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PhyrexianLibrarian posted:I'll be there running Grixis Delver, Aggro Loam, or Grixis Reanimator depending on what I get the most reps in with beforehand. Definitely up for testing via XMage or Cockatrice or something. yeah i thought about that too. mono red was already doing things before the miracles ban, and I cannot imagine miracles was a good matchup for it and yeah i'll be in Mt. Goon a little more to try and get testing in on xmage. I have grixis delver put together already but I just don't feel like playing it. What's the red for in Grixis Reanimator?
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Apr 25, 2017 15:23
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Johnny Landmine posted:Even as a 12 Post player, I may actually be more upset that I never got around to sleeving up Thought Lash combo for one more night of laughter and explaining what my cards do before it died than I am about Miracles. And losing Top for Post itself, but I'm pretty sure Miracles biting the dust hurts Post way more than losing Top did. Looks like it's time to pivot to Colorless Green Post for giggles and finally get around to building Lands. I think people get the wrong impression. This was less about Miracles being oppressive and more about top being obnoxious with 90% of players.
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Apr 25, 2017 15:31
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Johnny Five-Jaces posted:What's the red for in Grixis Reanimator? It's kind of a midway point between the other re-animator styles. The red is mostly for Faithless Looting and Dack Fayden, so you can more aggressively bin cards like BR while still having counters and selection like UB. It also allows SB options like Pyroclasm/Blast. Here's the list: https://deckbox.org/sets/1610145 I'm not sure it's better than either of the two-color variants, but I think it's a lot more fun. Edit: In fact, now that Miracles is out, BR Reanimator might lose a lot of its advantage, as it was exploiting a gap in the metagame where people were overcorrecting their sideboards. PhyrexianLibrarian fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Apr 25, 2017 |
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Apr 25, 2017 18:49
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Guess who has two thumbs and just bought elves. Hot tip for those of you down for a good spec, people are selling SP+ cradles for ~$120 on MKM.
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Apr 25, 2017 19:47
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The March Hare posted:Guess who has two thumbs and just bought elves. Hot tip for those of you down for a good spec, people are selling SP+ cradles for ~$120 on MKM. So what you're saying is I should run engineered plague.
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Apr 25, 2017 20:17
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EvilBeard posted:I think people get the wrong impression. This was less about Miracles being oppressive and more about top being obnoxious with 90% of players. I get that that was part of it, but I also think it's dumb to ban a card because some people are bad at Magic. Also not that I doubt it happens but geez, did I just luck out and get the only local scene where almost everyone could Top in a reasonable amount of time?
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Apr 26, 2017 02:50
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Johnny Landmine posted:I get that that was part of it, but I also think it's dumb to ban a card because some people are bad at Magic. Nope. I drew 2 matches ever with Miracles. One was literally his 2nd match with the deck and he refused to concede despite being dead on board with the most absurd sequence of draws (which he didn't have) being necessary to not die on my next turn. And he had taken about 80% of the time in the match. The other was Agentsythe and it was like, his 4th match with the deck and he was decent enough to concede because I was pretty likely to win. I'll admit I was also partially at fault, being pretty new to Death and Taxes at the time.
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Apr 26, 2017 03:22
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Johnny Landmine posted:I get that that was part of it, but I also think it's dumb to ban a card because some people are bad at Magic. Most people exaggerate how many people just durdle slowly with top. It's easy to complain about. I find after a month or two most miracles players speed up to normal speeds.
