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I do wonder who the press say are using a food bank vs actually uses food banks vs who needs to use a food bank. Having now googled I didn't realise that The Trussell Trust who run most of them, (all of them in our area are this trust) work on a means tested and referral basis "People are referred to the food banks by doctors, social services, CAB and police who assess need to ensure that it is genuine. Visitors are given vouchers for three days' worth of food, with each visitor eligible for no more than three vouchers.[8][10] Visitors are also signposted to agencies that can help with longer-term difficulties." Tbh the idea that somone on a nurse's wages would get referred to these people without it being because social services had discovered that they had a massive drug problem is silly.
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May 7, 2017 12:59
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This thing is demonstrably happening but I think it's silly. Therefore it is not happening.
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May 7, 2017 13:00
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I'm not saying that May and the Tories are going to start jailing reporters in the very near future (who among us would complain, frankly), but May clearly exchanged notes with Erdogan around "how to consolidate power when everyone with a brain hates you" when she visited him. Alienate young voters, rant incoherently about shadowy external forces threatening your democracy, pander to your largely rural voter base in your speeches and policies, STRONG AND STABLE, point out how anyone opposed to your reforms is an enemy of the state... well, we're not quite at the last one, but David Davis is definitely close.
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May 7, 2017 13:02
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Aren't the Trussell Trust super dodgy? I have hazy memories of a scandal from a year or two ago but can't remember the details.
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May 7, 2017 13:03
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kingturnip posted:I'm not saying that May and the Tories are going to start jailing reporters in the very near future (who among us would complain, frankly), but May clearly exchanged notes with Erdogan around "how to consolidate power when everyone with a brain hates you" when she visited him. Did they really need to learn this from Erdogan when this has been the Tory line for decades?
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May 7, 2017 13:06
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kingturnip posted:pander to your largely rural voter base in your speeches and policies I thought the AKP's voter base are the big cities, actually?
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May 7, 2017 13:06
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Oberleutnant posted:Aren't the Trussell Trust super dodgy? I have hazy memories of a scandal from a year or two ago but can't remember the details. Fairly certain that's not what you mean, but the only one I remember was when a Sun reporter went in and lied about his poverty to get a week's worth of cheap food.
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May 7, 2017 13:08
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Irony Be My Shield posted:This thing is demonstrably happening but I think it's silly. Therefore it is not happening. But it isn't demonstrably happening, that's the issue. Nobody can actually find any of these nurses who are using food banks (again caveating, there are definitely nursing students having to do this).
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May 7, 2017 13:09
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Andrew Marr today asking McDonnell the hard-hitting questions people want answers to, like 'are you a Marxist?' Never mind the fact that 90% of the population doesn't know what Marxism is, it makes a good negative soundbite.
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May 7, 2017 13:09
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Horseshoe theory posted:I thought the AKP's voter base are the big cities, actually? the make Erdogan dictator referendum got passed in the rural areas, I'm not sure where his voterbase is in general elections but I imagine people who usually vote against him wouldn't vote to give him more power. I could be wrong though.
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May 7, 2017 13:09
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jabby posted:Andrew Marr today asking McDonnell the hard-hitting questions people want answers to, like 'are you a Marxist?' Somehow I don't see Marr asking May or Farage if they are Fascists. Of course the problem is that the only correct answer either way is to lie, since equally bad sides blah blah blah.
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May 7, 2017 13:11
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Andrew Marr is a oval office
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May 7, 2017 13:14
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McDonnell is on film self-identifying as a Marxist, it's perfectly fair to put the question to him and personally I thought his answer explaining his beliefs was perfectly reasonable.
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May 7, 2017 13:15
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Baron Corbyn posted:the make Erdogan dictator referendum got passed in the rural areas, I'm not sure where his voterbase is in general elections but I imagine people who usually vote against him wouldn't vote to give him more power. I could be wrong though. Could have been depressed voting results given a non-election vote, plus reports of widespread voter suppression were reported, so who the hell knows.
