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sparkmaster posted:If it wasn't a warcrime for the Americans in 1991 and 2003, why is it a warcrime for us? Toss a pair of cruise missiles into the Defense Ministry executive washroom, throw their command into chaos, and let the Count's forces make real gains. well, same reason lots of things aren't warcrimes for america but are for everybody else  (like cluster bombs and landmines!)really tho our actual threat on the ground is the bulgarian mercenaries who have their own command structure and our threats in the air when they show up will have to be more mercs as well b/c angola doesn't have an airforce left, so i doubt it would be even particularly effective even in the case that they got through AA and didn't swerve into a kindergarten
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May 3, 2017 02:55
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sparkmaster posted:If it wasn't a warcrime for the Americans in 1991 and 2003, why is it a warcrime for us? Toss a pair of cruise missiles into the Defense Ministry executive washroom, throw their command into chaos, and let the Count's forces make real gains. Things usually aren't warcrimes for America because who is going to tell America they are? Warcrimes are for people without supercarriers and nuclear weapons.
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May 3, 2017 02:57
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Night10194 posted:Things usually aren't warcrimes for America because who is going to tell America they are? Humble correction: Warcrimes are for people who lose. Lets not lose.
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May 3, 2017 03:00
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power crystals posted:Adjusted: I want to be a Liontamer
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May 3, 2017 04:27
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As an aside to op planning, and along the same lines as my LGB presentation earlier, I would like to present Phantoms I Have Known I love F-4s. They are probably the ultimate in "we took a brick and stuck engines on it" aesthetics and they can mount all kinds of stuff - at least if you like bombs - while still being fairly cheap because they aren't super amazing these days in the whole "not getting shot down" department. But they're still plenty fast and can haul a pretty sizable load of munitions. Because half the planet operated these things at one point, there's a thousand variants. Here's some interesting ones. Israeli Kurnass 2000: Israel makes a strong opening with this one that can mount a single AGM-142 (standoff strike missile, 40nm) or, more excitingly, two Delilahs, which start off with the impressive range of 150nm but have the ability to loiter around an area and then be re-targeted later. Perfect for ambushing stuff that rolls through after your planes leave. When you want some truly ridiculous weapon, always trust Israel to have built one. American F-4G: Our old friend, the Wild Weasel Phantom. If you want to blow away some radars, these guys can mount 4 HARMs each. Iranian F-4E: Iran isn't exactly on great terms with most of the world, so their stuff mounts some really weird poo poo. Most interestingly, these Phantoms can carry two Chinese anti-shipping missiles. Or for the fans of just flattening the countryside, it can carry 10x M117 750lb dumb bombs. Though I'm admittedly not sure how the hell we'd manage to buy these even if they were available, and the supply chain for the munitions would probably be even more exciting. Japanese F-4EJ Kai: Iranian embargos got you down? Japan's also got Phantoms with anti-shipping missiles, this time produced domestically by Japan. Turkish Terminator 2020: Besides winning the award for most badass Phantom variant name, this thing can carry an AGM-142 like the Israeli entry above, but also optionally has access to 2000lb penetrator warhead bombs, for all your bunker busting needs. German F-4F ICE: Surprisingly, it seems that aside from the Greek Phantoms we own, the only ones that can mount AMRAAMs instead of Sparrows are these German ones. On top of that they can only hold 3 at most, and air to air is literally all they can do - they can't even mount dumb bombs or rockets! So I guess if we want more cheap AMRAAM carriers we're gonna have to go hit up Greece again unless these show up for like $10M or less. South Korean F-4E: We conclude our tour in South Korea, with these Phantoms that can mount two AGM-142s... with penetrator warheads. Because why not have access to bunker-busting standoff missiles? I hope you have enjoyed this tour through the wild and wonderful world of Phantoms.
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May 3, 2017 04:28
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Yooper posted:
For reference, here are the main roads the SA-11 will be using  It also means they're going to be relying on grounds-based radars (and maybe AWACS) to spot targets for their SA-11 instead of using the Buk's radars.
