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ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE

TBeats posted:

Facts cannot be puns :colbert:

:thejoke:

Intruder posted:

Petey Faggins is still my favorite incident

It's a good one.

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Henrik Zetterberg
Dec 7, 2007

Ches Neckbeard posted:

Good thing I planned to be drunk for the draft anyway.

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/855459059226595334

Welcome to Cleveland, Johnny Mitch!

FizFashizzle
Mar 30, 2005







Ches Neckbeard posted:

Good thing I planned to be drunk for the draft anyway.

https://twitter.com/JasonLaCanfora/status/855459059226595334

He's probably there at seven.

Just saying.

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land




Doltos, who would you pick #1 since you're not a big fan of Garrett?

Diva Cupcake
Aug 15, 2005

https://twitter.com/mlombardiNFL/status/855492042834624512

Amy Pole Her
Jun 17, 2002
lol Miami won't pass

That'd be a monster steal and it'd suck we'd be forced to play him at OLB but last year we drafted a SEC stud who fell because of weed concerns and played him out of position and it worked out pretty well so

Shangri-Law School
Feb 19, 2013

Foster's got a few more concerns than that.

Harlock
Jan 15, 2006

Tap "A" to drink!!!

Love bad QB who nobody gave time of day to getting 1st pick overall press written about him and then it happens.

Doltos
Dec 28, 2005

🤌🤌🤌

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Doltos, who would you pick #1 since you're not a big fan of Garrett?

Leonard Fournette. I'm a sucker for RBs.

If I had to go defense and wasn't judged for it and the owner guaranteed my job safety, Jamal Adams. The cover 5 is getting more prevalent in the NFL and I believe SS's should be valued a lot higher than they are. I think Garrett's an okay first pick still it's just that the Browns are stuck in a pretty horrible situation.

mcmagic
Jul 1, 2004

If you see this avatar while scrolling the succ zone, you have been visited by the mcmagic of shitty lib takes! Good luck and prosperity will come to you, but only if you reply "shut the fuck up mcmagic" to this post!

The Jets should take him.

Grittybeard
Mar 29, 2010

Bad, very bad!
Haha, did we talk about DeShone Kizer?

https://twitter.com/NBCSports/status/855175531377152000

https://twitter.com/DKizer_14/status/855179363880497152?ref_src=twsrc

Ok, here's that context he was worried about :

Kizer posted:

“Name a college quarterback who goes into the game-plan meetings on Monday and throws his notes at the coaches,” Kizer said. “No one else game plans the way I do. No one else prepares the way I do. No one else knows football the way I do. No one else is as big as I am. No one else is as powerful a runner as I am. Pat Mahomes might throw the ball 80 yards and I can only throw the ball 72, but I guarantee he can’t throw an out route the way I can.

“No one else can do what I can do. And I’ve truly figured out in this (draft) process, if I can maximize all my potential in every aspect of the game – this is bold – I do have the ability to be the greatest quarterback to ever play. Imagine taking (Tom) Brady’s intellect and Brady’s preparation and putting it on a guy with Cam Newton’s body. Why can’t I be the greatest? The only thing stopping me from it is me. That’s what’s driving me now.”

Grittybeard fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Apr 22, 2017

Flikken
Oct 23, 2009

10,363 snaps and not a playoff win to show for it

Henrik Zetterberg posted:

Welcome to Cleveland, Johnny Mitch!

Round up all bums in Berea and within one mile of the stadium.

D-LINK
Oct 1, 2007

I was talking to peachy Peach about kissy Kiss. He bought me a soda.

Doltos posted:

Leonard Fournette. I'm a sucker for RBs.

If I had to go defense and wasn't judged for it and the owner guaranteed my job safety, Jamal Adams. The cover 5 is getting more prevalent in the NFL and I believe SS's should be valued a lot higher than they are. I think Garrett's an okay first pick still it's just that the Browns are stuck in a pretty horrible situation.

I think the Steelers will take Jabrill Peppers for this reason. I'd rather they take best available edge rusher, but I see the thinking behind fielding 3 starting caliber safeties rather than your 2 starters and a guy off the bench. These position-less tweener guys are gonna get more and more valuable

Shangri-Law School
Feb 19, 2013

Mitch Trubisky said he's been preparing for the draft with Jared Goff and Ryan Lindley. :psyberger:

EDIT: LOL

https://twitter.com/SiriusXMNFL/status/855524125552648193

Shangri-Law School fucked around with this message at 01:15 on Apr 22, 2017

Sataere
Jul 20, 2005


Step 1: Start fight
Step 2: Attack straw man
Step 3: REPEAT

Do not engage with me



mastershakeman posted:

there isn't a single guy projected to go top ten that I want on the bears besides Garrett.

meanwhile I'd be happy with a half dozen mid round guys like oj Howard. this sucks

You don't like Jamal Adams?

kiimo
Jul 24, 2003

NickRoweFillea posted:

Titans gonna trade down now?

3rd rounder and the 27

C'mon Mahomes baby

MrSargent
Dec 23, 2003

Sometimes, there's a man, well, he's the man for his time and place. He fits right in there. And that's Jimmy T.

LOL

*imagine this scenario where you take the best attribute of Brady/Cam*

NBC Reports: Kizer says he has the best attribute of Brady/Cam

Michael Corleone
Mar 30, 2011

by VideoGames
I want Kizer now, not at 12 though. *throws this post at Hue*

Raku
Nov 7, 2012

Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

Roll Tide
kizer should be drafted at brady's pick # plus cam's pick #

OSheaman
May 27, 2004

Heavy Fucking Metal
Fun Shoe
http://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/mcginn/2017/04/21/mcginn-nfl-draft-wrs-tes-tight-ends-stand-out/100718284/

quote:

GREEN BAY - What makes the NFL draft the three-day televised event it has become is the hope it engenders for all 32 teams and their fans.

So let’s think big at tight end, which in the analysis of some personnel people noses out running back as the best position on offense.

“The numbers are unusual,” an executive in personnel for an NFC team said. “Normally there’s two, maybe three guys. This year, there’s probably eight or nine.”

History tells us that not all of them will succeed. Injuries likely will ruin the careers of one or two, and perhaps one or two others won’t perform anywhere close to expectations.

But be optimistic. Taken as a whole, those eight or nine players have the talent to leave a lasting impact on the league, especially as rules changes make it even easier to pass.

Scouts love comparables. So do we.

If things break right and the group goes bust-free, some of the most apt comparisons between these players and established standouts could play out.

“People see different things,” the NFC scout said. “That’s what makes the draft fun.”

Nine of the prospects garnered more than one vote in a Milwaukee Journal Sentinel poll of 16 scouts asking them to rank the best tight ends on a 1-to-5 basis. A first-place vote was worth five points, a second-place was worth four and so on.

O.J. Howard, with 14 first-place votes and two seconds, easily led with 78 points. David Njoku was next with one first and 54 points, and Evan Engram was third with one first and 43 points.

Following, in order, were Gerald Everett, 20 points; Jake Butt, 17; Jordan Leggett, 10 ½; Bucky Hodges, 7 ½; Adam Shaheen, seven; Jonnu Smith, two, and Cole Hikutini, one.

In the last 12 drafts only nine tight ends were selected in the first round, and the only year with more than one was 2006 (Vernon Davis, Marcedes Lewis). It certainly wouldn’t be beyond the realm of possibility for Howard, Njoku and Engram to be first-round picks next week.

