.
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Mar 20, 2017 21:31
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Pilsner posted:You could say each server was an instance.... for the 1 or 2 top guild(s) on the server. :P Other second-tier guilds had to take the scraps, and the remaining pleb guilds had to wait a few expansions until they could raid. I remember up-and-coming family guilds would cheer at having beaten Trakanon and Vindicator during late Luclin, lol. I managed to go through pretty much every level of this at different times on the Cazic Thule server. I was in a "family guild" that did fun stuff like farm Kael called Forgotten Destiny. That guild mutated and the harder-core members ended up migrating to Obsidian Coven, where during Luclin we did stuff like AoW, Umbral Planes, and eventually made it into Vex Thal. During PoP I ended up going to Shadowed Soul, which was in the top three on the server, and managed to down Quarm. I think I enjoyed all of them, though the hardcore scene is unreachable for me now that I'm 30 years old and have a full time job. I look back fondly, though.
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Mar 20, 2017 21:43
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MF_James posted:phone trees and calls at 5am to raid because emp ssra or whatever spawned were great and all when I was 16 with nothing better to do with my life, but now that I'm 31 and have a job and bills to pay, that poo poo is dumb. Pretty much this right here. This is why WoW became so popular and why other MMOs really never did well, so they just copied WoW. Accessibility. Classic EQ has a ton of charm (hell, even up to PoP or so for me) but man it takes a lot of ignoring other poo poo in your life to actually sink any time into it.
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Mar 21, 2017 00:57
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Bah, pic not showing...
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Mar 22, 2017 09:04
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Zaphod42 posted:I get you, and I agree, and at the same time I disagree. Because having instances kinda ruins the magic, I know, it feels less "real" at that point. That's a big part of the appeal of EQ, no instances, having to do all the phone trees and poo poo when bosses spawn, it felt more grounded. But at the same time, having to organize schedules for the top guilds to have ownership of certain bosses is kinda stupid, but even if you do that or not either way the top guilds are going to control the spawns and that kinda sucks. The lack of instances does make the game feel more like a shared world, I admit. But that's just not worth all the hassle it brings. If you want to raid in classic EQ you have to compete for spawns with people who have nothing else in their life besides the game. I want to fight dragons, not neckbeards.
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Mar 22, 2017 19:43
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MF_James posted:phone trees and calls at 5am to raid because emp ssra or whatever spawned were great and all when I was 16 with nothing better to do with my life, but now that I'm 31 and have a job and bills to pay, that poo poo is dumb. Yeah no poo poo, finish reading my post. I'm not saying I wanted that. I'm saying something more subtle. suuma posted:Pretty much this right here. This is why WoW became so popular and why other MMOs really never did well, so they just copied WoW. Accessibility. Again though, EVE Online is probably the second biggest subscription MMO there is alive currently. And its the direct opposite of WoW. Its NOT all about accessibility. Some people want that, but you lose something in doing that which appeals to other people. There's different markets. People who even liked vanilla WoW don't like modern WoW. Look at how popular games like Dark Souls are and say that "its all about accessibility". Not always! Look at how many people preferred Star Wars Galaxies BEFORE they remade it to be more like WoW, and more accessible. They hated that change. SWG died shortly after the NGE because of it. They preferred the sandbox, where you could build your own towns and make your own fun. It was hard and it wasn't very accessible, but some people loved it. My point was though that EQ was really half of both approaches since it was so early and experimental. A game really designed for a single-shard has to be built that way from the ground up to accomodate it, like I already said. Like EVE Online. Which scatters players across a massive environment and doesn't make you go through a single progression. EQ is halfway between a sandbox game and a themepark game. It has elements of both, and each side appeals to different people. That was my whole point.  Philonius posted:The lack of instances does make the game feel more like a shared world, I admit. But that's just not worth all the hassle it brings. If you want to raid in classic EQ you have to compete for spawns with people who have nothing else in their life besides the game. I want to fight dragons, not neckbeards. You're thinking too limited though. Yes, in classic EQ that's how it is. But duh, classic EQ has poo poo tons of problems. It was designed in 1999. Modern WoW is very accessible but it has problems too because everything feels generic and easy and pointless. There's ways you can design a game that is single-shard but doesn't require you to give up your life. You guys are all being super close minded. Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Mar 22, 2017 |
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Mar 22, 2017 20:29
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Zaphod42 posted:There's ways you can design a game that is single-shard but doesn't require you to give up your life. You guys are all being super close minded. Dark Age of Camelot anyone?.... single server. Had instanced zones later on. Initial leveling curve in that game was brutal. Had death penalties. Not in the from of XP loss, because that blows, but you dropped coin equivalent to whatever it cost to heal your 3 Constitution loss per death.
