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Jack Trades posted:By letting more and more machine intelligence "parts", represented by the holo girls, gather in the same place without destroying them she eventually caused them to start arguing with each other. Oh man, this is so thematically perfect considering all the poo poo happening in the setting. I had assumed a much more boring "memory leak" interpretation, but I like yours much better.
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Mar 25, 2017 02:57
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Tarezax posted:The Romeos and Juliets play within the game is so Shakespearean, it's amazing Whoops. My bad. Fixed.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:00
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Snak posted:Oh man, this is so thematically perfect considering all the poo poo happening in the setting. In a sense it's data overflow, the more copies were around, the faster the machines were evolving and learning new factors, until there was a split between two valid but contradictory courses of action (learn more x kill the threat).
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Mar 25, 2017 03:01
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Adams obsession also plays into each Machines 'gift' The gift represents some aspect of humanity the machines think what makes something human and how they tie into each zone or machine community. Love?- Desert Hate - Adam Family - Eve Fun - Park Loyalty - Forest War? - The Flooded City? Peace - Village Religion - Factory I'm prob getting some wrong and missing some.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:03
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Dias posted:In a sense it's data overflow, the more copies were around, the faster the machines were evolving and learning new factors, until there was a split between two valid but contradictory courses of action (learn more x kill the threat). I mean, that's not really what data overflow is, in computer terms. Romeos and Juliets was amazing. I think that I recorded it on my ps4. I should trim it up and upload it. edit: ^ Each Treasure Had Its Own Shape. Really good observation.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:04
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Also while 9S is inside the machine network he notices the machines copying all these social concepts but finds it strange they seem to be purposefully setting themselves up to fail by repeating the same mistakes over and over despite knowing full well they are capable of evolved thought and change by how they continuously improve themselves to fight better. Dunno if this is suppose to be a hint about the Red Girls control over the machines or if its some meta commentary about the human condition but it's a nice touch.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:09
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Monomythian posted:Adams obsession also plays into each Machines 'gift'  Love. Love. Love. Love.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:11
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I kept shooting the red girls and it finished decently quick as my pod counted up a percent thing. Like, I interpreted it as don't kill them, but I ran around a bit and nothing seemed to be happening. So I kept shooting them.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:12
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The rate they appear increases as time goes on so even if you keep killing them I think their replication rate eventually outstrips your ability to clear them out.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:13
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Oh another thing. The Flood City being a huge question mark when it comes to machine gifts also goes hand in hand with why I think Pure Waters and Black Pearls are so rare and that is because the Flood City was absolutely suppose to be an entire zone that ended up getting cut. Would explain why a named zone is also 30 seconds long and why they shoved a DLC gate there.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:19
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Monomythian posted:Also while 9S is inside the machine network he notices the machines copying all these social concepts but finds it strange they seem to be purposefully setting themselves up to fail by repeating the same mistakes over and over despite knowing full well they are capable of evolved thought and change by how they continuously improve themselves to fight better. I definitely thought it was a commentary on how humans do the same thing. I think it also ties into the concept of the war. The Android side has basically decided that the problem is they need to fight the war better. They never evolve beyond the idea that they need to destroy the machines, just get better and better at building soldiers to do it.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:20
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Having now finished route A-E I'd just like to say it's really disappointing how B2 gets offed like a chump 10 minutes after the B ending and then just ...never comes back. I kept expecting her to pop back into the story. I mean she's in all the games art and she's a robot and shes the drat main character! It's like the most perfect excuse to have a bullshit Jesus resurrection and the game doesn't go for it. She doesn't even get a cool death, just 'oh drat you're infected now time to die'. Why couldn't she save herself like 9S does in the tower? We see A2 using her pod to hack so why can't 2B use hers to hack the virus to death?
