|
Loel posted:Our map in chat has you going along the north bridge, but that's not set in stone That doesn't fit with their current fireplan at all. North does it fit with the current location of their arty. They're clearing focusing on the north. And our northern arty is vulnerable on its northern flank.
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 04:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 22:37 |
|
|
lenoon posted:
I had some time so I measured this out for you on our map in Roll20, only 5 of the guns can actually hit those howitzers, and one of those is just barely able to do it. That means for this bombardment you actually have 3 spare guns that can be doing something else. It also means that you're not able to dump as much firepower onto the howitzers, so you might want to lay it on for longer. You said you didn't have time for roll20 stuff, I hope you don't mind I measured this out for you.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 04:32
|
|
|
Bacarruda posted:That doesn't fit with their current fireplan at all. North does it fit with the current location of their arty. They're clearing focusing on the north. I agree with this general sentiment. We've no idea how successful our artillery bombardment in Effyaders Woods actually was. At last report, there were 2 German brigades in the woods, but as we all know, German divisions have 4 brigades. Effigies has made an enemy strength report, but conspicuously missing are 2 infantry brigades that would fill out a normal division of Fritz. Since we haven't seen any Germans at all, or new trenches, I thought to create a map of what we are capable of spotting.  It's a bit low-res, but my point should be clear. Having seen no Germans whatsoever, we can make some predictions about where they could be. It strikes me as very unlikely that the Germans have holed up fresh brigades in Stethoscope or Taillis Douche. It's certainly possible that they have something there, but there simply isn't enough room for more than 1 brigade. We know that yesterday, massed German troops (4 brigades total) entered Effyaders Woods, albeit in piecemeal. We also know that last night, we disrupted German communications and made it impossible for them to redeploy troops out of Effyaders, at least for a while. The three cases we have are thus: 1.The Germans are no longer attacking and are content to bombard us from across the Middle River. Their line brigades have retreated. 2. There are German troop concentrations in Effyaders, potentially very close to our own. 3. The Germans have retreated from Effyaders and are preparing to attack in the Centre or South. I see no reason to care if the Germans have retreated. Nor do I see any particular reason to care about a German attack in the center or South, we have a good position and the Germans would take all 8 turns to get forces into position before even starting to attack. However, we are weak in Effyaders Wood. The Germans sighted our Northern trenches last night, as they clearly bombarded those lines for hours. It's very possible that the Germans are aware of the Northern gap, a gap made worse by artillery attrition. This is the emphasis point I would like to make. The Germans may be aware of where our trench lines are in Effyaders Woods, and aware they don't cover the Northern edge. The bad thing about Effyaders Woods is that a German attack can be made instantaneously. We would not have any chance to react until the start of next round, which could allow the Germans to break (or sneak) through the North. This also means that any engineers we send to wire up the gap would be too little too late. I disagree about shuffling troops. I think it's too late to be useful, and our prexisting trenches are zeroed, and insufficently long anyways. All we'd be doing is hurting 24th brigade for no good reason. We should set up some specific conditionals orders in case of a boche attack towards Trois Freres, or a complete boche breakthrough in Effyaders. 24th brigade would be in a good position to flank (Counter-attack Germans exiting the Effyaders Wood, no counterattacking will fail if the Germans occupy our trenches and don't leave.), but would need to move out of their trenches to do so. Our artillery and engineers should set up concrete fallback positions, probably best in Saucisson Vallee. I don't know if we can count on Belgians or French Marines anymore, but if we can, we might be able to trick the Germans into triggering their appearances. Slim Jim Pickens fucked around with this message at 07:08 on Apr 4, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 07:05
|
|
|
professor_curly posted:I had some time so I measured this out for you on our map in Roll20, only 5 of the guns can actually hit those howitzers, and one of those is just barely able to do it. That means for this bombardment you actually have 3 spare guns that can be doing something else. It also means that you're not able to dump as much firepower onto the howitzers, so you might want to lay it on for longer. Thanks for measuring this out. Do we reckon my second fire plan is a good move for this turn then? Covering bases if they decide to move up their arty over the ford?
