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Baronjutter posted:Nope, that's Midtown, central park would just be a few blocks north juuuust cut off from the scene. If they had angled the camera down even just a couple degrees you'd have seen it, but they would have had to have rendered like 100x more stuff. I think they just have a more detailed model of midtown since that's where the UN is. Also I can see the empire state building so that's still around. Would be hundreds of years old at this point. The southern edge of Central Park is almost in line with the Queensboro Bridge (it actually extends about half a block South of it), which is just visible off the corner of the dropship. If you follow that line, you should definitely see a portion of Central Park in frame.
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Mar 29, 2017 18:50
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I decided to work out how many Martian would be serving in their military if everybody has to serve. If we are super conservative it would mean 400m-500m service personnel, aged 18-26, not including career soldiers. That seems like...a lot.
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Mar 29, 2017 19:30
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Everybody serves != Everybody serves in military full time. Could be a Switzerland style militia thing
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Mar 29, 2017 19:32
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If you think of Mars as space Israel it starts making a lot more sense.
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Mar 29, 2017 19:33
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Collateral posted:I decided to work out how many Martian would be serving in their military if everybody has to serve. Expanse is bad with numbers. Also conscription in most countries is like maybe a year or less of military daycare and make-work projects then being an extremely poorly trained reserve for the rest of your adult life with the occasional refresher course.
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Mar 29, 2017 19:35
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Demiurge4 posted:If you think of Mars as space Israel it starts making a lot more sense. Which fits in with Belters being Palestinian.
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Mar 29, 2017 19:36
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Earth is the space UN. …wait a minute…
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Mar 29, 2017 20:05
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To me it feels like the setting is a rather overt metaphor is for the actual colonialist era with Earth being old europe, Mars being the united states and the belters being the indigenous population in all the exploited colonies.
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Mar 29, 2017 20:15
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Bert Roberge posted:Syfy is now spoiling their own show. Man I can't wait for tonight's ep, those are some great damned scenes heh.
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Mar 29, 2017 21:00
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I'm really pissed off that Syfy spoils their own show every Wednesday at 10pm
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Mar 29, 2017 21:23
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emanresu tnuocca posted:To me it feels like the setting is a rather overt metaphor is for the actual colonialist era with Earth being old europe, Mars being the united states and the belters being the indigenous population in all the exploited colonies. Wouldn't Belters be the peasant labor complaining about taxes on tea?
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Mar 29, 2017 21:25
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Maybe not every work of fiction is a 1:1 translation of pop-history?
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Mar 29, 2017 21:25
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Phi230 posted:I'm really pissed off that Syfy spoils their own show every Wednesday at 10pm I'm quite angry they didn't require the books to be withdrawn from publication as a condition of making the show. Their actors should also stop posting on twitter that a forthcoming episode is going to be good. If it's good I want that to be a surprise!
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Mar 29, 2017 21:26
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Wait...I thought this was all allegory for the Bronze Age Collapse....
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Mar 29, 2017 21:35
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gohmak posted:Wouldn't Belters be the peasant labor complaining about taxes on tea? Not really because the primary movers of the American revolution were bourgeois and the Belters are very much proletarian. I think that the labor uprisings in the late 19th century and early 20th century America are far better analogies. The mining corporations and their robber baron owners using PMCs and state forces to brutally put down labor uprisings is much more like the relationship between Belters and the Inners than a bunch of well-to-do property owners getting pissed about taxes on luxury goods and paper. You even have a PMC in the setting that's a portmanteau of Pinkerton and Blackwater (Pinkwater.) Some historical examples of labor massacres in the US from that period: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludlow_Massacre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbine_Mine_massacre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lattimer_massacre https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bay_View_massacre
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Mar 29, 2017 21:45
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Earth is Something Awful, Mars is 4chan, the Belt is Kiwi Farms.
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Mar 29, 2017 21:49
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emanresu tnuocca posted:To me it feels like the setting is a rather overt metaphor is for the actual colonialist era with Earth being old europe, Mars being the united states and the belters being the indigenous population in all the exploited colonies. And there you have the basic premise of the Expanse. Add to that all the historical precedents you can think of for flavor. Mars is pretty vividly Israel, 19th Century America, and the USSR all at the same time in different ways. The Belt is the modern Third World, various native peoples, and workers in an industrial era factory town. And so on. A lot of things fit incredibly well because it's a well constructed world, history is long, and humans are great at seeing patterns. *Living in massive space stations or hollowed out asteroids makes more sense to me than living at the bottom of a gravity well, but I guess the long term issues with launching and landing stuff on a planet/moon weren't as pressing as the initial investment cost of making a space habitat were to the people in the Expanse. And in fairness they do talk about people living in "the Lagranges" around Earth, but I don't think they go into any detail about what's there.