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Mar 25, 2017 03:20
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sunken fleet posted:Having now finished route A-E I'd just like to say it's really disappointing how B2 gets offed like a chump 10 minutes after the B ending and then just ...never comes back. I kept expecting her to pop back into the story. I mean she's in all the games art and she's a robot and shes the drat main character! It's like the most perfect excuse to have a bullshit Jesus resurrection and the game doesn't go for it. She doesn't even get a cool death, just 'oh drat you're infected now time to die'. Why couldn't she save herself like 9S does in the tower? We see A2 using her pod to hack so why can't 2B use hers to hack the virus to death? Honestly, 9S is the main character.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:23
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sunken fleet posted:Having now finished route A-E I'd just like to say it's really disappointing how B2 gets offed like a chump 10 minutes after the B ending and then just ...never comes back. I kept expecting her to pop back into the story. I mean she's in all the games art and she's a robot and shes the drat main character! It's like the most perfect excuse to have a bullshit Jesus resurrection and the game doesn't go for it. She doesn't even get a cool death, just 'oh drat you're infected now time to die'. Why couldn't she save herself like 9S does in the tower? We see A2 using her pod to hack so why can't 2B use hers to hack the virus to death? I honestly think that A2 getting all of 2B's memories through the sword kind of... merged them. Like, A2 is still A2, but she starts giving a poo poo about Pascal awfully fast, which I felt like was 2B's memories of Pascal manifest and influencing A2's personality. edit: ^ also that.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:25
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A2 is the prototype with all the cool extra poo poo installed in her, 2B is the production model and doesn't have the ability to hack because it was given fully to the scanner types after the prototype run. Or so I imagine. Also, A2 cutting her hair after receiving 2B's memories is symbolic of her carrying on 2B's legacy. Post haircut their faces are now completely identical. The bullshit Jesus resurrection is what you had to fight for in ending E. Tarezax fucked around with this message at 03:29 on Mar 25, 2017 |
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Mar 25, 2017 03:25
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Snak posted:I honestly think that A2 getting all of 2B's memories through the sword kind of... merged them. Like, A2 is still A2, but she starts giving a poo poo about Pascal awfully fast, which I felt like was 2B's memories of Pascal manifest and influencing A2's personality. They did use A2's personality data to make 2B. 2B dying really hurt 
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Mar 25, 2017 03:27
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sunken fleet posted:Having now finished route A-E I'd just like to say it's really disappointing how B2 gets offed like a chump 10 minutes after the B ending and then just ...never comes back. I kept expecting her to pop back into the story. I mean she's in all the games art and she's a robot and shes the drat main character! It's like the most perfect excuse to have a bullshit Jesus resurrection and the game doesn't go for it. She doesn't even get a cool death, just 'oh drat you're infected now time to die'. Why couldn't she save herself like 9S does in the tower? We see A2 using her pod to hack so why can't 2B use hers to hack the virus to death? 100% agree, its my biggest complaint about the game. 2B gets hours of development then dropped before its concluded, while A2 wraps up the ending with no development at all. Like was 2Bs death suppose to be some kind of shocking twist about the horrors of war? Yeah ok I get it, but there is a time and place for that kind of twist and this was not it because you just replaced your co-lead with someone who is 90% the same anyway near the end of the story. Pointless and stupid because you could have had 2B do all the things A2 did with the slightest of story tweaks, even fighting 9S. Edit:It could have been something as simple as A2 giving 2B her body to avoid the corruption since she had nothing left to live for and 9S still would have went crazy thinking A2 killed her not realised A2 is now 2B Your Moms Ahegao fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Mar 25, 2017 |
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Mar 25, 2017 03:28
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Monomythian posted:100% agree, its my biggest complaint about the game. 2B gets hours of development then dropped before its concluded, while A2 wraps up the ending with no development at all. 2B's hours of development didn't drop from the game just because she died. In fact she became the most important character at that point.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:29
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Supremezero posted:Honestly, 9S is the main character. Nah. Pod 042 is the main character .