“Every once in a while you get a guy like Vernon Davis,” an AFC personnel man said. “Howard and Njoku are impressive physically and they can catch and (block). Difference-makers.

“The last couple years there’s been like eight, nine draftable tight ends, if that. If you took one you felt like you stretched. I could see eight or nine in the first four rounds this year. Guys that can start.”

Voted to the Pro Bowl in 2016 were Greg Olsen, Travis Kelce, Jordan Reed and Delanie Walker.

Olsen, a first-round pick in 2007, was 6 feet, 6 inches, 255 pounds, ran a 4.53-second 40, posted a vertical jump of 37½ inches and a broad jump of 9-11. Let’s match him up with Howard: 6-5½, 251, 4.56, 30, 10-1.

“He’s as talented as Greg Olsen,” an AFC personnel man said. “He doesn’t have near the instincts Greg had. I think O.J. will be a star but I think it’s going to take a little time.”

Njoku (6-4, 245, 4.65, 37½, 11-1) could be paired with Kelce (6-5, 257, 4.63, 35, 10-4), whose 13 collegiate starts are on par with Njoku’s nine.

Reed (6-2½, 235, 4.71, no jumps) has been compared to Everett (6-3, 240, 4.59, 37½, 10-6).

“The way the game has evolved, some of these guys are just big wide receivers,” another AFC scout said.

The prospect best fitting that description would be Engram (6-3½, 235, 4.39, 36, 10-5). He’s probably never going to work from in-line; it’s why he received a third-place in the wide receiver poll.

Scouts mentioned three large NFL wide receivers as the best comparables for Engram. They were Demaryius Thomas (6-3, 229, estimated 4.43, no jumps), Marques Colston (6-4½, 224, 4.53, 37, 10-3) and Devin Funchess (6-4, 232, 4.54, 38½, 10-2).

“Engram isn’t as quick-footed as Colston but he does have outstanding receiving potential and skills,” said an NFC executive. “He’ll never be a point-of-attack guy.”

Walker (6-1, 240, 4.52, 36½, 9-10) entered the league as a sixth-round wide receiver from Division II Central Missouri State in 2006. One scout compared him to Smith (6-2½, 247, 4.63, 38, 10-7), another undersized player from a relatively small school (Florida International).

“Or maybe he’s Charles Clay,” he said, referring to the Bills' leading receiver.

Both Hodges (6-6, 253, 4.55, 39, 11-2) and Leggett (6-5½, 259, 4.75, 33, 9-11) have drawn comparisons to Jimmy Graham (6-6½, 262, 4.53, 38½, 10-0), a third-round choice in 2010 and another towering, speedy, flex receiver.

Butt is rehabilitating from a torn ACL suffered in the Sugar Bowl, the second time he has done it on his right knee. Former Steeler Heath Miller comes to mind partially because Miller was unable to run a 40 (sports hernia) before the Steelers took him with the 30th pick in 2005.

An estimated time of 4.75 would seem appropriate for both Butt (6-5½, 249, no jumps) and Miller (6-5, 255, no jumps).

“Butt is not quite as good as Heath Miller coming out,” said an AFC personnel man. “But, as a healthy player, he’s a similar all-around guy.”

That leaves Shaheen (6-6½, 278, 4.81, 32½, 10-1), a massive tight end from Division II Ashland (Ohio).

Jason Witten (6-5½, 256, 4.67, 32½, 9-5), a third-round selection in 2003, has been the gold standard in that department for years. An NFC executive said Martellus Bennett (6-6, 259, 4.72, 34, 9-10) currently rated as the premier “Y” tight end, so let’s really shoot high and line them up with the big rookie.

“Love Shaheen,” said an AFC scout. “Two years from now he’s got a chance to be like Jason Witten. I think he’s going second round.”

Meanwhile, the situation isn’t as rosy at wide receiver. There’s a horde of attractive players in the third- to sixth-round range, but few scouts are thrilled with the players leading the pack.

Corey Davis won the Journal Sentinel poll with 65½ points (5½ firsts), followed closely by Mike Williams (58½, 4½ firsts) and John Ross (51½, six firsts).

Following, in order, were Zay Jones, 15 points; JuJu Smith-Schuster, 12; Cooper Kupp and Curtis Samuel, seven; Josh Reynolds, five; Amara Darboh and Carlos Henderson, four; Evan Engram, three; Dede Westbrook, 2½; K.D. Cannon, two, and Chris Godwin, ArDarius Stewart and Ryan Switzer, one.

“It’s the worst wide receiver draft at the top I’ve seen in a long time,” said an NFC executive.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/mcginn/2017/04/21/ranking-nfl-draft-prospects-wide-receivers-tight-ends/100718406/

quote:

Wide receivers

1. COREY DAVIS, Western Michigan (6-2½, 209, no 40, 1): Modest two-star recruit from Wheaton (Ill.) Warrenville South was instrumental cog in the Broncos’ rise to an appearance in the Cotton Bowl last season. “I don’t know how fast he could run but Michael Irvin ran 4.57 and he makes all those plays like Michael Irvin,” one scout said. “Watch the games against Illinois, Northwestern, Wisconsin. Strong, quick, can break tackles. He’s the best.” Injured an ankle in January, underwent minor surgery, missed the combine and won’t be able to run for scouts. “He will run high 4.4’s, low 4.5’s,” said another scout. “Little niftier athlete than Mike Williams, bends a little easier.” Four-year starter with 331 receptions for 5,278 yards (15.9 average) and 52 touchdowns. “He’s good, but not like some of the top guys from the past two years,” said a third scout. “He’s like the kid from the Eagles (Jordan Matthews). Little better hands.” Posted scores of 13 and 24 on the 50-question Wonderlic intelligence test.

2. MIKE WILLIAMS, Clemson (6-3½, 216, 4.52, 1): Fourth-year junior from Vance, S.C. “He’s good, but not in the same realm as Calvin Johnson, the guy at Cincinnati (A.J. Green) or the guy at Atlanta (Julio Jones),” said one scout. “Really good ball skills but he doesn’t have the great speed.” Caught 177 passes for 2,727 (15.4) and 21 TDs for national champs. “Power guy all the way,” said a second scout. “He can’t separate sufficiently. There’s been a lot of good players that don’t, but that’s his style. He makes a lot of contested catches, and he’s going to have to.” Poor vertical jump of 32½ inches. “Refused to do a short shuttle and a 3-cone (at the combine or pro day),” said another scout. “Why? Probably because he’s not that quick in and out of breaks. Maybe he’s afraid. Ball in the air, he’ll go and get it. He’s big, he’s clean and he’s tough. He’s kind of like Laquon Treadwell last year. At the beginning you heard he was the fourth or fifth pick in the draft. Now you don’t hear his name up there anymore.” Wonderlic of 17. Suffered a season-ending neck fracture in 2015 opener when he collided with the goalpost on a 4-yard TD.

3. JOHN ROSS, Washington (5-11, 188, 4.22, 1): Fourth-year junior ran possibly the fastest 40 ever at the combine. “He’ll be in that DeSean Jackson mold,” said one scout. “He’s a burner but he’s also skilled. He is extremely explosive and he’s got very good body control through the route.” Underwent labrum shoulder surgery in mid-March, the latest in a litany of injuries. Underwent microfracture on his right knee in 2014 and then tore the ACL in the same knee not long after. “Those small wideouts, they have a hard time surviving long-term,” said another scout. Caught 114 passes for 1,729 (15.2) and 22 TDs. “The speed is wonderful but I do have doubts,” a third scout said. “Is he fragile is the question. He’s very clean off the field. Injuries are a concern.” Played at Jordan High in Long Beach, Calif. “If you want that speed element, more of a playmaker, he’s the guy,” said a fourth scout. Wonderlic of 16.