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May 3, 2017 04:52
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How many cruise missiles would it take to really take out a major office building? It seems likely that we'll just blow up the auxiliary outhouse, two pencil pushers' offices, and the tertiary meeting room and that the whole thing would be mostly symbolic. If we're doing this maybe pick the more useful target and saturate that. Army HQ might cause problems with logistics for example, so extremely blow up that during office hours and just put one into the presidential palace as a little gently caress you.
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May 3, 2017 04:53
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I'm for any plan with one pie-in-the-sky strategic target (oil refinery, ammo depot, palace, Defence Ministry, etc.) that gets hit hard.
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May 3, 2017 04:56
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aphid_licker posted:How many cruise missiles would it take to really take out a major office building? It seems likely that we'll just blow up the auxiliary outhouse, two pencil pushers' offices, and the tertiary meeting room and that the whole thing would be mostly symbolic. If we're doing this maybe pick the more useful target and saturate that. Army HQ might cause problems with logistics for example, so extremely blow up that during office hours and just put one into the presidential palace as a little gently caress you. I thought the Defense Ministry HQ WAS the Angolan Army HQ. My plan was written on that assumption; that's why Kagatsuchi's target is labeled as "Defense Ministry HQ/Angolan Army HQ".
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May 3, 2017 04:57
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power crystals posted:As an aside to op planning, and along the same lines as my LGB presentation earlier, I would like to present When it come to standoff strike, I'm on record as being in favor of Hornets, Super Hornets, F-16Cs, and Strike Eagles. We should be able to get a line on the Greek F-16 Block 52s, which can carry four 2,000lb Pavaeway(!) and AGM-154C JSOW cruise missiles (45 nm) and SPICE 1000 bombs (35 nm). But for an affordable long-range capability, the upgraded Phantoms do have a lot to offer. In order, my favorites. The Kurnass has the standoff strike capabilities we need with the Popeye glide bombs (40 nm) and the Delilah cruise missiles (150 nm). It's not a serious air-to-air fighter, but it brings the noise in other areas. The latest version of the Turkish F-4 Terminator is alos very good (https://wiki.baloogancampaign.com/index.php/DataAircraft?ID=424). It can carry several types of 2,000lb bunker-busters and the new SOM A cruise missile with a 130 nm range. The Korean birds are less amazing without cruise missiles, but they do carry AIM-7 Sparrows for BVR work, which none of the other Phantoms can do. Bacarruda fucked around with this message at 05:11 on May 3, 2017 |
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May 3, 2017 05:05
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So, Bacarruda, if we were to put four cruise missiles into Luanda what would you want to hit with them?
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May 3, 2017 05:13
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What's a warcrime is this I hear about game considering the Rafalr to be the best plane... Back to topic, killing Dos Santos seems like a good way to save lives and money. I doubt he's in the Presidential Palace, but that said, it's just the Angolan Palace of some losing warlord, I don't think that international reaction would be substantial. Maybe after the war we could recruit some local defectors too, starting with the last air marshal who got fired, if he managed to fake his death. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 06:38 on May 3, 2017 |
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May 3, 2017 05:15
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I support the idea of using cruise missiles against strategic targets like radar sites and then striking any SAMs that pop up to defend those targets.
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May 3, 2017 05:23
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Bacarruda posted:When it come to standoff strike, I'm on record as being in favor of Hornets, Super Hornets, F-16Cs, and Strike Eagles. We should be able to get a line on the Greek F-16 Block 52s, which can carry four 2,000lb Pavaeway(!) and AGM-154C JSOW cruise missiles (45 nm) and SPICE 1000 bombs (35 nm).
