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I'm fairly sure that the Venus storyline will end with some kind of revelation about that Martian ship. It's floating dead for some reason beyond politics. Not a book spoiler.
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Apr 11, 2017 07:21
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Then why would it be shadowing every course correction the science ship made?
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Apr 11, 2017 08:57
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Daktari posted:Then why would it be shadowing every course correction the science ship made? Maybe he just meant running "silent", or maybe a lot of people just don't pay attention to the shows they watch.
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Apr 11, 2017 10:06
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WhiskeyWhiskers posted:The only good thing about the belt is that they're not space libertarians. The Ferengi are the best thing about Star Trek
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Apr 11, 2017 15:54
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vermin posted:The Ferengi are the best thing about Star Trek take hotter than that ganymede incinerator
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Apr 11, 2017 15:55
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WhiskeyWhiskers posted:The only good thing about the belt is that they're not space libertarians. It's true, flawless good people make lovely fictional characters.
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Apr 11, 2017 16:55
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Number Ten Cocks posted:The discovery will be Mei is alive on Io, along with many protomonsters. Holden will want to nuke it from orbit anyway, its the only way to be sure. Oh yeah, that's probably right. Not sure what resolution that would actually have that would be meaningful though. The only time it really has any real stakes is if it falls into someone else's hands or if it was actually the sample used to create the Ganymede type monsters. Not sure the timeline supports that though.
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Apr 11, 2017 17:15
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vermin posted:The Ferengi are the best thing about Star Trek DS9 maybe.
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Apr 11, 2017 17:15
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And even in the books, Naomi is kind of an emotional idealist. She needs a cause or something. When Holden starts to go all cold, it really unsettles her and she loses her focus.
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Apr 11, 2017 17:20
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It totally makes sense from her perspective. She's disillusioned by the OPA, there's no cause or group she thinks is true or good but then she meets this super idealistic do-gooder who seems to be out on a mission to save pan-humanity and isn't a political partisan and always tries to do-the-right-thing so she's happy to follow him as a captain and a squinty lover. But then he starts getting all "ends justify the means" while pursuing a never-ending mission who's immediate goals are constantly shifting. I'm guessing her son was either killed by the OPA or got super radicalized and maybe went off and died for them which is why poo poo like that is a bit of a button issue (which made it strange why she got all swoony and apologetic for Dawes and his extremism) and can see holden is going down the same path, self radicalizing himself into an anti-protomolecule crusader able to justify any sacrifice or any collateral damage. Holden has also begun to turn anyone associated with the protomolecule into a non-human other only fit to suffer and die not unlike how the OPA is fine flushing inners into space. You're either with him or you're with the protomolecule.
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Apr 11, 2017 18:05
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Calling it now: Holden goes off the deep end with his protomolecule obsession, takes the Roci and chases after the Navauouu, flies back to the inner system with the Navouuo, lands it facedown on Venus, then finally he uses the Nauvuuos engines to push Venus into the Sun
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Apr 11, 2017 18:43
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Lack of Gravitas posted:then finally he uses the Nauvuuos engines to push Venus into the Sun lol
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Apr 11, 2017 18:45
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Lack of Gravitas posted:Calling it now: Holden goes off the deep end with his protomolecule obsession, takes the Roci and chases after the Navauouu, flies back to the inner system with the Navouuo, lands it facedown on Venus, then finally he uses the Nauvuuos engines to push Venus into the Sun Hey, after that "gravity slingshot" last episode why not?
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Apr 11, 2017 20:06
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Holden's 100% character change re: the protomolecule is dumb and wish t hey stayed in line with the books, where at sighting the PM on Ganymede he just flips out and wants to get off the planet ASAP instead of being a retard and grumbling "time for some huntin"
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Apr 11, 2017 20:15
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At this point I thought Holden's entire character was going to focus on hunting every last
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Apr 11, 2017 20:16
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I hope Holden gets killed and replaced by a character with a better actor 'cause that guy sucks.