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May 7, 2017 13:15
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Alchenar posted:McDonnell is on film self-identifying as a Marxist, it's perfectly fair to put the question to him and personally I thought his answer explaining his beliefs was perfectly reasonable. Very few people watching, let alone those reading the papers, will have an accurate idea of what Marxism means. Even people who identify as Marxist will dispute what exactly it means. So asking him if he's a Marxist, yes or no, is not an informative question. Considering the misperceptions most people will have it's more likely to mislead about McDonnell's actual beliefs. So it's a bad question. Marr is also an absolute joke generally. Marr: 'You say you want 10,000 new mental health professionals and yet you sacked 6,000 of them in the last parliament. Why?' Hunt: 'We want better mental health services.' Marr: 'Let's move on to Brexit.' jabby fucked around with this message at 13:31 on May 7, 2017 |
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May 7, 2017 13:24
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jabby posted:Marr: 'You say you want 10,000 new mental health professionals and yet you sacked 6,000 of them in the last parliament. Why?' The general argument they use there is "we want the money to be spent in the right place". Which of course is when it goes into their pockets. It just blows my mind that people can't see May is mentally ill. She has a Napoleon complex, except instead of Napoleon it's Thatcher. She thinks that all she has to do is be hard line about everything and she'll succeed. It's not even her own brand of evil, it's cargo cult evil.
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May 7, 2017 13:43
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jabby posted:Very few people watching, let alone those reading the papers, will have an accurate idea of what Marxism means. Even people who identify as Marxist will dispute what exactly it means. So asking him if he's a Marxist, yes or no, is not an informative question. Considering the misperceptions most people will have it's more likely to mislead about McDonnell's actual beliefs. So it's a bad question. Marr is a tory. I'm not saying this in a "hurf anyone who doesn't like Mcdonnel is a tory" way, he actually is one. A lot of the big political commentators are which is genuinely quite worrying. quote:It just blows my mind that people can't see May is mentally ill. She has a Napoleon complex, except instead of Napoleon it's Thatcher. She thinks that all she has to do is be hard line about everything and she'll succeed. It's not even her own brand of evil, it's cargo cult evil.
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May 7, 2017 13:44
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Private Speech posted:Fairly certain that's not what you mean, but the only one I remember was when a Sun reporter went in and lied about his poverty to get a week's worth of cheap food. I remember this, wasn't the headline "I got free food no questions asked", and the body "I got free food after lying convincingly in answer to many questions"?
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May 7, 2017 13:44
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Bobstar posted:I remember this, wasn't the headline "I got free food no questions asked", and the body "I got free food after lying convincingly in answer to many questions"? It was indeed. But the damage had been done.
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May 7, 2017 13:48
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Jedit posted:It just blows my mind that people can't see May is mentally ill. I really don't think she is, but even if she is I'm not sure that's particularly relevant as to why you shouldn't vote for her or her party in June.
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May 7, 2017 13:48
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Yeah it was some shitbag journo sniffing about how he conned a doddering old foodbank volunteer out of a 65p chocolate pudding (ie nonessential luxury food) and hence everybody using foodbanks is a thieving scrounger living large at the expense of the overly generous and guillible public. But that's not the scandal i'm poorly remembering.
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May 7, 2017 13:47
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jabby posted:Andrew Marr today asking McDonnell the hard-hitting questions people want answers to, like 'are you a Marxist?' They don't know what Marxism is but they "know" it's "bad". The word has come to basically mean "traitor". Like when the alt-right goes on about "cultural marxists". The right has almost complete control of the word forkboy84 posted:I really don't think she is, but even if she is I'm not sure that's particularly relevant as to why you shouldn't vote for her or her party in June. No disrespect, i'm broken brained myself, but I think being "of sound mind" is actually one thing you do want in a leader.
