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HaB posted:By this measure, we'd be hard pressed to call Bed of Chaos a boss too. It's more like a puzzle. Like Dragon God or whatever that one from Demon's is called. Bed of chaos is required to beat the game. Beating ancient dragon is not. He just gives you an item and you never need return.
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Apr 11, 2017 18:30
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 07:48 |
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 hey guys whats up just trying to get a pale tongue :^)
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Apr 11, 2017 18:34
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the funniest part abt invading is when there are 3-4 people vs. you by yourself and they're still too scared to actually make a move towards you literally just run at me and there's almost nothing I could do
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Apr 11, 2017 18:36
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IronicDongz posted:
*points to Darkwraiths*
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Apr 11, 2017 18:41
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IronicDongz posted:the funniest part abt invading is when there are 3-4 people vs. you by yourself and they're still too scared to actually make a move towards you One time one of them handed us a tree seed and helped us killing enemies for a while and then our host got careless and died anyway so he still got his reward. RoadCrewWorker fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 18:50
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Johnny Joestar posted:any talk of 'worst fight in the series' begins and ends at bed of chaos, no matter what one's opinion of gael is. Yhorm is worse.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:17
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I like the yhorm fight
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Apr 11, 2017 19:20
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Cavelcade posted:Yhorm is worse. I think Yhorm's a different kind of bad than Bed of Chaos. Bed of Chaos can randomly send you plummeting to your death or get you stuck in a million Firestorm pillars; it's always bullshit. Yhorm is only bullshit the first time you face him, because the game doesn't give you even a vague hint that there's a sword you're meant to kill him with at the other end of the arena (nor does it easily describe how you use it to kill him until you have some time to fumble around with the controls enough); after that, he's just dull.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:21
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If you played Demon's Souls, Yhorm is no enigma. The fight is still terrible because he gets hyped in the intro pretty hard, but mechanically he's bad. His Area feels unrealized and unfinished as well, but with less copy paste.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:26
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The profane capital is unfinished, so yeah
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Apr 11, 2017 19:28
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At least this time they had the good sense to admit defeat and just make their unfinished area look unfinished instead of filling it with fullbright lava and sticking in ten thousand waddling dragon asses to pad it out.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:30
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I'm cool with Yhorm because my first fight with him Siegward pretty much carried me to victory. I don't mind the occasional set piece boss, particularly considering I followed it up with a sudden fight with the dancer while holding a ton of souls, which ended in a very narrow victory.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:32
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My first time through the Bed of Chaos I was in Havel's armor with a spooky skelesword and I was basically a linebacker jumping over roots and twirling around firestorms. I beat it first try and had no idea what all the complaints were about. Then I got there on my second character and it was like "oh"
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Apr 11, 2017 19:33
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RBA Starblade posted:The Ancient Dragon remains the one boss in the series I haven't beaten and have no desire to try to. once I solo friede and do the bb chalice dungeons, darklurker + ancient dragon + aldia are all I have left. ugh.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:36
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mastershakeman posted:once I solo friede and do the bb chalice dungeons, darklurker + ancient dragon + aldia are all I have left. ugh. Darklurker is fun
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Apr 11, 2017 19:37
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skasion posted:Darklurker is fun Darklurker and Aldia are fairly easy fights as it goes. Darklurker particularly if you've done a lot of pvp in DS2; the timing on his spells is basically the same.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:41
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Vermain posted:I think Yhorm's a different kind of bad than Bed of Chaos. Bed of Chaos can randomly send you plummeting to your death or get you stuck in a million Firestorm pillars; it's always bullshit. Yhorm is only bullshit the first time you face him, because the game doesn't give you even a vague hint that there's a sword you're meant to kill him with at the other end of the arena (nor does it easily describe how you use it to kill him until you have some time to fumble around with the controls enough); after that, he's just dull.  I have never felt particularly more frustrated with Bed of Chaos than a bunch of other bosses in the game. Yhorm is worse because he's dull. I get no sense of catharsis from defeating him, nor a sense of anything else to be honest. Bed of Chaos is probably my least favourite DS1 boss, but I got the satisfied feeling from killing it that I did from killing most other bosses and I was glad it was something different, even if it wasn't perfect. Yhorm was something different but lacking.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:49
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hanales posted:Bed of chaos is required to beat the game. Beating ancient dragon is not. He just gives you an item and you never need return. Ancient Dragon is not only optional, the item you get from it is just another Giant soul. Four is enough to beat Vendrick; that last one isn't worth it at all. So really, all you get from the Ancient Dragon is like 100,000 souls.