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May 3, 2017 05:27
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Added Space posted:So, Bacarruda, if we were to put four cruise missiles into Luanda what would you want to hit with them? I'd just as soon not attack Luanda. It's at the extreme range of our cruise missiles and would force us to fly 75-100km into their airspace to get our missiles off. That exposes our Tornadoes to a fair amount of risk, especially since they'd have to fly very close to the heavily-defended Benguela Airport to reach their launch points in the West. My preference is to go after the three military bases in the west. On order: Caimbambo Depot, Balombo FOB, and Benguela Airport. Killing these will choke the Angolas from getting gas, ammo, and spare to their frontline troops, letting Von Hoff and his new tanks break through. However if you pressed me, here is what I'd hit in Luanda. 1) The Defense Ministry -- Symbolic value. Interferes with their command and control. Kills educated senior officers and staffers needed to plan and run major military operations (provided we hit it while people are at work). 2) The Ministry of the Interior -- Symbolic value. Secret police are a major factor in any dictator keeping control. Von Hoff enjoys major popular support -- killing off the secret police will help enable and inspire a insurgency in the Dictator's backyard. 3) Rádio Nacional de Angola (or whatever is the most powerful radio transmitter in the country) -- Symbolic value. By killing off their ability to broadcast propaganda, we give Von Hoff the chance to set up a Radio Free Angola without having to worry about the Dictator trying to jam it with a bigger transmitter. Killing off Dos Santos by trying to hit the Presidential Palace is a risky position. It's a big building, so we'd need to absolutely hammer it to make sure we hit the part he's in. We have no intel so there's a good chance he might not be home. It's going to have air defenses which can kill cruise missiles. If we fail, he can spin it as a miracle and a sign he was "meant to rule" or some poo poo. If we succeed, we have no idea who might take over next -- they may be even worse. I'm not 100% against the idea, but I think we need to hit him will all the cruise missiles or none of them. Bacarruda fucked around with this message at 06:35 on May 3, 2017 |
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May 3, 2017 05:57
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Bacarruda posted:I'd just as soon not attack Luanda. It's at the extreme range of our cruise missiles and would force us to fly 75-100km into their airspace to get our missiles off. That exposes our Tornadoes to a fair amount of risk, especially since they'd have to fly very close to the heavily-defended Benguela Airport to reach their launch points in the West. As a Tornado driver, putting my support behind the military targets.
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May 3, 2017 06:34
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Agree that any chance that won't to buy cheap F16s and F18s that don't hemmorhage the budget should be taken. Also, voting for military targets. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 07:12 on May 3, 2017 |
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May 3, 2017 07:08
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Ok, will revise my op based on feedback tomorrow. Limit focus to the west, push the timing to daylight, hit the defense ministry. Hey, maybe we'll get lucky and he'll be in the building.
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May 3, 2017 07:13
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Ordnance used in the capital can't be used to wipe out a whole airfield. Military Targets
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May 3, 2017 07:29
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Operation Liontamer Military targets Attacking the capital is fun, but it won't win the war. Destroying radars and airfields will.
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May 3, 2017 07:59
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Military Targets if my opinion on the matter wasn't known already.
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May 3, 2017 08:02
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Military Targets. Don't think we have great intel on the capital beyond the buildings themselves. Striking them risks hitting civilians if our targeting is off and also runs the risk of not doing that much damage to them or infringing on their operations.
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May 3, 2017 08:08
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SK60B Pilot Thunderlips says:Loel posted:Uh, we did not blow up the hotel "We did not blow it up, someone we collectively voted to hire and pay to fly combat missions for us did!" Brother, are you the CEO of Uber? Also, I have an insane plan for a mission. Codename WRESTLEMANIA 13. I'll try to post it later today, so stay tuned, Thundermaniacs.
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May 3, 2017 08:11
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I second Military Targets. I'm worried about going after that airport, though. Aren't we pushing on that area on the ground? It seems like it's not really going to influence the ground battle at this point. Also, it's right in the middle of the city. Fun fact: it's just 5km from the Portuguese Consulate (which, is, as far as I'm aware, still an EU & NATO member). Because you know, that's probably something we should keep in mind. So we had better be drat sure it won't miss.
