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"The detective has a right to investigate all crime scenes" - is that true of golden age mystery fiction in general? In terms of genre expectations, I mean.
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Apr 4, 2017 13:41
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 October 5th, 1986, 8:04 AM   "There's no way he'll wake up if you do it like that! Father, it's Eva! Please wake up! It's an emergency!!"Eva pushed Natsuhi aside and knocked repeatedly with all her strength.  "Q, quiet down...!! You're being too boisterous...!" "Is now really the time to be saying something like that?!?!"  "...H, he might be in a bad mood again... Kinzo-san sometimes considers even the slightest change to be an omen. And gets into a bad mood for reasons only he can understand..." "Hoh, hohoho... Yes, that's true... This isn't something that's started today..." "Is that how badly Grandfather wants to shut himself away in the study?" "...Yes. It's not uncommon for him to stay in his study for more than a month at a time..." "...Don't tell anyone, but even though I work here, I sometimes forget that the Master even lives here..." "Gohda. That's not the sort of thing a servant should be saying!!" "M, my apologies, Madam, I am truly sorry..." "Anyway, isn't it bad that we can't get in contact with him? In the worst case, Father might not even know that there was a crime! Right?!" "...W, well, I wonder..."Keenly noticing that people were starting to doubt Kinzo's existence, Kanon mumbled his words...  "...Who was the last person to meet Father...? And when?" "I, it was me. Last night, up until the time of the uproar from when Battler found the gold, I was in Father's study, giving the daily report." "...So around 23:00 last night." "Wh, what did you say...?! This is the family head's precious study and research room! No one is permitted to trespass without permission, okay?!" "Who here holds the highest rank? Me, right?! I am the third in rank of the Ushiromiya family! If we open it and get scolded by Father, that is also a responsibility to be taken up by the highest ranked. Because of the urgent circumstances, we'll open this door. You have a key, right? Open it." "I, I believe you know this, but the study door cannot be opened with the master key." "Umm, the Master has recently taken away Genji-sama's key as well. So he has both keys on his person. Therefore, umm..." BGM: Mind  "A closed room. <Good>. It's finally starting to get a little interesting." "...It'd be pretty neat if Kinzo-san was lying on the bed in there with his throat cut." "That is too imprudent, Erika-san!! A, anyway, as you know, this door can only be opened by the keys that Father has." "...That means it's impossible for anyone, even a murderer, to even touch Father from outside the room! So Father must be alright...!!" "Still, that doesn't mean we don't have to worry about checking to see that he's safe. Are you really so unconcerned about confirming the safety of the Father you respect so much...?" "...Th, that isn't..."The atmosphere, which had been so agitated a second ago, suddenly went cold... and an eerie feeling filled the room as everyone stared at Natsuhi. They could understand why Natsuhi would protect the study under normal circumstances. It was understood that she probably didn't want to disturb the research of Kinzo, whom she respected, and she was therefore trying to keep the unpleasant relatives away. However, this was an extraordinary situation. A murder had occurred. Natsuhi's persistence in keeping things quiet for Kinzo even in a situation like this... was hard to understand using common sense.   "If we reconsider this as a series of murders following the epitaph, that means the crimes will continue further, resulting in a total of 13 lives being taken. Do you have any concept of how many victims that would be?" "...Wait a sec. How many people do you think there are on this island? Wouldn't that be almost everyone...?" "Non non. You've got it all wrong. As far as I know, the mystery novel with the most dead people in a serial murder was 'And then there were none' by Agatha Christie, which had 10 deaths. In the realm of Japanese mysteries, it's probably 'The Tokyo Zodiac Murders' by Shimada Souji. Though there were less than 10 deaths in that one." "...Did you know? If 13 people die at this rate, it will lead to the most infamous and famous development in the history of the mystery genre. The completion of a 13 person serial murder case, get it? And if everyone on this island is killed... That would make it a historical achievement in the world of serial murder mysteries. With even more deaths than the longest murder mystery in the world and the longest one in Japan put together, don't you see?! Hey, didn't you know? Everyone?"  BGM: Smile-less Soiree  "Huh...?" "Looks like you haven't read enough yourself." "Did I say something wrong...?"Erika, who had been chatting away happily all by herself up until a second ago, changed her expression into a displeased glare in an instant...   "...ah. Th, the number of people was the same in both, right?" "They tie for the record, but 'Non-serial Murders' was first published in 1947. 'The Zodiac Murders' was 1981... If you know so much about it, shouldn't you have mentioned 'Non-serial Murders' first?" "...Nn... gah."   "Well, that's understandable. The crimes in 'Zodiac' took place in 1936, right? That must have gotten her confused, right?" "Aaahhihihihihihihih hyahahahaahh!!"Lambdadelta kept on hitting the table, overcome with laughter. Even Bernkastel, who had been struck with humiliation, snorted and started pounding the table and laughing in the same way.  "Pfft, hihihihihhahahahahahaah!! This is just too good!! Giihihihihihihihihihihiii!! Not bad, Battler's piece. Gahihihihihyahah haahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaahhh!!" "Books? I don't read those at all." "...You liar. You know... quite a lot, don't you?" "Y, you mere... piece..." "Ah, *cough*. A, anyway, we can't let such a massive crime take place...!!" "That's right. At any rate, checking Dad's safety is our first priority right now. But what should we do? He's ignoring the phone and our knocking. The keys are inside. There's nothing we can do. Are we supposed to knock this thick door down? That won't be easy." "Father might have been attacked by someone and severely injured, and maybe he's waiting for someone to help him. This is an extraordinary circumstance. Even Father will understand. And if he has any rebuke, I'd be happy to take responsibility myself." "...B, but... breaking down a door would be... qu, quite rude..." "What about the window...?" "Th, that's right. The window. Is there a ladder somewhere which can reach up to a third floor window? We should be able to go inside by smashing the window...!"Erika finally came back to her senses and her tone regained its decisive edge.  "The third story window... th, that would be dangerous..." "We won't know unless we try. Is there a ladder around here that can reach up three floors?" "I don't think the ladder in the gardening shed is long enough..." "...Oh, then what about the ladder in the boiler room? I remember using it earlier when a bird made a nest on top of the rain gutter...! Yes, that would be able to reach without a doubt."He must have been extremely happy about thinking of something Kanon hadn't. Looking pleased with himself as though he had won something, he glanced around at everyone. He was probably hoping that Natsuhi would praise him, but she quickly avoided his gaze...  ...However, in order to protect Kinzo's secret, he had intentionally pretended to have forgotten... "But with this weather and the strong winds... Isn't this just too dangerous...?" "I agree. Even if someone gets seriously injured, we can't go to a hospital until tomorrow, right...?!" "...The wind might not be as strong in the courtyard. I think it's at least worth it to take a look." "But seriously, going up to the third floor will be quite a challenge...! Back when we had to clean up the bird's nest, most of the servants shrank away from the danger. And that's when I, your humble servant, took on a major role in spectacularly handling the situation. Uhahahahahahahaha...!" "Right, then there's no problem! Let's just get a ladder that'll reach-" "And it looks like someone here already has experience with this sort of thing." "...Hahahahahaha... huh?" BGM: None Fortunately, the ceiling jutted out a bit, so even the rain wasn't so bad.  "Alright. Let's try standing the ladder up. Be careful. Don't hurt yourself." "Sure..."Rudolf and Battler carried the special ladder, which was designed for work on high places. Two umbrellas followed the pair. Shannon and Kanon were holding umbrellas and sheltering them from the rain. "It doesn't matter if we get wet. Go back under the eaves. Gohda-san! Even if there's something wrong with your knees, you can at least hold a ladder down, right?!" "Y, yes yes yes yes...! If only I had enough Hyaluronan, going up a ladder would be no problem at all... I am truly sorry..."Gohda clambered forwards to replace Shannon and Kanon. As she watched this, Kyrie giggled. "Dad, hammer." "Cool. Battler, you love athletics, don't you?" "Not as much as I love my cool handyman of a Father♪" "You little brat. Sheesh, I guess I need to show this son of mine my good side every once in a while. Battler, Gohda-san. Hold that ladder down tight. And make sure you're looking up, okay? My hand might slip and you'll have this hammer tumbling down on you." "Don't worry. I'll catch it and smash your head in."After putting the hammer they had gotten to smash the window in his pocket and cracking his knuckles, Rudolf started climbing the ladder...  "Will Rudolf-sama... be alright...?" "He will be. That guy could totally be in an action movie. Plus, sports are one of his strong points."  "He'll manage to avoid dying, so there's nothing to worry about. More importantly, we're really lucky that the shutters aren't down. Isn't it a common practice to lower the shutters to Father's study for the night?" "Y, yes. When we're permitted to enter and exit, we open and close them in the morning and at night." "...However, I think it was decided that such a thing was unnecessary for the time being, so it was left open." "I see. Father will be pretty mad, won't he? If his son smashes his window and comes in while he's sleeping." "...That's... probably..." "It would be wonderful if we didn't have to smash the window, don't you think?" "..." BGM: Lure Natsuhi had ordered them to interfere as much as possible, but now that it had come to this, there was nothing that the two of them could do. They had tried to interfere by pretending that they didn't know about the ladder that could reach up to the third floor window, but... Because of Gohda's showing off, that ladder had been found... Rudolf carefully climbed the ladder. He would reach the third floor window very soon. As he did this... Shannon and Kanon stared at him, looking uneasy... After this... what will happen next? To the two of them. To Madam. To the Master. Very soon, Rudolf will reach the window.  BGM: Dead Angle  "Hahah. The soldiers are scaling the ramparts, trying to reach the other side. The moment of surrender is truly right before our eyes. I am prepared to be erased at any moment." "We can't let that happen. You have to remain alive, even if it means eating dirt. Think about what happens next. Escape from this place for now." "You may say that, but what can I do? Eva and the rest are still camped out in the hallway and Rudolf is approaching the window. There's no way of retreat through the door or the window." "In that case, perhaps you could hide under the bed." "...Hmph. So I am not even permitted the chance to wait for the enemies' arrival in my throne?" "You might have done that while you were still alive. However, you are now a ghost that Natsuhi and I brought to life. Ghosts should do what ghosts do best and hide under the bed or in a closet." "Will something like that really deceive their eyes...? My, my." "...Don't worry. I'll be with you. I'll let you escape at the last moment." "It'll be dangerous for you. Even though you're a demon, you won't get away unscathed if you're burned by the magic-resisting toxin." "Don't worry about that. Anyway, I need things to get at least that bad before my heart starts pumping." "How comforting. I understand. I'll hide under the bed." "...Milady. Rudolf will reach the window very soon." BGM: Witch in Gold (cembalo)  "What did you say...? You've got it backwards. Didn't we plan to leave this place to Gaap and have you retreat, Milady?"Even though Ronove should have been used to her fickleness, this surprised him for the first time in a long while. Though Beato was the powerful queen, she was also an important piece which mustn't be exposed to danger. Though she was strong, running to the front lines without any plan would not be a praiseworthy move.  "What kind of whim is this...?" "It's just a whim. I'm not so fond of boredom that I could simply sip tea while leaving everything to you...! I've just gotten the urge to jump into the struggle right away...!" "...I understand. It is your game, after all. You can do as you wish. I'll carefully watch over the corpses of the first twilight that I erased to make sure that nothing happens to them." "Sorry for stealing your time to shine." "...Is this really alright, Milady?" "You should know that I like standing out even more than my three meals a day. I've done nothing except gobble up Gaap's turn. Don't worry about it...!"...Ronove and Gaap were both silent. The two of them had already noticed.  ...This fight would probably be terrifying as well. Beato couldn't expose Gaap, her friend, to this danger... Beato bluffed and said that this wasn't the case, but Ronove and Gaap had already figured it out. Therefore, after confirming Beato's resolve one last time and seeing that she was completely firm in her decision, they nodded in silence and accepted it. "I understand. I'll leave this place to you. I'm rooting for you. Take care." "Yeah. Please watch over my efforts to your heart's content...!" "...Lady Bernkastel will probably start trying to expose Kinzo's absence with a closed room argument. Fights in a closed room are normally Gaap's area of expertise. Queens are the commanders because they are best at fighting in wide open areas. This won't be an easy fight." "I'm fully aware of that. I currently serve Natsuhi. Watching Natsuhi's danger from above and letting Gaap take care of it doesn't make sense to me." "...Understood. I wish you luck in your battle." "Be careful... If it becomes a complete closed room, we won't be able to come in and help you." "I'll laugh at them a bit, and if things get bad, I'll just grab Kinzo and run for it. It's easy. With the door and the window, the past and the future to choose from, there are plenty of places to run to. Of course I won't let this become a closed room." "...Though you won't see us, we'll be cheering you on from very close by. Good luck." "Sure."Gaap and Ronove became a swarm of gold butterflies and disappeared, and Kinzo melted into the darkness beneath the bed. Then, Beato also became a swarm of gold butterflies and melted away inside the study... After that, all figures and signs of life had disappeared from the study, and it once more regained a silence as though no one had been there from the beginning... Then, Rudolf's outline slipped into view from beyond the window's curtain.  BGM: None As he yelled, he hit the window. His foothold was so uncertain that just hitting the window felt life-threatening. But of course, this was Rudolf, the show-off. Deciding that he couldn't do anything stupid with so many people watching from below, he suppressed the fear from being so high up... and boldly knocked on the window.  "...Come on Grandfather... can't he hear...?" "I, I wonder... I hope he doesn't drop the hammer..." "How many seconds have passed?" "...It's been 30 seconds since he knocked on the window." "So, he'll really... sm, smash it? Umm, the Master... will be very mad..." "There's one person who's been kind enough to brag about how accepting that anger is her duty, so there's no need to worry. Rudolf-san! That's enough. Do it...!" "Sure...! Dammit Dad, you better not complain after I smash it." Because of his unstable footing, this took a lot of effort... Using the end of the hammer skillfully, he brushed aside the now fractured bits of glass and opened the hole further, stuck his hand through it, and unlocked the window. Then, after a hard struggle, Rudolf somehow managed to open the window, and his body slipped through into the study. After that, he flopped onto the floor, using his entire body to enjoy the relief of having a ground under him.  BGM: Witch of the Painting It wouldn't be an exaggeration to say that Kinzo's study was a small villa he had created inside the mansion. A study. A book archive. A place to sleep. And a bathroom and washroom. It was divided into multiple rooms. That's right, with all this at your fingertips, it wouldn't be hard to spend your days in this study without leaving at all. The bed was empty. There were marks on it which made it seem as though someone had slipped out, but there was no one in sight. "...This happens a lot in ninja movies. Someone finds that the bed is still warm, so the occupant couldn't have gone far."Rudolf tried placing his hand on the bed, but he couldn't feel any heat at all. Not only was there no heat... it felt completely ice cold. And the bed wasn't the only thing that was ice cold. The air inside the room... and even the presence about it, if that's the right word for it... even that felt ice cold. To Rudolf, it felt as though Kinzo had slipped out of this room a long time ago... "...However, it's been well cleaned. It has signs of having been lived in. "Wrinkles in the bed. The slight angle of the chair. Here and there, there were many marks that would doubtlessly have been cleaned or fixed up if someone had come in to make the beds. "As far as I can tell off the top of my head, Dad must have slipped out of bed several hours ago at the latest..."That would be the same general time period as the brutal murder case. It looks like we really can't be sure that Kinzo's absence and the crime have nothing to do with each other. For the time being, Rudolf leaned out of the window and told Kyrie and the others in the courtyard to come back up since he was going to unlock the door. Then, he pushed the button on the study desk and released the door's auto-lock. 
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Apr 4, 2017 13:43
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Ooooh, you cliffhanging tease. Whilst we're waiting for... whatever it is is coming (What's Beato even going to do if she's just a spirit here?), let me crack open a drink and enjoy the best part of this Arc so far:ProfessorProf posted:
Aw, poo poo.  When Smart Battler pokes his head out, even Bern is impressed... this is really why it becomes so infuriating when he can't get it, even if he does have really good reasons for falling apart: because when he does have his head in the game, he can do stuff like that. Up the mystery buffs.
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Apr 4, 2017 14:29
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Battler reminds me of Wolfe and Holmes: They're super smart, but you have to get them motivated and interested in order to activate that smartness. Otherwise they're goofing off/getting high on drugs.
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Apr 4, 2017 16:00
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If Battler's incompetent and even he can show up Bern, that doesn't say much for the quality of our heroine. Also, if anyone hasn't read it, And Then There Were None is possibly my favourite Christie.
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Apr 4, 2017 17:12
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The original name of that one was "Ten Little Indians" which changed due to the negative racial connotations, though I forget if the poem was changed as well. I know Suchet did the Poirot film versions, but is there a good film adaptation of it?
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Apr 4, 2017 17:20
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RedMagus posted:The original name of that one was "Ten Little Indians" which changed due to the negative racial connotations, though I forget if the poem was changed as well. I know Suchet did the Poirot film versions, but is there a good film adaptation of it? Uh nope, it was originaly "Ten little N***" and even the island was "N*** Island" Yeah.
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Apr 4, 2017 17:28
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RedMagus posted:The original name of that one was "Ten Little Indians" which changed due to the negative racial connotations, though I forget if the poem was changed as well. I know Suchet did the Poirot film versions, but is there a good film adaptation of it? I don't know about film, but BBC One did a good TV adaptation of it the Christmas before last. E: Here's the trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyPeQM4OgyU Dr Pepper posted:Uh nope, it was originaly "Ten little N***" and even the island was "N*** Island" Yeah, the original cover is uncomfortable, to say the least. It's still a fantastic mystery though. I think the only other of Christie's books I like as much is Five Little Pigs. If there was ever an adaptation of that one, I don't know about it though. CottonWolf fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 17:35
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Dr Pepper posted:Uh nope, it was originaly "Ten little N***" and even the island was "N*** Island" wait what? Wow, I've been living a lie for all these years.
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Apr 4, 2017 17:53
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I think my favorite mystery is still Orient Express.CottonWolf posted:If Battler's incompetent and even he can show up Bern, that doesn't say much for the quality of our heroine. Also, if anyone hasn't read it, And Then There Were None is possibly my favourite Christie. Erika isn't Bern, she just works for her. Hence why Bern and Lambda are laughing 
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Apr 4, 2017 18:13
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Oh! I thought she was literally a self-insert. Rodyle posted:I think my favorite mystery is still Orient Express. I appreciate the craft in that one. I'm just not keen on how... broad the solution is. If the answer to Umineko is functionally the same as the Orient Express, that's basically the only outcome I'd find disappointing. At least the red text has at least ruled out the most extreme Orient Express-eqsue answers.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:24
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CottonWolf posted:Oh! I thought she was literally a self-insert. Well she is. But she's also her own separate character.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:33
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Dr Pepper posted:Well she is. She's Bern's detective OC in that she's intuitive (to the point of basically having read the back cover and looked for spoilers on Google), calm around blood, amoral, etc., but she's also not a witch, and Bern's disdain for everyone who isn't a witch (and to a lesser extent, anyone who isn't her) means that Erika, as her creation, is a semi-competent detective who is permanently less skilled, less intelligent and overall worse than she thinks she is.