4. ZAY JONES, East Carolina (6-2, 201, 4.49, 2): Caught 158 passes as a senior to finish with FBS record of 399. “Top three ball skills in this draft,” said one scout. “He’s physical. He has to go into a crowd sometimes because he lacks really good separation and he’s not a run after. He’s a possession type, really. I’d rather have him as my third guy than an actual starter.” Averaged 10.7 per catch and scored 23 TDs. Excelled at the Senior Bowl all week. “He tore it up,” said another scout. “He is a good route runner. Great kid. I don’t see any acceleration.” Father, Robert, was an NFL MLB from 1992-01. “Productive as hell but that offense, they just kind of throw the ball in all kinds of different ways,” said another scout. “He showed a lot more at the Senior Bowl.” From Austin, Texas.

5. JUJU SMITH-SCHUSTER, Southern California (6-1½, 214, 4.56, 2): Third-year junior. Won’t turn 21 until late November. “He’s got a big personality,” said one scout. “I really appreciate him. He’s got a little Steve Smith how he attacks the game. He’s got good enough hands, body control, quickness and OK speed, given his size. I thought he played a little heavy in 2016. He was up to like 225. You have to go back and watch ’15 film to get a good feel for him. His game is all about strength and power.” Caught 213 passes for 3,092 (14.5) and 25 TDs. “As a freshman and sophomore he looked like he was a top guy,” said another scout. “I think he’s gotten too big. He’s lost some of his quickness. He is really strong and talented.” Played at Long Beach Poly.

6. CURTIS SAMUEL, Ohio State (5-10½, 196, 4.34, 2-3): Third-year junior. “He’s just a fantastic personality and kid,” one scout said. “Sometimes you end up with guys who are just quick and sometimes you end up with guys that are just fast, and sometimes you get both. He’s both. Still learning how to run routes. In terms of catch radius and all that from the elite guys, he’s not up to that level. But once he gets the ball he’s as elite as they come.” Played RB in 2014, a hybrid role in ’15 and H-back in ’16. “Even though he beat Michigan as a back I think he makes more plays as a wide receiver,” a second scout said. “He’s Percy Harvin.” Finished with 107 receptions for 1,249 (11.7) and nine TDs to go with 172 rushes for 1,286 (7.5) and 15 TDs. “Unique player,” said a third scout. “Loves football. Very smart (Wonderlic of 22). Physically tough.” From Brooklyn, N.Y. “He’s not really natural as a receiver and he’s not natural as a running back,” said a fourth scout. “He’s supposed to be this big-play speed guy but he doesn’t make any big plays. Just more of an athlete than a player right now.”

7. COOPER KUPP, Eastern Washington (6-1½, 203, 4.60, 3): Broke 15 FCS records in 52-game career. “When I first put the tape on I was hoping he was going to be Jordy Nelson,” said one scout. “He’s just not as big and fast as Jordy. Little bit more powerful. His draft stock from a size-speed standpoint took a little hit but he’s going to play.” Amassed 428 catches for 6,464 (15.1) and 73 TDs. Led WRs on the Wonderlic with 37. “If you want a first down on third down, I’ll throw it to him because he’s going to get open and catch the ball,” another scout said. “He’s a big slot. Fantastic with his feet. He’s natural.” In four games against Pac-12 teams he caught 40 passes for 716 (17.9) and 11 TDs. “Somebody is going to overdraft him,” a third scout said. “The Amendola’s, the Edelman’s are punt returners, and he’s not. He a catcher, not an explosive playmaker. Slot only. He can’t play outside.” From Yakima, Wash.

8. JOSH REYNOLDS, Texas A&M (6-3, 193, 4.53, 3): Former junior-college player went on to start three years for the Aggies. “He’s a real go-up-and-get-it kind of guy,” one scout said. “Talented perimeter receiver. You look at how lean he is and you think he might not be a tough guy that wants to go inside, but he’ll do it. Great ball skills.” Finished with 164 receptions for 2,788 (17.0) and 30 TDs. “He lacks strength and doesn’t consistently separate,” a second scout said. “He’ll quit on some routes. You question his focus. Not the most sudden guy in the world. Long, linear outside guy.” From San Antonio.

9. AMARA DARBOH, Michigan (6-1½, 215, 4.47, 3): Was outperformed by teammate Jehu Chesson in 2015 but blossomed into the Wolverines’ No. 1 target last year. “He’s just steady everywhere,” said one scout. “Fast, good route runner, he’s got run after, dependable, strong, physical. I don’t think he’ll ever be a Pro Bowl guy but he’ll be a really good starter.” Born in Sierra Leone, he came to Iowa at age 17 after a tragic childhood in which his parents were killed during a civil war. All-conference basketball player in West Des Moines. “Little bit (better than) Chesson,” said another scout. “He’s just not quite as consistent catching and route running as Chesson.” Started 28 of 49 games, caught 151 passes for 2,062 (13.7) and 14 TDs.

10. CARLOS HENDERSON, Louisiana Tech (5-11, 202, 4.52, 3-4): Joins Curtis Samuel as the two best run-after-the-catch WRs in draft, according to one scout. “He’s in that Emmanuel Sanders-Antonio Brown mold coming out,” said another scout. “He doesn’t have elite size but he’s got twitch and is explosive. He’ll have nuances to develop from a route-running standpoint but he’s got all the tools.” Fourth-year junior with 147 catches for 2,878 (19.6) and 28 TDs. “They limited the route tree that he ran but he can run by people,” said a third scout. “He’s got really good vertical speed.” From New Orleans. Added a fourth scout: “Every time he touches the ball it’s a potential touchdown.”

11. K.D. CANNON, Baylor (5-11, 178, 4.39, 3-4): Third-year junior. “Little bit of a one-dimensional speed guy,” said one scout. “He can really run, but when’s the last Baylor wide receiver to (succeed)? Doesn’t run a lot of routes. Same (expletive) we say every year. Little scary.” Starting 32 of 38 games, he caught 195 for 3,113 (16.0) and 27 TDs. “I don’t believe in those Baylor receivers,” a second scout said. “He fits in with those other guys. Consistency was an issue. He can run, there’s no doubt.” From Mount Pleasant, Texas.

12. ARDARIUS STEWART, Alabama (5-11, 205, 4.49, 3-4): Fourth-year junior started 29 of 33 games. “Whenever I saw Alabama need a third-down conversion throwing the ball he caught it,” said one scout. “Highly competitive. Plays maybe faster than you think.” Five personnel people expressed reservations about Stewart’s maturity level. Finished with 129 receptions for 1,713 (13.3) and 12 TDs. Wonderlic of 20. “You’ve got to do some work on him off the field,” another scout said. “He’s got the talent. Loves football. Great run after catch. He’ll battle you.” From suburban Birmingham, Ala.

OTHERS: Dede Westbrook, Oklahoma; Chris Godwin, Penn State; Ryan Switzer, North Carolina; Malachi Dupre, Louisiana State; Taywan Taylor, Western Kentucky; Robert Davis, Georgia State; Jehu Chesson, Michigan; Mack Hollins, North Carolina; Josh Malone, Tennessee; Shelton Gibson, West Virginia; Kenny Golladay, Northern Illinois; Quincy Adeboyejo, Mississippi; Chad Hansen, California; Bug Howard, North Carolina; Chad Williams, Grambling.