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Apr 11, 2017 20:53
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stranger danger posted:I hope Holden gets killed and replaced by a character with a better actor 'cause that guy sucks. One day he's going to squint so hard and do such a batman voice you'll fall in love.
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Apr 11, 2017 20:58
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im commander holden and this is my favorite proto molecule on ganymede
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Apr 11, 2017 21:06
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Phi230 posted:Holden's 100% character change re: the protomolecule is dumb and wish t hey stayed in line with the books, where at sighting the PM on Ganymede he just flips out and wants to get off the planet ASAP instead of being a retard and grumbling "time for some huntin" A panicky ABORT ABORT ABORT GET THE FUUUUUUUCK OUT would have been more fun. Does Holden not know that a great many well trained and equipped marines got shredded by one of those?
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Apr 11, 2017 21:12
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AlternateAccount posted:A panicky ABORT ABORT ABORT GET THE FUUUUUUUCK OUT would have been more fun. This is clearly above Scooby and the Gang's pay grade. Him literally saying, "Nope" and turning around to join Naomi would've been totally acceptable.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:16
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AlternateAccount posted:Does Holden not know that a great many well trained and equipped marines got shredded by one of those? How would he? Edit: I've rather had him panic at the first evidence of Protomolecule presence, but everything's so much more of a secret in the show.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:19
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After reading book spoilers, I have a feeling his protomolocule obsession is going to work out in the long run.
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Apr 11, 2017 22:03
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Wow, I totally have thought that Jay Hernadez was Holden up until the other day, Hernadez was Miller's partner who was pretty much forgotten about after he was found alive after being harpooned. Also, I am really hoping that Mao and Miller are now god like beings on Venus with their interaction with raw protomolocule.
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Apr 11, 2017 22:17
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twistedmentat posted:Wow, I totally have thought that Jay Hernadez was Holden up until the other day 
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Apr 11, 2017 23:00
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twistedmentat posted:Wow, I totally have thought that Jay Hernadez was Holden up until the other day, Hernadez was Miller's partner who was pretty much forgotten about after he was found alive after being harpooned. different people http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1711829/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t1 http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0379596/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t22
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Apr 11, 2017 23:11
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Yea, basically that was the only name I recognized other than Thomas Jane and assumed he was the other lead.
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Apr 11, 2017 23:50
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enraged_camel posted:different people I can't see why anyone would recognize either of these people by name or face.
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Apr 12, 2017 00:03
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In the book, wasn't the sales pitch being made to the UN and not Mars?
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Apr 12, 2017 02:02
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Sammus posted:In the book, wasn't the sales pitch being made to the UN and not Mars? No, it was both, there's a quote at the end about how the spook who lost the bidding probably saved their career by not moving ahead with it.
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Apr 12, 2017 02:06
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Phanatic posted:The difficulty of stealth in space is predicated on the fact that when things warm up, they radiate, and being able to scan the whole sky for that radiation is a fairly modest task, well within the capability of any entity that can actually engage in advanced interplanetary travel. I'm gonna be a dick and dig up this argument again. It's dumb to assume "If a society can do X, surely they'll have unrelated Y technology as well" Fifty years ago they assumed we'd all have flying cars, no one thought we'd be carrying personal electronic devices connected to each other and the entire collection of human knowledge, and use it mainly to share pictures of cats with one another. Guessing what advanced technology is easy and hard is a losing bet. Maybe picking up a tiny pinprick of heat across millions of kms is hard? And especially distinguishing that from a random rock floating about in space. As penance, here's a repeat of the shot where Frankie Adams apparently assaults her co-star and breaks the TV prop: https://giant.gfycat.com/ClosedCompleteFowl.mp4
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Apr 12, 2017 12:26
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NZAmoeba posted:Maybe picking up a tiny pinprick of heat across millions of kms is hard? And especially distinguishing that from a random rock floating about in space. The technology literally exists today. A network of decent digital cameras and some software to run comparisons will find nearly anything.
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Apr 12, 2017 15:44
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Besides overt plot changes, one of the biggest discrepancies between the show and the books is the efficacy of surveillance technology. In the books, pretty much anyone can see anything in space that they have a mind to look for. Even the fancy stealth tech largely depends on people not looking at it during engine burns; once you've spotted a stealth ship, tracking it isn't difficult.
