|
I think the point is that it's a kinda silly taunt unless you literally breath fire or use fire magic, endorph. Which I don't agree with, that's probably the best line corrin gets for this whole game regardless.
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 05:18
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 8, 2024 06:56 |
|
|
I don't think any death really would have been satisfying with as much as Hans put us through, really.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 05:54
|
|
|
Endorph posted:im fairly certain it is possible to burn a person. perhaps, by tying them to a lot of wooden things, and then setting those things on fire. i wonder if anyone has ever invented that. My point is that the expression "burned to the ground" is an expression applied to buildings, not people. Saying it to a person sounds incredibly odd.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 13:31
|
|
|
  Drop your weapons, and your lives will be spared. They killed Captain Hans... What do we do? I...I don't know. I think we surrender. It looks like they're giving up. Good. Then we're done here. Guys, we've got a problem. Lilith took quite a shot... Gods, no... So basically in-game, Corrin immediately killed Hans after that Lilith sacrifice. Or Lilith has literally just been chilling and bleeding to death for like 30 minutes.   Oh, NOW you try to heal her.  And now it's snowing. Because...sadness.   Hans is dead. We finally got him. Please... You have to be OK! She's too far gone for my rod to work. I don't think I can save her, Corrin... What?! No! My staff isn't helping either. What do we do? This can't be happening...   Aaaand now she's a girl again. Lilith! You're...you're human again! *cough* *cough* Only for a moment, it seems... The Astral Dragon Moro has taken pity on me. It's giving me the strength to return to this form for my last few breaths... "Who will eat all these peaches?! I have 99 of them and Takumi can't burn them all fast enough!"  I'm sorry, milord, but I'm not long for this world. Please don't cry. I decided to give my life for you, and I'm happy I succeeded. After all, you already saved my life once. This just makes us even. I die with no regrets. But...we could end the war today! You could live in a peaceful world... Don't give up! It's OK, Lord Corrin. I know how far we've come. And I know you will succeed.  What progress? Like, before the game started? Cause you didn't show up since like chapter 16. Lord Corrin...be brave and go on without me.   *Lilith dies*  No... WAAAAAH Lilith... This can't be happening... I'm so sorry...I couldn't s-save you...  You're going to give up now??? Look up, Corrin. Ryoma? Dry your tears. Think about Lilith's sacrifice. She gave her life so you could continue fighting. And what are we fighting for?  We are fighting for Queen Mikoto and for the whole world! Do you think Lilith would want you to give up like this? Ughhh... Listen. It is time for you to rise to the occasion. If we want to end this war, now is the time for us to take action! "And that bullshit involving Kaze with A rank. The most heinous of it all" There will be a time for rest. But that time is not now. Rise up! The sacred blade Yato chose YOU, Corrin. We're all counting on you! ... You're right. I know you're right.  I will not stop until King Garon's reign of terror is over. Let's go, everyone. That's the spirit. Father's room is this way, Corrin. Please promise you'll try talking first. I will....   No but seriously, 99 peaches
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 16:50
|
|
|
This whole sequence is ridiculously stupid. I mean, if you've gotten this far then presumably you can handle Hans, and you can probably take a hit or two; there is literally no in-game reason for Lilith to die other than "Story Corrin sucks." Sadly, it isn't the worst this game has to offer as far as "gratuitous drama" goes; Kaze is a prime example.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 16:58
|
|
|
And this is what happens when you try to drop in a cookie cutter "emotional" moment when you don't do any of the actual groundwork to set it up
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 17:16
|
|
|
 It's like the dad's dumb sacrifice in Fallout 3, except ten times worse.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 18:01
|
|
|
One narrative rule for character death I want writers to follow is similar to a rule I've seen for adding new characters: If the death doesn't serve any purpose in the plot, that death is not necessary and should not be written in. For an example of character death done well, I'd say Kamina's death in TTGL is probably ideal: His death is a vital element of pretty much everyone's personalities for the rest of the series. In fact, his influence is so profound that it could be said that he never really leaves the show despite no longer being physically present. This, on the other hand, does basically everything WRONG. There is no purpose, there is no impact, we don't even really know the victim, and the only in-story reaction is a brief moment of melodrama from the protagonist, who is hard to sympathize with because he's just so STUPID.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 18:15
|
|
|
Having Corrin say "WAAAAAAAAAH" to imply that he's crying is not a very good idea if you want me to take this story seriously. Although at this point in the game I guess it doesn't matter since the players stopped caring a long time ago.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 18:45
|
|
|
Another problem I can see with this: Lilith is (technically) a combat unit in the castle. She has stats. What if she has enough defense to tank a single hit from a Brave Axe (or even two)? What if you've seen her do so before? I'm pretty sure that's a thing that could happen, too. And now she gets one-shotted.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 19:11
