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Nice plan Bacarruda but I think the SU-25s should be used with anti-runway bombs instead of attacking TLA assests. Our only goal in this mission is to disable the airfield and we need to get that done.
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Apr 9, 2017 17:17
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No to the museum pieces, we don't have an unlimited amount of money and they're useless if we want to take big-time missions.
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Apr 9, 2017 17:19
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quote="Quinntan" post="471191930"] The AMX is not a Gripen, it's more akin to the Frogfoot out of all the aircraft we currently operate, being a specialised ground attack platform. [/quote] I meant in terms of size. I wasn't clear though, with this mission my head is only looking at ground attack stuff. You're right, they come with very poor air-to-air options.
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Apr 9, 2017 17:20
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Popete posted:Nice plan Bacarruda but I think the SU-25s should be used with anti-runway bombs instead of attacking TLA assests. Our only goal in this mission is to disable the airfield and we need to get that done. The Su-25s can't get to Lhasa. They just don't have the range simplefish posted:I meant in terms of size. I wasn't clear though, with this mission my head is only looking at ground attack stuff. You're right, they come with very poor air-to-air options. I've been campaigning for us to go back to the Ivanovs to buy their Fencers, those things have some huge weapons.
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Apr 9, 2017 17:20
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If I go back and find out that the people going "no we can't use the SK60s for anything they're useless" are the same people going "BUY THESE RUSTED OUT UKRAINIAN HULKS" I will be... displeased 
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Apr 9, 2017 17:23
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Seems like a pretty good plan Bacarruda. The ground raid and the intel they bring back will decide if we want to use primarily cluster or precision munitions. If they can give us GPS locations for juicy targets, then we should hit those, otherwise we should bring as many cluster munitions as possible. Also, we should do our best to not gently caress up the commercial terminal. The Indians want the Tibetans on their side, after all. I like the diversion plan, but I think we should send them after the chinese, not the TLA. The TLA are already pretty much out of the fight, and we're trying to distract the Chinese anyway. Would anyone take issue with Chucklefuck transferring from the pilot corps to boom op on our tanker? Speaking of our tanker, does CMANO model the fact that two probe aircraft can tank at the same time on the KC-135? On the subject of getting an MPA; Depending on how good we make India look in this next mission, we could try to buy a P-8I from our new best friends. Failing that, we could buy some of their recently decommissioned Tu-142s. In the future, I think we should try to build options like that into our contracts. And I think we should get something along these lines even if we don't end up doing eco-terrorism, their ELINT capabilities, depending on how well CMANO supports this, could be worth the price by itself. When it comes to transport, I think we should get some C-130s. Are KC-130s still competent at moving stuff? or does the tanker conversion ruin them for that? Any time we can use a dual-purpose aircraft we should. Right now, if we want to leave somewhere in a hurry, we're gonna have to leave stuff behind. The C-235 and KC-135 won't be able to get everything out in one go. CBJamo fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Apr 9, 2017 |
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Apr 9, 2017 17:34
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Where is the Indian distraction occurring? We probably need to make sure our flight path isn't near there.
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Apr 9, 2017 17:34
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 I got a text from Jack. He's in Zurich and already shacked up with some French ex-pat. He hopped a flight from Gander in some overloaded Russian cargo plane. For the moment he's out of reach of the feds but his utility to us is running thin. But he has some intel, though I don't know what he's talking about.  General Krishna said their plan is coming together. They're going to lure the J-20's to Sikkim province. At that point they're hoping some new detection technology can pinpoint them. The Indians will have an entire flight of Dassault Rafales supported by some EA-6B Prowlers. Behind that is a line of SU-30's. For the Indians this is all or nothing. It's looking like once they form up is our cue to get in the air. They're hoping the Chinese will think it's an Indian assault and vector towards them. It'll be a border fight, neither side wants to go too far into the others space. I hit up Jack on it, here's his take.  If our Attack Aircraft lacks the legs to hit Lhasa from our current field the Indians are willing to let us refuel and launch from a field just outside of Bhutan. We will receive intel from the ground on a decent quantity of assets. Though I can't guarantee we'll get every SAM site, but hopefully most of them.  Voting is closed on Ukranian Museum Offer
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Apr 9, 2017 17:49
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I hope they're Czech trash cans 
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Apr 9, 2017 17:52
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I think we need to move the Fogfoots up to Bhutan and load them up to hit the runway.
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Apr 9, 2017 17:54
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Can't think of a NATO designated Soviet radar named Trash Can. Hmm... Maybe he auto corrected something else. EDIT: nm, good call Vando. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamara_passive_sensor I don't think those will provide a firing solution, but it'll let them know something is in the air and it's general area. Maybe theyre hoping IRST gear can detect them once they know the general area. Should be a wild fight though. Rafales and Super Flankers vs Mighty Dragons. Hopefully the Prowlers don't eat HoJ shots from them! Dandywalken fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Apr 9, 2017 |
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Apr 9, 2017 17:58
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamara_passive_sensor link ops to be what Jack is talking about.
