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There's no stat difference, why do people assume there's a stat difference...
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Apr 24, 2017 02:05
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Khisanth Magus posted:I'm enjoying the beta. Wait what. How do I do this thing.
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Apr 24, 2017 02:33
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You can do it with the orks too, you can lead the ork one around yourself but the codex says you just disable the spess mehreen one
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Apr 24, 2017 02:40
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Liu posted:You can do it with the orks too, you can lead the ork one around yourself but the codex says you just disable the spess mehreen one Oh, I always assumed it just ran out shortly after I captured it. It does give you control of the beam for a short time before it powers down.
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Apr 24, 2017 02:55
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You can also capture the banner that SMs drop, removing the buffs from their units (though sadly not giving them to your own).
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Apr 24, 2017 04:46
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I just uninstalled the beta and it caused a survey to pop up. 
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Apr 24, 2017 07:08
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Christ that was loving delicious, I wish the replay function was available already. On the 3v3 map, getting needled to death by ranger spam as marines at the top point and after they push forward one too many times my eldar ally flanks with a few banshees and loving goes to town on them. Then pushing up their marine player has their entire drat army in the heavy cover so I jumped assault terminators in there from max range and slammed them and smeared their devastators, called team to push through now that their support is gone so they try and drop a knight in and it immediately gets tied by up my dropped dread and terminators and doesnt accomplish a damned thing.
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Apr 24, 2017 10:08
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I had a game earlier where I think I killed 4-6 ranger squads simultaneously by teleporting my Assault Terminators into their bubble and doing the slam attack. Really wish I had a GIF of that moment.
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Apr 24, 2017 11:15
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For a tanking elite assault terminators are extremely killy in that one instant.
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Apr 24, 2017 11:23
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I enjoyed the beta even though I'm quite terrible at this game. Not a $70 good game though. If this was around $40 I'd be snagging it come launch. All that said I'm probably going to preorder it anyway 
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Apr 24, 2017 12:14
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I'll grab it but I'm not sure when, multi games always have this issue where it's best to grab them early so other people are as nooby as you are but they're also overpriced. I don't really get why the internet decided to hate this game but I can see why it pisses off DoW2 fans since it's nothing like DoW2 apart from the strong hero units. As a DoW1 fan I guess it does make me sad it's not just a fancier DoW1 because it's so close.
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Apr 24, 2017 12:28
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nopantsjack posted:I'll grab it but I'm not sure when, multi games always have this issue where it's best to grab them early so other people are as nooby as you are but they're also overpriced. I think because of the learning curve that doesnt actually apply here, having bad team mates in earlier games sucked but it didnt actively hamstring you and stop you from carrying the team. if the rest of the team aren't holding ground and paying for node output upgrades you don't have enough resources to field an army or hold ground so you just get wailed on. If everyone on the team does their share you end up rolling through the enemy with like 4 predators and laughing.
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Apr 24, 2017 12:40
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I enjoyed the beta, although I did have a few gripes with it. I still found it hard to actively pick out units to use their various abilities in the middle of a big fight. Squad reinforcement almost seems pointless after the first 5 minutes into the game since I always ended up floating in waaaay to much Requisition. It was faster to just replace whole squads outright instead of slowly reinforcing them back to full strength. Makes me think they should just make reinforcing units automatic and/or free if they're within a reinforcement zone, pretty much like elite units heal for free near them as well. With no retreat mechanic there's really no reason to do it.
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Apr 24, 2017 13:32
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Reinforcing units is WAY better than outright replacing them. If you're floating resources then you're being bad at the game like me
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Apr 24, 2017 13:36
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I think the game could stand to make reinforcements cheaper to reward you for going that extra mile and actually managing your squads, all it really amounts to now is not having to pay for plasma/flamers again and thats for one unit in the entire game. That and we need the right click overwatch reinforcement option from the earlier games.
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Apr 24, 2017 13:58
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As a solo player I'm much more interested in the AI and difficulty levels. I don't care about the campaign, I'll be asking for feedback once the full game is out.