Tight ends

1. O.J. HOWARD, Alabama (6-5½, 251, 4.56, 1): One of the most complete TEs to enter the draft in several years. “He’s by far and away the best this year,” one scout said. “He can do everything. He’s got rare speed and athletic ability. He runs like a receiver. He got better as a blocker from his junior to his senior year. He’s a top-level character kid. He has all the professional qualities you want. He’ll end up being one of the best tight ends in the league.” Caught 114 passes for 1,726 (15.1) and seven TDs in 46 games (36 starts). “Most underused player in the country,” a second scout said. “Really good at pro day. Big, he can run, he can catch. A year ago he wasn’t a real good blocker in-line. This year he got a little better. Alabama didn’t use him to his potential. When they did it was a big play. Usually it was downfield throws.” Scored 27 on the Wonderlic. “He’s not instant coffee,” a third scout said. “In terms of running routes, finding open space … he’s got a little instinct issue.” From tiny Prattville, Ala.

2. DAVID NJOKU, Miami (6-4, 245, 4.65, 1-2): Third-year sophomore with just nine starts in 26 games. “Everybody just seems to like the guy,” one scout said. “But he is raw as can be. He’s a backup for them. I don’t know how you take an unproductive backup guy from an average team and take him in the first or second round … he’s a track guy but as far as a football player, he is a long ways away.” Was a 7-1 high jumper in Cedar Grove, N.J. Arms measured longest (35 ¼ inches) of any TE. “Lot of wow plays,” said a second scout. “An athletic freak.” Said a third scout: “Gonna be a star. He’s better RAC (run after the catch) than O.J. Howard. O.J.’s better, but this kid has up side.” Finished with 64 catches for 1,060 (16.6) and nine TDs. Wonderlic of 24. “He’s a beautiful looking thing,” a fourth scout said. “His broad jump (11-1) and vertical jump (37 ½) were out of this world. Very explosive linear but when he runs he’s kind of stiff upper body. Little herky-jerky. Last year he had a lot of drops; this year he cleaned up his hands a little bit. He needs a boot up his (expletive) but he’s got a lot of ability. His blocking is OK. I don’t know how self-motivated he is to be a really good player.”

3. EVAN ENGRAM, Mississippi (6-3½, 235, 4.39, 1-2): Compared by scouts to some oversized WRs and undersized TEs. “He’s like (Aaron) Hernandez, Jordan Reed,” said one. “He can play slot, smooth athlete. This is where the modern-day offense is going. May slide up there in the first round.” Ran one of the fastest 40’s ever by a TE and scored 26 on the Wonderlic. “Amazing speed and separation,” said another scout. “He can probably play receiver. He’s maybe 240 soaking wet. He maybe can do some back-side stuff (blocking) but point of attack he’s going to get crushed.” Caught 162 passes for 2,320 (14.3) and 15 TDs. “Better college football player than Jordan Reed,” said a third scout. “He’s a matchup nightmare on quicker slot defenders. He’s in and out. Caught the ball well. Not afraid (to block) but that’s not his forte. He’ll be in the slot all the time.” From Powder Springs, Ga.

4. GERALD EVERETT, South Alabama (6-3, 240, 4.59, 2): Will be the first draftee in program’s eight-year history. “He’s got some rarities post-catch,” said one scout. “Eric Ebron had a little bit of that out of North Carolina. I don’t know if he’ll ever be an in-line ‘Y’ guy but he is competitive. Does the search-and-seal stuff. He’s that big flex slot teams are looking for now. He can probably be a 250-pound guy. He’s lean but broad-shouldered and tapered. Looks the part.” More of a basketball player in Decatur, Ga.; didn’t play football until his senior year. “Smart kid (Wonderlic of 24), works hard but not a weight-room guy,” said another scout. “The only thing that holds me back is he’s got smallish hands (8 ½).” Finished with 107 catches for 1,584 (14.8) and 13 TDs. Played two years in junior college and behind ex-Packers TE Kennard Backman at Alabama-Birmingham in ’14 before transferring.

5. JAKE BUTT, Michigan (6-5½, 249, no 40, 3-4): Most productive TE (138 catches for 1,646 and 11 TDs) in Wolverines’ history. “He’s everything you want,” said one scout. “Just not the most talented. Deceptive route runner but not the fastest or the quickest. He just knows how to uncover. In the run game he’s going to fight you, but he’s not overpowering. He’s a gamer. He can move the chains. Smart player. Great intangibles.” Blew out his right ACL in the Sugar Bowl after suffering the same injury to the same knee in early 2014. “He’s had it twice, which is scary,” another scout said. “He wasn’t a dynamic guy, anyway. Just kind of a system pass catcher-competitive blocker. He’s more ready than those other guys. He probably goes no later than the third round. People are going to be scared of that knee.” Started 37 of 49 games. Wonderlic was 32. Out of Pickerington, Ohio.

6. JORDAN LEGGETT, Clemson (6-5½, 259, 4.75, 3-4): Captain for the national champions and a two-year starter. “First name is ‘Lazy’ at the school,” said one scout. “Lazy Leggett. When you watch him try to block on the back side or point of attack I guess the name fits. But he’s long, he’s big, he can catch over the middle, big target, good receiving skills, good catch radius. But I wouldn’t want him in a foxhole with me.” Had 112 receptions for 1,598 (14.3) and 18 TDs. “More of a finesse tight end,” said one scout. “He’s a one-speed guy. There’s no twitch in his game, either.” From Navarre, Fla. “He’s a receiver but he’s soft,” a third scout said. “Does he really love it? We don’t know. He’s not a fighter. Has no interest in the run game.”

7. ADAM SHAHEEN, Ashland (Ohio) (6-6½, 278, 4.81, 3-4): Out of the same Division II conference (Great Lakes Intercollegiate) that sent such players as CB Brandon Carr, RB Chris Ivory and G Todd Herremans to the NFL. “He’s a huge, huge, huge guy,” one scout said. “Got decent hands. He’s a project. He doesn’t dominate that level of comp as far as blocking. He’s the biggest guy on the field and you think he’d just dominate people. Not very fast. You’re just kind of looking at up side hoping he’d be a blocking safe-catching TE.” Fourth-year junior began college as a basketball player at Division II Pittsburgh-Johnstown (5.5 points per game). Starting 19 of 31 games for Ashland, he caught 129 for 1,755 (13.6) and 26 TDs. “Skilled big man,” said another scout. “Dominates the competition. Was a good basketball player before he got super big. He’s beyond prototypical size, and he’s a receiver, too.” Wonderlic of 24. From Galena, Ohio.

8. BUCKY HODGES, Virginia Tech (6-6, 253, 4.55, 3-4): Fourth-year junior. “He was a glorified receiver this year,” one scout said. “Limited in-line exposure. Best comparison I can give is (Devin) Funchess. Funchess was a more naturally fluid and skilled receiver.” Tremendous testing athlete. Led TEs in vertical jump (39) and broad jump (11-2). From Virginia Beach, Va., where he was a prep QB. “From a tough area,” another scout said. “Tough life growing up. Very laid-back kid.” Finished with 133 receptions for 1,747 (13.1) and 20 TDs. Started 37 of 40 games. “They play him at receiver but he’s not dynamic for what he does,” a third scout said. “He won’t block anybody.” Said a fourth: “Complete figment of someone’s imagination. Might be the most overrated player in the draft. Looks good, big, has good hands. Not a lot of positives other than that.”