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Apr 9, 2017 18:00
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For anyone curious to read more about the Eurotrash we operate and could consider purchasing: in 2009, parts of the Swiss Air Force's comparative evaluation of the Eurofighter, Rafale, and Gripen leaked. Keep in mind that these evaluations were done with an older version of the Gripen than the one we operate, though. In Command, the biggest advantage our Gripens have over the Gripens the Swiss were evaluating is their Meteor compatibility, which makes them more potent in the air-to-air realm than described in this report. tl;dr of the report:  Switzerland posted:Among the three NFA candidates, the Rafale was the aircraft which demonstrated the best effectiveness and suitability in the accomplishment of all types of air-to-air missions, recce, and strike missions. In addition, the Rafale made the best impression on the pilots.
Switzerland posted:The Eurofighter was able to fulfill all Mission Essential Tasks required by air-to-air missions... in the air-to-air domain, there were several deficiencies that prevented a good execution of some mission essential tasks. Pros
Switzerland posted:Although the Gripen could be engaged in all types of air-to-air, recce, or strike missions, there were several limiting factors affecting the overall mission success. The Gripen obtained the 3rd rank in the evaluation of the effectiveness.
Their overall ranking of the candidates: 1. Rafale 2. Eurofighter 3. Existing Swiss F/A-18C/D 4. Gripen
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Apr 9, 2017 18:09
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Indeed, the Trash Can is an emitter locator system. Not just for Radar emissions but things like radio and datalink transmissions can be detected and triangulated. The name is not just picked out of a hat, either: 
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Apr 9, 2017 18:11
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Do we buy a bunch of Ukrainian Museum Pieces and replace Saros's Liver?  The NO's have it. Sorry bout your liver Saros. I'll have more details from the Indians later on in regards to their mission. We'll time ours to coincide with there strike operation. Bacarruda posted:Yooper, again - sorry for the complexity of this plan I like complex plans, the more details I have the less likely I'll interpret and have our planes be pants on head stupid. Yooper fucked around with this message at 18:28 on Apr 9, 2017 |
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Apr 9, 2017 18:26
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Vando posted:If I go back and find out that the people going "no we can't use the SK60s for anything they're useless" are the same people going "BUY THESE RUSTED OUT UKRAINIAN HULKS" I will be... displeased The Ukranian planes can carry weapons, which is a pretty big difference from the SK60s. Also seriously, what the gently caress is with people freaking out about quality when we know that if they're good they're good and we've got actual numbers showing we'd be getting a ton of planes? People did it with the Phantoms, and now they're doing it with the museum pieces. (Don't get me wrong, if you wanted to say they're wildly obsolescent fuckbarges that can't carry anything modern enough to make them less valuable than chaff for the new stuff, I'd probably agree) Seriously though, don't let a gamble scare you off.
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Apr 9, 2017 18:41
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Yeah it's a shame I think for $20 million the chances were pretty good we would be getting 6 or more planes which if anything just allows more hilarity in our race to become hated by every country on the planet.
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Apr 9, 2017 18:45
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VKing posted:Indeed, the Trash Can is an emitter locator system. Not just for Radar emissions but things like radio and datalink transmissions can be detected and triangulated. These are really useful as part of an IADS, but they're also of questionable effectiveness against 5th-gens with LPI AESAs and datalinks. I suspect our Gripens will be modeled as having more capable ELINT systems against that sort of threat than Trash Can/Tamara-M, if only because they're newer. I actually have no idea if CMANO models an EW suite's ability to listen for datalink signals, which is fair, since finding good information on that sort of thing is pretty difficult. baloogna pls help i know you're reading this thread
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Apr 9, 2017 18:45
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Mr. Showtime posted:These are really useful as part of an IADS, but they're also of questionable effectiveness against 5th-gens with LPI AESAs and datalinks. I suspect our Gripens will be modeled as having more capable ELINT systems against that sort of threat than Trash Can/Tamara-M, if only because they're newer. I did a quick test scenario and I couldn't really get it to work. But I don't have any idea how it works either, so 
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Apr 9, 2017 18:48
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VKing posted:I did a quick test scenario and I couldn't really get it to work. But I don't have any idea how it works either, so These systems (usually ~4 stations in a system, confusingly) typically work by listening out for radio, radar, datalink, etc. emissions. Even the most sophisticated VLO aircraft on the planet can't remain entirely silent for the duration of a mission, and by sniffing out these electronic emissions you can learn a surprising amount about what they're doing, where they are, etc. and thereby deprive them of the element of surprise (which let's be honest is one of the big draws of stealth). They can operate independently, but are normally employed as part of an IADS. I'm pulling this half-remembered from that pdf on counter-stealth technologies and tactics Yooper was kind enough to post earlier, so take with a pinch of salt. e: I get the troubling feeling you were talking about how it works in CMANO rather than real life. Ignore me. 