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Apr 11, 2017 20:00
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Funny thing about Yhorm is that if you have a bow or sorceries you can lock on his head and do a lot of damage. I once sunbrod for a sorcerer that was hitting Spears for 4k.
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Apr 11, 2017 20:02
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The storm thing probably counts as headshots and that's why it does so much
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Apr 11, 2017 20:12
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You know what really sucks? Fighting Dancer low-level on minimum specs. Why yes, I DO want frames to drop in the middle of dodging mad combos. Not random at all! Tl;dr port sucks
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Apr 11, 2017 20:17
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Vermain posted:I think Yhorm's a different kind of bad than Bed of Chaos. Bed of Chaos can randomly send you plummeting to your death or get you stuck in a million Firestorm pillars; it's always bullshit. Yhorm is only bullshit the first time you face him, because the game doesn't give you even a vague hint that there's a sword you're meant to kill him with at the other end of the arena (nor does it easily describe how you use it to kill him until you have some time to fumble around with the controls enough); after that, he's just dull. There's a what now  Stink Terios posted:You know what really sucks? Fighting Dancer low-level on minimum specs. Your system chugs on dark souls? Maybe update your system from an e-machines to a hot pentium II gateway. uncle w benefits fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 20:24
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Uncle w Benefits posted:There's a what now Oh no. Oh dear. The sword at the end of his hall, the secondary charges it up. Then you hold secondary again once it's glowing white and it fires a ranged attack. If you are aimed at his head it does like 1/4th his health per shot if you upgrade it a couple times.
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Apr 11, 2017 20:27
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Uncle w Benefits posted:There's a what now pro tip: wolnir also dies faster if you hit the glowing weak spots
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Apr 11, 2017 20:29
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Stink Terios posted:You know what really sucks? Fighting Dancer low-level on minimum specs.  The situation's not as bad as DS1's was, but the port is still unoptimized such that any dated graphics card will have issues. And even with an up-to-date graphics card (like my RX 470) the game still needs another art pass to not be so washed out. Of all things, loving MadWorld looked better despite having only four or five colors in its entire palette (two of which were just black and white).
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Apr 11, 2017 20:35
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Uncle w Benefits posted:There's a what now I’m kinda surprised poo poo like this happens, honestly. I would figure that at that point in the game, when you come up to a boss that you’re only plinking away at for like 30 damage, you figure that there’s something you’re probably missing in the fight. The only interesting thing in the area is the sword, and the description mentions that its weapon art is particularly useful against Giants. Sounds easy enough to put two and two together, but I guess if you just write it off as some random weapon, maybe not.
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Apr 11, 2017 20:36
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The thing that annoyed me with Yhorm on my spoiler-free blind run through the game was an obvious safe spot in the arena for switching weapons. I hadn't developed my skills at switching weapons on the fly, and the game hadn't really given much incentive to clean out the inventory before this point, so I died trying to find and equip the sword I'd just picked up. This also could have been solved if the top line or two of each item type's page was recently acquired items, or if there was an obvious way to sort items in reverse chronological order of acquisition (which would also be helpful when you get like six things at once in the middle of a fight, and you want to read their descriptions, but can't remember what you got or where to find it in your inventory).