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Apr 4, 2017 18:46
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Dr Pepper posted:Uh nope, it was originaly "Ten little N***" and even the island was "N*** Island" Rereading old literature from back then is always a special treat, because it's easy to go from "hey cool I'm going to be rereading the classics  " to " " in a very short amount of time.CottonWolf posted:I appreciate the craft in that one. I'm just not keen on how... broad the solution is. If the answer to Umineko is functionally the same as the Orient Express, that's basically the only outcome I'd find disappointing. At least the red text has at least ruled out the most extreme Orient Express-eqsue answers. Honestly I'm expecting an Orient Express type of solution to Umineko, because there are so many sketchy people with their own goals and plots to enact them. After all...  (And not even Krauss is immune to scheming, as we have seen with the whole 'Kinzo is still alive' idea.) I love Gohda though. He still continues to be the best character by far.  quote:He must have been extremely happy about thinking of something Kanon hadn't. Looking pleased with himself as though he had won something, he glanced around at everyone. He was probably hoping that Natsuhi would praise him, but she quickly avoided his gaze...  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeYEsaydrtI EagerSleeper fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 18:50
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RedMagus posted:wait what? Wow, I've been living a lie for all these years. You're not totally wrong. The original title and children's rhyme were indeed Ten Little N-words, but the original American release switched the rhyme out for Indians (although the title of the book was "And Then There Were None"). The book got revised again once everyone realized "Ten Little Indians" was only marginally better, and the rhyme is now Ten Little Soldiers. As I mentioned in the last thread, Umineko owes a lot to that story in particular; I'm glad to see it got name-checked here. Speaking of which... Battler being an obvious mystery fan just reinforces my idea that this mystery is being staged for him. It's not just a puzzle for him to solve, it's a puzzle for him to solve using conventions he is familiar with and even enjoys. Is this an interest he shared with someone else on the island?
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Apr 4, 2017 19:21
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resurgam40 posted:Ooooh, you cliffhanging tease. Whilst we're waiting for... whatever it is is coming (What's Beato even going to do if she's just a spirit here?), let me crack open a drink and enjoy the best part of this Arc so far: I'm pretty sure Bern is still playing Battler, since this is all recap. Meta Battler came in much later, when Mary Sue accused Natsuhi. So this is Bern schooling herself for some reason. I mean, it's a pretty absurd argument for them to have in the first place. And I find it very hard to believe that there weren't other fictional serial killers who killed more than 10 people.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:31
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EagerSleeper posted:Rereading old literature from back then is always a special treat, because it's easy to go from "hey cool I'm going to be rereading the classics AKA: How I found out Lovecraft is a racist, and how if written today, Peter Pan would be a horror story (not only the whole thing about the Indian tribes, but how casually Peter would kill the lost boys and then forget about them completely). idonotlikepeas posted:Speaking of which... Battler being an obvious mystery fan just reinforces my idea that this mystery is being staged for him. It's not just a puzzle for him to solve, it's a puzzle for him to solve using conventions he is familiar with and even enjoys. Is this an interest he shared with someone else on the island? I could think of Kyrie, but for obvious reasons, she's not the person playing Beato.
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Apr 4, 2017 19:31
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While we're talking murder mysteries, has anyone here read The Tokyo Zodiac Murders, the other book Erika namechecks? Apparently it has an English translation. If it's any good, I might give it a go.idonotlikepeas posted:Speaking of which... Battler being an obvious mystery fan just reinforces my idea that this mystery is being staged for him. It's not just a puzzle for him to solve, it's a puzzle for him to solve using conventions he is familiar with and even enjoys. Is this an interest he shared with someone else on the island? That is a very good question. I don't think know enough about pre-Rokkenjima Battler to know who he'd have brought it up with. Plus would he even have been into that stuff 6 years ago? E: It would also tie into the meta-world really well. The metagame is the literal embodiment of the intentions of the murderer. CottonWolf fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 19:37
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Qrr posted:And I find it very hard to believe that there weren't other fictional serial killers who killed more than 10 people. Oh yeah, of course there have been other fictional serial killers that have killed more. But they're specifically talking about murder mysteries. Serial killers and murder mysteries don't usually go together; the vast majority of murder mysteries, maybe just one or two people die.
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Apr 4, 2017 20:35
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xxlicious posted:"The detective has a right to investigate all crime scenes" - is that true of golden age mystery fiction in general? In terms of genre expectations, I mean. Forgot to address this. Fundamentally, yes, it is. There are occasions where the detective is opposed in investigating the scene, but those are a tool to generate more interest; in the end, the story will always let them look at it in any classical mystery. In general, in the earliest mysteries, the detective will be present with the support of the police or some other powerful party, which makes this trivial. Later mysteries are where you'll encounter more difficulties; Archie Goodwin often has to pull some kind of flim-flam to investigate a scene for Wolfe. (On one particularly memorable occasion it was literally guarded by a bull.)
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Apr 4, 2017 23:42
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Qrr posted:I'm pretty sure Bern is still playing Battler, since this is all recap. Meta Battler came in much later, when Mary Sue accused Natsuhi. So this is Bern schooling herself for some reason. Isn't Lambadelta the game master and thus using Battler as her piece?
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Apr 4, 2017 23:43
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ProfessorProf posted:
Oh right. So, this is a fun one. It's actually a pretty complex and multilayered joke here. First off: Ina Bauer is a famous german figure skater who is mostly remembered today for a specific move that bears her name. There is literally a foot positioning in skating and Ballet known as the The Ina Bauer. Doesn't that seem like an odd thing for Rudolph to know, though? Here is the thing. Rudolph already had his voice actor at the time Chiru was released, since the Anime premiered during the break between Episode 4 and 5 (and all or most of the VAs from the anime got rehired for the VN, in a move so expensive it must have utterly bankrupted Alchemist.) Rudolph's voice actor, Rikiya Koyama, is most famous locally for being the semi-offical VA for two famous american actors. George Clooney and Kiefer Sutherland. And, in the mid-late 2000s, what show do you think most people would see Kiefer Sutherland in? Rudolph is Jack Bauer. Which brings us to the real magic of this line. Something you're just gonna need to see to believe. ORE WA JAKKU BAUER Edit: Also, Rudolph figure skates in his spare time. oath2order fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 23:43
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oath2order posted:Which brings us to the real magic of this line. Something you're just gonna need to see to believe. ... oh god this is amazing and beautiful.