|
|
|
Cutscenes: The number one killer in any RPG
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 20:02
|
|
|
LEGO Genetics posted:Cutscenes: The number one killer in any RPG Cutscenes in RPGs turn every grunt with a pistol from an imperial stormtrooper to Chirico Cuvie.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:04
|
|
|
 So you might be wondering what's with Lilith's Temple if she's dead now. Well, it still functions exactly the same.  You can still offer food on Lilith's pad, and she still appears in MyCastle as a battle unit.  But now the food just disappears as her spirit gains levels instead.  I still don't understand how anyone think that's a bird   Goddamn amazing. That's the most restraint I've seen in forever.  *Corrin, Sakura, Takumi, and Azura arrive at the scene*  All right...the throne room is just upstairs from here. Understood. Wait. Someone's coming down. Oh!  *Teleports to them*   Well, well...look who's still alive! You're just full of surprises, Corrin. I'm through playing games, Iago. Let's just do this. Not so fast!  Lady Elise, I'm here for you! Why don't you come over here, and I'll protect you. Why would I ever listen to YOU! You tried to make Xander and Leo fight Corrin!  FINALLY someone's keeping count. And she's only been with us for like an hour! Save your breath, Elise. This guy never listens to reason. He doesn't care about right or wrong. He's just looking out for himself. I think it's time we taught him a lesson he'll never forget. Ooh, such big words. Hoshidan prince! But you are right... I don't care about what's right or wrong. That's why I always get my way. I'm willing to do what's necessary. Like THIS! *A gasp is heard behind them*   Oh no it's Takumi! Takumi was the traitor in...the most...boring way possible. Wow, literally taking the tension out of that reveal, huh Birthright. Takumi! What are you doing? Die die die die die... Urk...you're...hurting me! Why... What's wrong with you? Stop hurting her! *sigh*  And I need you to comprehend the totality of your defeat. Otherwise I can't properly enjoy myself, you see? Very well, let me explain. Prince Takumi has been on our side all along! Thanks to him, I've known your whereabouts every step of the way. You're lying. How could that be possible? Takumi, tell me this is a joke! To be fair, most of the backstabbing was by Garon. That doesn't really count at this point... And to think of all that time you spent looking for poor little Takumi... There's no way Takumi would betray us of his own free will. He must still be possessed! Oh, please. Of course he's possessed. But the spell wouldn't work without a kernel of dissatisfaction in his soul. He's always felt like an afterthought in the royal family.  Also fair. Ryoma at level 5 can still outdamage most of the army. That's how he survived. His hatred kept him going so he could deceive you all! Now it's his turn to shine. Mwahahaha! He's deliciously evil, is he not? Better hurry up and kill him...before he kills Azura!No, actually you made this traitor thing the dumbest reveal possible because there's no investment in a half-game sub-plot about the traitor be just possession. There's got to be a better way... Takumi, listen! What happened in the Bottomless Canyon? What made you this way? Nnngh... I can fix this... Just need to sing my song... *Takumi hits Azura?* Aieeee! Azura! Oh, I'm so glad I'm getting to see this all in person for once. It's quite a show! I wonder how it will end... Are you really just going to let him kill Azura like this? What are you waiting for? Kill Takumi! And then see how Ryoma reacts. Oh ho ho!Where the gently caress is Ryoma anyway  I believe in you, Takumi. I know the real you is still in there. Nnngh...Brother... What?! Now's my chance...  You are the ocean's gray waves... ♪ No! Shut up! *Sakura hits Iago?* I'm putting question marks because this entire conversation is still just on this screen. No cutscenes or anything. Still just...Takumi holding Azura...  Gwaahhh... I w-won't let you interrupt her! Sakura! Thank you! You will pay for that bit of sass, young lady. I didn't want to get my hands dirty, but I suppose it can't be avoided. Eeeee!   So Takumi shot Iago, but you only saw the aftermath. They ran out of budget for this scene or something? It's OK, everyone...  I'm myself again. Thank you, Azura. Yes! I knew you'd snap out of it! Thank you for believing in me, Corrin. Of course. I've been asking that for a long time, dude I just woke up for good. That's what happened. You were able to exploit some of my deepest fears and flaws, but that's over.  My brothers and sisters need me, and I won't let them down. I'm a proud prince of Hoshido, and from now on I will live up to the title! How disappointing. This is it for you, Iago. You're on the wrong side of history. Peace is coming, and you can't stand in its way any longer.  No seriously, where the gently caress is Ryoma and Hinoka   Welcome to Walhart's castle Birthright edition. Complete with treasure chests on both northern sides of the map. Bench Kaze or Felicia: http://www.strawpoll.me/12733738
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:08
|
|
|
Tae posted:
Corrin, that's bad guy talk. You can't do that and still be the good guy. FoolyCharged posted:Hey man, shes a suuuuper spooky ghost now. This is totally serious Just saying that I was being literal there. I laughed so hard when I got back to base and saw what they did with lilith there.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:28
|
|
|
What was the point of Lillith's death? She was barely a character, and you still have access to her gameplay-wise, so why was that scene even in the game? Why did anyone have to die when Hans attacked Corrin? 