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May 3, 2017 08:29
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Holy poo poo, 24 hours is a lot of mission.  Operation BAD ANIME  We’ve just destroyed a large number of Central Angolan air forces, so we should have lots of free reign over Central Angola and the ability to strike at deeper targets than we’ve been able to previously. Sometime during the 24 hours there’s a possible event from Northern Angola, which I will only refer to as “HERDED CATS.” The objectives of this operation are: 1. Destroy search radars and high-threat SAMs, like the SA-11 Buk-M1 and SA-19 Tunguska, and degrade airfields, to clear the way for continued air operations over Central Angola, including possible HERDED CATS. 2. Search and destroy vital military infrastructure for the dictator’s army, reducing the capability of all Central Angolan ground forces to defend the regime. 3. Be prepared to conduct counter-air operations against Central Angolan and Northern Angolan air forces in support of HERDED CATS. 4. Degrade the Dictator’s ability to gain funds and import military equipment 5. Interdict and destroy Bulgarian and dictator ground forces, to degrade and reduce their ability for continued offensive operations and or impair their ability to defend against Southern Angolan offensive. This operation will be split into day and night phases. During the day we start destroying search radars, airbases, what SAMs we can, and FOBs and other military infrastructure, in preparation for later air operations, including HERDED CATS. HERDED CATS is likely to occur during these daylight hours, so all CAP pilots must be prepared for counter-air operations against the Free State. At night we can search for the SA-11 sites with impunity as they should be blinded. Once we’re sure we’ve taken out most AA, we can go full ham on destroying targets in the west. I also strike at Luanda over the sea, after nightfall. Our cruise missiles have an imaging infrared camera seeker on them to make sure they hit the right target. It’s at night so there should be less risk of civilian casualties. I target the piers at the port because the cruise missiles will do a lot of damage and set fires, which should hamper the ability for the ports to export Lithium and import military vehicles, yet still not cause much permanent damage. I didn’t really know what to do with our light strike aircraft. We have no idea where the Dictator’s put his SA-11s and any remaining Tunguskas, so I don’t want to put them at anywhere we haven’t scouted thoroughly. I end up letting them try to plink at targets in the west, only letting them start flying after our first pass trying to clear out SAMs. I don’t even touch the SK 60Bs. The operation tempo is mostly defined by how often we can get those Tornados and their cruise missiles in the air. I tried to give 7-8 hours to allow for a mission and then 6 hour turnaround. If planes aren’t ready, feel free to delay each phase. GENERAL: All Ground Strike missions may be delayed during HERDED CATS until its completion. All ground strike missions may also be delayed until their component aircraft have finished ready preparations. 6x Gripen, Loadout: Max Intercept (4xMeteor, 2xIRIS-T) 6x Phantom, Loadout: Air Superiority (4xAMRAAM, 4xSidewinder) Mission: 1. Provide CAP for all friendly forces, on a “1/3” rule rotation, with 2-ship flights. 1.1. If more than 2 Phantoms or 4 Gripens are on station upon completion of an escort or OCA mission, RTB the oldest flights. 2. Provide combat escort for various flights as needed, specified in the strike mission 3. Upon HERDED CATS, scramble all available fighters and perform offensive counter air over Central Angola 3.1. ROE during HERDED CATS is to only engage air contacts positively identified as hostile 4. Outside of HERDED CATS, scramble fighters if appropriate to defend against a large number of incoming bandits. 5. (Phantoms only) CAP Mission ends at 1700 (Dusk). 5.1. Beginning at 1400, Phantoms that are standing down (not quick turnaround) rearm to 2x GBU-24 loadout. Only rearm a maximum of 4 Phantoms. 