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Who is the man?? This poll is closed. |
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| Goku |
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202 | 7.09% |
| Vegeta |
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279 | 9.79% |
| Krillin |
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208 | 7.30% |
| Piccolo or his nameks |
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212 | 7.44% |
| Gohan or Cool Gohan |
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135 | 4.74% |
| Yamcha |
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90 | 3.16% |
| Tien |
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120 | 4.21% |
| Muten Roshi |
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89 | 3.12% |
| Tao Pai Pai |
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71 | 2.49% |
| Frieza |
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69 | 2.42% |
| Cell or an android |
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86 | 3.02% |
| Buu |
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62 | 2.18% |
| Hercule "Mark" Satan |
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327 | 11.48% |
| Videl |
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90 | 3.16% |
| Bulma |
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104 | 3.65% |
| Yajirobe |
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99 | 3.47% |
| Ginyu or other Frieza squad guy |
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68 | 2.39% |
| King kai or another kai |
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53 | 1.86% |
| Chi-Chi |
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83 | 2.91% |
| Goten |
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43 | 1.51% |
| Trunks or Cool Trunks |
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112 | 3.93% |
| Bardock |
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48 | 1.68% |
| Other villain of DB,Z, or GT(please post about it!) |
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41 | 1.44% |
| Uub |
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42 | 1.47% |
| Oolong |
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90 | 3.16% |
| Zamasu |
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26 | 0.91% |
| Total: | 1326 votes | ||
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Monaghan posted:He let vegeta go recover, so he could fight him again, shortly after Vegeta and his crony brutally murdered more than half of goku's friends. He still did it knowing that Vegeta would likely come back and attempt to commit genocide on everyone one earth. Krillin even goes "What the gently caress are you talking about goku." While the Vegeta part is true, the Freeza part is just downright wrong. Goku lets Freeza power up not because he wants a cool fight, he lets him power up because he wants to absolutely humilliate Freeza as punishment for killing Krillin, and for that, he needs Freeza to be at his best. Goku only enjoys fighting Freeza before he realizes just how evil he is (by killing Goku's best friend). Once Goku becomes a Super Saiyan, he's clearly not enjoying what's going on at all, he's consumed by rage and wishes to inflict the greatest of sufferings to Freeza. Super Saiyan Goku there is terrifying, he's left Goku's usual fight-lust behind and only wants to inflict pain and suffering to Freeza in revenge.
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Apr 10, 2017 19:21
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goku giving cell the senzu was justified. before ssj2 cell could have killed literally every z fighter, he needed gohan to trigger into his new state and feel backed against a wall. picollo, while he had gohans best intentions in mind, was wrong that it was a bad idea. however if picollo jumped in and got killed it wouldve sped up the transofmration process
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Apr 10, 2017 19:23
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Blaze Dragon posted:Goku only enjoys fighting Freeza before he realizes just how evil he is (by killing Goku's best friend). Once Goku becomes a Super Saiyan, he's clearly not enjoying what's going on at all, he's consumed by rage and wishes to inflict the greatest of sufferings to Freeza. Super Saiyan Goku there is terrifying, he's left Goku's usual fight-lust behind and only wants to inflict pain and suffering to Freeza in revenge. Which makes Goku's desire to see Gohan reach the same point truly awful parenting. SS2 Gohan is a sadistic little monster.
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Apr 10, 2017 20:43
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Speaking of awful parenting, Christopher Sabat weighs in on a longstanding question:
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Apr 10, 2017 23:28
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It's still Uncle Phil.
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Apr 10, 2017 23:41
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Rhjamiz posted:I'm trying to imagine a DBZ where Goku reforms/collects Cell like he does most everyone else who tried to kill him. Reminds me of a story idea I had where instead of Krillen blowing up the incubating Cell, Bulma has the idea to replace the indoctrination Dr Gero put in his computer to program Cell with some new ones of her own, so sometime between the beginning of the Buu saga and the beginning of Super a good version of Cell emerges Rhonne posted:Imagine a series where Goku befriended Frieza and he was forced to babysit Trunks and Goten. And now I'm remembering a really silly idea I had inspired by two of the What If stories the video games have had, basically that every time an alien comes to Earth with conquest or destruction on their mind they instead end up crashing and getting amnesia and becoming good in the process
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Apr 10, 2017 23:52
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drrockso20 posted:Reminds me of a story idea I had where instead of Krillen blowing up the incubating Cell, Bulma has the idea to replace the indoctrination Dr Gero put in his computer to program Cell with some new ones of her own, so sometime between the beginning of the Buu saga and the beginning of Super a good version of Cell emerges Yeah but unless Bulma let him drink a ton of people or absorb 17 and 18 he'd be pretty weak and not much help to anyone. Also not as handsome.