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Apr 11, 2017 20:38
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CodfishCartographer posted:I’m kinda surprised poo poo like this happens, honestly. I would figure that at that point in the game, when you come up to a boss that you’re only plinking away at for like 30 damage, you figure that there’s something you’re probably missing in the fight. The only interesting thing in the area is the sword, and the description mentions that its weapon art is particularly useful against Giants. Sounds easy enough to put two and two together, but I guess if you just write it off as some random weapon, maybe not. Also it's image is the weird hilt of the sword your buddy is using to blast yhorm
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Apr 11, 2017 20:51
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CodfishCartographer posted:I’m kinda surprised poo poo like this happens, honestly. I would figure that at that point in the game, when you come up to a boss that you’re only plinking away at for like 30 damage, you figure that there’s something you’re probably missing in the fight. The only interesting thing in the area is the sword, and the description mentions that its weapon art is particularly useful against Giants. Sounds easy enough to put two and two together, but I guess if you just write it off as some random weapon, maybe not. The game doesn't prime you for this kind of thinking, though. At no point in any other boss fight in the entire game is there some nearby weapon, item, or environmental effect that makes a boss significantly easier. The closest thing you get is them planting Firebombs near to the Pus of Men in High Walls, but even that requires luck to figure out (since the Firebomb description never specifically mentions the Pus of Men as having cause to "fear the flames," nor would a first time player make any kind of connection between the Abyss and fire). Moreover, people are likely going to fight him in the area where they have the most space to maneuver (right in the middle), meaning that the developers were banking on people stumbling to the opposite end of where they entered before they'd notice the item. All they had to do was have a random NPC - or, gently caress, even Siegward - say a couple of lines about how he kept some Giant-slaying weapon near his throne. The fact that no one does points towards the larger truth that Profaned Capital was a rush job, since I can only assume you'd discover the relevant history of the Storm Ruler there if it hadn't been reduced to three buildings and a swamp. Vermain fucked around with this message at 20:54 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 20:51
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I love to Sunbro in this game. I made a Dex character named "I help you" and rack up mad souls helping people mostly on the Grand Archives. I frequent GA because it's required, easier with help, I know all the secrets and it's a popular invasion target. One of my favorite things is to throw lightning urns at invaders repeatedly while they try to flee or heal.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:03
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Vermain posted:the developers were banking on people stumbling to the opposite end of where they entered before they'd notice the item. I thought it was more the developers banking on people having played Demon's Souls and fan service
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Apr 11, 2017 21:06
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You hit the demon prince enough times with the murky shotel it'll add up. Just 800 swings more 
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Apr 11, 2017 21:07
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Lakbay posted:I thought it was more the developers banking on people having played Demon's Souls and fan service Storm King is at least a little more obvious about the fact that he's not a traditional boss, given that he and his cronies fly safely out of melee range. Yhorm just looks like a regular ol' boss who you're supposed to hit until he dies. Even people who played Demon's Souls probably aren't going to make the connection between a flying manta ray and an angry giant with a cleaver and start looking around the room.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:10
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There's a developer message in the boss room right in front of the throne with the storm ruler that tells you what to do with it. Granted, it says like "Only a great storm can fell a great giant" or something like that, but still. They don't just leave you twisting in the wind. edit: It says "only a storm can fell a greatwood" which is a bit less clear. But I mean, the sword is called the storm ruler... CJacobs fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 21:11
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CJacobs posted:There's a developer message in the boss room right in front of the throne with the storm ruler that tells you what to do with it. I first have to A) get close enough to the throne to see it and the Storm Ruler and then B) read an instruction manual while a giant is trying to kill me. Neither of these are good examples of game design.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:12
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I don't know about you guys but I picked up every thing while the dragon was still breathing fire at me. You need better magpie instincts
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Apr 11, 2017 21:14