OTHERS: Jonnu Smith, Florida International; Jeremy Sprinkle, Arkansas; Cole Hikutini, Louisville; George Kittle, Iowa; Eric Saubert, Drake; Michael Roberts, Toledo; Pharaoh Brown, Oregon; Durrell Daniels, Washington; Cethan Carter, Nebraska; Ricky Seals-Jones, Texas A&M; Scott Orndoff, Pittsburgh.

****

Unsung Hero

Robert Davis, WR, Georgia State: Absolutely blew up the combine with a 4.43 40 (at 6-2½, 216), 41-inch vertical jump and 11-4 broad jump. Played in a Wing-T offense as a high-school senior, caught 11 passes and was fortunate to land a scholarship. Productive and intelligent, he would be an outstanding developmental selection.

Scouts' Nightmare

Eric Saubert, TE, Drake: The Bulldogs were a big name in college football but that was 75 years ago. Not only does Saubert (6-5, 253) have the size but also the speed (4.69) and smarts (35 on the Wonderlic) to factor in the NFL. He doesn’t block much, however, and it’s a tough year for a small-school player to make waves at such a stacked position.

Packers' Pick to Remember

Aundra Thompson, WR, East Texas State: Drafted in the fifth round as a RB in 1976 but quickly moved outside. Started 46 of 48 games opposite James Lofton from 1978-’80. Two games into the ’81 season he was part of the deal to acquire WR John Jefferson from San Diego. Played briefly for the Chargers and Saints, ending his career in ’82. Caught 95 passes for 1,573 yards (16.6) and seven TDs for Green Bay.

Quote to Note

AFC executive in personnel: “I really enjoy watching teams in that league (Mid-American Conference) play. They’re well-coached and they play hard. They’re not spoiled brats like some others."

That Quote to Note is my favorite thing ever

dphi
Jul 9, 2001
Love that the three names dropped in the Kupp blurb were Jordy, Edelman, and Amendola - not lazy at all.

Silly Burrito
Nov 27, 2007

SET A COURSE FOR
THE FLAVOR QUADRANT
Who would be the best replacement for the Saints Reggie Bush/Darren Sproles RB role? Is Christian McCaffrey really the best guy who fits that mold in this draft?

TheFlyingLlama
Jan 2, 2013

You really think someone would do that? Just go on the internet and be a llama?



Silly Burrito posted:

Who would be the best replacement for the Saints Reggie Bush/Darren Sproles RB role? Is Christian McCaffrey really the best guy who fits that mold in this draft?

he's certainly the best player for it. There are some guys like Matt Dayes or Kareem Hunt who sorta vaguely fit that role, or small school guys like Tarik Cohen or De'Angelo Henderson who have the speed but are tiny even by RB standards. The wildcard is probably Curtis Samuel, who played RB at Ohio State but is more of a Percy Harvin type and is probably a WR in the NFL

mastershakeman
Oct 28, 2008

by vyelkin

Sataere posted:

You don't like Jamal Adams?

he was who I initially wanted but I'm concerned about how well he can cover. I'm sick of the bears having a million in the box safeties who let packers run past them for TDs over and over

basically- all the QBs suck. Solomon Thomas too small and loafs too much, Allen has injury issues + doesn't seem explosive, Adams is a run stuffer, Malik hooker has one year of tape + injured, none of the wrs or cbs are amazing , tackles are even worse , etc

again I'd be happy with any of these guys at the standard bears pick around #10 but since this is their highest in the Superbowl era I want a potential perennial all pro at an impact position

Cactus Jack
Nov 16, 2005

If you even try to throw to my side of the field in a dream, you better wake up and apologize.
These McGinn articles really drive home why certain teams are successful and others are awful. Love it.

The Glumslinger
Sep 24, 2008

Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?


Hair Elf
One thing to mention about JuJu Smith-Schuster is that he was playing through recurring back spasms for a large chunk of last season. It affected him a lot out there, as well as Max Browne not being able to ever get him the ball

dphi
Jul 9, 2001
Didn't Browne only start like two or three games? I do like Schuster though, very physical dude that always seemed bigger than he actually is.

Zifnab
Aug 21, 2005

Hope Springs Eternal

dphi posted:

Didn't Browne only start like two or three games? I do like Schuster though, very physical dude that always seemed bigger than he actually is.

Three I think. I remember being pissed when he went to USC, guy was a dynamite can't miss recruit.

Metapod
Mar 18, 2012
there is no such thing as a can't miss recruit or prospect

FizFashizzle
Mar 30, 2005







Metapod posted:

there is no such thing as a can't miss recruit or prospect



The Glumslinger posted:

One thing to mention about JuJu Smith-Schuster is that he was playing through recurring back spasms for a large chunk of last season. It affected him a lot out there, as well as Max Browne not being able to ever get him the ball

Back problems don't go away. Back spasm is a nice way of saying slipped disc.

a neat cape
Feb 22, 2007

Aw hunny, these came out GREAT!

I am convinced that if Kizer is there, the Chargers will take him in the 2nd

Slowpoke!
Feb 12, 2008

ANIME IS FOR ADULTS

Silly Burrito posted:

Who would be the best replacement for the Saints Reggie Bush/Darren Sproles RB role? Is Christian McCaffrey really the best guy who fits that mold in this draft?

Saints or Patriots are probably the best landing spots for McCaffrey. He does kind of project to be a Reggie Bush type player in the NFL I guess? Obviously they'd hope he would be more productive as a rusher, but from a role standpoint I'd say Reggie Bush Saints days is the type of player he would be.

OSheaman
May 27, 2004

Heavy Fucking Metal
Fun Shoe
http://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/mcginn/2017/04/22/mcginn-nfl-draft-qbs-kizer-another-notre-dame-bust/100737052/

quote:

GREEN BAY - Playing quarterback at Notre Dame once meant a certain cachet that often led to All-American distinction, the Heisman Trophy and first-round berths in the NFL draft.

Nowadays, it’s a dead-end job when it comes to pro football.

The latest Fighting Irish signal-caller, the physically imposing Deshone Kizer, is being met with understandable skepticism from NFL teams that admire his talent, question his intangibles and fear he’ll turn out to be the latest flop out of South Bend.

“Name me a Notre Dame quarterback lately that’s flourished in the NFL,” an executive in personnel for an NFC team said this month. “Just name one. Oh, Joe Theismann. Yeah, that was recently.”

OK, the sarcastic scout did forget about Joe Montana, Notre Dame Class of 1979, winner of four Super Bowls and arguably the greatest quarterback in NFL history. His general point, however, hit the mark.

Theismann, a Super Bowl champion from the Class of 1971, and Montana haven’t watched any of their successors waking the echoes and shaking down the thunder.

Kizer will become the eighth Golden Domer drafted to play quarterback since Montana was selected by Bill Walsh and the San Francisco 49ers in the third round in 1979.

In order, the others were Rusty Lisch, fourth round, 1980; Blair Kiel, 11th round, ’84; Steve Beuerlein, fourth round, ’87; Rick Mirer, first round, ’93; Jarious Jackson, seventh round, ’00; Brady Quinn, first round, ’07, and Jimmy Clausen, second round, ’10.

Their career records as starters and passer ratings were as follows: Lisch (0-1, 25.1); Kiel (0-3, 75.4); Beuerlein (47-55, 80.3); Mirer (24-44, 63.5); Jackson (0-1, 46.4); Quinn (4-16, 64.4), and Clausen (1-13, 61.9).