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Apr 24, 2017 14:41
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Artum posted:I think the game could stand to make reinforcements cheaper to reward you for going that extra mile and actually managing your squads, all it really amounts to now is not having to pay for plasma/flamers again and thats for one unit in the entire game. Yeah I wish we had that at least. I don't even know what I'm supposed to be doing with the extra resources. I literally just notice I have way too much every so often so I pick a building and queue up a ton of new basic squads or something. My main issue with reinforcements is that squads drop so god damned fast, I feel like I'm actually doing less by trying to pull them back to reinforce them instead of just leaving them to at least do some damage before they're wiped out. Other wise you risk getting wiped out on a retreat since most of your guys have been running instead of fighting (But not running super fast with damage resistance like the other games' retreat mechanic)
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Apr 24, 2017 15:12
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DarkAvenger211 posted:Yeah I wish we had that at least. I don't even know what I'm supposed to be doing with the extra resources. I literally just notice I have way too much every so often so I pick a building and queue up a ton of new basic squads or something. I really miss the retreat mechanic, and it's lack makes retreating to reinforce way harder and feel a lot less useful.
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Apr 24, 2017 15:17
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Khisanth Magus posted:I really miss the retreat mechanic, and it's lack makes retreating to reinforce way harder and feel a lot less useful. I think part of this is just because of the way people run units into eachother, but I don't think the game is supposed to be like that. I think the game being new and people still figuring it out is what's leading to the blob vs blob compositions and the lack of strategy. Hopefully top end games once the meta has been figured out will have lots of interesting back and forth dynamics and the where/how/why of engagements will matter a lot more than people think (closer to Warcraft 3.) I mean, that might not happen. But that's my hope for the game. The potential is certainly there with all the crowd control, unit upgrades, stealth mechanics, etc.. Perhaps it'll just be a game about the rich getting richer and big blobby armies. Way too early to tell. I'd hope that the developers would steer it away from that, though.
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Apr 24, 2017 15:37
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a harpy posted:I think part of this is just because of the way people run units into eachother, but I don't think the game is supposed to be like that. I think the game being new and people still figuring it out is what's leading to the blob vs blob compositions and the lack of strategy. Hopefully top end games once the meta has been figured out will have lots of interesting back and forth dynamics and the where/how/why of engagements will matter a lot more than people think (closer to Warcraft 3.) I think other game modes will lead to significantly different playstyles as well. The current objective's game type leads to deathballing, because you need to just push and push. Some people have complained about the lack of impact of weapons in this game. For the most part I think it is ok for most weapons, but lascannons are way way too anemic for my taste. Give me back the DoW1 and 2 lascannon. Khisanth Magus fucked around with this message at 15:44 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 15:42
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a harpy posted:I think part of this is just because of the way people run units into eachother, but I don't think the game is supposed to be like that. I think the game being new and people still figuring it out is what's leading to the blob vs blob compositions and the lack of strategy. Hopefully top end games once the meta has been figured out will have lots of interesting back and forth dynamics and the where/how/why of engagements will matter a lot more than people think (closer to Warcraft 3.) Yeah that's my feeling on it too. If it's supposed to be that way then I don't know why reinforcing is even a mechanic they decided to put in but restrict to base buildings/transports.
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Apr 24, 2017 15:42
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a harpy posted:I think part of this is just because of the way people run units into eachother, but I don't think the game is supposed to be like that. I think the game being new and people still figuring it out is what's leading to the blob vs blob compositions and the lack of strategy. Hopefully top end games once the meta has been figured out will have lots of interesting back and forth dynamics and the where/how/why of engagements will matter a lot more than people think (closer to Warcraft 3.) The aoe kind of stops it being about blobby armies, the moment you have the element of surprise, which is extremely easy given how cheap infiltrators are and how hard detection is, means you can wipe out the other side before they can really fight back. Scoutings insanely important and I'm really liking it.
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Apr 24, 2017 15:50
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Enjoyed the few games I played over the weekend, but some of the design decisions had me scratching my head a bit. Number 1 on my list of "What were you thinking?!" is the slight delay before units respond to move commands. This just feels terrible and laggy and I hope to hell it's removed. The lack of a "Retreat" command like others mentioned seems pretty dumb also, but we'll see I guess. All in all, still looking forward to the full release. Just quietly praying they kept the Battlegear mechanic in for the campaign so that we can have Last Stand mode return 
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Apr 24, 2017 17:05
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I'm glad they moved away from DoW II and moving back to more like DoW, flaws and everything, but i'll take it.
