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I think that SDP has the issue of having a missing generation, much like LA used to have but LA just overcame that sooner than SDP. Looking at the present state of Kok and Kepu, they're going to be in for a similar problem soonish, say after 2020. Kok kind of has the issue that their tier A up and comers like Lasse Männistö tend to exit party politics and go work in the private sector instead, where they can make more money. For the longest time, Kok was able to coast on the "commonsense caretaker party" image but you can't really do that when your only politician who even vaguely fits the bill anymore is Jan Vapaavuori. Pertti Salolainen doesn't seem interested in getting more responsibility for anything, Zyskowicz has little interest in moving up due to his health reasons, Stubb is absolutely worthless and beyond those, there's very few credible Kok politicians left. Edit: oh yeah dog. Have a dog. 
Kemper Boyd fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 17:09
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El Perkele posted:This might surprise you, but I have no issue imagining you didn't know the political terms you used to attack a politician you don't like. You might try to get through to Geriatric Pirate with sense, logic or reasoning, but the only thing he will listen to is hate of anyone who has failed to learn to fly by pulling on their bootstraps.
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Apr 11, 2017 17:17
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Kemper Boyd posted:I think that SDP has the issue of having a missing generation, much like LA used to have but LA just overcame that sooner than SDP. How has the LA overcome anything? Their support has always been abysmal because their voter base consists almost totally of pseudo-Greens who are just too änkyrä to agree with anyone over anything, and I guess some delusional communists in the countryside.
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Apr 11, 2017 18:03
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Kemper Boyd posted:I think that SDP has the issue of having a missing generation, much like LA used to have but LA just overcame that sooner than SDP. that's a good dog
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Apr 11, 2017 18:11
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Fabulous Knight posted:For some reason, Alexander Dugin has been allowed to enter the country for the second time since the annexation of Crimea. https://twitter.com/Alexey__Kovalev/status/850439594713731072 He's not even enjoying any of the favors for being Putin's "main ideologue", so I guess he has to resort to weirdos like Johan Bäckman. But the press sure like scare stories about Russians!
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Apr 11, 2017 18:21
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Darkest Auer posted:How has the LA overcome anything? Their support has always been abysmal because their voter base consists almost totally of pseudo-Greens who are just too änkyrä to agree with anyone over anything, and I guess some delusional communists in the countryside. They have overcome the real danger of disappearing from the game completely. Being like the Greens but more left is a valid position, and has actually forced the actual Greens to shift left too.
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Apr 11, 2017 19:41
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LA and the Greens should have a Grand Meet and unite their forces for common good for everyone. Apart from the old Stalinist or whatever who don't really exist, it's difficult to make a difference with their policies in general but just the painotus. The other group is, like, nature and save planet earth and then social justice and identity politics and luokkataistelu (wasn't Emma Kari for luokkataistelu, for example, correct me if not), and the other is, like, first luokkataistelu and then social justice and identity politics and nature. Not that far? The other group talks about the evils of capitalism though, I can't off the bat remember many Greens going that way but it's not like I kuumeisesti read all their vaalisivustot. Both are as far as I can tell for practically unlimited immigration especially if from Africa or Middle-East. Ligur fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Apr 11, 2017 |
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Apr 11, 2017 20:41
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doverhog posted:They have overcome the real danger of disappearing from the game completely. Being like the Greens but more left is a valid position, and has actually forced the actual Greens to shift left too. Yeah compared to many other socialist parties european countries, LA avoided a complete collapse post 1991. And unlike SDP, most of the old guard of the party is now gone and it's doing better compared to how things were ten years back. It's not entirely by chance that there's just two parties in Finland who have actually managed to raise their membership numbers in the last five years or so, and it's the Greens and LA. All the other parties are suffering from the fact that there's not people joining them anymore in numbers comparable to pre-1991. Ideologically, the party is still a mess since it hasn't really ever managed to come up with what it actually wants as far as economic policy goes, but that's common on the left anyway, since at least at this point, nationalization in any greater extent doesn't have popular support. There's a broad support for Keynesian economics tho which is mostly well-received on the left wing side of voters.
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Apr 11, 2017 21:00
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saas nähdä paljonko feministipuolue syö vasureiden ja vihreiden ääniä ensi eduskuntavaaleissa
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Apr 11, 2017 21:32
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Kemper Boyd posted:Yeah compared to many other socialist parties european countries, LA avoided a complete collapse post 1991. And unlike SDP, most of the old guard of the party is now gone and it's doing better compared to how things were ten years back. It's not entirely by chance that there's just two parties in Finland who have actually managed to raise their membership numbers in the last five years or so, and it's the Greens and LA. All the other parties are suffering from the fact that there's not people joining them anymore in numbers comparable to pre-1991. LA might have gained members but their seats in parliament have gone from 20 in 1999 to 12 in 2015 with a drop in every election (the greens are up from 11 to 15)
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Apr 11, 2017 21:34
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http://yle.fi/uutiset/3-9561163 A city councillor has to go to a trial for inciting against a group of people. Three guesses as to the party, and the first two don't count. *ääripäät* 
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Apr 11, 2017 21:38
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Where's the juicy facebook post?