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Mar 25, 2017 03:31
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Romeos and Juliets is literally a summary of the game's plot.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:32
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Monomythian posted:100% agree, its my biggest complaint about the game. 2B gets hours of development then dropped before its concluded, while A2 wraps up the ending with no development at all. Yea reading these replies sort of made me think 'why is A2 even a character?' Like she's physically identical to 2B and she gets 2B's memories. So she's just 2B but angrier? With an even more tragic past? I dunno if I missed like a huge chunk of backstory that would make me care about her somehow but I had like 80% completion on side quests and all the main routes so if it's more hidden then that... Supremezero posted:Honestly, 9S is the main character.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:34
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Snak posted:Romeos and Juliets is literally a summary of the game's plot. It's what I show to people to show them the tone of the game. It's perfect. Edit: I see A2 as a version of 2B who took a different path when faced with the loss of loved ones. A2 throws herself into killing machines and cuts off all contact with others, while 2B is clearly tormented by her love of 9S and her duty to kill him but holds onto that love regardless. We follow A2 as she learns mentally and physically to be more like 2B. She reconnects with Anemone, and forms a bond with Pascal. The old A2 would have just killed 9S in the final fight, but instead she either sacrifices herself to save him or hesitates on the killing blow due to 2B's final wish. Tarezax fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Mar 25, 2017 |
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Mar 25, 2017 03:34
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In the duel at the end 9S looks like Eve with the red eyes and the black stuff kind of covering his face. Like he's turning into the same thing.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:38
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A2 and 2B are practically the same person, except that 9S hates one and loved the other. Even though A2 only killed 2B because she was infected and did it with 2B's blessing and 2B gave her her legacy. That's human nature.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:41
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SHISHKABOB posted:In the duel at the end 9S looks like Eve with the red eyes and the black stuff kind of covering his face. Like he's turning into the same thing. It was weird at the end of A/B when he gets corrupted and starts magnetizing all the metal that Eve was previously manipulating as well.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:41
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OddObserver posted:Nah. Pod 042 is the main character . This
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Mar 25, 2017 03:41
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SHISHKABOB posted:Are you guys playing on hard? Because while it wasn't exactly the most fun boss, it wasn't that bad. Jack Trades posted:I'm pretty sure it's possible if you have enough prior experience with shmups. I didn't see any unfairness in the patterns, they were just hard as balls.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:49
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Monomythian posted:Dunno if this is suppose to be a hint about the Red Girls control over the machines or if its some meta commentary about the human condition but it's a nice touch. I took it as the machines missing the point of what being human entails, much like the androids. The whole scenario reminds me a lot of Dark City: just as the Strangers inject people with various archetypical personalities (the hooker with a heart of gold, the hardboiled detective, the serial killer, etc.), the machines create different communities representative of different aspects of humanity, and the androids manufacture different models who fulfill different tasks in combat, all under the assumption that it's the "features" of a human being - the easily explained surface elements and quirks of personality - that make someone human. In Automata, what makes someone human is being connected to another in a deep, meaningful way. Pascal is the closest thing the machines manage to make to being human, because it's patently obvious that he's not playing house: his devastation is real, and it's the fault of the Terminals that they don't realize how profound the creation of an entity like Pascal is. Tarezax posted:I see A2 as a version of 2B who took a different path when faced with the loss of loved ones. A2 throws herself into killing machines and cuts off all contact with others, while 2B is clearly tormented by her love of 9S and her duty to kill him but holds onto that love regardless. We follow A2 as she learns mentally and physically to be more like 2B. She reconnects with Anemone, and forms a bond with Pascal. The old A2 would have just killed 9S in the final fight, but instead she either sacrifices herself to save him or hesitates on the killing blow due to 2B's final wish. She serves as a very important foil to 9S, which is probably why she was included. This is made especially obvious during the entire Tower sequence, as the entire design of the tower is "upside down": 9S has become an unhinged killer, and A2 has becoming a loving saint. Vermain fucked around with this message at 03:56 on Mar 25, 2017 |
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Mar 25, 2017 03:51
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Someone said that past a certain point, their shots just started passing through names without hitting them, meaning it's actually impossible. My current plan is to 100% the game on my current save, then sacrifice it, and start a new save on hard, since I've done normal this whole time. Edit: ^ I'm not sure the the red girls were directly having machines do thise things. The archives I read said they just increased entropy in the machines learning so they would learn about more stuff that wasn't applicable to combat. So that they would be less efficient fighters, so that they wouldn't win. Snak fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Mar 25, 2017 |
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Mar 25, 2017 03:52
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OddObserver posted:Nah. Pod 042 is the main character . I really like the people that compare Pod 042 and Pod 153 to the Greek Chorus in old Greek theater, except in a postmodern twist, the Greek Chorus upends the system to forge a new ending.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:54
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sunken fleet posted:So she's just 2B but angrier? With an even more tragic past? I dunno if I missed like a huge chunk of backstory that would make me care about her somehow but I had like 80% completion on side quests and all the main routes so if it's more hidden then that... Yeah she is, but the game sure as poo poo goes out of its way not to say that. I probably had 90% completion for everything before I finally deleted my save and I still didn't find anything concerning A2 expect the book she finds in the tower (which you have to remember and read, because it doesn't show it to you at the time). I think there is something on the terminal in the camp too but its super easy to miss. The document is pretty interesting. It's about how A2s incredible fighting potential and betrayal surprised the Red Girls despite all indications otherwise. This caused them to use her body and mind as the base for models like YoRHa androids like 2B because such potential to go beyond their calculations would speed up their evolution radically.
