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Will Perez force the dems left? This poll is closed. |
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| Yes |
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33 | 6.38% |
| No |
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343 | 66.34% |
| Keith Ellison |
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54 | 10.44% |
| Pete Buttigieg |
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71 | 13.73% |
| Jehmu Green |
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16 | 3.09% |
| Total: | 416 votes | ||
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Brainiac Five posted:This is a non-sequitur and it's a black mark against the colleges that graduated you that you post like this. You're overdue for your weekly suspension, please kindly shut your computer off and seek mental counseling.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:21
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MooselanderII posted:You're overdue for your weekly suspension, please kindly shut your computer off and seek mental counseling. Oh, how cute, the vermin are trying to protect each other.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:21
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Majorian posted:As someone posted a couple pages back, Democratic voters staying home was not a particularly large factor in Clinton not winning. Turnout was not the decisive factor in this election; Obama voters who defected to Trump were. hmmmmm quote:It's a very odd result. Turnout up slightly in terms of raw numbers, but down as a percentage of those eligible.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:22
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Brainiac Five posted:Oh, how cute, the vermin are trying to protect each other. Is that the autism speaking or your stupid looking avatar? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 30, 2017 02:21
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stone cold posted:By appealing to Trump voters who were one time Obama voters, over the people who didn't vote, you somehow don't see how that would be a slap in the face to the people Trump has sought to oppress and these people enthusiastically nodded along to? Again, why don't we appeal to the people who didn't vote? Because there is a lot of overlap between why the people who stayed home didn't vote, and why the people who defected to Trump did so as well. quote:Also, if we're talking about decisive votes, I mean Trump only won Michigan by 13000 votes, so is this an appeal to racists deal or get the loving vote out spend money and get actual boots on the ground kind of deal? Again, people who didn't get out the vote didn't play nearly as large a role as people who defected to Trump. Democrats can capture both by embracing left-wing economic populism. quote:Or maybe we can focus on labor principles that help all labor not just the wwc? That's literally what I"m advocating, Jesus Christ. 
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Mar 30, 2017 02:22
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MooselanderII posted:Is that the autism speaking or your stupid looking avatar? The Bernie poster, deprived of calling a person gay to own them, wets his index finger and flips the page. He reads aloud, "autistic", nods, and turns to post, swearing as he turns too fast and bangs his hang on the desk.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:23
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That's nice that you found article that's older and has data that's less up-to-date than the NYT one.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:24
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Majorian posted:Because there is a lot of overlap between why the people who stayed home didn't vote, and why the people who defected to Trump did so as well. This is not proven. This is not proven. No you're not, you're talking about appealing to a specifically white segment of voters that are relatively well-off. So either you're a moron or you're lying.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:26
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Brainiac Five posted:The Bernie poster, deprived of calling a person gay to own them, wets his index finger and flips the page. He reads aloud, "autistic", nods, and turns to post, swearing as he turns too fast and bangs his hang on the desk. What drug of choice are you using to stay up all night again to keep posting in this thread?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:26
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Majorian posted:Because there is a lot of overlap between why the people who stayed home didn't vote, and why the people who defected to Trump did so as well. Some people chose a racist; some didn't. Why do you think they're the same? Is somebody who hears about hate crimes the same as somebody who commits them? I mean, by your logic, yes. quote:That's literally what I"m advocating, Jesus Christ. No, what you're advocating is to once again tell minorities to step aside in the name of the rising tide lifting all boats. Typical.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:25
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Majorian posted:That's nice that you found article that's older and has data that's less up-to-date than the NYT one. It's nice that you're so set in your sympathy for the poor oppressed middle class whites that you think you're a leftist.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:25
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MooselanderII posted:What drug of choice are you using to stay up all night again to keep posting in this thread? I see you've skipped to "druggie".