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Apr 11, 2017 23:05
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DarkCrawler posted:http://yle.fi/uutiset/3-9561163 käräjäoikeuden lautamies, jc do they hold any standards for choosing juries?
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Apr 11, 2017 23:22
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Nenonen posted:käräjäoikeuden lautamies, jc ei ne valitaan puoluepohjalta
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Apr 12, 2017 05:55
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Hogge Wild posted:saas nähdä paljonko feministipuolue syö vasureiden ja vihreiden ääniä ensi eduskuntavaaleissa Tämä on hyvää kehitystä  edit: oh no someone made a facebook post, the sky is falling, will someone not punish those who make facebook posts I don't like : (((( Nenonen posted:käräjäoikeuden lautamies, jc Hitsi.. ehkä kukaan ei osannut sanoa etukäteen, koska emme näe tulevaisuuteen, että k.o. henkilö menee ja tekee fb-postauksen siitä suuttuneena, että irakilaiset hyökkäilevät naisten kimppuun turvapaikkaa hakiessaan, lisäksi, kuinka outoa, että joku hermostuisi sellaisesta :O Ligur fucked around with this message at 06:22 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 06:00
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Soininvaara blog about Jungner being in the wrong party etc: http://www.soininvaara.fi/2017/04/11/jungner-ja-urbaani-liberalismi/ quote:Jungner ei ole ainoa joka on väärässä puolueessa. On paljon ihmisiä, jotka haluaisivat kuulua urbaania liberalismia edustavaan puolueeseen, mutta ovat hajallaan eri puolueissa. He's making a good point - you don't really have a good socially liberal, economically science-based party in Finland. Instead you can choose between social conservatives who understand economics or liberals who don't. And you have people in Kok and Vihr. What he gets wrong is the assumption that Vihr are the closest thing to a home for these people. Vihr are moving left (and not in the reasonable "let's have a market system but just give the poor more money") and while Kok has nationalist, anti-gay etc politicians, they voted for gay marriage and support further EU integration. So basically - come home to Kokoomus, Soininvaara, Jungner and everyone else. He also makes a good point - there's a difference between wanting more redistribution but for the most part understanding economics and letting markets function where they function and being a moron who doesn't understand consequences of policies. SDP and Vas are still very much influenced by the AY-movement who don't really favor the out of work poor and are in general pretty obsolete thanks to globalization and improved living standards in Finland. And then you have people like Arhinmäki who seem proud to be illiterate about economics, supporting things like municipality run subsidized housing (makes sense since he made good use of that system himself). Geriatric Pirate fucked around with this message at 10:53 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 10:50
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Ligur posted:Tämä on hyvää kehitystä quote:Irakilaisnuoret tulevat maahan raiskaamaan naisiamme ja tekemään muita tihutöitä Asiallista keskustelua maahanmuutosta.
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Apr 12, 2017 10:51
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jos tihutöitä aletaan rankkaamaan, niin asettuuko naisten raiskaaminen vakavuusasteikossa omenavarkauden ylä- vai alapuolelle?
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Apr 12, 2017 10:59
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Ligur posted:Tämä on hyvää kehitystä Man, you really have a bizarre problem with people getting punished for breaking the law.
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Apr 12, 2017 11:22
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DanTheFryingPan posted:Asiallista keskustelua maahanmuutosta. Mielestäsi irakilaiset eivät siis ole tehneet ikäviä kepposia? On hauskaa, kuinka tässä langassa useampi kuin yksi postaajaa pillittää persuista joka sivulla sen perusteella, että joku persu on tuomittu rikoksesta tai kirjoittanut SoMessa ikävästi. Yhyyy, persut ovat pahoittaneet mieleni. Persut ovat pahoja, katsokaa tätä kuvakaappausta jonka löysin imgurista! Tsk tsk, ei saisi yleistää koko porukkaa kun ei ne kaikki, vai miten se meni. edit: sallittakoon toki jokaiselle lempiaiheensa, mutta on koomista, että suurin osa kitinästä tai ihan suorasta vihamielisyydestä joka koskee persuja kohdistuu siihen, että ne on ihan juntteja koska eivät usein pidä tietyntyyppisestä maahanmuutosta tai peräti kirjoittavat netissä ikävästi tjsp. Eli eivät lopulta tee juuri yhtään vittu mitään. Ymmärtäisin paremmin jos persut murhailisivat väkeä tai jotain sellaista. Ligur fucked around with this message at 11:59 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 11:46
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Ligur posted:Mielestäsi irakilaiset eivät siis ole tehneet ikäviä kepposia? Ethnic background is a bit different than political affiliation. That said, people do often generalize persut a bit too much. Most persus are just lovely conservatives instead of the far-right menace or whatever.