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Apr 10, 2017 23:59
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Ammat The Ankh posted:Yeah but unless Bulma let him drink a ton of people or absorb 17 and 18 he'd be pretty weak and not much help to anyone. Also not as handsome. Honestly I figure even a freshly born Cell(at least once he's molted to his first humanoid stage) is still probably at least as strong as a standard Super Saiyan, and that's without any training(and considering he's got both Saiyan and Freiza genes in him, training would probably be very effective) Also I figure Bulma would have planned ahead and programmed out any urges to eat 17 or 18, or to drink people for the most part, also Bulma could probably replicate the parts in 17 and 18 that Cell needs to achieve perfection if needed And lastly the idea of an 8 foot tall bug man with a creepy voice being one of the nicest guys around is just too rich in potential
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Apr 11, 2017 00:11
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drrockso20 posted:Honestly I figure even a freshly born Cell(at least once he's molted to his first humanoid stage) is still probably at least as strong as a standard Super Saiyan, and that's without any training(and considering he's got both Saiyan and Freiza genes in him, training would probably be very effective) Feed him 17 and 18. Beat the poo poo out of him until he vomits them both up. Force him to self destruct. Bam, you have perfect cell and both androids.
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Apr 11, 2017 00:13
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Caros posted:Feed him 17 and 18. Beat the poo poo out of him until he vomits them both up. Force him to self destruct. Bam, you have perfect cell and both androids. That's a bit needlessly traumatic for everyone involved
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Apr 11, 2017 00:26
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drrockso20 posted:That's a bit needlessly traumatic for everyone involved No pain, no gain
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Apr 11, 2017 00:30
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drrockso20 posted:That's a bit needlessly traumatic for everyone involved It'll appeal to 2/3 of his genetics.
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Apr 11, 2017 00:49
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drrockso20 posted:That's a bit needlessly traumatic for everyone involved Pfft, you don't know that. According to 17 it is downright tubular up inside cell. Edit: the real question is what would happen if he absorbed them again at that point.
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Apr 11, 2017 00:54
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Rhjamiz posted:I'd guess Piccolo did some poo poo too probably but I don't remember much of Dragonball honestly. King Piccolo killed a shitload of people. Current Piccolo tried to kill everyone at the World Tournament by exploding Papaya Island but everyone evacuated I think. I don't think Piccolo's actually done anything after the 23rd tournament that was too evil.
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Apr 11, 2017 01:00
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Ammat The Ankh posted:Yeah but unless Bulma let him drink a ton of people or absorb 17 and 18 he'd be pretty weak and not much help to anyone. Also not as handsome. the androids were a quick fix crutch, cell is biological and could have empowered himself through training.
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Apr 11, 2017 01:12
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Elfgames posted:the androids were a quick fix crutch, cell is biological and could have empowered himself through training. Considering what 3 months of light training did for Frieza, one can only imagine what the training regiments Goku and company do would do for a good guy Cell Also I just realized that all of the villains in DBZ once they get to Namek onward don't train for the most part
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Apr 11, 2017 01:20
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drrockso20 posted:Considering what 3 months of light training did for Frieza, one can only imagine what the training regiments Goku and company do would do for a good guy Cell well cell and buu use eating people as a replacement for training.
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Apr 11, 2017 01:24
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Elfgames posted:the androids were a quick fix crutch, cell is biological and could have empowered himself through training. But would it make him handsome?
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Apr 11, 2017 01:33
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Piccolo killed Goku.
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Apr 11, 2017 01:48
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sharktamer posted:Piccolo killed Goku. Goku willingly sacrificed himself
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Apr 11, 2017 01:54
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sharktamer posted:Piccolo killed Goku. Little did we realize that this was a preemptive act of heroism.
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Apr 11, 2017 02:29
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Aurora posted:Goku willingly sacrificed himself Piccolo wasn't exactly upset and then he kidnapped and brutalized a four year old.
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Apr 11, 2017 03:23
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khwarezm posted:Piccolo wasn't exactly upset and then he kidnapped and brutalized a four year old. Ehem. He kidnapped, brutalized and adopted a four year old, becoming a far better dad than his biological dad ever was.
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Apr 11, 2017 03:31
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I don't get the desire to see Cell 'reformed', although maybe that's because I thought he was creepy as gently caress when I was a kid. At least Fat Buu seemed to be weirdly innocent, while Vegeta seemed to have been a villain more due to being forced to serve Frieza at a young age and out of a deep seated sense of inadequacy and emotional trauma that he's slowly being growing out of. I never got any impression Cell was anything other than a guy who loving loved being evil to the core. He started off being creepy and ended up being smug. Leave him dead imo.