Collectively, the group posted a starting record of 76-133 and a passer rating of 71.4. Thank goodness for Beuerlein, who accounted for the lone Pro Bowl appearance in 1999.

When Walsh broadcast Notre Dame games for NBC-TV in 1991, he never backed off comparing Mirer to Montana, both of whom wore jersey No. 3. They were option quarterbacks and measured an identical 6 feet 2 inches.

Mirer, a career 53.3 percent passer for seven teams, served as the Green Bay Packers’ third-stringer in 1998 before being traded the following August. He never solved his accuracy woes.

Mirer scored 31 on the Wonderlic intelligence test, two more than Quinn would 15 years later. Whereas Mirer was the second overall pick in 1993, Quinn went 22nd in ’07.

“I coached at Notre Dame,” Jim Gruden, a longtime NFL personnel man, said before the ’07 draft. “The pressure on a kid playing quarterback at Notre Dame is immense.”

Quinn bounced around for six years with six teams, another inaccurate thrower and skittish decision-maker.

In 1970, Theismann became the 12th quarterback from Notre Dame to achieve All-American status. Four of the 12, including Angelo Bertelli, Johnny Lujack, Paul Hornung and John Huarte, also captured the Heisman.

Kizer entered the 2016 season with high hopes, having started the final 11 games as a redshirt freshman the year before for a club that finished a surprising 10-3.

“This is a team that will likely be favored in their first 11 games,” wrote Phil Steele in his College Football Preview. “That could put them 11-0 when they travel to USC for a game with probably playoff implications … they are a legitimate national title contender.”

Kizer was voted the team’s MVP but it was a hollow award, to be sure. One of the nation’s most disappointing teams, the Irish posted their second worst record (4-8) in 54 years.

“You look at that team, they’ve got players,” an AFC personnel man said. “There’s no way they should win just four games. It was because of this guy, the quarterback. Boy, at times he looked bad. He was so bad against Stanford in the first half that they benched him.”

Two weeks after the season ended, Kizer renounced his final two years of eligibility having posted a 12-11 record in 23 starts.

“He is the classic boom or bust,” said an AFC evaluator. “In terms of arm strength, athleticism, talent, intelligence, he’s the highest-end guy. At the same time, he’s also the one with the most flaws.”

In a Journal Sentinel survey of 16 personnel people, Kizer’s ranking reflected considerable angst among scouts regarding his future.

Evaluators were asked to rank the quarterbacks on a 1-to-5 basis, with a first-place vote worth five points, a second worth four and so on.

In a tight three-way battle, North Carolina's Mitchell Trubisky led the way with 61 points (four firsts) followed by Clemson's Deshaun Watson (58, six) and Texas Tech's Patrick Mahomes (56, five).

Kizer was fourth with 32 points and one first, followed by California's Davis Webb (23), Pittsburgh's Nathan Peterman (five), Iowa's C.J. Beathard (two), Virginia Tech's Jerod Evans (two) and Miami's Brad Kaaya (one).

“I really don’t like any of them,” one longtime executive said. “Maybe two will go in the first round because of need but they all have holes. It’s, like, ‘Let’s see if we can develop them and get something out of them.’ It’s one of the worst groups I’ve watched in a long time.”

At the same time, the scouts were asked who among the leading passers would have the best chance to bust.

Kizer was the easy winner with nine votes. Mahomes drew two votes, Trubisky and Watson each had one and one scout declined comment. Two of the executives indicated all five were equally risky.

A common refrain among scouts was that Kizer possesses more physical gifts than any quarterback in the draft. “Athletic, strong arm, nice release, throws a nice deep ball, can move in the pocket,” one scout said.

An equally heard assessment of Kizer’s shortcomings centered on what is widely perceived to be his questionable reason for playing football.

“He’s not as good as he should be because he’s not committed to the game,” said one AFC executive. “He’s committed to building a brand. He wants all the things that come with being a starting quarterback but doesn’t want to put in the work.”

An NFC personnel man described Kizer as a selfish player worried mostly about status and money.

“That’s what drives him,” said the executive. “It’s all about him. Prima donna. Thin-skinned.”

At 6 feet 4 ½ inches and 235 pounds, Kizer has a chance to become the 19th quarterback drafted in the first round over the last 20 years to enter the league weighing at least 235.

The stigma now attached to Notre Dame quarterbacks is perhaps less daunting than the dubious success rate of heavy-set quarterbacks.

Of the 18, only four – Daunte Culpepper, Ben Roethlisberger, Cam Newton and Andrew Luck – have been voted to the Pro Bowl. Sam Bradford and Joe Flacco have played near Pro Bowl levels at times, and the jury’s out on second-year men Carson Wentz and Paxton Lynch.

The thick-bodied busts in Round 1 since 1997 include Jim Druckenmiller, Ryan Leaf, Kyle Boller, Byron Leftwich, Brady Quinn, JaMarcus Russell, Josh Freeman, Tim Tebow, Blaine Gabbert and E.J. Manuel.

“Kizer looks the part and all that,” an NFC executive said. “The guy also got benched, had a lot of bad games and doesn’t win.”

http://www.jsonline.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/mcginn/2017/04/22/ranking-nfl-draft-prospects-quarterbacks/100736988/

quote:

The Journal Sentinel’s Bob McGinn assesses the top quarterbacks in the NFL draft April 27-29. Included is each player’s height, weight, 40-yard time and projected round.

1. PATRICK MAHOMES, Texas Tech (6-2, 225, 4.81, 1): Third-year junior with a 13-16 record. “I may be crazy but when I watch his tape, just as a scout, I get excited,” one personnel man said. “He’s a guilty pleasure. We all have biases. Going in, Texas Tech, dink, dunk, dink, dunk, this guy cannot translate. I left saying, ‘Love this guy. He’s so much fun.’ He pulls plays out of his (expletive) like you wouldn’t believe. It’s not dink and dunk. He believes in his arm so much that it’s a problem sometimes. He’s not ready right now. I’m not comparing him to Aaron (Rodgers), but that natural sense of making plays when they break down is unusual. Now can he make plays from structure? That’s why he’s not a top-10 pick.” Finished with 63.5% completion rate and NFL passer rating of 103.8. Also ran for 820 yards and 22 touchdowns. “He is a great kid and willing to do everything,” said another scout. “But he’s playing in this gunslinger spread offense (expletive) that no quarterback has ever succeeded from, really.” Father, Pat, compiled a 42-39 record as an MLB pitcher from 1992-'03. Scored 24 on the Wonderlic intelligence test. “He has the best arm of the group but he plays crazy,” a third scout said. “I don’t even think ‘gunslinger’ is the right word. He’s reckless. … I remember seeing (Brett) Favre in his bowl game his senior year. In that game he had three or four plays you thought were a little off the wall. Mahomes might have 20 plays in a game where you go, ‘What are you doing?’” Drafted as a pitcher by the Tigers. From Whitehouse, Texas.