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Apr 12, 2017 11:53
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I too think that the country you happen to be born in is equally indicative of your values and beliefs as a political party you've voluntarily chosen to join specifically because they espouse certain values and beliefs. I mean, even for ligurwhine this is especially dumb.
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Apr 12, 2017 11:58
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Andrast posted:Ethnic background is a bit different than political affiliation. Ovathan ne eri asioita, mutta keskustellessamme eri ryhmistä voisimme silti pyrkiä käyttämään samaa logiikkaa tai perusteita kun niputetaan ryhmää jokisin, tai puhutaan minkä tahansa ryhmän ominaisuuksista. Joko yleistäminen on ymmärrettävää ja ok, tai sitten se ei ole. Ne ihmiset jotka lausuvat persuista (tai suomalaisista) melko villejä yleistyksiä alkavat huutamaan pää punaisena jos joku sanoo samaa vaikka, no, irakilaisista. Ei ole irakilainen valinnut synnyinmaataan ja puoliaktiivi on valinnut puolueensa, mutta yleistäminen on silti yleistämistä. Lisäksi tämän lautamiehen facebook -kiihoitus on kyllä niin kevyttä kamaa, että on suurempi rikos tuhlata aikaa siihen, että asiaa käsitellään missään oikeusasteessa. Ei kukaan lue lautamiehen facebooktekstiä, ja päätä sitten, että nytpä menen lyömään ulkomaalaisenoloista henkilöä. Kohtalaisen orwellilaista menoa & uhriton rikos. Samaa mieltä siitä, että suurin osa persuista on en nyt tiedä paskoja mutta laimeita konservatiiveja.
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Apr 12, 2017 12:12
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Andrast posted:That said, people do often generalize persut a bit too much. Most persus are just lovely conservatives instead of the far-right menace or whatever. "lovely conservatives who enable far-right to gain power and traction are lovely and can be accurately described as collaborators; failure to act on the subject indicates at least implicit acceptance" is my common idea in my social circles.
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Apr 12, 2017 12:24
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Ligur posted:Ovathan ne eri asioita, mutta keskustellessamme eri ryhmistä voisimme silti pyrkiä käyttämään samaa logiikkaa tai perusteita kun niputetaan ryhmää jokisin, tai puhutaan minkä tahansa ryhmän ominaisuuksista. Joko yleistäminen on ymmärrettävää ja ok, tai sitten se ei ole. Yeah because it's not like every other post you make is whining about people of certain political affliation. And now it is again magically wrong because other people do it. What a huuugeeee surprise!
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Apr 12, 2017 12:28
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Nenonen posted:käräjäoikeuden lautamies, jc The demari incest daddy also served as a lautamies, maybe it's actually a positive if you have some criminal tendencies 
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Apr 12, 2017 13:28
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I guess we're hosed http://www.is.fi/taloussanomat/art-2000005165696.html quote:Nykyisten kaksi- ja kolmikymppisten tulokehitys on tyssännyt, ja historiallista kyllä, 25–34-vuotiaiden tulot ovat jo muutaman vuoden ajan olleet pienemmät kuin 64–75-vuotiaiden eläkeläisten.
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Apr 12, 2017 15:17
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http://www.savonsanomat.fi/kotimaa/...e18f84a2aa66a81 *ääripäät*  DanTheFryingPan posted:I guess we're hosed Lol if you are under 40 and actually expect to get a pension
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Apr 12, 2017 16:28
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My pension savings are an amount of money equal to the value of a cyanide capsule.