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Apr 5, 2017 00:14
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...that is magical. METAPHORICALLY.
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Apr 5, 2017 00:50
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Did Knox give a rule about throttling the detective when they treat the death of your friends and family as light entertainment? I guess the tape is her version of a police line: I've sealed this and nobody else is allowed in. Despite it's past title, "And Then There Were None" is very good. I read it on a plane, and wasn't finished when we landed. Rather than drive home, I sat down in the airport until I was done. I understand that ice staking is actually really popular in Japan. Maybe Rudolf used to put on a sparkly shirt and go twirling under the lights. Cyouni posted:Beato has nothing to gain from having someone solve the epitaph. I don't want to drop the discussion of Beato's motive for the murders, but drat, that's a tough block of red. Is there some weasel room by saying Beato isn't Beatrice? I hope that isn't it. Spin the board, as Kyrie would say. Why write the epitaph? Kinzo (or maybe his ghost) said it was because if he took more risks, by making possible to lose the gold, magic could give him more gain. I also feel it's him saying to the rest of his family "Prove you aren't worthless and you can have my money and position." If that's the case, then the strange thing is that the epitaph ever becomes a murder plan. And it hasn't been followed all that well, really. We've never had only 13 people die, the "next twilight" comes whenever the killer feels like it, and the gouging is sometimes skipped. So why follow that? Maybe to draw attention to the epitaph? The red says Beato has nothing to gain by it being solved, but, yea, I also wonder how literally we should take "gain." Financially? Emotionally? Being allowed to die? In anything translated I get nervous about trying to push the wording too hard. Concepts don't always neatly map from one language to another. What did Beato say? That she didn't exist six years ago, even though she's 1000 years old?
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Apr 5, 2017 00:52
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idonotlikepeas posted:...that is magical. Tsk. Almost got him.
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Apr 5, 2017 00:58
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I really like how Suchet performed in "Murder on the Orient Express". In the book the reveal is very much like Bern here, full of "well of course I know how it was done. but I'm enjoying knowing, and the guy is a dick, so we'll all lie and be happy". In the film, Poirot really shows a fight with his faith, and his values, in the face of what some of us would call a justified murder. I don't think I've seen anyone outside of noir detective fiction be this callous though. And even then, the inner monologue is usually long on how regretful it is that life is cheap and short.
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Apr 5, 2017 01:08
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oath2order posted:Rudolph is Jack Bauer. Magic is a hell of a drug.
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Apr 5, 2017 01:48
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BurningStone posted:I don't want to drop the discussion of Beato's motive for the murders, but drat, that's a tough block of red. Is there some weasel room by saying Beato isn't Beatrice? I hope that isn't it. Several of those lines actually referred to "this child", which I thought was quite suspicious. Especially when some said "this child" and some said "Beato".
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Apr 5, 2017 04:15
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oath2order posted:Which brings us to the real magic of this line. Something you're just gonna need to see to believe. That is glorious. It's more magic than the furniture. BurningStone posted:I don't want to drop the discussion of Beato's motive for the murders, but drat, that's a tough block of red. Is there some weasel room by saying Beato isn't Beatrice? I hope that isn't it. I'm pretty sure there is no weasel room in there. Just like how hidden rooms were defined outside of the red truth, Beato was defined as being Beatrice. I'm also pretty sure the epitaph is the equivalent of Kinzo's will, given what was mentioned in the starting scene. They said it was put up two years before, and Kinzo died a year and some before. The times match up. I think 'gain' in that conversation was considered as 'benefit'. If Beatrice benefits from the games ending, then that'd be considered a 'gain'. We know Beato's motive relates to Battler's 'sin' six years ago. The red related to that: Six years ago, no person called BEATRICE existed for me. The sin I am now demanding you remember is not between Ushiromiya Battler and BEATRICE. Ushiromiya Battler has a sin. Because of your sin, people die. Due to your sin, a great many humans of this island die. No one escapes, all die. The last one seems very interesting to me in that it contradicts the third game, episode 3. Eva makes it out. We also know that there are two Ushiromiya Battlers. My name is Ushiromiya Battler. I am the Golden Witch, BEATRICE. And I opened this game in order to fight Ushiromiya Kinzo's grandchild, Ushiromiya Battler. Ushiromiya Battler's mother is Ushiromiya Asumu. It was from Ushiromiya Asumu that Ushiromiya Battler was born. You are not Ushiromiya Asumu's son. With a failed "It was from Ushiromiya Asumu that I was born." Beatrice's lines relating to that: ProfessorProf posted:
It could be deceptive, but this one doesn't feel quite as likely. So we have two Battlers. It's unknown as to when the current one switched in (likely points being a little under six years ago and at birth). That particular section suggests Beatrice is Shannon/Sayo (with Battler's sin being not coming back). If this is true, then the "true/false" being referred to here is metaphorical, and the swap happened near birth. That seems to be the more likely interpretation of the two, though him literally being a different person than he was six years ago can't be discounted as impossible. Presumably the epitaph can be used to serve as a reminder to the past, where things like this happened: Things that might help him remember the promise he made six years ago. Problem is, I have absolutely no idea where in the timeline that mentioned section happened, and if Shannon was actually around for that section. The connection to the epitaph also seems a little weak for the epitaph to serve as a reminder.
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Apr 5, 2017 04:18
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"Proof, you say?!"
"...Uh, th-that's..."
"No, the true Ushiromiya Battler would not have committed a sin. But a sin did occur in the end, that span of six years became a blank space, and a man who knew nothing of that time took on the name Ushiromiya Battler and appeared on Rokkenjima. That truth... goes like this."
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BurningStone posted:In anything translated I get nervous about trying to push the wording too hard. Concepts don't always neatly map from one language to another. If it were a mistranslation it would have been fixed already. "Something to gain" is just as indefinite in Japanese as it is in English. Like I said, it's a matter of trust, she's either misleading or not.
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Apr 5, 2017 05:04
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Cyouni posted:The last one seems very interesting to me in that it contradicts the third game, episode 3. Eva makes it out. A lot of our theories thus far have relied on mental death. I'm not sure if that's a valid concept that it is contradictory.