2. DESHAUN WATSON, Clemson (6-2½, 218, 4.68, 1): Third in Heisman Trophy in 2015, second in ’16 as Tigers split a pair of national title games against Alabama. “He’s No. 1,” one scout said. “He’s played the best in the biggest stages. His best thing is leadership. He’s a winner. He has to develop into a pocket passer.” Compiled a completion mark of 67.4%, a rating of 107.2 and a 32-3 record. Also ran for 1,934 yards and 26 TDs. “He’s got to be a better progression reader,” a second scout said. “He’s got a good arm. He makes some throws you question, but in the end he wins, and you play to win.” Actually played a full game on a torn ACL late in 2014, underwent surgery and was ready for the next season. “You can say he’s better than Dak Prescott,” a third scout said. “Total winner. Highly poised. Top intangibles. Lot of predetermined throws. Going to need a lot of work, like all these guys from the spread.” Hails from Gainesville, Ga. Wonderlic of 20. “He’s No. 1 just because he’s a better leader,” said a fourth scout. “Like the kid a lot. His character is really, really good. His mechanics are below average. He threw 17 interceptions this year, which is terrible for a first-round quarterback, and a lot of them were really bad decisions. Just throwing the ball up for grabs.”

3. MITCHELL TRUBISKY, North Carolina (6-2, 219, 4.66, 1): Fourth-year junior backed up Marquise Williams, a free agent cut by Green Bay Sept. 3, for two years. All 13 starts (8-5) came last year. “You’ve got to try with him,” one scout said. “He’s the best of the bunch. You just wish he played more. The guy he played behind was terrible. Kind of a concern. As far as the physical gifts, he’s got everything. He’s got the poise, and he works hard.” Completed 67.5% and had a rating of 109.6. Ran for 439 and eight TDs. “Has a ceiling to be a solid starter like Alex Smith,” another scout said. “There’s a smaller variance between his floor and ceiling than Mahomes. He does some good things but doesn’t get me excited. If he hits he’s like from 10 to 20 among the quarterbacks. Him being a one-year wonder is problematic.” Named Mr. Football in Ohio (from Mentor). Wonderlic of 25. “Can sling the ball but his feet get a little bit happy under pressure,” a third scout said. “I don’t think he’s a quick mental processor. That’s going to take some time. I don’t know if guys will rally around him. He’s got great feet. Not as athletic as (Marcus) Mariota. Rhythm passer.”

4. DESHONE KIZER, Notre Dame (6-4½, 235, 4.86, 2): Third-year sophomore from Toledo, Ohio. “Really good arm strength,” said one scout. “Can crank the ball through the tight windows. He’ll stand tall in the pocket. When he’s under pressure he doesn’t move in the pocket as well as you would like. Big dude.” Started 23 of 25 games, competing 60.8% for a rating of 98.6. “He should be the top guy but for some reason he’s not,” said another scout. “The tape is just incongruent. He’s smart (Wonderlic of 28). I talked to the kid. He’s got size, a good arm, pretty good athlete. Everything lines up. It doesn’t connect. Is there a fatal flaw somewhere? Maybe the game doesn’t slow down for him.” Ran for 992 yards and 18 touchdowns. “He’s a pure millennial,” said a third scout. “He’s caught up in being more of a quarterback image than being a quarterback. If he goes to the right spot with the right coach, he’ll ascend. They’re going to have to get him to focus on football. I honestly think this guy would do better in a small market. If he goes to a big market he’ll enjoy everything else that comes with the position. The one position in the building you don’t want to worry about whether he’s going to be focused on football is quarterback.”

5. DAVIS WEBB, California (6-4½, 226, 4.80, 2): Beat out Baker Mayfield at Texas Tech in ’14, and Mayfield left for Oklahoma. Started that season but was surpassed by Mahomes in ’15 and departed for Cal as a graduate transfer in ’16. “I think everyone is a little bit scared watching (Cal’s Jared) Goff last year,” said one scout. “That puts the fear of God in you. But he has the potential to be a starter. Looks like an NFL quarterback.” Named MVP of the Senior Bowl. “He’s got a lot of things you want,” another scout said. “He’s big, he can throw it, he moves around good enough, he’s competitive. But nobody really has been successful playing in that offense.” Completed 61.5% for a rating of 93.3. Not a running threat. “He melted as the season went on,” a third scout said. “Better athlete than people realize. Plays in a junk offense. He could get in the top 50.” Wonderlic of 25. From Prosper, Texas.

6. NATHAN PETERMAN, Pittsburgh (6-2½, 225, 4.81, 3): Redshirted in 2012 and backed up in 2013-'14 at Tennessee before heading to Pitt as a grad transfer in ’15. Was 14-10 for the Panthers, 0-2 for the Vols. “The guy just has really good command,” one scout said. “Got a lot of poise, lot of moxie. Not the most gifted physically but the guy moves around well.” Completed a master’s in business degree. Wonderlic of 33. “Like him,” said another scout. “He’s a Brian Hoyer. Good, tough, mid-round guy that if he gets in the right system maybe he becomes a starter.” Completion mark of 60% and rating of 98 (111.2 in ’16). Marginal runner. “Played really well at the Senior Bowl,” a third scout said. “That’s obviously a big deal for a quarterback. Go down there and work in somebody else’s system with a bunch of guys you haven’t worked with. Then you go back and start watching his film and you say, ‘You know what? This guy is pretty good.’ Not a top-tier starter, but I think he is a starter.” Only QB to defeat Clemson (43-42) last season. From Jacksonville, Fla.

7. C.J. BEATHARD, Iowa (6-2½, 219, no 40, 4): Completed 58.1% for a rating of 87.0 and 21-7 record. Much more effective as a junior (95.7) than as a senior (80.8). “It wasn’t even close,” one scout said. “He’ll end up being one of the best backup quarterbacks in the league. As a starter, he doesn’t do a lot of things by himself. But he’s got a good arm, he’s accurate and has intangibles. Athletically, you want a little bit better.” From Franklin, Tenn. Wonderlic of 26. “He’ll play 10 years as a second- or third-team quarterback,” said a second scout. “He’s smart as (expletive) and a great kid. His grandfather should be in the Hall of Fame.” Grandson of Bobby Beathard, the legendary GM-scout for the Chiefs, Dolphins, Redskins and Chargers who helped seven teams reach the Super Bowl. “In the games where they put pressure on him he just starts putting the ball up for grabs,” said a third scout. “He did play hurt. In the bowl game they beat the crap out of him and he kept coming back.”

8. JOSH DOBBS, Tennessee (6-3½, 217, 4.64, 4-5): Overtook Peterman in mid-2014 and held job for 2½ years (23-12). “Right now he’s not a good enough thrower (or) decision-maker but he is very smart,” one scout said. “He’s big, athletic, can run and he’s got a pretty good arm. They didn’t run a very complicated offense (so) it will take time for him to make reads and throw to the right guy.” Nicknamed “Astro.” Aerospace Engineering student with a Wonderlic of 29. “Just a great person,” a second scout said. “Natural leader. Not a good passer. He beats you with his feet, not his arm. Runs well.” Rushed for 1,502 yards and 23 TDs. Completed 61.5% for a rating of 88.7. “He had one of the most impressive pro-day showings I’ve seen in a while,” a third scout said. “He’s not without talent.” From Alpharetta, Ga.

9. BRAD KAAYA, Miami (6-4, 216, no 40, 4-5): Third-year junior started all 38 games (22-16). “He’s OK,” said one scout. “It sets me back when the coaches are excited he’s leavin’.” Finished as the Hurricanes’ all-time leading passer. Completed 60.6% for a rating of 98.5. “He’s a mystery guy,” another scout said. “Extremely talented but it looks like he’s got dead eyes. He’s like Carson Palmer. I see a guy who holds the ball. Against Virginia Tech he got sacked eight times. Their offensive line wasn’t that bad.” Two-time team MVP with a QB-leading Wonderlic of 34. “Hasn’t run the 40,” said a third scout. “Said he had a turf toe at pro day. I get the creeps about that kid. He doesn’t extend a lot of plays and he’s not going to hurt you with creativity.” From Los Angeles.