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Mar 22, 2017 20:49
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FknMeh posted:Dark Age of Camelot anyone?.... single server. Had instanced zones later on. Initial leveling curve in that game was brutal. Had death penalties. Not in the from of XP loss, because that blows, but you dropped coin equivalent to whatever it cost to heal your 3 Constitution loss per death. I only played a little bit of DAoC but I have a friend who swears by it and still plays on a private server the way I still play EQ. I should really give that server a chance sometime, DAoC definitely had some smart ideas. Another really cool one was Shadowbane, which again I only played for the briefest of bits and I kinda regret it. That game let players build their own towns and stuff the way Star Wars Galaxies did. I would love to see more MMOs embrace that side of things. EVE Online is the only game really trying that at all right now, and its really cool but there's lots of things about EVE that just don't appeal to me the same way. I get tired of flying ships around, and warping from system to system having people just cloak and check system chat to see who enters the space. There's w-space which is cool too, but then its really a pain in the rear end to get around or do much...
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Mar 22, 2017 21:03
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Shadowbane was so drat good, the problem is one organized force could completely rule a server. If the sides were even somewhat matched or there was a bunch of smaller forces it was a dickload of fun.
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Mar 23, 2017 05:46
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I played DAoC pretty solidly on a free shard couple of years ago. One of the most populated ones is called Genesis. Worth giving it a go there if you've never played DAoC. Similarly to how P99 is supposed to be like the "Wonder days" of EQ, Genesis is set up before they added all the BS that broke the PvPers motivation to play the game....
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Mar 23, 2017 21:28
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Im pretty sure EVE is not the second biggest sub mmo around. Maybe Final Fantasy XIV
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Mar 23, 2017 21:45
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ESO is probably up there, not sure but I would guess 2nd through 4th
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Mar 23, 2017 23:18
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Zaphod42 posted:You're thinking too limited though. Yes, in classic EQ that's how it is. But duh, classic EQ has poo poo tons of problems. It was designed in 1999. Modern WoW is very accessible but it has problems too because everything feels generic and easy and pointless. Sure, in a broader context. I was specifically talking about an emulated or official progression EQ server though, so the discussion is more about how much you tweak and how much you keep 'classic'. The developers of P1999 seem firmly committed to keeping the game as close to the way it was way back when as is reasonably practical, and I think from a nostalgia perspective that makes a certain kind of sense. I'm not a purist though, and would accept some changes from classic EQ if I felt they improved the game substantially. Mostly, I'm debating whether I should keep playing P1999 or roll something on Agnarr when it gets released. P1999 pros : - classic everquest for maximum nostalgia - free - has had stable population levels for years - no boxing, strictly enforced P1999 cons: - will be stuck in velious forever - I'm late to the party - Raiding scene is a toxic cesspool Agnarr pros: - Get in on the ground floor, everyone starts with a rusty dagger - Luclin / PoP raiding is fun - Can raid and maintain a social life Agnarr cons: - It's expansion locked but otherwise modern EQ with revamps, balance changes, cash shop - Population will dwindle when a newer progression server gets released
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Mar 23, 2017 23:44
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Athropos posted:Im pretty sure EVE is not the second biggest sub mmo around. Maybe Final Fantasy XIV Okay I said 'probably' but I was too hasty, you're right, its more like 5th. Its WoW and then GW2 (since there's no sub) and then FFXIV and then ESO and EVE. But the point is EVE still gets huuuuge numbers and manages to at least compete with the big boys. There's tons of themepark wow-style MMOs that don't pull in 1/10th the numbers that EVE does. Philonius posted:Sure, in a broader context. I was specifically talking about an emulated or official progression EQ server though, so the discussion is more about how much you tweak and how much you keep 'classic'. The developers of P1999 seem firmly committed to keeping the game as close to the way it was way back when as is reasonably practical, and I think from a nostalgia perspective that makes a certain kind of sense. I'm not a purist though, and would accept some changes from classic EQ if I felt they improved the game substantially. Oh sure, P1999 should stay how it is for me. Its like a museum of a great once-game. A living museum you can play around in and experience. But I'm just saying, the logic that hardcore EQ style MMOs are dead and gone and only WoW style can survive now is false. And clearly so, since lots of us care enough to play P1999. I'd really really love to see a modern MMO with modern graphics and modern design systems but a bit more like original EQ, a bit more sandbox and hardcore and punishing than WoW. And it seems even lots of WoW's fans want that since they're setting up vanilla WoW servers like Nostalrius. But MMOs being as expensive as they are to develop I doubt any publishers will take the chance. We'll get a few weirdo sandbox things like ARK and Conan where you run around naked, beating each other with sticks, and that's probably as close as I'll get to what I want.  Everquest Next
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Mar 24, 2017 01:37
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Philonius posted:- Luclin raiding is fun This is incorrect. Source: I just did Luclin for 4 months
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Mar 24, 2017 05:50
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xZAOx posted:This is incorrect. Luclin raiding is fun for about a month.