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 08:21
|
|
|
Slim Jim Pickens posted:I agree with this general sentiment. This is all good stuff and I agree with much of it We need a clear plan to deal with the high northern offensive the Germans are currently telegraphing. Artillery will be a big part of this. We need a clear fire plan that will 1) destroy the German gunline, 2) pound the German's suspected rallying positions in the Effyaders forest, 3) engage any definite targets spotted by the 24th, etc. But we also need to figure out what we're going to be doing with the infantry. If the 24th gets broken, we're hosed in a major way. The Germans can turn our northern flank and get into half our artillery. If the Belgians are still an option, that'll help, but it could be too little to prevent a division+ breakout in our north. Here are some options for discussion: 1) Have the centre brigades counterattack any German assault on the 24th. 2) Wait for the artillery to slacken, then move the 24th to the northern edge of their trench and have the other brigades, move to fill in its old space 3) Leave all units in place, shuffle the 8th Division's Artillery to a safe spot (i.e. out of rifle range in Effayders) further south so that they can enfilade fire on on any Germans exiting Effyaders.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 08:40
|
|
|
Bacarruda posted:2) Wait for the artillery to slacken, then move the 24th to the northern edge of their trench and have the other brigades, move to fill in its old space The current plan is a mix of these. The big guns are moving to the big ditch to the northwest, while the 24th moves up to the 23rd through the trenchline (with orders to stop and defend if the enemy is spotted), doing the final switch simultaneously. Final result - 24th defends the north, 23rd defends the center, the guns are moved back and safe from CB while still close enough to contribute to defense. I'd personally prefer keeping the guns in place for 3-4 turns, just to cover the infantry while they perform the switcheroo, and only then move them back.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 09:02
|
|
|
my dad posted:I'd personally prefer keeping the guns in place for 3-4 turns, just to cover the infantry while they perform the switcheroo, and only then move them back. Agreed. And if no targets are spotted, they can be hammering Effyaders to hit suspected German staging areas (I'd imagine they are 13-14" away from our lines in the forest).
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 09:06
|
|
|
They have to know that our line is not that strong on the edge of the forest - if I were them I'd be bringing up those howitzers this turn so they can try and suppress the whole trench and move into it before we can get enough men back up there. They've been using their artillery really badly so far, as we've had I think only one update where it's even been mentioned as having an effect. I presume that at least some of this is bad spotting and bad guessing, as they've only confidently hit places they absolutely knew we were - the trenches. I'd be surprised if after a couple of updates of artillery achieving gently caress all they weren't panicking and rushing to try and use it effectively. If the situations were reversed I would be 100% moving my guns to hit things we finally can see, if only out of frustration at how it's gone so far. I feel pretty confident then that the arty will shift west or north in preparation for a breakout in the forest. Hopefully my guns will thin theirs and our heavies will break up the battalion in the forest. If we can blunt that threat I don't see what they would have left - a demoralised enemy is a good one to have. Once we've smashed up the forest and taken out their artillery I think we could reinforce the push south.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 09:53
|
|
|
Their artillery has been constantly shelling places we were rather than where we actually are up until this point, because we kept moving our men in ways that wouldn't make sense if your turned the table around.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 10:04
|
|
|
Lenoon - Actually we have a request from 8th division if you're willing to help out. Basically the infantry in front of me is shuffling around, and they should be ready to roll in 2 turns, but will be vulnerable until then. I'm going to build a wall of artillery in front of them. Would you mind contributing your three guns to that effort? Basically, have us do a combined barrage like the following for two turns:  Where 60-pounders are blue, 18 pounders are yellow and your (lenoon's) guns are orange.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 10:27
|
|
|
Happy to help. I'll revise my orders at lunch. Edit: If I go with the second fire plan just in case they do send something over the ford, I could put all eight guns into the forest for a turn. Idea would be to extend the kill zone: 
lenoon fucked around with this message at 12:57 on Apr 4, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 11:20
|
|
|
Nah don't worry about it. I'm gonna fire off two rounds of that then get out of dodge. I'll amend my orders as well.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 17:20
|
|
|
I considered using all the guns because you can't indirect and direct fire in the same turn, but in the end I may as well use the guns that can reach the ford to do so. Everything should be in range, and orders clear.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 17:40
|
|
|
No, but you could probably have a thing where half your guns support infantry that call for it with indirect fire while half continue the ordered barrage, similar to how you can choose to split fire when called for aid from multiple brigades.
|
|
#
?