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Mar 29, 2017 22:33
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I always think the expanse got the geography and politics entirely wrong, but it makes for a decent fictional setting. 99% of the population should be living within the earth-moon sphere, mostly at lagrange points. Asteroid mining would either be remote and automated, or there'd be a continuous train of asteroids from the belt (after we've mined all the near earth asteroids, of which there are MANY) coming towards the earth-moon for processing here. Mars might get a science station, something like the south pole stations we have today, but not cities. Eventually you'd get to the point where resources are plentiful enough and space so developed that groups of people could fund their own colonies, sort of like the mormons did. If they wanted isolation they may make the trip out to the belt or mars orbit or anywhere really. But once you get away from the earth-moon sphere and it's orbit you'll be dealing with extreme isolation and trade that takes years and can be very orbit-sensitive and have to deal with syncing up your optimal launch windows. But there's going to be pioneers and people with weird politics or religions that will want to bugger off away from earth and enjoy the isolation, or see it as a challenge. But resources and space are plentiful and with "only" a couple O'Neil cylinders and some asteroids to chomp on you can easily be self sufficient for most things and be fine with the once a year shipment from earth. Once you've got some more neighbours to trade with things become easier, and eventually little trading communities would form based on common orbits/proximity. The main source of tension could still be economic, but it would be the poverty and economic irrelevance of the earth vs the nearly post-scarcity plenty and productivity of space. It's cheap as free to ship stuff TO earth, but worth more than its weight in gold for earth to ship anything out. Other than rare organics earth would have absolutely nothing of value for space, while also not being able to compete with it industrially. If this was a brutal capitalist setting the earth could simply fade into economic irrelevance and be ignored like a global detroit or flint. And earth on its own could never be a threat to space based powers. A spacer could shoot down that huge heavy 8 billion dollar missile that needs to achieve escape velocity with a 1 million dollar anti-missile that's small and nimble and already in space, and has the resources to have thousands to counter every single earth weapon. Being at the bottom of a gravity well is absolutely economically and militarily crippling. So another source of tension could be that earth directly controls a lot of colonies and space resources in order to supply itself while "giving nothing back" and space randians could see this as parasitic behavior and dream of a future unburdened of having to support earth's dead weight because the market has spoken.
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Mar 29, 2017 22:57
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Baronjutter posted:But once you get away from the earth-moon sphere and it's orbit you'll be dealing with extreme isolation and trade that takes years and can be very orbit-sensitive and have to deal with syncing up your optimal launch windows. Magic fusion drives.
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Mar 29, 2017 23:04
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Heads up, audiobook people! The new Jefferson Mays recording of Cibola Burn has been released, and people who bought the lovely Erik Davies version from Audible get the new one free. Just re-download the book and you're good to go.
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Mar 29, 2017 23:08
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Phi230 posted:I'm really pissed off that Syfy spoils their own show every Wednesday at 10pm Usually they wait until the episode airs to post an 'inside the episode' youtube clip. They posted an 'inside the episode' clip for The Magicians a day before it aired too.
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Mar 29, 2017 23:42
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Why wouldn't Earth just run their own asteroid mines in orbit and get to post-scarcity the same way? If we own the mines there's nothing else we need in space. At any rate the modern economy is increasingly service based and Earth would compete just fine in services - maybe become like Hong Kong or something.
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Mar 29, 2017 23:44
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Toast Museum posted:Heads up, audiobook people! The new Jefferson Mays recording of Cibola Burn has been released, and people who bought the lovely Erik Davies version from Audible get the new one free. Just re-download the book and you're good to go. Hopefully it's something they'll fix soon, but it looks like it lacks the usual Kindle integration at the moment. With every other Expanse novel, you get a discount on the Audible version if you already have the Kindle e-book, and they've also got a nifty feature where it'll pick up where you left off when you switch between the audiobook and e-book.
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Mar 29, 2017 23:50
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Number Ten Cocks posted:Earth is Something Awful, Mars is 4chan, the Belt is Kiwi Farms. This is the only analogy that makes sense to me.
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Mar 30, 2017 00:09
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I think they don't orbit and consume asteroids around Earth because a hundred years ago politicians freaked everyone out about how easy it would be to tip one down the gravity well and made that poo poo illegal. This is not based on anything canonical, but it's a pretty valid guess IMO. Dumb humans being inefficient for dumb human reasons always trumps better solutions. E: I bet Mars got colonized because of a couple nations dick-measuring each other, too. Initial outlay on a colony would probably be cheaper than actually assembling an O'neil cylinder or something; look for the short term solutions and extrapolate from there. NmareBfly fucked around with this message at 01:17 on Mar 30, 2017 |
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Mar 30, 2017 01:13
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I can't imagine anyone would ever be crazy enough to do that, though.