10. JEROD EVANS, Virginia Tech (6-2½, 233, 4.82, 5): Blew out an ACL at Air Force in 2013. Opted out of the military, played two years of junior college and went 10-4 for the Hokies last season. “He’s raw but I love his presence,” said one scout. “Off the field he has a long, long ways to go as far as the football learning and background. He really should have stayed in school. He’s big and strong and athletic. You like that he went there and took over the job and had a drat good year.” Completed 63.5% for a rating of 105.1. “A real project,” a second scout said. “Probably the same type of arm strength and same type of athlete as DeShone Kizer, but Kizer is more advanced. He’s got a strong arm but he has no idea where he’s throwing the ball.” Wonderlic of 21. From Mansfield, Texas.

11. TREVOR KNIGHT, Texas A&M (6-1½, 220, 4.58, 5): Started off and on at Oklahoma from 2013-'15 before departing as a grad transfer in ’16 after Baker Mayfield passed him by. Claim to fame is MVP performance in Sugar Bowl victory over Alabama as a freshman. “Knight is a bigger Johnny Manziel,” said one scout. “Speed’s about the same. Really good runner. His stuff is all on the move. If he goes to Canada he’d be excellent up there.” Went to College Station and started 11 games, ending career with an 18-8 record. Completed 55.6% for a rating of 81.5. Also ran for 1,467 and 18 TDs. “(Tim) Tebow kind of guy,” a second scout said. “An athlete who struggles to throw from the pocket.” Wonderlic of 30 and QB-highs in the 40, vertical jump (35½) and broad jump (10-5). From San Antonio.

12. CHAD KELLY, Mississippi (6-1½, 228, 4.85, 6): Grew up in Buffalo. Jim Kelly’s nephew. “He’s got talent,” one scout said. “If you only picked the last two games against Alabama you’d think the guy was a first-rounder. He had fantastic games against them.” Beat five top-25 teams in 2015. Started nine games in ’16 before blowing out his right ACL Nov. 5. “He’s dirty tough,” said a second scout. “Does have some physical skills. He’s also got some off-the-field issues that need to be worked through.” Thrown off the team at Clemson for conduct detrimental to the team and played 2014 at a junior college. Pleaded guilty to non-criminal disorderly conduct after a bar fight in Buffalo, then charged onto the field during his brother’s prep game and entered a melee. “Obviously, I wouldn’t touch him with a 10-foot pole character-wise,” said a third scout. “There’s a lot. I question some of his decision-making but he can throw the ball.” Completed 63.9% for a rating of 100.8. Also ran for 949 and 16 TDs. Blew out left ACL in ’13. Wonderlic of 22.

OTHERS: Cooper Rush, Central Michigan; Wes Lunt, Illinois; Alek Torgenson, Penn; Sefo Liufau, Colorado; Seth Russell, Baylor; Mitch Leidner, Minnesota; Brady Gustafson, Montana.

****

Unsung Hero

Wes Lunt, Illinois: Started five games at Oklahoma State in 2012 before transferring to Champaign, where he played for three different coaching staffs in three years. Started when healthy for Illini, but that wasn’t often enough. Compiled 83.1 passer rating amid the onslaught of injuries. Big pocket passer showed well at pro day.

Scouts' Nightmare

Alek Torgenson, Penn: Became Quakers’ all-time passing leader in 29 starts (16-13). Stepped up a notch from Ivy League competition with impressive showing all week at the NFLPA all-star game. Served as a heady game manager for three seasons in a lower level of football. Does he have the arm and athletic ability to do it in the NFL?

Packers' Pick to Remember

Don Majkowski, Virginia: Tenth-round pick in 1987. Nicknamed “Majik Man,” his one shining moment was Pro Bowl season of ’89 when the Packers finished 10-6 under his gutty, crowd-pleasing direction. Suffered rotator-cuff damage on a sideline hit by the Cardinals’ Freddie Joe Nunn in November 1990 and was never the same. Also played for Colts and Lions. Finished with 26-30-1 record and rating of 72.9.

Quote to Note

AFC personnel man: “You’ve got a lot of players that are either first-year starters in college football or upside-type players. Nothing that is just guaranteed. I see some guys going first round that will be back-end-of-the-league starters. But, if you don’t have one, they’re better than what you’ve got.”

Doltos
Dec 28, 2005

🤌🤌🤌

The Glumslinger posted:

One thing to mention about JuJu Smith-Schuster is that he was playing through recurring back spasms for a large chunk of last season. It affected him a lot out there, as well as Max Browne not being able to ever get him the ball

Him and Adoree were getting a ton of hype last year and JuJu was pretty much the #1 or #2 WR going into this year. I still think JuJu is a fantastic prospect and he's right there with Ross as a potential #1 on a team.

Michael Corleone posted:

I want Kizer now, not at 12 though. *throws this post at Hue*

I honestly think Kizer is the most prototypical QB in this group and probably the best bet to be a franchise QB but he just didn't produce and there's a ton of coaching question marks about him. Usually that means he's a 4th or 5th round QB in most drafts but this draft sucks so he's a potential #1 overall pick!!


Njoku grew up one town over from where I've lived for the past decade. He was their WR in HS and Cedar Grove destroyed D1North athletics while he was there. Apparently a super active kid that participated in everything and almost went to Ohio State to be a track guy. I know he's a backup but I think he's got the potential and the drive to be a premier TE, better than Howard.

Grittybeard
Mar 29, 2010

Bad, very bad!

OSheaman posted:

“I think everyone is a little bit scared watching (Cal’s Jared) Goff last year,” said one scout. “That puts the fear of God in you.

Haha, every now and then something reminds me of just how hosed the Rams are and makes me smile.

e: Also does anyone else remember Brad Kaaya being talked up as one of the top guys real early in the process or am I hallucinating that?

Grittybeard fucked around with this message at 05:16 on Apr 23, 2017

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land




PJ Walker getting passed over by dudes like Beathard, Knight, and Mitch loving Leidner is incredibly dumb

Ches Neckbeard
Dec 3, 2005

You're all garbage, back up the truck BACK IT UP!

Grittybeard posted:

Haha, every now and then something reminds me of just how hosed the Rams are and makes me smile.

e: Also does anyone else remember Brad Kaaya being talked up as one of the top guys real early in the process or am I hallucinating that?

Bunch of goons had/have hard-ons for Kaaya.

I can't wait for Haslam to demand we take Kizer at 12 (or 1 goddamnit) because that description reeks of Johnny's personality. Let's face it that's all Flying Jimmy cares about.

Doltos
Dec 28, 2005

🤌🤌🤌

Ches Neckbeard posted:

Bunch of goons had/have hard-ons for Kaaya.

I can't wait for Haslam to demand we take Kizer at 12 (or 1 goddamnit) because that description reeks of Johnny's personality. Let's face it that's all Flying Jimmy cares about.

It's me i'm the only one who has a hard on for Kaaya look how different I am than every other evaluator out there i have the secret formula

No Irish Need Imply
Nov 30, 2008
How are you a professional football executive and don't know Joe Montana went to Notre Dame?

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Ehud
Sep 19, 2003

football.

No Irish Need Imply posted:

How are you a professional football executive and don't know Joe Montana went to Notre Dame?

Also, Notre Dame QB's haven't been good in a while, therefore Kizer must stink, too!!"

That sounds like something a fan would say. It's so stupid and such a dumb, lazy approach to evaluating a player.

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