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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:It's going to be even more ridiculous to re-harmonize everything again once they are ready to rejoin in 20 years or so. We'll just have Germany buy them piece by piece and they can live with German laws and regulations. A slow blitz.
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Mar 31, 2017 12:39
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Honj Steak posted:Just checking and rewriting the tens of thousands of EU regulations into Britain's own post-EU regulatory system will take many years and will seriously impede government and bureaucracy. Tusk is right in saying that there's no need for punishment, Brexit itself is a punishment without additional political action. This is a really glorious article about "Brexit by the numbers" - the whole thing is worth reading, but I'll C/P the big numbers here: quote:
All of that and more, supposedly to be sorted out in two years.
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Mar 31, 2017 12:42
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:It's going to be even more ridiculous to re-harmonize everything again once they are ready to rejoin in 20 years or so. The current plan is that the UK will have the exact same regulations as the EU on the day of Brexit. Their bill for this has a Henry VIII. powers clause, which gives the executive the power to write all the laws by themselves without needing everything to go through parliament. Junior G-man posted:You really have to stop using words like 'punish', 'hardball' etc. You pre-determine outcomes with that, and especially it allows you to create a universe where one side is 'good' or 'bad' or 'winning' or 'losing'. At the end of the day, as the end of the Politico article I posted said, there are no winners here. Everybody is now a hostage of having to play their pre-determined role in the upcoming drama (and/or farce). If you view it like that, then that mindset will help you interpret things in the next two years a lot more clearly rather than if you think in oppositional terms or some kind of mercantilist attitude to trade deals. That's all fine and dandy in theory, but in reality this is the biggest change the UK will experience in the last 40 something years and given how polarized the subject is, they will grade May on whether she "lost" and allowed the EU to punish the UK or not and in case that the agreement does not make UK the land where milk and honey flow, she will get blamed for it by the pro-Brexit crowd to make them look better.
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Mar 31, 2017 12:45
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Pretty sure that was the Italians. No, that was the Romans. Italians are basically Germans with too much Latin in their language.
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Mar 31, 2017 13:08
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e X posted:They might not want to "punish" the U.K. but this is a historic first and the idea that EU will play anything but hardball here is naiv. The inverse is also true, there's no win for the EU here.
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Mar 31, 2017 13:10
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yeah but unless the eu manages to out-stupid idiot brexiteers, the uk will be the much bigger loser
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Mar 31, 2017 13:19
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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So yeah then, RIP EU.
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Mar 31, 2017 13:20
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His Divine Shadow posted:So yeah then, RIP EU. I think you mean RIP UK. The EU will no doubt destroy itself but brexit wont really matter in the end.
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Mar 31, 2017 13:39
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His Divine Shadow posted:So yeah then, RIP EU. Eh, I don't know. The UK leaving with a slightly-worse deal than EU membership is probably one of the things all 27 remaining countries can agree on. Plus, the central leadership (except Verhofstadt  ) is much, much more competent than the UK side.
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Mar 31, 2017 13:39
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9-Volt Assault posted:I think you mean RIP UK. The EU will no doubt destroy itself but brexit wont really matter in the end. I meant rip to 'em both really.
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Mar 31, 2017 13:42
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Junior G-man posted:Eh, I don't know. The UK leaving with a slightly-worse deal than EU membership is probably one of the things all 27 remaining countries can agree on. Plus, the central leadership (except Verhofstadt How dare you say that about Liam Fox, David Davis & Boris Johnson? ARE BOYS WILL RESTORE THE EMPIRE BULLDOG SPIRIT 
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Mar 31, 2017 13:50
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His Divine Shadow posted:I meant rip to 'em both really. RIP EUK?