5.2. Leave 2x Phantoms on CAP loadout to provide escort to the night strike. Notes: EMCON is at pilot’s discretion while patrollng. Radars ON when engaging BVR, when escorting strike missions, and when the S 100B is on the ground. Rearm with Quick Turnaround if possible. Try to stay at least 30 nm from all known or suspected SAM locations. Your RWRs should warn you of any SA-2 and SA-3 search radars. Joker fuel settings plus mission tanker settings should not total more than 20%. (Ie: 10% Joker + 10% Tanker, or 20% Joker + 10% Tanker) 1x S 100B Argus Mission: 1. Provide AEW&C and ELINT support 2. RTB at 1130 and be wheels down by 1200 in order for quick turnaround, take off ASAP after that. 1x KC-135, 1x VC.10 Mission: 1. Provide tanker support 2. Alternate time on station for round-the-clock coverage. DAY WAVE 1 (0700 local time) MQ-9 Reaper, Loadout: Gorgon Stare recon pod Mission: 1. Recon defenses around the FOB at R1. 2. Recon the front line at R2 3. Continue to patrol the entire western front line, from the coast to RX. 4. RTB by 1500, or when bingo fuel. Notes: Deploy early to scout R1 before by 0730. Stay at least 30-40 nmi away from all ground contacts. 1x EA-6B Prowler, Loadout: 1x HARM, Long range Mission: 1. Engage mission target: 1.1. Santo Marta Tin Shield radar site (T1) Do not RTB Winchester 2. Provide jamming support for the Saudi Tornados on their ingress and egress to LP1 during DAY WAVE 2. 3. RTB to rearm 2x German Tornado IDS, Loadout: 2x Taurus KEPD Mission: 1. Engage mission targets: - Catumbela Airport Runway (T2) - Catumbela Airport Runway-grade taxiway (T2) - Caconga Tin Shield radar site (T3) - Huambo Airbase Runway (T4) Notes: Remember to set waypoints for the missiles to try to path them around known or suspected enemy ground forces. This must be done before launch. (Shift-F1 target, there is a “Plot Course” button below the top-right panel.) Rearm with 2x Taurus KEPD and wait for THIRD WAVE 2x Saudi Tornado IDS, Loadout: 2x Storm Shadow Mission: 1. Engage mission targets, launching from LP1. 1.1. Kuito Airbase RUNWAY (S1) 1.2. Lussusso Tin Shield Radar site (S2) 1.3. Malanje Bar Lock RADAR SITE (S3) 1.4. Cariango Flat Face Radar site (S4) Notes: Navigate to launch point (LP) by staying at least 25 nm from any ground forces. When launching on targets S2, S3, and S4, try to launch from LP1 and preprogram the missiles around known or suspected enemy forces Rearm with 2x Storm Shadow and wait for THIRD WAVE ESCORT: 1. Pull 2 Gripens from the CAP to provide anti-air escort to and from LP. 2. 1 Prowler for jamming escort. 2x Gripens, Loadout: 8x SDB, Light Mission: After the MQ-9 has scouted R1 1. Reveal SAM locations by enaging ground forces or suspected SAM sites along the in the vicinity of R1 1.1. If possible, spread out targeting to maximize chance of revealing SAMs 2. RTB quickly in order to quick-turnaround and deploy in DAY WAVE 2 Notes: It looks like the SDB, Light loadout allows for quick turnaround. DAY WAVE 2 (approx 0800-1000 local time) 2x Gripen, Loadout 8x SDB (Light) Mission: 1. Engage targets along the western FLOT (R2) 1.1. Radars T1 and T3, if they are still up 1.2. Other ground targets in vicinity of R2 1.2.1. Try to launch 2x SDB on various targets spread along the entire FLOT to reveal SAMs NOON STRIKE (Approximately 1200-1300 Local Time) 2x Gripen, Loadout 8x SDB (Light) Mission: 1. Engage targets of opportunity along the western FLOT (R2) or near R1 and R3 2. RTB For quick turnaround DAY WAVE 3 (Approximately 1400-1600 Local Time) 1x EA-6B Prowler, Loadout: 1x HARM, Long-range Mission: 1. Launch your HARM at any available target in the vicinity of R2. 2. RTB 2x Saudi Tornado IDS, Loadout: 2x Storm Shadow 2x German Tornado IDS, Loadout: 2x Taurus KEPD Mission: 1. Engage mission targets, with priority: 1.1. Any discovered SAM sites (SA-11 and SA-19 in particular) 1.2. Any remaining sites from the morning (T1, T2, T3, T4, S1) (Taurus KEPD) 1.3. New mission targets: 1.3.1. Military Base at U4 (Storm Shadow) 1.3.2. Luena Airport RUNWAY at U5 (Storm Shadow) 1.3.3. Luena Flat Face Radar at U5 (Storm Shadow) 1.3.4. Other discovered Military Bases, Vehicle Depots, Ammo Depots 1.3.5. FOBs ( U1, U2, U3, and newly discovered) Notes: Remember to preprogram and path the Taurus/Storm Shadow to minimize its exposure to hostile ground units. 