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:36
|
|
|
Dr. Fetus posted:What was the point of Lillith's death? She was barely a character, and you still have access to her gameplay-wise, so why was that scene even in the game? Why did anyone have to die when Hans attacked Corrin? Nothing, because her amazing storyline was probably axed save for this screen and we really needed to play up how strong Hans was. Y'know, people told me the plotline in Birthright was better than Conquest but uh, I'm not too sure.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:40
|
|
|
Honestly Conquest is probably even dumber but at least it's funny dumb instead of Birthright's boring dumb.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:56
|
|
|
Krumbsthumbs posted:Nothing, because her amazing storyline was probably axed save for this screen and we really needed to play up how strong Hans was. I don't know, having played neither I'm going to hazard a guess that while Birthright might have worse peaks of stupidity, Conquest has the ball and chain that is king  dragging it down.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:57
|
|
|
FoolyCharged posted:Corrin, that's bad guy talk. You can't do that and still be the good guy. After what Iago's put us through, you can't NOT say that and be a relatable character. That might be me projecting Corrin's outbursts as him getting fed up with this game as the rest of us are though 
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 22:57
|
|
|
Krumbsthumbs posted:Y'know, people told me the plotline in Birthright was better than Conquest but uh, I'm not too sure.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 23:06
|
|
|
Conquest reaches higher then Birthright and thus fails much, much more spectacularly. It also makes it much funnier.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 23:32
|
|
|
also ryoma is mostly just boring while xander is aggressively stupid
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2017 23:56
|
|
|
Also, Nohr's royals are better than Hoshido's. Character-wise at least, since Ryoma and his dumb lightning sword are stupidly good.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 06:10
|
|
|
I still have no idea what the point of that "reveal" with Takumi was, especially since they decide to have play out in the worst way possible. Just... a still screen. I honestly do think that the structure of Fire Emblem often doesn't easily allow for good stories, but you can see they can do better in this game, but... didn't. Probably money or time reasons, I guess, but still it is spectacularly lazy. Okay, I guess it's here because of Conquest, and oddly enough that's one plot point Conquest does do better. Still. Why have the Takumi possession in Birthright. Just remove it , guys. We would have lost nothing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 06:39
|
|
|
Wow; I never really paid it much attention, but your Corrin has awful Strength for a level 10 Hoshido Noble.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 07:59
|
|
|
Endorph posted:Because writing a video game is freaking impossible. Pretty much every possible good idea you can have inevitably gets sacrificed for the sake of gameplay, or marketing, or whatever. Fates is just an incredibly egregious example, but even games I think are well-written have more than a few moments of filler, odd pacing, or half-finished ideas. However I do agree that most games tend to get it wrong rather than right. Fates problems other than the ones brought up are: Gameplay and Story Segregation. This is a problem Fire Emblem has had forever and was only just getting out of during the Gamecube games. The story that's being told and your actions in battle don't interact all that much. Yeah you won't get certain supports or lines of dialogue if you let people die but by and large you get the same general story no matter what happens during gameplay. Games with half decent writing tend to get around this by hiding/obscuring this fact, while Fates makes it extremely blatant and noticeable. Writing by committee/proxy. Too many cooks spoil the pot, too many writers trip over each others words. Focus and purpose are important at all levels of game/software design in order to keep things in shape. Fates had that in the initial draft but then that draft was expanded far beyond it's scope (while I could believe getting 2 games worth out of it, 3 is just inane.) The animated cutscenes are pretty good though. Those are nice.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 08:00
|
|
|
Tae posted:
Iago getting the poo poo beaten out of him by Sakura is amazing because he deserves no better.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 09:10
|
|
|