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CJacobs posted:There's a developer message in the boss room right in front of the throne with the storm ruler that tells you what to do with it. Granted, it says like "Only a great storm can fell a great giant" or something like that, but still. They don't just leave you twisting in the wind. It's also not even true, by that point you've already fought like five giants (some bigger than Yhorm) and they go down like chumps when you stub their toes. The whole storm ruler thing is quite random and I suspect was put in there as a stopgap for a fight the designers didn't have time to flesh out the way they hoped.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:15
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Vermain posted:I first have to A) get close enough to the throne to see it and the Storm Ruler and then B) read an instruction manual while a giant is trying to kill me. Neither of these are good examples of game design. I'm not saying it is. What I will say though is that if you whack the guy and your sword- which does hundreds of damage by this point -does like 20 and his health bar doesn't even move, maybe think about if you are doing something wrong.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:15
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Vermain posted:The game doesn't prime you for this kind of thinking, though. At no point in any other boss fight in the entire game is there some nearby weapon, item, or environmental effect that makes a boss significantly easier. The closest thing you get is them planting Firebombs near to the Pus of Men in High Walls, but even that requires luck to figure out (since the Firebomb description never specifically mentions the Pus of Men as having cause to "fear the flames," nor would a first time player make any kind of connection between the Abyss and fire). Moreover, people are likely going to fight him in the area where they have the most space to maneuver (right in the middle), meaning that the developers were banking on people stumbling to the opposite end of where they entered before they'd notice the item. I will admit that there’s nothing like this in the game before, and there’s almost nothing done to prepare you for this beforehand. However, I think the game does enough on its own. It’s not counting on your to stumble accidentally onto the sword, it’s counting on you to see that just straight-up fighting him probably isn’t going to work, and you need to try something else. I actually think they should have made you deal even less damage to his feet / hands, so that you’d know it’s obviously the incorrect choice. Almost immediately upon starting the fight blind I noticed I wasn’t doing a lot of damage, and figured there was a gimmick I needed to figure out. You’ll probably die before figuring out the trick to the fight since there isn’t any obvious safe zones, which is a fair criticism against the fight. I feel like the best way to have handled this would have been to not start the fight immediately, maybe have Yhorm be asleep or something at the throne, and let you pick up the sword first. Either have him wake up when you pick up the sword, or go a step further and make the only way you can wake him up is to hit him with the blast from it. These may mess with how the fight works with Seigward, but still. Meanwhile, if Seigward is in the boss room, then it feels instead more like a story fight where he does the work and you get to sorta help out, and then you get the reward of a cool sword at the end. Vermain posted:Storm King is at least a little more obvious about the fact that he's not a traditional boss, given that he and his cronies fly safely out of melee range. Yhorm just looks like a regular ol' boss who you're supposed to hit until he dies. Even people who played Demon's Souls probably aren't going to make the connection between a flying manta ray and an angry giant with a cleaver and start looking around the room. I mean, I played Demon’s Souls first, so that may have spoiled me a bit with the fight. No, I didn’t make the connection at first, but when I saw I was barely piddling away at him, I figured there was something I was missing. I tried running around the area, found the sword, and immediately upon seeing the name knew what was up. I can imagine someone without Demon’s Souls experience not making the connection with the sword, it probably should have been named “Giant Slayer” or some poo poo, since “Storm Ruler” was only named so in Demon’s Souls because the boss was names Storm King and you fought him in The Shrine of Storms. It doesn’t really make any sense to be named the same in Dark Souls 3, other than obvious fanboy pandering.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:17
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CJacobs posted:I'm not saying it is. What I will say though is that if you whack the guy and your sword (which does hundreds of damage by this point) does like 20 and his health bar doesn't even move, maybe think about if you are doing something wrong. Again: if any other boss in the game had some example of you picking up a weapon/item or using an environmental effect to make the boss easier, that's fine, because then the developers have given the player an example of what could appear in the future and primed their thinking appropriately. DS1 does this nicely by forcing you to drop down onto Asylum Demon and then having you fight Taurus Demon next to a large drop that clever players can pick up on. If you hadn't had to drop down on Asylum Demon, would you have ever seriously considered climbing to the top of the tower and trying to fall down onto Taurus?
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Apr 11, 2017 21:19
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