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Mar 31, 2017 13:53
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forkboy84 posted:How dare you say that about Liam Fox, David Davis & Boris Johnson? ARE BOYS WILL RESTORE THE EMPIRE BULLDOG SPIRIT Reminder that Liam Fox got busted for corruption from his previous post in defence. Well I guess his new post as the head international trade negotiator doesn't provide any opportunities for corruption, so it's fine and all. David Davis and BoJo, just  Unfortunately I think their departmental personnel might actually be somewhat more effective.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:07
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Private Speech posted:Reminder that Liam Fox got busted for corruption from his previous post in defence.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:08
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Toplowtech posted:Yes it's a divorce, we get it, stop trying to convince us. That's the big question, will the UK "cleverly" attempt to fracture the bloc at some point to keep all the dogs and all the silverware; because if it's even perceived that it's what May is trying to do, no matter what you say "punishment" will be a weak term to design what the EU will aim for. Immediately after the referendum it seemed that's what they were going for but it seems (and I hope) they have reconsidered. Not only could the EU desestabilize the UK if it started making openings to Scotland in retaliation I never understood what would be in it for the UK to break up the EU other than spite. It's evident the UK wants to keep their access to the common market, no EU would mean no common market. I doubt it's benefits could be made up for with a individual trade deals and it would still be catastrophic for the UK in the short/medium run anyway.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:09
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Libluini posted:No, that was the Romans. Italians are basically Germans with too much Latin in their language. Italy seems like a weird monster hybrid of Germany and Greece getting the worst of both
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Mar 31, 2017 14:13
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Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't a huge part of the UK's economy dependent on immigrants? I was under the impression that even the big bucks jobs in finance and IT were filled with people that aren't British since there aren't enough people to fill all those gaps. In the same way those who voted out most surely think of immigrants and refugees as freeloaders I think of brits themselves as welfare queens (I, however, know this is a false point of view). Maybe that's because the british culture I consume presents them as such (Misfits, Shameless, Attack the Block). I honestly think immigration was helping the country in my limited knowledge.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:23
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orange sky posted:Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't a huge part of the UK's economy dependent on immigrants? I was under the impression that even the big bucks jobs in finance and IT were filled with people that aren't British since there aren't enough people to fill all those gaps. Yup, farming is incredibly depending on seasonal/harvest labour, and this morning the UK hospitality industry was crying alarm because they say they need about 60.000 EU migrant a year to keep everything going (think waiters, room service, cleaners etc). The NHS itself can't exist without immigrants.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:27
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jBrereton posted:The Disgraced Dr. Liam Fox MP and David Davis are ablative ministers that can be fired for being corrupt/inept and disloyal at any time if the public mood on Brexit changes, and the press will be like "oh yeah obviously". BoJo will probably do Okay as foreign minister when the cameras are off him and he isn't pretending to be a churchillian moron for domestic consumption. Boris also has the weight of the Foreign Office propping him up - despite the erosion of the civil service in recent years (and the post-Brexit clusterfuck) its still a highly competent and professional foreign service with highly skilled personnel and extensive institutional knowledge. Unless he personally fucks up catastrophically - he will probably be fine. Davis and Fox both head newly established government departments - light on staff, expertise and institutional structures, and with confusing cross-cutting departmental mandates. They are eminently expendable and have almost certainly been set up for a fall. Davis almost certauinly realises this, but I suspect Fox is too dense to.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:29
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Junior G-man posted:Yup, farming is incredibly depending on seasonal/harvest labour, and this morning the UK hospitality industry was crying alarm because they say they need about 60.000 EU migrant a year to keep everything going (think waiters, room service, cleaners etc). The NHS itself can't exist without immigrants. Yeah from what I know a lot (a lot) of our nurses (Portugal) were leaving right after getting their Master's to the UK because the NHS gave them really good conditions and found the portuguese nurses pretty good. Brexit already affected that: https://www.publico.pt/2017/03/29/sociedade/noticia/medo-do-brexit-e-teste-mais-dificil-de-ingles-travam-emigracao-de-enfermeiros-1766833 quote:In the last four months of 2016 the average of nurses going to the British NHS fell from 800/month to under 200/month. That's... Quite a difference. I imagine what the grand totals will be like.
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Mar 31, 2017 14:31
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orange sky posted:Yeah from what I know a lot (a lot) of our nurses (Portugal) were leaving right after getting their Master's to the UK because the NHS gave them really good conditions and found the portuguese nurses pretty good. From what I recall the grand totals are in the negative (for all NHS personnel, but we're talking thousands not hundreds).
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Mar 31, 2017 14:37
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:It's going to be even more ridiculous to re-harmonize everything again once they are ready to rejoin in 20 years or so. I've got a great idea for a jobs program: we force the UK to constantly Brexit and Brenter every few years. We'll need tens of thousands of lawyers and their assistants to handle the workload, full time!
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Mar 31, 2017 15:44
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fishmech posted:I've got a great idea for a jobs program: we force the UK to constantly Brexit and Brenter every few years. We'll need tens of thousands of lawyers and their assistants to handle the workload, full time! I'm pretty sure the UK would be on board - there'd be a neverending supply of dirty foreigners to blame all the problems on.
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Mar 31, 2017 16:29
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Libluini posted:No, that was the Romans. Italians are basically Germans with too much Latin in their language. are you telling the Lombards are not the true heirs of rome?!