2x Gripen, Loadout 8x SDB (Light) Mission: 1. Engage targets along the western FLOT (R2) or near the FOBs at R1 and R3. 1.1. Engage known SAMs and AA if able 1.2. Engage other targets 2x AMX A-11, Loadout: 2xGBU-32 JDAM 2x Mirage F.1CR, Loadout: 2x BGL 400 LGB 1x Hawk 209, Loadout: 2x AGM-65G 1xSu-25T, Loadout: 2x Kh-29T Mission: 1. Engage targets of opportunity in the western FLOT (R2) 2. Avoid all known or suspected SAM locations. RTB if nothing feels safe enough. 3. (Mirage only) Rearm to 4x GBU-12 loadout. DUSK (Approx 1800 Local Time, if available) 2x Gripen, Loadout 8x SDB (Light) Mission: 1. Engage targets of opportunity along the western FLOT (R2) or near the FOBs at R1 and R3, with priority: 1.1. Any emitting radars, including SAMs or SPAAGs 1.2. Other discovered AA threats. 1.3. Other military targets of opportunity 2. RTB for quick turnaround 1x MQ-9 Reaper Mission: 1. Take off and provide stand-off recon along the front line, R2 to R1, until nightfall Notes: Stay at least 30-40 nm away from all hostile ground contacts 1x Sperwer UAV Mission: 1. Take off in preparation for night time scouting. Stage near the R2 front line NIGHTFALL (1900 Local Time) 1x MQ-9 Reaper 1x Sperwer UAV Mission: 1. The UAVs are AUTHORIZED to overfly all non-emitting ground contacts along the western FLOT 1.1. Stay outside of all detected hostile radar search radii 1.2. If nothing is emitting, UAVs may join an ASuW patrol along the western FLOT, with prosecution zone extending up to 30 nmi across the border. 2x Gripen, Loadout 8x SDB (Light) Mission: 3. Engage targets of opportunity along the western FLOT, from the coast to RX, with priority: 3.1. Any emitting radars, including SAMs or SPAAGs 3.2. Other discovered AA threats 3.3. Other military targets of opportunity NIGHT STRIKE (2200 - 2400 Local Time) 1x EA-6B Prowler, loadout 1x HARM (long-range) Mission: 1. Provide jamming support to Tornados to and from LP3 2. Launch HARM at any convenient emitting radar. Do not RTB Winchester until primary mission is complete. 2x Saudi Tornado IDS, Loadout 2x Storm Shadow 2x German Tornado IDS, Loadout 2x Taurus KEPD Mission: 1. Navigate to LP3 and strike command & control and military logistics targets in vicinity of Luanda, with priority: 1.1. Angolan Army HQ 1.2. Any other Military Command facilities 1.3. 2x Luanda Port Pier Structure 1.4. Refinery AvGas Storage (40x 150kL Tank Farm) (Do not engage other refinery facilities) 1.5. Caboledo Airport Runway 1.6. 2x Quatro de Fevereiro Airport Runway ESCORT: - 2x Gripen from Lubango. - 2x CAP Phantoms from Lubango. - 1 Prowler for jamming. Notes: Remember to preprogram a path for the cruise missiles that minimizes exposure to hostile forces, and using terrain masking if possible. (For example, there is a small river estuary to the south of Luanda) Escort fighters should be fresh fighters taking off from Lubango if possible, for maximum fuel range. 4x F4-E Phantom II, Loadout: 2x GBU-24 2x AMX A-11, Loadout: 2xGBU-32 JDAM 2x Mirage F.1CR, Loadout: 2x BGL 400 LGB 1x Hawk 209, Loadout: 2x AGM-65G 1x Su-25T, Loadout: 2x Kh-29T 2x Gripen, Loadout 8x SDB (Light) Mission: 1. Engage military infrastructure and targets in along the western FLOT, from the coast to RX, with priority: 1.1. Any emitting radar. 1.2. SAMs or other AA 1.3. FOBs or Depots 1.4. Artillery 1.5. Armor 1.6. Other targets of opportunity 2. Units are authorized to fly within known and estimated non-emitting SAM positions 2.1. Stay out of range of any detected active radar Psawhn fucked around with this message at 10:31 on May 3, 2017 |
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May 3, 2017 10:09
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Reminder : I'm putting plans to a vote in about 8 hours. If you need more time to get your plan together please let me know!