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Apr 24, 2017 17:08
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Mackers posted:All in all, still looking forward to the full release. Just quietly praying they kept the Battlegear mechanic in for the campaign so that we can have Last Stand mode return It hasnt and its supposed to.
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Apr 24, 2017 17:09
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Delays in move orders have been a thing in all multiplayer RTS's since forever. It mostly just has to do with latency. I don't know if they're still doing P2P or a client-server setup, but both can give you delays if your connection isn't that great. I didn't notice too much of a problem in the beta, I think there was one 3v3 I played where the delay was actually painfully noticeable.
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Apr 24, 2017 17:12
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Mackers posted:Number 1 on my list of "What were you thinking?!" is the slight delay before units respond to move commands. This just feels terrible and laggy and I hope to hell it's removed. The lack of a "Retreat" command like others mentioned seems pretty dumb also, but we'll see I guess. That DOTA feel. It's 100% why I could never get into DOTA. For my tastes it doesn't feel as bad a DOTA does from a responsiveness perspective but it annoys me to some extent. DarkAvenger211 posted:Delays in move orders have been a thing in all multiplayer RTS's since forever. It mostly just has to do with latency. I don't know if they're still doing P2P or a client-server setup, but both can give you delays if your connection isn't that great. It's probably this.
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Apr 24, 2017 17:16
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Artum posted:The aoe kind of stops it being about blobby armies, the moment you have the element of surprise, which is extremely easy given how cheap infiltrators are and how hard detection is, means you can wipe out the other side before they can really fight back. Yeah, I had the (mis)fortune to run into one or two solid premade teams that whooped my pug team's loving rear end horribly because they made good use of scouting and jumped our blobs out of nowhere. It doesn't matter if you have 20 squads of tacs if they're all in a blob and a Gorgutz stuns 2/3 of them and blows half of them with his spin klaw while a weirdboy immobilizes the rest and fist of gorks them. Blobs are an easy way to control your troops but they're insanely vulnerable to anyone who knows where you are and can prepare for it. Speaking of Orks, they definitely feel like the most powerful faction by a mile. The others don't feel weak - it's definitely possible for marines or eldar to beat them - but the micro burden on an eldar or marine player to beat an ork player is dramatically higher, especially in early game. The initial 3 boyz mob vs 3 tac squad or 3 dire avenger squad skirmish is the starkest and most ruinous example of this, since the boyz can quite literally attack move into the enemy after popping warshout and have a reasonable expectation of winning while the enemy has to do a lot of frantic kiting and squad splitting, and the ork's units are massively cheaper. God help you if the orkz are fighting around their forward waaagh tower, since it's a forward turret that is nearly impossible for other races to kill with low tech squads, and once they get scrap rolling because 'ard boyz are absolutely loving RIDICULOUS for a 300 req basic unit. It's not like they just have an early game advantage and nothing else, either, because as the game goes on they get the trukk and nobz with their enormous AoE "haha, you wanted to dodge aoe? lol?" taunt which would be powerful on an elite unit, nevermind a line unit. AS A HEADS UP FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE TRIED THE BETA AND LIKE IT, GREEN MAN GAMING HAS THE PREORDER FOR 25% OFF FOR A STEAM KEY. I only recommend doing this if you've tried the beta and are confident that you want to buy it, since of course buying from an outside retailer forfeits your steam refund rights, but if you're on the fence about wanting to get it but not wanting to pay $60 smackeroos for it this is the best sale you're likely to get for quite a while. Kanos fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 18:22
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I think the problem with orcs being better is made a lot worse as a result of them being the most straightforward and everyone being bad. Except for the early basic troop vs basic troop you mentioned boys really kick everyone's rear end early on. I won every game easily where the other player engaged me early and got stomped trying to fight orcs early as the others.
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Apr 24, 2017 18:36
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Boyz are cheap and effective. You can have 3-4 of em out in really quick time. I think I'd be okay with them staying exactly the way they are except not letting them go through shields/cover points until they become 'Ard Boyz.