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Mar 30, 2017 01:16
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Earth is The Gem, mars is the Bella Union edit: the protomolecule is Hearst
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Mar 30, 2017 01:34
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NmareBfly posted:I think they don't orbit and consume asteroids around Earth because a hundred years ago politicians freaked everyone out about how easy it would be to tip one down the gravity well and made that poo poo illegal. My take on AI in the Expanse is similar, too. We know the Roci has a pretty powerful computer system that can basically handle everything itself, so I could see the governments going 'well, poo poo, to prevent one power from developing autonomous kill-ships, we should put strict measures on what sort of AI can be developed'.
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Mar 30, 2017 01:43
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NmareBfly posted:I think they don't orbit and consume asteroids around Earth because a hundred years ago politicians freaked everyone out about how easy it would be to tip one down the gravity well and made that poo poo illegal. The plot of The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress is basically the loonies (belters on the moon) get sick of sending all their goods to Earth and getting poo poo in return, so they start loading the railgun launched cargo pods with rocks. They basically won a war of independence against the nuclear equipped space battleship flying earthers by chucking rocks down a gravity well.
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Mar 30, 2017 01:44
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I read that in middle school and still feel bad for Mike sometimes.  Isn't there supposed to be a movie in production? NmareBfly fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Mar 30, 2017 |
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Mar 30, 2017 01:46
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Can't we have an episode in first person with Amos in a suit of power armor just purifying an entire station of everyone who hasn't shared a lasagna dinner with him?
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Mar 30, 2017 03:28
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Snowman Crossing posted:Can't we have an episode in first person with Amos in a suit of power armor just purifying an entire station of everyone who hasn't shared a lasagna dinner with him? As long as we also get one of Avasarala going around Earth angrily yelling at everyone with power then making them her political bitch.
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Mar 30, 2017 03:53
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I love that this show took the Southland route and just bleeps the dialogue. Not only does this give Avasarala her chops back, but now I can get the uncensored version on bluray!  Pharmaskittle posted:Earth is The Gem, mars is the Bella Union And the Belters are the whores...which means Fred is Trixie? Snowman Crossing posted:Can't we have an episode in first person with Amos in a suit of power armor just purifying an entire station of everyone who hasn't shared a lasagna dinner with him? MizPiz posted:As long as we also get one of Avasarala going around Earth angrily yelling at everyone with power then making them her political bitch. 
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Mar 30, 2017 04:19
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Snowman Crossing posted:Can't we have an episode in first person with Amos in a suit of power armor just purifying an entire station of everyone who hasn't shared a lasagna dinner with him? You say this like Amos would need power armor.
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Mar 30, 2017 05:40
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Toronto condos and highway overpass and polluted lovely "beach" make for a perfect post apocalyptic dystopian earth.
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Mar 30, 2017 05:44
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Well. So much for my "Basic isn't that bad" theory. Turns out Earth is explicitly a dystopian hellhole. Honestly, it seems like Ceres (at least Miller's neighborhood) and Tycho actually have things better. Prax and Amos are a really interesting pair to watch. I loved their conversation through the bushes in the wall- both how it was framed, and the interesting and terrifying things Prax was saying. Ecosystems separate from Earth's are fragile. Actually, pretty much every scene in this episode was interesting and fun to watch. Erinwright, Avasarala, Bobbie, Prax, Amos, and even Alex all had great moments. The tablet Avasarala gave Bobbie said "Caliban Project" at the top. (Very minor book information) Book 2 is called Caliban's War, but I don't think the word "Caliban" actually shows up in the book anywhere, which has confused a few people in the past. It's interesting that it's more explicit here in the show.
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Mar 30, 2017 06:04
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drunk zero-g Alex was fun.
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Mar 30, 2017 06:29
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Watching the characters talk to eachother in this show sometimes feels like I'm watching a live action version of jrpg party banter
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Mar 30, 2017 06:35
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Well I got my wish of more Ashur.Eiba posted:The tablet Avasarala gave Bobbie said "Caliban Project" at the top. (Very minor book information) Book 2 is called Caliban's War, but I don't think the word "Caliban" actually shows up in the book anywhere, which has confused a few people in the past. It's interesting that it's more explicit here in the show. I always thought the Caliban in Caliban's War was a reference to Shakespeare's The Tempest (I think it's The Tempest).
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Mar 30, 2017 07:50
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Mars is running an extremely efficient intel operation on Earth if they can find Draper on foot only a few minutes after Avasarala who has a VTOL and the entire Earth apparatus at her disposal to find her and hinder the Martians.
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Mar 30, 2017 08:06
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