EponymousMrYar posted:disagree with this sentiment LifeofaGuardian posted:Iago getting the poo poo beaten out of him by Sakura is amazing because he deserves no better.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 09:18
|
|
|
Endorph posted:also ryoma is mostly just boring while xander is aggressively stupid I'd say Xander is more willfully ignorant than straight up stupid but I guess we'll come to that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 16:14
|
|
|
blizzardvizard posted:I'd say Xander is more willfully ignorant than straight up stupid but I guess we'll come to that. Being willfully ignorant does not make you not stupid, though. Considering the average character intelligence of Fates? I'd say he's both, at best. On a side note, I was screwing around with a massive stockpile of stat boosters, and I found out that Subaki actually has a lower Strength cap than SETSUNA, of all people. In fact, when I checked his caps online I found out that pretty much all he's good at is Skill and Defense, with the only other stat that is not penalized being Magic; maybe he's trying so hard it's actually causing muscular damage due to overexertion or something? I've heard that's a problem athletes can have.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 17:12
|
|
|
Gonna close the vote early , Kaze's out (Unless a sudden surge of 30 more Kaze fans swarm in to retort)
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2017 17:50
|
|
|
 Pretty much the same party as last mission, and probably the same going forward. The power levels of the enemies are at that point where everyone needs to be as high of levels as possible to survive.   It took forever, but welcome to Fates' signature gently caress-you move: Entrap. Entrap-B Rank, 60 hit, 1-7 range, 2 uses, Moves an enemy next to the user Pretty much any of these users are surrounded by enemy units and they act first in enemy turns, so a unit caught in its area will suddenly be assaulted by a million max strength zerkers. No one, not even Oboro with Rally Defense, can handle more than two attacks at this point from those enemies.   What? No, Kagero. You are wrong.   More clearing of the initial Generals, Corrin continues to be Roy levels of disappointing with a +MAG/SPD/LCK level. WHY DO YOU REFUSE TO GAIN DEFENSE   After Kiragi takes out the Entrap Strategist, Oboro and Silas take sides to bait out enemies. The team is going to stay here for a while because constant reinforcements appear at the ends of the bottom map.   Silas kills off about three Great Knights before gaining a great level.   The zerkers hit hard, but the Heroes are the real damage sponge because they have high balanced stats while retaining the high HP count.   Once Mozu clears out, the same pair of enemies will start spawning every turn for like three more turns. Right side spawns Great Knight+Dark Knight, while the left side does Great Knight+Bow Knight. Great Knights at this point are by far the weakest enemies because they don't hit that hard, have bad resistance, and Silas/Kagero/Scarlet eat them for breakfast with their anti-armor weapons.   And Felicia can just solo Dark Knights.   At least he's at an average 23 speed now. Can't take a hit worth a drat but his AoE has been surprisingly useful.   Some General elimination while I'm waiting out on the reinforcements.   At least she's back on track gaining magic.   I don't know why this lone Maid was so aggressive to approach the team.   Azama, you've been kinda screwing up lately.  Now that the bottom reinforcements stop, it's time to tackle the actual puzzle of the map. The Sorcerer and Maid will spam AoE on the party constantly and they hurt hard. That Entrap Strategist will basically almost kill any unit caught. Those zerkers require at least two units to kill. And then factor in that the top right and left have been spawning reinforcements constantly.   Look, at this point I just want Midori to hit level 15 so she gets the overpowered skill.   Corrin's team continues up the right side treasures, while the rest of the team is splitting duties to make the middle safer.   The Shuriken turret is accurate and powerful enough to severely cripple the more fragile units like Felicia and Kagero to basically paper tissue. That's another issue why the Entrap Strategist is dangerous, because the unit will most likely be crippled by the turrets beforehand.   WHY   Meanwhile, Mitama doesn't give a crap and she gets an excellent level.   I dunno why Scarlet has been on this magic kick lately. Now at 8 magic.   Uh oh.   Well, that could've ended badly after a couple Tomohawks to the face.   Mozu switches out and makes sure to eliminate the main problem of the map. A nice bonus of 10k gold drops from the corpse. Sakura comes with the clutch Rescue to get Mozu out of dodge.   