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Apr 24, 2017 18:45
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Kanos posted:AS A HEADS UP FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE TRIED THE BETA AND LIKE IT, GREEN MAN GAMING HAS THE PREORDER FOR 25% OFF FOR A STEAM KEY. I only recommend doing this if you've tried the beta and are confident that you want to buy it, since of course buying from an outside retailer forfeits your steam refund rights, but if you're on the fence about wanting to get it but not wanting to pay $60 smackeroos for it this is the best sale you're likely to get for quite a while. I just wanna add that if you were gonna buy right before release just to get the pre-order bonus, the GMG pre-order does NOT include the bonus. BUT, those skins are going to be available for sale after release. So it's likely you'll still save money... Unless they charge $15 or more for 3 elite skins. I got 8 hours out of the beta and I think $45 is a good price for this game so I pulled the trigger. My biggest wishes are just for lots of map support post-release. Since there is a map editor, hopefully they can just be active about pulling community maps and making them official.
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Apr 24, 2017 18:55
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I hope they add more races to the game quickly. Specifically, Imperial Guard.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:03
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There are also a lot of things that you pick up with time. I thought Gorgutz's spin attack was unstoppable until somebody told me that knocking him down ends it, so SMs can use Drop Pods, Assault Marine jumps, Gabe, etc. to break him out of the ability. (On the other hand, it deflects grenades.) Once you learn a few tricks like that, stealing Ork nukes, shutting down the SM orbital relay and banner, etc. things become a lot more manageable. One of the main things with Marines is that Tacticals are pretty weak for their cost until you give them weapon upgrades. One strategy that has worked well for me is only building one Tactical squad at the start and then going straight to ASMs, who are really threatening to almost everything (especially once you research power swords) and can use their giant leap to instigate fights, raid isolated generators (ASMs are great harassers against the triple points on the left side of the beta 1v1 map), or even just escape from bad scenarios.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:03
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BadLlama posted:I hope they add more races to the game quickly. Specifically, Imperial Guard. I like your optimism of 2 a year or 1 a year.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:12
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Fetterkey posted:There are also a lot of things that you pick up with time. I thought Gorgutz's spin attack was unstoppable until somebody told me that knocking him down ends it, so SMs can use Drop Pods, Assault Marine jumps, Gabe, etc. to break him out of the ability. (On the other hand, it deflects grenades.) Once you learn a few tricks like that, stealing Ork nukes, shutting down the SM orbital relay and banner, etc. things become a lot more manageable. Assault Marines, especially with power swords(which I upgrade to ASAP) tear ork boyz apart. 2 squads of assault marines with power swords killed 4 squads of boyz who were trying to hide in a shield. Stagger their jump packs to keep knocking the boyz down and you will just tear through them. I only lost a couple marines in that fight too.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:15
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Assault marine power swords are not going to survive as is. True Damage should be on elite units ONLY.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:21
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just a sad loving shame about this game...... drat
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Apr 24, 2017 19:21
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DarkAvenger211 posted:Yeah that's my feeling on it too. If it's supposed to be that way then I don't know why reinforcing is even a mechanic they decided to put in but restrict to base buildings/transports. Dawn of War 1 had in the field reinforcing. You could constantly reinforce your units as the battle happened, which lead to longer fights and infantry feeling less squishy. Dow 2 had retreat, which caused your units to gtfo with one button and granted them damage reduction while they ran away. DoW 3 has neither of these things leading to another layer of busy work while you're trying to use a bunch of skills on every loving unit while everything lumbers around and giant aoe's fall from the sky killing all your poo poo anyway. They really should have given either retreat or easy reinforcing in the field, or just gotten rid of it and made infantry a bit cheaper.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:28
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Frustrated posted:Dawn of War 1 had in the field reinforcing. You could constantly reinforce your units as the battle happened, which lead to longer fights and infantry feeling less squishy. Dow 2 had retreat, which caused your units to gtfo with one button and granted them damage reduction while they ran away. DoW 3 has neither of these things leading to another layer of busy work while you're trying to use a bunch of skills on every loving unit while everything lumbers around and giant aoe's fall from the sky killing all your poo poo anyway. They really should have given either retreat or easy reinforcing in the field, or just gotten rid of it and made infantry a bit cheaper.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:30
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They should bring back auto-reinforce, but i am ok with needing a base/transport to reinforce, i never liked the reinforce in the field from dow 1. Even if the no retreat stays, a hotkey for pathing to the closest reinforce point would be sweet.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:34
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