Apr 4, 2017 19:24
|
|
|
Actually trin that's a question - can we divide our indirect orders like the following: Put 4 guns on ordered fire on a specific location. These guns keep shooting this no matter what. 4 Guns are on ordered fire at a different location, but if infantry calls for help they can adjust to support those infantry. If we can I say go full ham on those howitzers. If they elect to stay, make drat sure they regret it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 01:44
|
|
|
My Dad I think it makes way more sense for all of us to shift north, it lets us concentrate our MGs up there where their reach is needed most and it means we aren't awkwardly fussing about if they come in. Plus I don't have to move companies out of the forward positions. Tell me if you want to change this order, but you'll have to provide the image for me. As far as I can tell I have a CMD chit, an MG chit, and 9 inf. 23rd Infantry Brigade  Right, yes, we're going to shuffle up north in this trench following the bright orange arrow. I want that MG positioned so that if they try and loop around North of us, it can get a billy bonus off the company West of it while they're Northwest in the wire. Erm, right, I drew the positions we should be in as French. That's because I'm a bit low on colored pencils and those damned fool pants stand out anywhere. When sighting an enemy on Attack stance: Halt and switch to Defend orders When attacking the enemy: Use rifle fire When an enemy company Breaks Off or Retreats Suppressed: Do not pursue Break Off automatically when: Fight to the last man. xthetenth fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Apr 5, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 03:07
|
|
|
Tehan posted:Major General Tehan III, 8th Division, Acting Commander of 7th Division  We're still looking for some Germans to share  SURPRISE AND TERROR with...maybe we'll find some further east!ORDERS FOR 20TH INFANTRY BRIGADE The Brigade shall switch to attack and advance east along the southern edge of the map using the following formation:  Upon reaching the river, the Brigade shall move north to cross the bridge and enter the southern half of La Dand.  At the end of the march, the Brigade shall assume the following positions and switch to Defend. Brigades in eastern La Dand are located on outskirts. Single westernmost brigade is located on outskirts, rest of units in La Dand suburb are located within the town.  Standing Orders during Advance quote:IF ENEMY IS SPOTTED WITHIN 12 INCHES - Turn and move directly towards enemy Standing Orders on Defense quote:Turn and move directly towards enemy CONDITIONALS While assembling into Attack formation: If the Brigade spots an approaching enemy brigade while assembling into Attack formation, the Brigade shall instead move units back into the L trenches and assume Defend stance. Before reaching the elevation change: If the Brigade spots two or more German brigades while in Attack formation, it shall immediately retreat to the L trenches and switch to Defend. If the Brigade receives indications that Bacarruda's Division HQ is under attack (messenger, signal flare, sounds of fighting), the Brigade shall move to enter and take up positions in Taillis Sud as shown below and await further orders.  If a super-heavy artillery gun (+10cm) is spotted: If the Brigade spots a super-heavy artillery battery (+10cm) with no other unlimbered units spotted within 12 inches of it, the Brigade will immediately move to charge it. Once the artillery is destroyed, the brigade will move to Taillis Sud or La Dand, whichever is closer. Terrifying Effigies fucked around with this message at 03:22 on Apr 5, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 03:08
|
|
|
That's a good set of orders, I approve.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 03:42
|
|
|
quote:If a super-heavy artillery gun (+10cm) is spotted:  "Saint Jomini, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it. No one, not even you will remember if we were good men or bad, why we fought, or why we died. No, all that matters is that two stood against many, that's what's important. Valor pleases you, Jomini, so grant me one request, grant me this! And if you do not listen, then to hell with you! Loel fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Apr 5, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 03:44
|
|
|
Loel posted:
I leave y'all alone for a few hours and when I come back you're sending men into bloody Germany...