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Mar 31, 2017 18:48
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Kurtofan posted:are you telling the Lombards are not the true heirs of rome?!
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Mar 31, 2017 19:00
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/31/future-of-gibraltar-at-stake-in-brexit-negotiationsquote:After lobbying from Spanish diplomats, a clause has been inserted in the EUs draft Brexit negotiating guidelines that appears to allow Spain to exclude Gibraltar from any transitional single market access arrangement or future trade deal with the UK if it is not satisfied with the status of the territory. I can't see this realistically having much real impact on anything, but lol if the UK manages to lose Gibraltar down the road thanks to Brexit.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:06
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YF-23 posted:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/31/future-of-gibraltar-at-stake-in-brexit-negotiations Doubt they're gonna care much after losing Scotland and NI
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Mar 31, 2017 19:11
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YF-23 posted:I can't see this realistically having much real impact on anything, but lol if the UK manages to lose Gibraltar down the road thanks to Brexit.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:32
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This is funny too: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/22/uk-based-airlines-told-to-move-to-europe-after-brexit-or-lose-major-routes It's even related to the topic of Gibraltar: quote:Spanish diplomats, for example, say they will not sign any international aviation agreement that recognises the airport on Gibraltar.
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Mar 31, 2017 22:42
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Tomorrow Frauke Petty will announce her resignation as AfD leader, putting party in potential civil war 6 months before federal elections. http://www.dw.com/en/afd-leader-frauke-petry-hints-at-resignation-ahead-of-convention/a-38215341 BACK OF THE NET
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Mar 31, 2017 23:01
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Panama Red posted:Tomorrow Frauke Petty will announce her resignation as AfD leader, putting party in potential civil war 6 months before federal elections. http://www.dw.com/en/afd-leader-frauke-petry-hints-at-resignation-ahead-of-convention/a-38215341 
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Mar 31, 2017 23:04
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Panama Red posted:Tomorrow Frauke Petty will announce her resignation as AfD leader, putting party in potential civil war 6 months before federal elections. http://www.dw.com/en/afd-leader-frauke-petry-hints-at-resignation-ahead-of-convention/a-38215341 Please don't post fake news. The whole point of this farce by Petry (crying, "hinting" at resignation) is to get sympathy and motivate her base in the AfD while at the same time humanizing herself in the public. GaussianCopula fucked around with this message at 23:10 on Mar 31, 2017 |
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Mar 31, 2017 23:07
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GaussianCopula posted:Please don't post fake news. I would agree if it was just her "considering" resigning again, but she's actually calling a conference to announce something -- almost certainly her quitting in a big tantrum e: Turns out this is fake account. Frauke Petty has NOT announced retirement as AfD leader Panama Red fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Mar 31, 2017 |
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Mar 31, 2017 23:12
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Cat Mattress posted:This is funny too: 
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Apr 1, 2017 05:52
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Toplowtech posted:Well it looks like the divorce is going to force England to solve all the small conflicts it wouldn't even want to discuss during the marriage. Spain wants to keep the rock obviously. We should ask for some Normand islands just to scare some tax dodgers while we are at it. If you guys want to renegotiate the terms of the Thirteen Colonies' autonomy, I wouldn't be too upset.
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Apr 1, 2017 07:16
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feedmegin posted:Most Scots on these forums wanted out the last time, too. Most British people you know probably wanted to Remain. 'People you know' isn't a representative demographic as a rule. What I meant was that very few people enjoy England and Scotland being one country, they just didn't want to gently caress up the economy / change a working thing.
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Apr 1, 2017 07:51
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can't wait to go vacationing in liberated Gibraltar!!
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Apr 1, 2017 10:21
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*In extremely losing seats to Podemos voice* "Listen we might have 40% youth unemployment but what really matters is that fuckin rock with some crap shops and a handful of monkeys on it!!!!"
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Apr 1, 2017 15:47
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jBrereton posted:*In extremely losing seats to Podemos voice* Pretty borders is serious business okay.
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Apr 1, 2017 17:37
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jBrereton posted:*In extremely losing seats to Podemos voice* Most governments are quite capable of addressing multiple issues at the same time, and dealing with Gibraltar and addressing youth unemployment are certainly not mutually exclusive. It's only the UK government which will find it very difficult to deal with anything other than Brexit for the foreseeable future, in the rest of the EU they can just leave it to Barnier after his negotiating mandate has been agreed.
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Apr 1, 2017 18:10
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