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Mar 24, 2017 06:12
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Zaphod42 posted:We'll get a few weirdo sandbox things like ARK and Conan where you run around naked, beating each other with sticks, and that's probably as close as I'll get to what I want. ARK is tons of fun actually.... nothing like using your Kraken to kill Mosasaurs!
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Mar 24, 2017 06:20
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FknMeh posted:ARK is tons of fun actually.... nothing like using your Kraken to kill Mosasaurs! Oh sure, I have ARK. But a little more structure would add a lot, some EQ style towns, quests, NPCs, stuff like that. Maybe even some dungeons. But games like Ark and Conan are made on a shoestring budget so they can't really do content in that way. Its just a player sandbox. Ultimately I soured on ARK because PvE I didn't have enough stuff to do and it didn't feel very rewarding, but PvP, while very fun, whenever you log out at night you wake up the next day covered in poop and all your things you spent hours building have been destroyed. So screw that. Day-Z was fun too, but ultimately too shallow and frustrating. I really want an MMO that has that kind of open sandbox gameplay but a little more structure to it.
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Mar 24, 2017 07:27
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Zaphod42 posted:I'd really really love to see a modern MMO with modern graphics and modern design systems but a bit more like original EQ, a bit more sandbox and hardcore and punishing than WoW. And it seems even lots of WoW's fans want that since they're setting up vanilla WoW servers like Nostalrius. Dude, Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen (terrible name) is EXACTLY what you're looking for: https://pantheonmmo.com/ It's being designed to play like classic EQ. Even uses essentially the same classes. Brad McQuaid's heavily involved.
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Mar 24, 2017 15:43
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Brad McQuade even stopped trying to develop it through that two-person Evangelical Christian Game Studio!
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Mar 24, 2017 17:29
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I got the itch. Back in as Sinai the monk. Looking for an invite!
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Mar 24, 2017 22:04
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Need someone with admin rights to get on and hand out some privileges. Hard to add any goons when it seems like 1 or 2 people are able to invite.
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Mar 24, 2017 22:41
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I'd like to join up - level 18 enchanter named Asfestor.
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Mar 25, 2017 04:30
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Rand Ecliptic posted:Dude, Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen (terrible name) is EXACTLY what you're looking for: https://pantheonmmo.com/ No Bard 
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Mar 25, 2017 04:59
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KingFisher posted:No Bard There are bards. The site is out of date. They have a bard subforum even. They hope to have it ready by "launch".
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Mar 25, 2017 06:47
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Is class balance still a joke on (new) progression servers? I played a bit on Lockjaw I think it was but gave up because mage pets were hitting harder than my rogue could backstab
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Mar 26, 2017 22:28
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Did everyone wanting invites into Unknown Guild get them?
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Mar 28, 2017 02:24
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You guys should try p2002 if you want something still fun classic eq but less grindy. It's the 2nd most populated EQ server behind p99 I believe. Luclin is getting released next month and it will eventually stop at PoP. It has a +20% overall exp bonus compared to p99 and runs double exp weekends once a month.
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Mar 28, 2017 04:22
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