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Apr 11, 2017 03:32
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khwarezm posted:I don't get the desire to see Cell 'reformed', although maybe that's because I thought he was creepy as gently caress when I was a kid. At least Fat Buu seemed to be weirdly innocent, while Vegeta seemed to have been a villain more due to being forced to serve Frieza at a young age and out of a deep seated sense of inadequacy and emotional trauma that he's slowly being growing out of. What you said about Cell is exactly what Vegeta was. That he was only evil because Freeza forced him to is dubtext and absolutely not his original characterization. Saiyans are monsters who kill entire races for fun (and profit, thanks to Freeza controlling them) and Vegeta was a monster amongst monsters, to the point the also-evil Nappa was shocked at Vegeta's actions in killing both a Saibaman and himself. At least Cell showed some competitive spirit with the Cell Games and a love of fighting that's perfectly fitting for the cast.
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Apr 11, 2017 03:37
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I think it's all because of his hilarious portrayal in Xenoverse, myself.
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Apr 11, 2017 03:43
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Was Japanese Cell like that in Xenoverse, because Dameon Clarke made sure every single line was hammed up to its maximum in that game.
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Apr 11, 2017 03:58
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Blaze Dragon posted:What you said about Cell is exactly what Vegeta was. That he was only evil because Freeza forced him to is dubtext and absolutely not his original characterization. Saiyans are monsters who kill entire races for fun (and profit, thanks to Freeza controlling them) and Vegeta was a monster amongst monsters, to the point the also-evil Nappa was shocked at Vegeta's actions in killing both a Saibaman and himself. Vegeta didn't do much that was exceptional for a saiyan, of course Nappa would be upset that he killed him, he killed him! The main thing was that you get some context to see that he was as much of a product of his environment than anything and taken out of that environment and put into a fairly chill place like Earth he showed a surprising proclivity for change and temperance. Even before that, during the Namek stuff, at least he seemed genuinely miffed about the fate of people other than himself when talking about what Frieza did to the Saiyans. Even then he held back on just killing his recent enemies from Earth when he thought they weren't of any more use to him. What does Cell have? His competitive spirit is explicitly so he can rub his awesomeness in everyone's faces before killing everything. Like I said, we don't see any kind of growth except from 'Creepy' to 'Smug'. Even if he did it would just be retreading Vegeta but with none of the interesting background fluff. If they ever brought Cell back it should entirely be for purpose of him getting clowned by other people better than him to wipe that dumb look off his face. But then that's another thing they already have Vegeta for! khwarezm fucked around with this message at 04:02 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 03:59
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Cell has some likable qualities that mask what a complete monster he really is. He can act nice and friendly while also murdering thousands. Freeza has no likable qualities. There is nothing hiding what a monster he is. It's why Toriyama said he was the only purely evil character he ever made. There are no redeemable qualities to Freeza, and that's why Goku and friends didn't get any new allies from him. Also yeah, Vegeta was pretty much pure evil up until he FINALLY Got it when fighting Buu. That was his actual redemption moment
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Apr 11, 2017 03:59
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khwarezm posted:Vegeta didn't do much that was exceptional for a saiyan, of course Nappa would be upset that he killed him, he killed him! The main thing was that you get some context to see that he was as much of a product of his environment than anything and taken out of that environment and put into a fairly chill place like Earth he showed a surprising proclivity for change and temperance. Even before that, during the Namek stuff, at least he seemed genuinely miffed about the fate of people other than himself when talking about what Frieza did to the Saiyans. Even then he held back on just killing his recent enemies from Earth when he thought they weren't of any more use to him. "Evil people aren't evil because it's just how they were brought up!"
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Apr 11, 2017 04:02
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Aurora posted:"Evil people aren't evil because it's just how they were brought up!" I mean, probably.
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Apr 11, 2017 04:05
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khwarezm posted:I mean, probably. Wrong.
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Apr 11, 2017 04:08
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Aurora posted:Wrong. Nope.