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Mar 30, 2017 02:26
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Brainiac Five posted:I see you've skipped to "druggie". How about we get to the inevitable part of your posting cycle where you start issuing death threats?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:28
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MooselanderII posted:How about we get to the inevitable part of your posting cycle where you start issuing death threats? So, do you have any actual points to make dear or are you just gonna keep slapping your genitals on the table?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:28
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MooselanderII posted:How about we get to the inevitable part of your posting cycle where you start issuing death threats? No, I will not help you masturbate without pay, and you frankly can't afford what it would take for me to assist you with your little snuff fetish, kiddo. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 30, 2017 02:28
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MooselanderII posted:Is that the autism speaking or your stupid looking avatar? Look as much as I think effetronica is a repherhensible deama queen. Dont engage in pol bullshit.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:29
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stone cold posted:No, what you're advocating is to once again tell minorities to step aside in the name of the rising tide lifting all boats. Typical. You tipped your hand too much here. Your trolling game is weak, young'un.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:29
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Majorian posted:You tipped your hand too much here. Your trolling game is weak, young'un. Time to get back to packing my ears with powdered acai. So why do you believe that post to be trolling.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:29
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Majorian posted:You tipped your hand too much here. Your trolling game is weak, young'un. This isn't trolling you, you idiot, you've repeatedly told the consistently Dem voting base of POC and minority voters to step aside so you can appeal to the "economically anxious" whites. Then, when confronted by the evidence that these voters were motivated by racism far more than economic or trade policy, you doubled down. You're an intellectually hollow racist.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:31
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Brainiac Five posted:No, I will not help you masturbate without pay, and you frankly can't afford what it would take for me to assist you with your little snuff fetish, kiddo. Your methed out posting cycle is set to devolve into such threats either tonight or tomorrow, why not just do us all a favor and self probate?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:30
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Brainiac Five posted:you weaselly little Valley motherfucker Are you JK Rowling?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:31
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stone cold posted:This isn't trolling you, you idiot, you've repeatedly told the consistently Dem voting base of POC and minority voters to step aside so you can appeal to the "economically anxious" whites. Then, when confronted by the evidence that these voters were motivated by racism far more than economic or trade policy, you doubled down. You're an intellectually hollow racist. Yeah considering more blacks and latinos turned for Trump then for Romney it might just be that its not just Whites who are economically anxious.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:33
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MooselanderII posted:Your methed out posting cycle is set to devolve into such threats either tonight or tomorrow, why not just do us all a favor and self probate? Are you telling me to kill myself here or is this some kind of asinine analogy where you want to feel like a big boy without actually risking anything? Tight Booty Shorts posted:Are you JK Rowling? Is there any member of your immediate family or circle of acquaintances that wouldn't cheer if you got hit by lightning? Crowsbeak posted:Yeah considering more blacks and latinos turned for Trump then for Romney it might just be that its not just Whites who are economically anxious. Thanks, Mr. Streicher, but you need to be able to spell before we can accept your freelance submissions.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:33
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stone cold posted:This isn't trolling you, you idiot, you've repeatedly told the consistently Dem voting base of POC and minority voters to step aside so you can appeal to the "economically anxious" whites. Nah, I haven't done that at all actually. Also, there are a lot of people of color in the Rust Belt who would benefit tremendously from the programs I've advocated here, so your argument is about as dumb as it gets. I know you're not actually that dumb. So, nice try. 
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Mar 30, 2017 02:34
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Majorian posted:Nah, I haven't done that at all actually. Earlier you were talking about how only perception matters, but here you're talking about how only your image of what you're saying matters, so it really seems like you have no intellectual consistency whatsoever, and also you regularly attempt to engage in sex with small forest animals.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:35
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stone cold posted:This isn't trolling you, you idiot, you've repeatedly told the consistently Dem voting base of POC and minority voters to step aside so you can appeal to the "economically anxious" whites. Then, when confronted by the evidence that these voters were motivated by racism far more than economic or trade policy, you doubled down. You're an intellectually hollow racist. Except there's no evidence that a majority of Trump voters were motivated by racism, and good evidence that they were motivated by Clinton being dogshit.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:38
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Crowsbeak posted:Yeah considering more blacks and latinos turned for Trump then for Romney it might just be that its not just Whites who are economically anxious. [citation need] And please don't cite any non-bilingual polling numbers for latinx polling, tia. Majorian posted:Nah, I haven't done that at all actually. A rising tide lifts all boats, claims local man who doesn't think Trump voters are racists. What policies have you proposed to ensure that minorities also benefit so it's not Great Society all over again, exactly? And why, again, do you think we should slap our minority and POC voting base that consistently turns out for us for the middle class economically anxious whites?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:38
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Frijolero posted:Except there's no evidence that a majority of Trump voters were motivated by racism, and good evidence that they were motivated by Clinton being dogshit. JeffersonClay posted:Ok, if you think that data is flawed, here's another independent data set showing exactly the same thing. 
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Mar 30, 2017 02:39
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Frijolero posted:Except there's no evidence that a majority of Trump voters were motivated by racism, and good evidence that they were motivated by Clinton being dogshit. So a majority of Republican voters stayed home in order to make room for all the Trump voters who only cared about Hillary Clinton, just like you. I see. Next, you'll freak out about the existence of anime again.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:40
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Brainiac Five posted:So a majority of Republican voters stayed home in order to make room for all the Trump voters who only cared about Hillary Clinton, just like you. I see. Next, you'll freak out about the existence of anime again. Local man sees klansmen commit hate crime, quoted as saying "must be a group of lone wolves." Same man sees black child gunned down by cops, "why that kid must've been a thug gangster!"