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May 3, 2017 13:49
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One thing I think people should take into account when thinking about the morality/legality of our actions: Our unit is sexy as poo poo, flying jets and getting into huge aerial dogfights. We're the kind of people that'll attract media attention because we are incredibly awesome. That means we can't quite do stuff in the dark the way a ground unit could. Being 'heroic' is good marketing. E: Speaking of, we should really stick to Military Targets Night10194 fucked around with this message at 14:08 on May 3, 2017 |
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May 3, 2017 14:05
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Please No Warcrimes
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May 3, 2017 14:10
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Please More Warcrimes
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May 3, 2017 14:11
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warcrimes for some, miniature angolan flags for others!
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May 3, 2017 14:14
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*hastily scribbles on business card and hands it back to you* "No, more warcrimes!"
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May 3, 2017 14:17
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RentACop posted:*hastily scribbles on business card and hands it back to you* Just to be sure, that comma's supposed to be there?
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May 3, 2017 14:36
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Guys, lets be clear on what is a warcrime here. Lobbing cruise missiles into the capital is fine as long as we're hitting legitimate military targets. If Dos Santos puts 23mm AAA on top of hospitals, even those become permissible targets under conventional interpretation of laws and treaties of armed conflict, whereas if they had no military targets in/on them, they wouldn't be. Just because something is brutal doesn't mean it's illegal. If we have the chance to cripple Angola's warfighting ability, we should do it. It might even save more civilians in the long run by shortening the conflict.
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May 3, 2017 14:48
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Lobbing cruise missiles onto protected targets probably isn't going to work though. We already saw in our first attempt to take out the SA-10 that a Tunguska can pretty much just shoot down cruise missiles all day and important targets like the capital and airbases will have AA defenses. This isn't some cave in rural Afghanistan! This is a capital city of a paranoid dictator, you bet your rear end he's going to have significant air defenses.
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May 3, 2017 15:19
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You people do realize that the Ministry of Defence is most likely not the actual headquarters of the Angolan Army? I mean, smashing some bureaucrats is going to disrupt the operations, but probably not to the extent that it would be worth killing a bunch of civilians for.
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May 3, 2017 15:19
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Its a moral victory, it shows he cant defend his own capital 
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May 3, 2017 15:21
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Tevery Best posted:You people do realize that the Ministry of Defence is most likely not the actual headquarters of the Angolan Army? I mean, smashing some bureaucrats is going to disrupt the operations, but probably not to the extent that it would be worth killing a bunch of civilians for. Probably not, but the paychecks for the Bulgarians probably come through there, as do paying for the meals and supplies for the Angolan Army. The generals might be in some HQ out in the bush, but their army won't fight if they don't eat and don't get paid.
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May 3, 2017 15:22
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Psawhn posted:1.1. Angolan Army HQ Is it possible we could cut it to one pier or at least target the largest pier if there are different sized piers? If we destroy too many facilities, I'm worried that lithium shipping will be affected enough to get other countries siding against us.
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May 3, 2017 15:25
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RentACop posted:*hastily scribbles on business card and hands it back to you* 
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May 3, 2017 15:37
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| # ? Jun 12, 2024 00:20 |
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Tevery Best posted:You people do realize that the Ministry of Defence is most likely not the actual headquarters of the Angolan Army? I mean, smashing some bureaucrats is going to disrupt the operations, but probably not to the extent that it would be worth killing a bunch of civilians for. Give me a better target and I'll hit it. Also, bureaucrats working for the army aren't civilians. Operation renamed Care Package and it now hits every military target west of Huambo.
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May 3, 2017 15:39
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