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Apr 5, 2017 09:13
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 BGM: Witch of the Painting  "Sorry, but it isn't Dad. I'm the one who opened it." "...Was Kinzo-san there?" "Nope. It looks like someone slipped out of the bed, but you can't tell when that happened." "And Natsuhi nee-san was the last person to meet him, right...? Around 11:00 last night. I wonder if that means he slipped out of the study sometime after that and went somewhere else..." "Th, that's... B, but Father is a fickle person... He used to sometimes say that he had a revelation in a dream all of a sudden, wake up in the middle of the night, and walk around the mansion. Isn't that right, Doctor Nanjo...?" "Nn, y, yes, such a thing has happened before... Anyway, umm, he is a fickle person. R, right, Kumasawa-san...?" "...Hoh, hohoho. That's true... He might have had some sort of strange dream and slipped out of bed... That happens a lot, yes..." "Then where did he slip off to...?! Does this mean... that there's a good chance Father's been caught up in this crime?!" "...See? We should have checked to make sure Father was safe from the beginning, right?" "...Nn..." "We can't be sure he isn't in this room. Maybe the culprit tied him up and locked him in the closet or something like that." "...Good point. Let's search." "Th, this is the head's precious study... You mustn't touch things without reason...!" BGM: None When Natsuhi heard this said from right in front of her, her heart froze. ...But Erika had only just happened to be standing right in front of Natsuhi when she said it. She had directed her words to the room at large. She hadn't been speaking to Natsuhi in particular... Natsuhi turned her back on Erika, trying to make it so that her faltering expression wasn't noticed...  BGM: Smile-less Soiree "...I, I don't understand what you're saying, but try to refrain from incautious remarks. Father, are you there...?! Please answer me...!"Natsuhi started walking around and calling out in a loud voice, refusing to let Erika say any more. There was a knock. Kyrie and the others who had gone down to the courtyard had returned. "So Father isn't here after all?" "He might be tied up and shut away somewhere around here. We were just searching for him." "...I'm surprised he managed to shut himself away in a place like this for all that time." "..." "...Give it up, Nee-san. We can't change anything now." "I wonder... what Madam plans to do..." "...Get paid back for all the lies she's told up until now." "...Shh. Let's leave fate in God's hands." "Y, yes..." "..." Inside the closet and in the bathtub. Even in the refrigerator and under the study desk. They looked everywhere, almost as though they were 'it' in a game of hide-and-seek. However, not only were they unable to spot Kinzo, they couldn't even find a single suspicious mark... "I, it seems clear that Father isn't here. That's enough. Please don't disturb Father's precious study any further." "That's right, that's right... There's nothing the Master hates more than having things moved around without his permission..." "Father's nowhere to be found. Maybe he really was caught up in the crime...?" "...Th, though we can't be sure of that..."Natsuhi averted her gaze once more.   "...We truly do have our backs against the wall... On the off-chance that someone entered the study, I had planned to trick them by saying that he had probably gone for a walk somewhere. However..." "Hmph. No one would believe that I'd get dressed up for a casual midnight stroll in a mansion where a murder has occurred and many people have been killed. Though I wouldn't put it past myself to do such a thing." "Come now, Kinzo. Be a good boy and hide under the bed. It's alright, Natsuhi. You may remain calm. You can prove that someone exists, but you can't prove that someone doesn't exist. In other words, the human world is one in which regardless of whether something exists or not, you can make it so that they 'exist'. And the shadows which can make those things 'exist' form the world of us witches, the world of demons." "...You mean... a Devil's Proof." "Yes. So don't worry. The power of demons will most certainly protect you." "...If it could protect the honor of Father and my husband, I wouldn't mind sacrificing this body of mine to demons." "Your resolve is good. Don't be anxious. I most certainly won't let Kinzo be killed."At that time, a dry sound suddenly rang out twice. Erika had clapped her hands, seeking everyone's attention. Though such an action should have been above a guest's place, for some reason, it already felt like a natural right of hers. After all, she was the 'detective'.  BGM: Suspicion "Yeah, we've searched all the places where he could have been hiding. Dad's nowhere to be seen." "Furthermore, we've found nothing that looks suspicious." "Yes, we didn't find anything at all."Erika said it again. They hadn't been able to discover anything... "In that case, we mustn't loiter around this room. Do you understand how angry Father would be if he learned that so many people were looking through his study...?!" "Eva-san, you said that you were prepared to take responsibility, didn't you? Are you prepared for him to break off relations with you for the rest of your life...?!" "Th, that's for Father to decide...!! Not you!!" "Silence, please. I'd like to lay out the situation. At 23:00 last night, the last person to meet Kinzo-san in this room was Natsuhi-san, right? Can anyone confirm that?" "...Confirm...?" "...So you're saying that alibis are the foundation of a mystery?" "Yes, that's right. Alibis are important. Of course, they're almost useless when it comes to the actual theory-making, but it's common courtesy to poke around those boxes." "Heh. Even though you didn't ask for alibis regarding last night's murder, you are doing it for Grandfather's disappearance. You really are a fickle person." "Oh, don't worry. Have no fear that I will fully examine everyone's alibis regarding the murders of the first twilight later." "...So, can anyone confirm that Natsuhi-san visited here at 23:00? If no one can, we'll be forced to doubt whether Natsuhi-san really was the last person to spot him." "...A, are you saying that I can't be trusted?" "...Natsuhi-san... is suspicious? W, wait a second. How can you say that...?!" "He's right...! Calling Madam suspicious is the height of discourtesy...!!" "Be quiet!! Doctor Nanjo, Gohda, thank you. Erika-san. Do you have enough proof to justify such a rude outburst...?" "...Yes. Though it's so simple that it annoys me. Sorry to bother you with this TV drama-quality evidence, but if you don't mind..." "...Why don't you just let us hear it?"When Battler glared at her, a cold expression rose to Erika's face for an instant. But it was only for an instant. After smiling peacefully and gazing around at everyone, she started to talk. She looked almost like the main character in a play who had come out onto the stage, bathed in a spotlight...   "...W, well, I wonder..."Keenly noticing that people were starting to doubt Kinzo's existence, Kanon mumbled his words... "...Who was the last person to meet Father...? And when?" "I, it was me. Last night, up until the time of the uproar from when Battler found the gold, I was in Father's study, giving the daily report." "...So around 23:00 last night. Heheh."Erika chuckled significantly.  "I think Kyrie-san probably did that intentionally. Am I right?" "..." "Wh, what do you mean... by that...?" BGM: Mind  "I see. Thanks, Kyrie-san. Actually, I was planning to say the same thing if you didn't." "...I, is it really that important who saw the Master last...?" "Yes. If we take the circumstances into account, then in response to the question 'Who met him last?', it was very odd for Natsuhi-san to instantly answer 'me'." "Wh, why?! Madam told the truth without hiding anything...!" "Be quiet!! Why do you think that was odd...?" "W, well, that's I watched as he went to bed. It's only natural to assume that he would then sleep until morning and not meet with anyone..." "In light of the circumstances, it was easy to suspect that the last person to spot him had some kind of involvement with this case. If a normal person was in Natsuhi-san's position, they wouldn't say 'I was the last person to meet him. I met him at 23:00'. Right, Kyrie-san...?" "...Yes, that's right. A normal person would say 'I met him at 23:00. However, I'm not sure that I was the last person to meet him'. Something like that." "...In third-rate mysteries, the last one to spot the victim is often the culprit. They killed the victim themselves, so they knew that no one else could have met the culprit later on... is how the argument goes." "Hohoh, hohohoho... Couldn't that be nothing more than a minor misspeak...? It's not important enough to be picked up out of the blue and focused on..." "Yes, yes, that's nothing more than nitpicking... Isn't it a little too early to suspect Natsuhi-san because of a little slip of the tongue like that...?" "Furthermore, you mentioned needing a reason to be sure that no one else spotted the person in question... but of course, she had such a reason...! She left the room after seeing the Master go to bed! Following common sense, it's perfectly natural to assume that he probably wouldn't meet anyone else until the next morning...!" "...No. That isn't natural at all. After all, Natsuhi-san, Doctor Nanjo, and Kumasawa-san all made this claim a short while ago. Please, try to remember." "Th, that's... B, but Father is a fickle person... He used to sometimes say that he had a revelation in a dream all of a sudden, wake up in the middle of the night, and walk around the mansion. Isn't that right, Doctor Nanjo...?" "Nn, y, yes, such a thing has happened before... Anyway, umm, he is a fickle person. R, right, Kumasawa-san...?" "...Hoh, hohoho. That's true... He might have had some sort of strange dream and slipped out of bed... That happens a lot, yes..." "<Good>. Your memory is pretty good, Battler-san. In other words, it's well known amongst the people at the Ushiromiya head house, Natsuhi-san included, that there's a chance Kinzo-san might wake up in the middle of any given night on a whim and wander around. On top of that, they were aware that this happened quite often." "...Isn't that odd? If you knew that Father often wanders around at night, there's no way you could be certain that he'd stay in his bed until morning. Right?" "It really is... like a third-rate mystery. A lot of those have this part in the last 5 minutes where the culprit asks 'When did you figure out it was me?' and the detective answers..." "Seriously... That's why I feel let down. If it turns out that Natsuhi-san really is the culprit, this'll be worse than a TV mystery. That's why I want to clear away the suspicion surrounding Natsuhi-san as soon as I can. I want to make sure that this mystery isn't third-rate before I do anything else." "...uu, gah..."  "In the court of hell, all of the demon jurors will declare you innocent. So calm down and don't get flustered..." "...It may be true that Aunt Natsuhi looks suspicious when you say it like that. Still, it sounds like you're just nitpicking to me." "But it is suspicious. Isn't this more than enough reason to suspect that Natsuhi nee-san is hiding something...?" "Th, that accusation is entirely false...! And that's not fair, Eva-san...!! Aren't you the sole person who can confirm that I really was here at 23:00...?!" "...Is this true, Eva-san?" "...Oh, did that happen? Heheheh, I'm sorry. At the time, I was losing my head because the gold had just been found, so I forgot all about meeting Natsuhi nee-san until just a second ago." "So, Eva-san, you can confirm that Natsuhi-san was a witness at 23:00?" "Yes, unfortunately. I'm able to acknowledge that one part of Natsuhi nee-san's story. But only that she came out of this room." "...Wh, what are you implying?" "Let me tell you what I'm implying. No, I've wanted to say this for a long time now. I really did feel like saying this in the middle of such a tragic murder case would be improper, but the timing now is just too perfect. You know what I'm talking about, don't you? Natsuhi nee-san...?"The servants gulped and held their breaths... It seemed that they hadn't been able to hide it... after all... In the middle of this heavy silence, Eva fingered her trump card, and Natsuhi pretended to be calm. Both space and time grew as heavy as lead... and swallowed up everything...  BGM: Deep Blue Jeer Erika's words, spoken almost casually, tore that atmosphere to pieces like shattering glass...  "...Simply put, we haven't met him once at the family conferences this year or last." "That's right... We've suspected it since last year. Seeing as how my son and the others have just been killed, this may not be the time or place to pursue this. But there's a chance that this has something to do with the crime, so we will do just that..." "It's possible that you have a motive for hiding Father's death. We can suspect that you're embezzling Father's assets." "If Father were to die, an investigation would be conducted for the distribution of the assets and your embezzlement would be exposed. That's why you hid the fact that Father is already dead!!" "...I see. That's more than enough for the 'why dunnit'. This keeps getting more and more third-rate. Aaah, boring." "I, I don't know what you're talking about...!! You say I'm hiding the head's death?! I most certainly won't forgive... such a reckless accusation!!" "That's right...!! In addition to Madam, the other servants take care of the Master on a daily basis, and they see him all the time...!! Genji-san, Shannon-san, and Kanon-kun...! Even Doctor Nanjo and Kumasawa-san meet with him often...! P, perhaps because he doesn't trust me, I haven't seen him even once since last year, but..." "Be quiet, Gohda!!!" "Eek!! M, my apologies...!" "Aren't all of the witnesses besides Natsuhi-san servants employed by her? So you used money to make them follow your story... ah man, this is really third-rate. Pitiful, pitiful. I'm disappointed, Natsuhi-san. So I guess I'll have to finish this now." "F, finish what...?!" "...What is it, uninvited guest?" "You don't exist, do you? You're a ghost whose death was concealed by those humans who didn't want it known because of the inheritance problem." "...Hmph. Heheheheheheheh." So close to Erika's face that you might just barely have been able to wedge a single sheet of paper between them, Beato's pipe stopped suddenly.  "And a good day to you too. I'm the Ushiromiya family alchemist, Beatrice the Golden. I'll be your opponent in this fight from here on out." "Glad to meet you, I'm the detective of this game, Furudo Erika. I'm pleased to make your acquaintance. And now, goodbye." BGM: Death (from Stupefaction) "...My master is almighty and all-powerful. A fool like you couldn't even begin to compare with her. I accept your challenge." "*cackle*cackle*cackle*. You really are calm. Even though a witch has appeared before you and is about to fight with magic and fantasy. If you were Battler, you'd be lying on the ground, screaming that this can't be a mystery anymore." "Yeah, even in the mystery genre, parallel universes like this have gotten popular lately. You know about Pure Reasoning Space and all that?" "Ayatsuji Yukito doesn't make his debut until next year." "You sure are picky for a witch." "Hahha!! You think you're on the same level as a witch? Don't be so full of yourself, you mere human!!"When Beato snapped her fingers, something bounced around the room at terrifying speeds...!! It was the witch's stake. The witch's wedge which contained the power of the blue truth within it...! Of course, a mere human like Erika couldn't follow that terrible speed with her eyes. Erika understood this, so she didn't attempt to look every which-way stupidly trying to spot it.  