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Mar 30, 2017 02:40
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Hmm yes, I make all my assertions from one source with a broken web link.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:40
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Frijolero posted:Hmm yes, I make all my assertions from one source with a broken web link. Was it the second gunman on the grassy knoll who made the graphs, or is Sean McElwee a concoction of the Hillarymen to destroy the natural alliance between white nationalists and people of color that the KKKlintons have so cruelly disrupted? http://www.salon.com/2016/11/27/obama-to-trump-voters-are-not-a-myth-mdash-but-theyre-also-not-the-real-story/
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Mar 30, 2017 02:44
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Majorian posted:Actually, it pretty clearly demonstrates that economic anxiety, and disappointment with a lack of assistance from Democratic politicians, played the dominant role in Rust Belt Democrats defecting to Trump. Even their preoccupation with immigration has a significant economic component; they almost certainly wouldn't care that much about undocumented workers, if they hadn't been fed the lie that those workers have stolen their jobs. The data does not back up the bolded assertion, at all.  Economic anxiety is what's causing a loving perfect correlation between racial animosity and trump opinion with former Obama voters? Its not really racism because the people are being racist about economics? The question didn't ask "did you lose your job because of minorities?" it asked "how likely is it many whites are unable to find a job because employers are hiring minorities instead?" That's not economic anxiety. That's racial anxiety, specifically anxiety that white supremacy is being eroded. Majorian posted:Because there is a lot of overlap between why the people who stayed home didn't vote, and why the people who defected to Trump did so as well. There is zero evidence that the voters who flipped from Obama to Trump were concerned about the size of the welfare state. There is significant evidence that racial animosity was the primary issue. Nothing supports these assertions. JeffersonClay fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Mar 30, 2017 |
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Mar 30, 2017 02:46
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Frijolero posted:Hmm yes, I make all my assertions from one source with a broken web link. No, you make your assertions without any sources at all. But please tell me how the people who voted for the man who promised to kick out all the Muslims and brown people, wants to terrorize the black community, and thinks all undocumented immigrants are rapists weren't racist at all. But please tell me more about how middle class whites are the paragons of progressivism and haven't consistently been reactionary fucks for, forever.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:47
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I really don't know how someone can say "these policies will benefit all people in the Rust Belt" and simultaneously insist they're not using "a rising tide lifts all boats" rhetoric.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:47
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stone cold posted:A rising tide lifts all boats, claims local man who doesn't think Trump voters are racists. Neither are things that I've ever argued. I have argued that racial resentment wasn't the decisive issue for why Obama voters defected to Trump, but that's kind of it. quote:What policies have you proposed to ensure that minorities also benefit so it's not Great Society all over again, exactly? My feelings are pretty similar to that of the SPUSA: "We fully support strong and expanded affirmative action programs to help combat the entrenched inertia of a racist and sexist system which profits from discrimination and social division. People of color, lesbians and gays, and other oppressed groups need independent organization to fight oppression. Racism will not be eliminated merely by eliminating capitalism." In the shorter-term, I support requiring banks to extend access into underserved minority neighborhoods, cracking down on police forces with records of brutality against minority groups, and obviously an end to the drug war. I also support financial reparations for the black community and other oppressed minority communities.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:48
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Brainiac Five posted:I really don't know how someone can say "these policies will benefit all people in the Rust Belt" and simultaneously insist they're not using "a rising tide lifts all boats" rhetoric. Programs like Medicaid do, in fact, benefit people across most demographics. That doesn't mean that there isn't more work that needs to be done to ensure that people in underprivileged demographics can enjoy the same level of benefits from society as more privileged groups.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:50
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Majorian posted:Programs like Medicaid do, in fact, benefit people across most demographics. That doesn't mean that there isn't more work that needs to be done to ensure that people in underprivileged demographics can enjoy the same level of benefits from society as more privileged groups. You didn't use to be this stupid. Did you suffer severe cranial trauma in the last few months?
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Mar 30, 2017 02:52
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Brainiac Five posted:You didn't use to be this stupid. Did you suffer severe cranial trauma in the last few months? Democrats should be pushing for the expansion of the welfare state. Programs like medicaid definitely help minorities (that's why they're vulnerable to the Southern Strategy). But there's no evidence whatsoever that the reason democrats lost this election, and former democratic supporters flipped to Trump, has anything to do with the size and scope of the welfare state that democrats were advocating.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:57
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JeffersonClay posted:The data does not back up the bolded assertion, at all. The data you're citing is from before the election, and as you yourself have admitted, its conclusion about turnout was quite wrong. So I'm having trouble taking this Salon piece more seriously than Cohn's more up-to-date analysis.
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Mar 30, 2017 02:59
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