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 05:43
|
|
|
This is a really bad idea Edit: or a really glorious idea, I don't know lenoon fucked around with this message at 08:21 on Apr 5, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 07:01
|
|
|
xthetenth posted:My Dad I think it makes way more sense for all of us to shift north, it lets us concentrate our MGs up there where their reach is needed most and it means we aren't awkwardly fussing about if they come in. Plus I don't have to move companies out of the forward positions. Tell me if you want to change this order, but you'll have to provide the image for me. As far as I can tell I have a CMD chit, an MG chit, and 9 inf. My main issue here is the rule that either the whole brigade moves or nobody moves. Division general Tehan III, please set the priority of orders like this, to maximize the odds of us not loving things up: Artillery 24th 23rd 25th
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 09:15
|
|
|
Done.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 10:51
|
|
|
my dad posted:My main issue here is the rule that either the whole brigade moves or nobody moves. Ahh, and those damned picket companies need to move then. Hey  trin, can something like that be classed as a formation change given that's all space I was occupying, or do we need to swap the brigades to pull off the move?
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 14:08
|
|
|
xthetenth posted:Ahh, and those damned picket companies need to move then. This is one of the reasons why I wanted a swap. That way, we can get the pickets in place no problem. e: For the record, I have slightly less than an hour to make a plan, then I really need to get around to drawing a map and making orders, I have stuff to do later.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 14:12
|
|
|
Time's out. I'm starting to work on the orders, assuming xthetenth's guys will deploy as he ordered a couple of posts ago.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 14:58
|
|
|
On splitting the artillery, I'd take those orders the time, but if they prove too difficult to keep track of (we'll see) I'll have to disallow it for future updates.xthetenth posted:Ahh, and those damned picket companies need to move then. I'll let you keep the pickets if you want and do it without swapping the brigades over, that's in the spirit of the thing. (I'll adjudicate it as the picketing companies moving back into the trench and a couple more moving out; usually I wouldn't allow this since the end result is that a company's occupying exactly the same space as another one did last time and violates the "appreciably different position" clause, but now it seems like there should be an exception for pickets.) ... having looked at how much time there isn't, maybe let's just see what Pater Meus comes up with and then I'll interpret it in your favour
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 15:13
|
|
|
24th Infantry, 8th Corps Had to abandon my roadguard to do this. Same standing orders as before. I'm assuming I managed to recruit the MG in the triangle trench. Every chit should is in 8 inch radius from the Brigadier chit, I think. Move here unless you can see an enemy, in which case wait until they're dead and then move here.  Standing orders for attack and defence remain the same. I think it could have been done a lot more elegantly, but I just don't have the time for it right now.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 15:26
|
|
|
Trin artillery orders currently only has split target indirect fire rather than split direct/indirect as far as I'm aware, so it shouldn't come up this turn.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 15:27
|
|
|
Trin Tragula posted:On splitting the artillery, I'd take those orders the time, but if they prove too difficult to keep track of (we'll see) I'll have to disallow it for future updates. Appreciate it. I bet the guys out front will be happy to get relieved.
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 16:35
|
|
|
The adjudication begins...
|
|
#
?