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Apr 9, 2017 19:04
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Popete posted:Yeah it's a shame I think for $20 million the chances were pretty good we would be getting 6 or more planes which if anything just allows more hilarity in our race to become hated by every country on the planet. 6 planes would've been a safe bet and 7-8 would have been about where the expected result would've been sitting. I dunno, I'm just very angry about bayesian statistics. 
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Apr 9, 2017 19:21
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Mr. Showtime posted:These are really useful as part of an IADS, but they're also of questionable effectiveness against 5th-gens with LPI AESAs and datalinks. I suspect our Gripens will be modeled as having more capable ELINT systems against that sort of threat than Trash Can/Tamara-M, if only because they're newer. i don't know offhand we're doing comms disruption in the next DLC
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Apr 9, 2017 19:21
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Baloogan posted:i don't know offhand baloogan make ground combat
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Apr 9, 2017 19:22
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ill get right on that *develops model for wear and tear on ammunition bandoleers and other LBE as a function of use, weather, terrain, fabric/textile era, load carried*
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Apr 9, 2017 19:27
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*reinstalls Jagged Allegiance 1.13*
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Apr 9, 2017 19:29
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Baloogan posted:*reinstalls Jagged Allegiance 1.13* Im the guy carrying all the SCAR ammo conversion kits JUST TO BE SAFE, YA KNOW???
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Apr 9, 2017 19:34
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Baloogan posted:*reinstalls Jagged Allegiance 1.13* You uninstalled it? I'm disappointed in you.
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Apr 9, 2017 19:39
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xthetenth posted:Also seriously, what the gently caress is with people freaking out about quality when we know that if they're good they're good and we've got actual numbers showing we'd be getting a ton of planes? People did it with the Phantoms, and now they're doing it with the museum pieces. (Don't get me wrong, if you wanted to say they're wildly obsolescent fuckbarges that can't carry anything modern enough to make them less valuable than chaff for the new stuff, I'd probably agree) Seriously though, don't let a gamble scare you off. Hey I just thought we could do better for that money (doubly so now that it turns out we're now leaving this theater). If we want sacrificial chaff we have the SK60s for that and they're significantly cheaper anyway; at $600k per you can get 33 of them for $20M. Or if that's the sale price and new is double that (I forget) that's still 16 vs 12 if we're perfectly lucky.
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Apr 9, 2017 19:43
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power crystals posted:Hey I just thought we could do better for that money (doubly so now that it turns out we're now leaving this theater). If we want sacrificial chaff we have the SK60s for that and they're significantly cheaper anyway; at $600k per you can get 33 of them for $20M. Or if that's the sale price and new is double that (I forget) that's still 16 vs 12 if we're perfectly lucky. Oh I agree. What I mean is people talking about planes in uncertain shape like that makes them intrinsically awful. I would've reversed my call the second I knew this theater was ending soon, and possibly once I realized how limited the fulcrums actually are. Also I'd love if someone could tell us what the actual loadouts planes have so we aren't hi-fiving our faces when we realize just how bad something actually is.
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Apr 9, 2017 19:52
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Charge your phone, Yooper. Also lmbo at us having the worst plane ever, apparently, according to the Swiss 
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Apr 9, 2017 19:58
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Wonder where we'll be visiting next? Also since I died I'm now a wisecracking ghost that helps with plane maintenance and puts lost tools in places where crew can find them.
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Apr 9, 2017 19:59
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Dandywalken posted:Wonder where we'll be visiting next? The job in the Bering Sea area is still open though the situation has gotten nasty. That US Carrier Group moved south as the new pipeline is up and running. Shits gone wild now. We'll have one other job to choose from. Did you ever wonder where steampunk went to die? Yah, they're looking to hire. More details to come later.
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Apr 9, 2017 20:19
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To think, you guys could have managed to get into a fight with the United States instead of war ravaged China.
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Apr 9, 2017 20:27
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Ikasuhito posted:To think, you guys could have managed to get into a fight with the United States instead of war ravaged China. We could have accidentally sunk the USS Donald Trump instead of some piddly Chinese frigate. Think about the glory!
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Apr 9, 2017 20:32
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Z the IVth posted:We could have accidentally sunk the USS Donald Trump instead of some piddly Chinese frigate. Think about the glory! dare to dream, there's always next op
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Apr 9, 2017 20:38
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By the way, what part of Warlord China is fighting us anyways? edit: steampunk? Is the Big Coal hiring us to bomb win turbines and sun pannels?
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Apr 9, 2017 20:39
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JcDent posted:By the way, what part of Warlord China is fighting us anyways? The "Real" China, the one controlled by Beijing. Southern China is a mish-mash of poo poo.
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Apr 9, 2017 20:42
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With China turning into a failed state how's Best Korea doing?
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Apr 9, 2017 20:53
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Hey, some of us went against museum soviets because it didn't fit our aesthetic, not because it was bad value for money (it was good if you're just counting air frames, yea)
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Apr 9, 2017 21:09
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I'd be down for some African work tbh.
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Apr 9, 2017 21:16
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