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Apr 11, 2017 04:11
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khwarezm posted:Vegeta didn't do much that was exceptional for a saiyan, of course Nappa would be upset that he killed him, he killed him! The main thing was that you get some context to see that he was as much of a product of his environment than anything and taken out of that environment and put into a fairly chill place like Earth he showed a surprising proclivity for change and temperance. Even before that, during the Namek stuff, at least he seemed genuinely miffed about the fate of people other than himself when talking about what Frieza did to the Saiyans. Even then he held back on just killing his recent enemies from Earth when he thought they weren't of any more use to him. No, he didn't. Once brought into Earth, Vegeta impregnated Bulma then proceeded to only care about the new strong people he could fight with his newfound Super Saiyan powers. He was still so evil, he was fully willing to let his child and the mother of said child die, and when the future version of said son calls him out on it, he makes it clear that he couldn't care less about their life, or anyone's other than his own. He also very definitely kills a truck driver and likely several other innocents in his fight against 18. The latter, the technically actually evil one, never hurts anyone except actual fighters. Vegeta only starts changing once he's stuck in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber with Trunks, and even there, he only shows proper signs of changing after Trunks' death. His future counterpart never goes through that and dies just as evil as he begun, considering he never marries Bulma and as far as we know never cared about Future Trunks. And even with that, Vegeta only truly becomes good after he dies fighting Majin Buu, before that, he saw his growth as a person as a negative thing and willingly allowed himself to be possessed by Babidi to go back to being evil. In Namek, Vegeta cares about no one other than himself. He wants the Dragon Balls to wish for immortality to one-up Freeza, not because Freeza is a threat to the universe, but because he wants to be the top dog and fight forever. He kills a whole village of innocent Namekians to get their Dragon Ball, and in fact, when everyone killed by Freeza's men is brought back to life, Vegeta's kills are not and not only does he point out why to the grieving Namekians, he does so in a very smug way, showing that he's proud of his unjustifiable murders. He doesn't kill Gohan and Krillin exactly because they're of use to him, and he absolutely does heavily wound Gohan, a child, before for no reason. For all we know, Cell could go through the same growth if given the chance, Vegeta's character is basically completely opposite to how he was when he appeared, and it took a very long time for him to reach his current personality, something he's outright praised for in Battle of Gods.
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Apr 11, 2017 04:20
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The Cell arc only escalates the way it does because Vegeta was a jackass.
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Apr 11, 2017 04:40
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To be fair the Cell I was suggesting get the redemption chance was the one that hadn't even killed anyone yet
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Apr 11, 2017 04:44
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cell was always gonna kill people. 17 and 18 were on his hit list from the moment he was born
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Apr 11, 2017 04:48
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And when that didn't pan out, he broke Trunks' neck and then went back in time so he could eat more people.
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Apr 11, 2017 04:49
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Manatee Cannon posted:cell was always gonna kill people. 17 and 18 were on his hit list from the moment he was born Also why I suggested the learning computer get reprogrammed for this What If, since while Cell loving fighting was almost definitely genetic in nature(since he does have Saiyan genes in him), him wanting to kill and eat people as well as his massive ego were almost certainly the result of Dr Gero's programming and recordings rather than anything inherent
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Apr 11, 2017 04:54
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| # ? May 16, 2024 15:52 |
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Blaze Dragon posted:No, he didn't. Once brought into Earth, Vegeta impregnated Bulma then proceeded to only care about the new strong people he could fight with his newfound Super Saiyan powers. He was still so evil, he was fully willing to let his child and the mother of said child die, and when the future version of said son calls him out on it, he makes it clear that he couldn't care less about their life, or anyone's other than his own. I feel like we're talking past each other. Obviously Vegeta was evil for ages, but you can see slow but clear change through the whole time he's present. Like I said, what happened to the Saiyans irks him in his own way and that's clear early on. That Truck Driver was collateral damage, which is a step up from killing whole planets for funsies. By that point in the series he didn't care about other people's lives but wasn't arbitrarily slaughtering stuff for no reason anymore, heck, all the Z fighters hate his his guts but he doesn't have any particular bugbears for anyone other than Goku and has no designs on Earth, a place he was trying to blow up not long before. On Namek, when he steals the Dragonball from Krillen and Bulma and doesn't know Gohan nicked his he has absolutely no reason to let them live in his mind, he's a wish away from being unstoppable, but does anyway. Yeah kicking Gohan in the gut is an rear end in a top hat thing to do, but he could have outright killed him there and then instead. The wider point is that you can see that progressive change that slowly drags Vegeta from being 'Genocidal fuckface who reveals in slaughter' to 'overtly prideful fuckface who's ego keeps making situations worse', briefly back to 'Genocidal Fuckface' and finally to 'Detached dad who constantly tries to hide his love for his family but occasionally blurts it out'. Nothing about Cell has ever implied he'd do anything like that. All we've ever seen of him shows him drinking people horrifically, eating teenagers, bragging about being perfect, torturing the Z fighters and vindictively killing 16 to try and get a rise out of Gohan and trying to destroy the entire earth when he realizes he lost. Everything we know about his past implies no greater complexity than evil for evil's sake and wants to eat a couple of teenage robots. You could as easily say they should redeem Frieza.
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Apr 11, 2017 05:13
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