Apr 5, 2017 18:07
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0Wj5iP5rDY Day 3, Turn 16 0800 British initiative The 20th forms up and heads off on the Regimental Bear Hunt, attendance mandatory.  The 25th Brigade shuffles about; note that this has been altered slightly to obey the "all companies must move to an obviously different position" rule.  A number of order changes fail to go through; lenoon's guns do manage to open fire; Professor Curly's don't. Day 3, Turn 17 0830 German initiative The sneakybeakers get moving.  lenoon fires on the ford again; a German aeroplane emerges from the clouds for a moment to take a look at the Saucisson crossroads. Day 3, Turn 18 0900 German initiative Comedy crew continues moving.  lenoon fires his third round of planned shots; Professor Curly's men still haven't had their orders. In front of them, though, there is now movement.  Day 3, Turn 19 0930 German initiative More movement in the forest.  The weather is deteriorating by the minute; your spotter plane dives down below the clouds as long as it dares. The observer apologises for not having seen any enemy units, but really sir, it was all we could do to keep the bloody thing in the air...  (You're getting this now because I think one of my problems with filing things in the wrong bucket is coming from delaying the spotter plane's information.) Good news, though: you're not relying on the spotter plane for spotting!  Oh. Oh, I see.  You do get the better of the opening exchange, though; and now it's time to fix bayonets. Mid-update overview.  Kill dots are now being switched off on the overviews, since they may potentially indicate the positions of kills from your indirect fire that you're unaware of, and gently caress trying to sort 300-odd kill dots. Day 3, Turn 20 1000 British initiative It begins to rain. Well, it's been nice knowing you, chaps.  The western runaround ends.  Good news! You spot the enemy gun line in front of Stethoscope.  Bad news! You spot it because it fired on the 20th Brigade. Also, Professor Curly's orders have finally reached him, and he opens fire on the forest.  That's not the forest...  That could have gone a lot better for you than in fact it did, too. Day 3, Turn 21 1030 British initiative Chaaaaaaaaaaaarge!  A couple of Germans poke their heads out of the south-eastern corner of the forest.  Some mutual spotting occurs to the west of there.  You exchange fire (not pictured) and that one company is killed. To the south...  If not for the guns, you might have survived to close combat. As it is, the enemy's rifle fire beats your last company back; then the 20th Brigade fails a morale check and routs. No room for comedy crew in this war, apparently. Day 3, Turn 22 1100 British initiative More scrapping goes on in the middle of the map.  lenoon uses an awful lot of supporting fire to kill one company, and the enemy uses an awful lot of rifle fire to suppress one company. Day 3, Turn 23 1130 British initiative Once again, lenoon dumps a whole lot of ordnance on top of one guy's head.  And the middle falls silent. Meanwhile, in Ferme Chatte...  Your lunatic on a horse (well, dismounted at the moment) sees this. The rain is now steady, and from the next turn onwards hill spotting rules will be suspended. Flying is also impossible until further notice. Overview:  Your last division, the 9th, arrives from Turn 40, or Turn 32 if you wish to spend a fatigue point. Three brigades, one 18-pounder artillery brigade, no engineers. Speaking of which, by the way, that northern bridge has now been wired for demolition. Soft deadline: Friday 8th April, 5pm. This is one day less than last time; don't get caught out.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 00:38
|
|
|
And thats all you get, observers  no more shenanigans. 20th Brigade, you will be missed.First things first, we need an updated map of known enemy forces.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 00:44
|
|
|
Is that brigade in the final picture searching for our men? Looks like it's going backwards.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 00:49
|
|
|
If it was their reinforcement going north, we hit them in the back.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 00:54
|
|
|
Loel posted:If it was their reinforcement going north, we hit them in the back. I'm referring to the one our division commander is spotting. I'm pretty sure the southern one the 20th charged was heading south from stethoscope. Yeah, they did. They moved into the 20th vision range. If the one up north is going backwards and the southern one is going straight down I'm fairly certain they're panicking about who cut their wires. AbortRetryFail fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Apr 6, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 01:00
|
|
|
Hunt11 posted:
So did my engineers just jack off this entire turn?
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 01:11
|
|
|
no, they did stuff, your orders got done, people kept interrupting me trying to give me money and then when you're three hours later than you were expecting to be you just want to get it over with
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 01:15
|
|
|
AbortRetryFail posted:I'm referring to the one our division commander is spotting. Panic is good. Lets move Baccarauda into La Dand, wait a round, and cone back out to cut some more wires 
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 01:19
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 22:37 |
|
|
Trin Tragula posted:no, they did stuff, your orders got done, people kept interrupting me trying to give me money and then when you're three hours later than you were expecting to be you just want to get it over with A second question. Why is there less trenchwork on the map then last turn and what happened to my missing wire?
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2017 01:25
|
|