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Apr 26, 2017 03:46
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suicidesteve posted:Nope. I drew 2 matches ever with Miracles. One was literally his 2nd match with the deck and he refused to concede despite being dead on board with the most absurd sequence of draws (which he didn't have) being necessary to not die on my next turn. And he had taken about 80% of the time in the match. The other was Agentsythe and it was like, his 4th match with the deck and he was decent enough to concede because I was pretty likely to win. I'll admit I was also partially at fault, being pretty new to Death and Taxes at the time. shamefully i wasn't even playing miracles. it was a horrendous UWR deck that featured the following: 4 Monastery Mentory 4 Tops 4 Lightning Bolt 4 Swords to Plowshares 4 Dig Thru Time some number of terminus no counterbalance it wasn't even a matter of making decisions (well sometimes it was because loving death and taxes just needles you a million different ways), it was just the muscle memory required to top quickly
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Apr 26, 2017 04:33
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Errant Gin Monks posted:Most people exaggerate how many people just durdle slowly with top. It's easy to complain about. The people I do know who were slow Toppers are also all just excruciatingly slow players in general. Top does present those people with a greater number of decisions, but man I just do not think that's a good criteria for a ban at all. Enforce or re-examine the rules concerning slow play in competitive environments if you have to, but take care of it with those rules, not by taking cards away.
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Apr 26, 2017 04:42
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Johnny Landmine posted:The people I do know who were slow Toppers are also all just excruciatingly slow players in general. Top does present those people with a greater number of decisions, but man I just do not think that's a good criteria for a ban at all. Enforce or re-examine the rules concerning slow play in competitive environments if you have to, but take care of it with those rules, not by taking cards away. But it's already a well established reason for banning. Top was already banned in two other formats for this reason. Do I think they NEEDED to ban Top? No. Can I see why they did it? Yeah. It's not the worst decision they've made. This showed up at WotC today: 
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Apr 26, 2017 05:21
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Well with Miracles dead I'm thinking of making a bant control-ish list running the usual suspects. Force Snap Daze Brainstorm Ponder Jace Noble Heirarch Tarmogoyf True name Etc etc... see how it plays.
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Apr 26, 2017 05:41
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EvilBeard posted:But it's already a well established reason for banning. Top was already banned in two other formats for this reason. Do I think they NEEDED to ban Top? No. Can I see why they did it? Yeah. It's not the worst decision they've made. Wait what other format besides modern?
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Apr 26, 2017 05:51
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Errant Gin Monks posted:Well with Miracles dead I'm thinking of making a bant control-ish list running the usual suspects. there's a stoneblade deck in bant that was doing okay even with miracles around another option is throwing in some natural orders since progenitus is probably better with fewer terminus and council's judgment
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Apr 26, 2017 05:56
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Errant Gin Monks posted:Well with Miracles dead I'm thinking of making a bant control-ish list running the usual suspects. You know what would make this deck better? A black splash for Deathrite and Abrupt Decay. Johnny Five-Jaces posted:shamefully i wasn't even playing miracles. it was a horrendous UWR deck that featured the following: Oh right you changed your name.
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Apr 26, 2017 05:57
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suicidesteve posted:You know what would make this deck better? A black splash for Deathrite and Abrupt Decay. And Leovolds right?
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Apr 26, 2017 06:03
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kirtar posted:And Leovolds right? Well what else are you going to do on turn 2?!
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Apr 26, 2017 06:15
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abrupt decay + 2nd deathrite
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Apr 26, 2017 06:20
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Truly we live in a world of possibilities!
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Apr 26, 2017 06:40
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EvilBeard posted:But it's already a well established reason for banning. Top was already banned in two other formats for this reason. Do I think they NEEDED to ban Top? No. Can I see why they did it? Yeah. It's not the worst decision they've made. 
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Apr 26, 2017 06:51
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kirtar posted:Wait what other format besides modern? Extended, when that was a thing.
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Apr 26, 2017 07:57
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Abrupt Decay seems worse in a format without Counterbalance. It will likely be trading down a lot more and there might be more TNNs, Anglers, and Tasigurs that make Decay look real silly. I wouldn't be surprised if Deathrite decks got a bit less popular with less incentive to be an Abrupt Decay deck.
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Apr 26, 2017 14:08
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Sampatrick posted:Abrupt Decay seems worse in a format without Counterbalance. It will likely be trading down a lot more and there might be more TNNs, Anglers, and Tasigurs that make Decay look real silly. I wouldn't be surprised if Deathrite decks got a bit less popular with less incentive to be an Abrupt Decay deck. Nah Blood moon decks are going to run rampant. Abrupt Decay is the only sure fire answer to that card.