With a terrible sound, Lucifer's blue stake buried itself into Erika's right collarbone. It pierced all the way through her back. Lucifer rotated and rebounded, landed in front of Beato, and disappeared, laughing shrilly. Erika wasn't blown back. She had just been run through deeply by the blue wedge. "...So, this is that so-called blue truth. Well then, let me hear your opinion." Beato announced that with an expression worthy of her title as witch. Erika was silent. Was she too shocked to speak? There was no anguish in her expression. She was just quietly listening to Beato's blue truth. No, judging by her disdainful expression, it's probably more appropriate to say that Beato's words went in one ear and out the other. "...<Good>. Let's start with the classic moves. By the way, this thing really is stuck good. I can't take it out."She tried pulling from the front and the back of the blue wedge that pierced her, but it didn't budge an inch. However, her indifferent, relaxed expression didn't budge an inch either.  "You can't take it out! The blue truth can only be defeated by the red truth. For one such as yourself, a guest who came to this island at most a day ago, there is no truth that you could possibly know! That means there exists no red that you can use...! In other words, this is checkmate!!" BGM: None "...I'm the detective. My position is to be an opponent for the human culprit. You are a witch. There does exist a fitting piece to use against witches and demons."
Quinn2win fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Sep 16, 2017 |
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Apr 5, 2017 13:50
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...Who? What kind of name is "Dlanor"? That's not the King's English, there... Oh god, not more characters... Natsuhi's deteriorating, but Beatrice is right that the proof against her is largely one of semantics; after all, there has been no way to tell that the door to Kinzo's study remained closed the whole time (Eva didn't get to pull off her paper trick, and there was none of that weird tape on the door; Rudolph had to come in by window). And there's another idea; could be Grandpa went out the window using a ladder, which a servant cleared away later. God, I don't know why I'm arguing something that I know very well isn't true, because I saw the corpse (and have been calling Kinzo himself a fuckface from Update 1) . But Erika is being such a loving tool here that I want to argue with her on every point just on general principle. I get that Natsuhi is the shadiest and most secretive person here, but to finger the outsider for a crime just for having the most secrets, or for just being an outsider, is a mistake all to often made by real life law enforcement- to the point that it's a feature, not a bug. And it's something a so called Great Detective- typically an "outsider" themselves- should be above. e: And just so you know, Prof, that link to Smile-less soiree" goes to the Youtube page, not the Polsy, so you know. Didn't read the comment's (I generally don't, on YT) but so you know. resurgam40 fucked around with this message at 14:26 on Apr 5, 2017 |
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Apr 5, 2017 14:23
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one of my favourite scenes in the series is coming up fairly soon and I can't wait
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Apr 5, 2017 14:36
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Bravely ignoring that update to try and focus:Cyouni posted:Six years ago, no person called BEATRICE existed for me. So, two big puzzles that probably can't be solved independently: what's up with the two Battlers and what is Beatrice doing. Skipping the double Battlers (his father said he wanted to talk about his parents, so maybe we'll get some more information soon), what about the sin? In the first line, BEATRICE in all caps means the witch, which means the human version is talking. Who's that human? No, instead, how do you create a witch? It seems to be, with Maria and Ange as guides, by having a girl so unhappy she wants to escape to a fantasy land. Note the "girl;" we haven't seen a male witch, not even Kinzo, who was both occult obsessed and none too sane. There was talk of "Goldsmith," who we never saw. I'm not sure if it was a witch who splits off, or more of a nickname. Trying to narrow down the possibilities leaves a depressingly long list. It had to be somebody who was around six years ago, to be sinned against, and still around now, to kill people. It needs to always be the same person (maybe not, but this is hard enough). Gohda and Kanon weren't around six years ago (I'm trying to keep it simple, so ignore the "Kanon is family" speculation). Kinzo is dead now. Maria was only three, and has a different witch. Eva had a different witch too. This isn't going to work; there are too many possibilities. It could be Shannon, or Jessica, or Kyrie, or even Rudolf! I'm going to jump to the top suspect, based on what's going on in this update: Natsuhi. She's having conversations with Beatrice, who Kinzo told her about, but she also has all the furniture running around: stakes, Gaap, and Ronove. She seems to feel trapped and at the end of her rope. However, I have no idea what the sin could be.
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Apr 5, 2017 14:47
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I have no idea what in the heck a Dianor might be, but I'm sure whatever happens next will be crazy.resurgam40 posted:Erika is being such a loving tool here that I want to argue with her on every point just on general principle. I suspect that this is at least part of the point of having her in the story. Umineko is an argument about what genre the story it contains is, and she is, at least superficially, exactly the character a mystery fan wants to be in there to defend the idea that everything is done without magic. But she's such an enormous prick about it that you almost WANT the magic stuff to be true just so she'll be wrong. She's another way of making the argument more complicated. Simply by the existence of Erika in the story, this level of reasoning is possible for forums user idonotlikepeas. What do you think, everyone?
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Apr 5, 2017 14:54
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resurgam40 posted:...Who? What kind of name is "Dlanor"? That's not the King's English, there... Oh god, not more characters... 
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Apr 5, 2017 14:59
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Aaaaa Dlanor. This is going to be fun.
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Apr 5, 2017 15:01
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Oh drat I thought Dlanor was today's update
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Apr 5, 2017 15:09
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