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Mar 25, 2017 03:56
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Monomythian posted:Yeah she is, but the game sure as poo poo goes out of its way not to say that. I probably had 90% completion for everything before I finally deleted my save and I still didn't find anything concerning A2 expect the book she finds in the tower (which you have to remember and read, because it doesn't show it to you at the time). I think there is something on the terminal in the camp too but its super easy to miss. I'm pretty sure that document is an internal Project YoRHa report that the machines stole off the Bunker's server before it was scuttled
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Mar 25, 2017 03:59
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Monomythian posted:100% agree, its my biggest complaint about the game. 2B gets hours of development then dropped before its concluded, while A2 wraps up the ending with no development at all. There was definitely more room for 2B to develop as a character, but thematically, her getting killed for real was fitting. Loss is a major part of the story and having the supposed protagonist permanently die halfway through the game was great. Her being resurrected wouldn't have ruined the story for me, but keeping her dead was ballsy and I appreciated that. The biggest problem I have with the game happens to be about the part I liked the most. Ending E spoiler: Calling for help during the credits was the greatest thing I've seen in gaming in a while. I want everyone who plays this to experience that moment themselves and not have to resort to looking up the ending on the internet. If you don't have a network connection during that part you're going to miss out. Hommando fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Mar 25, 2017 |
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Mar 25, 2017 04:02
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Snak posted:Edit: ^ I'm not sure the the red girls were directly having machines do thise things. The archives I read said they just increased entropy in the machines learning so they would learn about more stuff that wasn't applicable to combat. So that they would be less efficient fighters, so that they wouldn't win. According to Jackass's report, the "deficiencies" in the network that led to the creation of Pascal and the Forest King happened before the Terminals appeared, although the deficiencies were still initiated intentionally.
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Mar 25, 2017 04:04
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Motherfucker (A/B) gently caress these runaway Resistance assholes! I did their quest and coughed up the 50k they wanted on my A run. Now I'm on B and I just got to the village for the first time, and HERE THEY ARE AGAIN as if I never gave them anything. Now they're gonna ask me to go back to the factory to get their poo poo and then tell me to fork over the 50k again. Goddamn it. Is this quest actually worth doing? Like, is there a weapon in it for me or anything. I want to tell them to gently caress off. Seriously. ALL MY MONEY.  Oxxidation posted:Has anyone else noticed a weird "iris" effect when playing this? The corners of my TV during gameplay seem darker than usual, making it look like the game's being viewed through an eye or something. Don't know if it's just me being neurotic. You're not, I noticed it too doing the desert relic garbage where the screen is largely the same color. There's a faintly darker border around the screen. Made me freak out for a moment because I thought I'd burned the pause menu shapes into my tv or something.
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Mar 25, 2017 04:04
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melodicwaffle posted:Motherfucker (A/B) gently caress these runaway Resistance assholes! I did their quest and coughed up the 50k they wanted on my A run. Now I'm on B and I just got to the village for the first time, and HERE THEY ARE AGAIN as if I never gave them anything. Now they're gonna ask me to go back to the factory to get their poo poo and then tell me to fork over the 50k again. Goddamn it. Is this quest actually worth doing? Like, is there a weapon in it for me or anything. I want to tell them to gently caress off. You didn't finish the quest! Owned.
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Mar 25, 2017 04:06
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So for path C Does it matter who you play as? I picked A2 until it forced me to pick 9S. If I picked 9S first would anything be different?
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Mar 25, 2017 04:05
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melodicwaffle posted:Motherfucker (A/B) gently caress these runaway Resistance assholes! I did their quest and coughed up the 50k they wanted on my A run. Now I'm on B and I just got to the village for the first time, and HERE THEY ARE AGAIN as if I never gave them anything. Now they're gonna ask me to go back to the factory to get their poo poo and then tell me to fork over the 50k again. Goddamn it. Is this quest actually worth doing? Like, is there a weapon in it for me or anything. I want to tell them to gently caress off. The Wandering Couple quest is worth ot for the ending of the quest. "Women can be scary"
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Mar 25, 2017 04:05
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Nuebot posted:So for path C Does it matter who you play as? I picked A2 until it forced me to pick 9S. If I picked 9S first would anything be different? No.
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Mar 25, 2017 04:07
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SHISHKABOB posted:You didn't finish the quest! Owned. Trolled by Cavia...  So how do I finish that quest then? Nothing popped up telling me to do something after that.
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Mar 25, 2017 04:08
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