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Apr 12, 2017 19:52
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DarkCrawler posted:Yeah because it's not like every other post you make is whining about people of certain political affliation. And now it is again magically wrong because other people do it. What a huuugeeee surprise! Huokaus. Mitähän tämä DarkCrawler nyt tällä kertaa parkuu. Kuten asiaan kuuluu, kaveri ei ymmärtänyt pätkääkään mistään mitään mitä kirjoitin? En suinkaan sanonut, että on väärin yleistää, antaa palaa vaan. Yleistäminen on ihan ok. Senkuin valitat joka toisessa postissa siitä kuinka kamalia persut ovat, mutta älä viitsi sen jälkeen nillittää jos joku muu posteri yleistää tai vetää linjoja suoriksi muista. Tai joku hörhö kirjoittaa fabossa niin hurjasti että pitää kopioida imgurista kuvia. On yksi asia kiljua, että kaikki tavalliset oikeistolaiset tai keskusta-oikeistolaiset jotka kannattavat parlamentaarista demokratiaa ja monipuoluejärjestelmää ovat sama kuin hitler ja fasismi. (Valitettavasti yleistä täällä foorumilla.) En minä täällä mölise, että kaikki vasemmalla minusta olevat henkilöt ovat Stalinisteja ja kommareita jotka haluavat ampua kaikki sekä Mao, vaikka naurankin vassareille joka toisessa postauksessa tai jotain. Tällä foorumilla kuitenkin mellastaa aika monta posteria, joiden mielestä kaikki heistä oikealle ovat fascisteja. (Crawler ei tosin ole yksi näistä urpoista, vaikka muuten sekaisin ja käy mielikuvitusväittelyitä muiden postaajien kanssa.) Ligur fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 20:48
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onko minnekään koottu hauskoja äänestyslappuja
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Apr 12, 2017 20:58
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Hogge Wild posted:onko minnekään koottu hauskoja äänestyslappuja Näiden hauskuudesta voi olla montaa mieltä, mutta tuossa on ilta-syövän tämän vuoden katsaus aiheeseen. Ei ole peräruiske-Hitleriä 
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Apr 12, 2017 21:37
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Ligur posted:Huokaus. Mitähän tämä DarkCrawler nyt tällä kertaa parkuu. Kuten asiaan kuuluu, kaveri ei ymmärtänyt pätkääkään mistään mitään mitä kirjoitin? En suinkaan sanonut, että on väärin yleistää, antaa palaa vaan. Yleistäminen on ihan ok. Senkuin valitat joka toisessa postissa siitä kuinka kamalia persut ovat, mutta älä viitsi sen jälkeen nillittää jos joku muu posteri yleistää tai vetää linjoja suoriksi muista. Tai joku hörhö kirjoittaa fabossa niin hurjasti että pitää kopioida imgurista kuvia. Like it or not, nationality, origin, skin color, sexuality or any other thing you have no power or choice over are not the same thing as political orientation. You yourself already conceded this fact so the attempt to go on equating them was quite bizarre. TF are a political party with clearly stated, lovely principles, their elected politicians continually do lovely illegal things that other politicians seem to be able to avoid doing and their supporters and sympathizers are without an equivalent in the lovely illegal things they do that get into the news. They tend to vote for lovely decisions, like preventing gays from getting married. They are all united by their support for said principles, said politicians and voting record. It is an organization. You are not born into persuhood. Is it yleistäminen if I say Wahhabists are lovely people? If i say anarchists are lovely people? They've all agreed to certain tenets and clearly seem to vote certain kind of people into power when given a chance, especially at a local level. Persus may not be as lovely as those aforementioned groups but the scale of poo poo sure has a lot of room in it. And now that the only uniting factor and campaining tactic in the party is xenophobia, it's even easier to make that judgement. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 21:45
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Rappaport posted:Ei ole peräruiske-Hitleriä Höh. Se oli paras
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Apr 12, 2017 21:51
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Hogge Wild posted:onko minnekään koottu hauskoja äänestyslappuja Helsingin kaupungin arkistoon on ainakin koottu jokunen hauska pöytäkirja http://www.hs.fi/kaupunki/art-2000005168833.html quote:HS:n saamien tietojen mukaan sunnuntain vaalien jälkeen valtuutetun paikassa kiinni ollut Matti Niiranen on pudonnut varavaltuutetuksi äänten tarkastuslaskennan jälkeen.
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Apr 12, 2017 21:55
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Rappaport posted:Näiden hauskuudesta voi olla montaa mieltä, mutta tuossa on ilta-syövän tämän vuoden katsaus aiheeseen. pahus
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Apr 12, 2017 22:11
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DanTheFryingPan posted:I guess we're hosed It's literally because they made vuokratyö legal.
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Apr 13, 2017 04:20
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 the gently caress is that blue speck doing in Lapland? (had to check, it's Inari, wtf)
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Apr 13, 2017 05:37
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okay now I'm just paralyzed   Inari is not the county where I would expect Cock to be the largest party, or the left and greens pushing basic finns out of existence and bringing pedo party down a notch, or swedes getting as many votes as the finns, or women overpowering men, or the average age being less than 150 years, or... e: and no kd?!? I don't get Lapland 
Nenonen fucked around with this message at 05:46 on Apr 13, 2017 |
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Apr 13, 2017 05:43
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Nenonen posted:the gently caress is that blue speck doing in Lapland? Population of Inari is like fraction of people living in Kallio, so just dozen votes makes all the difference. edit: there's the Border Guard base in Ivalo, which probably swings heavily to Kok too Stubb Dogg fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Apr 13, 2017 |
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