Rinkah eliminates the Sorcerer to cut off magic turret barrages, while Kagero moves up and unlocks a Waterwheel. Waterwheel-S rank, 19 mt, 85 hit, Critical Evade +20, Defense and Resistance +5; after the battle, Strength is halved for the next attack One of the few S rank weapons that is actually good, because it's effectively a better Guard Naginata for Oboro.   Rinkah finally gains some magic. Despite Bolt Axe being super powerful, her paltry 13 magic was starting to show its limitations.   Hinoka eliminates the last side enemy, leaving only the middle to tackle on.   This is possible one of the worst Dragon Veins, because it just "disables" weapons for this turn. Not even a whole turn, just this player phase.   27 STR/SPD is a good spread. And 25 defense is a nice surprise. Takumi has turned out well, unlike another white haired Hoshidan prince....   Skill or speed. Which one will be 30 first.   Another Boot for Kiragi.   The slow march towards Iago's execution continues. Mozu gains another level, getting STR/LCK/DEF.   I'm having Kiragi troll the hell out of Iago with the AoE function until Kagero picks up the last treasure.  Bowbreaker doesn't help against Balista's, apparently. Hagakure Blade-S rank, 18 mt, 95 hit, +20 avoid, After the battle, Strength is halved for the next attack If you have a developed Swordmaster that isn't Ryoma, here's a sorta decent sword that gives extra dodging. I dunno why Iago has a katana on him, but I don't care at this point.  Pursuer-S rank, 22 mt, 80 hit, 10 crit, -10 avoid, Defence -5 and Resistance -3; follow up attack speed +5, enemy’s follow up attack speed +5 Basically lets Takumi double an enemy he otherwise wouldn't.   Just triggering some conversations. Takumi vs. Iago Yes! I was hoping I'd get a chance to kill you myself. This is for everything you've put me through! *yawn* You know I chose you because you were the weakest, right? You should never have come out of that spell—now you're going to suffer! Wrong! Now that my head is clear, my aim is truer than ever. I'm going to turn your face into my own personal bull's-eye.   Just when I think I've got you under my foot, you scamper away. Sure. Just keep talking. It's what you do best. I'm through talking. Well, then! I'll save the rest of my clever analogies for another time... And kill you right now. HAAH!  Best joke ever 
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 03:51
|
|
|
Tae posted:I dunno why Iago has a katana on him, but I don't care at this point. The classic Fire Emblem tradition of how to pass out S-Rank weapons when they aren't tied to the lore as Legendary Weapons: Put them in the hands of randos near endgame.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 04:04
|
|
|
Yeesh, a lot of your level ups make my generics look good by comparison. Lucky for you this is happening in Birthright and not Conquest.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 04:08
|
|
|
Emperordaein posted:The classic Fire Emblem tradition of how to pass out S-Rank weapons when they aren't tied to the lore as Legendary Weapons: Put them in the hands of randos near endgame. Levail is cool, please don't insult him. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 04:12
|
|
|
Ah, that moment in every video game villain's career where the devs take away his cutscene powers. Death soon follows.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 05:19
|
|
|
Personally, I'm kinda betting that Mozu's gonna hit 30 Skill and Speed at the same time.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 06:39
|
|
|
Before I played Fates and I saw Entrap I thought "Oh, that's kind of funny, it's like a reverse Rescue, that's a clever idea." After this map I never want to see that drat thing again.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 09:06
|
|
|
39, 28, 17, 21.5, 19.5, 23.5, 26.05, 12.95 I was getting really curious about Corrin and those are what his stats are supposed to be at level 12, after promoting at 20. So he's +0 HP, -5 Str, -2 Mag, +0 Skill, +4 Speed, +5 Luck, -6 Def and +0 Res. That's our Prince, alright.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 10:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 8, 2024 06:56 |
|
|
Iago at least makes sense as someone we want to kill: he's demonstrated desire to hurt us and even managed to, so when we kill him, it feels good. We accomplished something. Whereas Hans has only one character trait (likes to kill/hurt others) and all the times he hosed us over, he got away with it not because he's superbadass, but Cutscene Magic TM. It's kinda funny when the Cutscene Magic is taken away and you can steamroll him, but it feels as cheap as all his kills.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2017 10:55
|
|