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Apr 26, 2017 15:55
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I mean, there are plenty of 1 color and 1 Mana answers to moon, decay isn't required. Also mean you need 2 drs or a basic in play to cast over say, natural state or similar.
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Apr 26, 2017 16:40
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Skyl3lazer posted:I mean, there are plenty of 1 color and 1 Mana answers to moon, decay isn't required. Also mean you need 2 drs or a basic in play to cast over say, natural state or similar. Or if you think your opponent has it just hold up bg and float Mana in response to the moon on the stack.
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Apr 26, 2017 17:04
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Errant Gin Monks posted:Nah Blood moon decks are going to run rampant. Abrupt Decay is the only sure fire answer to that card. I don't think that the answer to Blood Moon is going to be playing zero nonbasics. I think, in general, the best answer to Blood Moon is to play a bunch of basics.
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Apr 26, 2017 17:14
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L0cke17 posted:Or if you think your opponent has it just hold up bg and float Mana in response to the moon on the stack. Yes, but that's the issue. The only answer to moon being "always hold up 2 Mana and decay"
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Apr 26, 2017 17:16
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Skyl3lazer posted:I mean, there are plenty of 1 color and 1 Mana answers to moon, decay isn't required. Also mean you need 2 drs or a basic in play to cast over say, natural state or similar. You can maindeck Decay though.
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Apr 26, 2017 17:17
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Skyl3lazer posted:Yes, but that's the issue. The only answer to moon being "always hold up 2 Mana and decay" Force of Will also exists and is a very useful card against Blood Moon
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Apr 26, 2017 17:20
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spine of ish sah is a pretty clean answer, I think I'll be running those e: mono blue improvise with March of the Machines, Spine of Ish Sah, and Ghostly Flicker is the new tier 0 e2: nevermind the leaves the battlefield trigger im thinking of is on sundering titan Johnny Five-Jaces fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Apr 26, 2017 |
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Apr 26, 2017 17:30
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Are there any good Enlightened Tutor-based control decks in the format?
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Apr 26, 2017 17:34
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Card disadvantage tutors are almost always good in combo decks but not in control decks. So uh probably not?
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Apr 26, 2017 18:38
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I think thopterbalance was running enlightened tutor, but that was also a countertop deck. Presumably any kind of Etutor control like list is going to be running some sort of combo finish (e.g. RIP/Helm, Thopter/sword) that is tutorable by Etutor along with haymaker permanents like RIP, blood moon, etc.
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Apr 26, 2017 18:47
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There's always leylines.dec
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Apr 26, 2017 19:08
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Smashing Link posted:Are there any good Enlightened Tutor-based control decks in the format? Boy is there! Let me tell you all about The Mighty Quinn! Which is to say that Agentsythe will tell you all about The Mighty Quinn!
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Apr 26, 2017 19:15
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DO I HAVE A DECK FORsuicidesteve posted:Boy is there! Let me tell you all about The Mighty Quinn! god damnit
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Apr 26, 2017 19:18
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Smashing Link posted:Are there any good Enlightened Tutor-based control decks in the format? I've been testing a rip/helm list for the last couple days. Seems pretty so far. Can post list when I'm at a real computer
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Apr 26, 2017 19:24
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Enchantress is a prison deck that usually runs 1 enlightened tutor, does that count?
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Apr 26, 2017 20:01
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L0cke17 posted:I've been testing a rip/helm list for the last couple days. Seems pretty so far. Can post list when I'm at a real computer I own three Helms and four each of RIP and Leyline, and I also love lovely mill strategies so yes please do.
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Apr 26, 2017 20:05
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Fingers McLongDong posted:Enchantress is a prison deck that usually runs 1 enlightened tutor, does that count? does it? i thought sterling grove was the tutor of choice e: maybe if i would have stopped and thought a little bit i could have come up with some scenarios where you want E tutor, like if your win con is Helm, or you have any other hateful artifact in the board
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Apr 26, 2017 20:08
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