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Apr 12, 2017 15:58
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AlternateAccount posted:The technology literally exists today. A network of decent digital cameras and some software to run comparisons will find nearly anything. Yeah but like people thought the earth was flat and they were wrong, makes u think. Those scienticians making their haughty predictions about the future based on technology we have today and will only be getting way better could be totally wrong.
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Apr 12, 2017 18:53
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Except there are no scienticians in this thread, only people who read that one atomic rockets article and now think they know how the future of mankind will be. its a good read
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Apr 12, 2017 19:07
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That grenade was just the pizza party trying to tell Amos his table was ready
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Apr 12, 2017 20:05
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AlternateAccount posted:The technology literally exists today. A network of decent digital cameras and some software to run comparisons will find nearly anything. Pointing a scope at something and seeing what's what is something we can do today, having full coverage of the entire solar system at all times is something else entirely.
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Apr 12, 2017 20:11
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NZAmoeba posted:I'm gonna be a dick and dig up this argument again. It's not advanced technology. It is literally done today. WISE has detected objects as cold as 225 Kelvin at a distance of over 7 light years. Agahnim posted:Pointing a scope at something and seeing what's what is something we can do today, having full coverage of the entire solar system at all times is something else entirely. But it's not "advanced technology." It's something we could entirely do today if we chose to. And at the point at which you've got people living in habitats all across the solar system and dozens and hundreds of ships flying around constantly on a daily basis it's something you would choose to do because if you didn't it would be like shutting off the ATC networks at all the airports and just hoping things work themselves out without a whole bunch of people dying. To say nothing of the *military* advantages. Discerning an object radiating to any significant degree in the infrared is entirely current tech. Sweeping an IR-sensitive CCD around the sky on a regular basis, having enough CPU cycles to throw at the image processing, and so forth, that's all present-day tech. It's just not a hard problem. Phanatic fucked around with this message at 20:39 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 20:35
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I highly recommend that anyone interested in discussing the mechanics of stealth in space read the Project Rho article on the subject. A ton of the arguments and counter arguments recently brought up are well covered in that article. http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacewardetect.php
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Apr 12, 2017 20:39
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You wouldn't even need to have 100% real time vision on every chunk of space, only where ships originate or do their initial burn, which is highly highly visible. Ships don't pop out of nowhere in the middle of deep space, they launch from stations. You keep your eye on every station and any ship that hasn't correctly logged their flight path and done everything on the level would be a huge instant red flag and be extra tracked. Once the eyes are focused on you, there's no hiding. A ship launched from a semi-secret location though might have some moments where no one knows where it is. Launch and do a quick violent burn away from your secret asteroid hanger (which really isn't secret because anything built in space would also have been logged and flagged) while hidden behind it from every scope in the entire system and maybe if no one's looking at you get a bit of time. But you're still hot and will most likely be spotted quickly by some automated system, and the moment you do a burn you'd light up like a christmas tree to every sensor in the system along with your exact heading and speed. But every single launch from every single station in the system would be 100% known just from initial observations alone. Governments and militaries would make sure to have dedicated scopes and scanners set up just for that, on top of the system wide automated detection.
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Apr 12, 2017 20:52
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If you want a real, historical precedent for a watch‐the‐skies‐continuously‐to‐track‐all‐ships project, we spent, and continue to spend, an awful lot of money watching for nukes. Duga over‐the‐horizon RADAR looking for U.S. missiles  One of twelve U.S. Vela satellites monitoring the surface of Earth to detect any atmospheric nuclear detonations.  One of sixty infrasound stations, in 35 countries, monitoring for nuclear detonations in compliance with the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty. Pictured is IS18 in Greenland. ”A reaction drive's efficiency as a weapon is in direct proportion to its efficiency as a drive.” The Epstein drive is a really good weapon. Everyone in the Expanse knows this and would be willing to spend good money to defend themselves.
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Apr 12, 2017 21:01
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