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May 7, 2017 13:53
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Regarde Aduck posted:They don't know what Marxism is but they "know" it's "bad". The word has come to basically mean "traitor". Like when the alt-right goes on about "cultural marxists". The right has almost complete control of the word. To be fair you could make a similar arguments for the left and Fascism, and maybe nationalism/nativism too. (and of course there was a time when racialist was a thing some people identified with)
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May 7, 2017 13:55
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Regarde Aduck posted:No disrespect, i'm broken brained myself, but I think being "of sound mind" is actually one thing you do want in a leader. I think someone with major depressive disorder will probably be be capable of being PM (and people with it certainly have been PM in the past), especially with the sort of support framework that comes with the job. Ditto bipolar disorder. Can't really comment on schizophrenia, don't know enough. Now, I'd probably not want someone with narcissistic or antisocial personality disorders leading the country, but there's a difference between a mental illness & a personality disorder as I understand it.
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May 7, 2017 14:03
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And I repeat, McDonnell is on tape describing himself as 'a Marxist'. Cat's out of the bag. The fairest thing to do is to put the question to him and allow him to give a full answer, which is what happened. The word isn't unfair when you are the one who's used it.
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May 7, 2017 14:04
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"People are referred to the food banks by doctors, social services, CAB and police who assess need to ensure that it is genuine. Visitors are given vouchers for three days' worth of food, with each visitor eligible for no more than three vouchers.[8][10] Visitors are also signposted to agencies that can help with longer-term difficulties." This was four years ago and I didn't last very long as a volunteer but we had to give the voucher if asked. Our records system was not robust and we did not ask for ID. As long as they were willing to wait in reception and have a 5 min appt with a volunteer, the voucher was given.
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May 7, 2017 14:08
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Horseshoe theory posted:I thought the AKP's voter base are the big cities, actually? AKP swept to power on a wave of rural discontent, who are less nationalist in the Turkish style than people in the big cities, more devoutly muslim and socially conservative in general. They welcomed the AKPs promise to reinstate things like calls to prayer and other openly muslim trappings, which had been banned since the fall of the Ottoman empire in order to foster a clean break between the cosmopolitan muslim empire and secular nationalist Turkey. Having said that there is still support for the AKP in cities, particularly in highly religious neighbourhoods like Fatah in Istanbul, but the cities in general are not as supportive of Erdogan as the countryside.
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May 7, 2017 14:21
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Zephro posted:I read that piece. It doesn't explicitly state the government is playing 14-dimensional chess and secretly sabotaging the talks in the hope of having to Remain, but it skates amusingly close 60th dimensional horseshoes
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May 7, 2017 14:28
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Juliet Whisky posted:Pre-tax income for 25% of us <£15,500pa --> O level math nerdery No, high end wages only affect _average_ income, not the_median_. 5% of people making 200kpa would add 10k to the average, but nothing to the median. The ONS report is actually smart about not listing average wage in the overview, as it is pretty much meaningless, but you know all the right wing tabloids would quote it. And at least it make the right wing broadsheets do a bit of arithmetic to come up with a lie.
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May 7, 2017 14:29
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jabby posted:Very few people watching, let alone those reading the papers, will have an accurate idea of what Marxism means. Even people who identify as Marxist will dispute what exactly it means. So asking him if he's a Marxist, yes or no, is not an informative question. Considering the misperceptions most people will have it's more likely to mislead about McDonnell's actual beliefs. So it's a bad question. tbf I think it's the answer that's supposed be informative for the viewer at home, not so much the question
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May 7, 2017 14:36
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Alchenar posted:And I repeat, McDonnell is on tape describing himself as 'a Marxist'. If it had been put as "You're on record as describing yourself as a Marxist, could you explain what you mean by that?" I suspect people would be less suspicious of it.
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May 7, 2017 14:57
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Oberleutnant posted:Yeah it was some shitbag journo sniffing about how he conned a doddering old foodbank volunteer out of a 65p chocolate pudding (ie nonessential luxury food) and hence everybody using foodbanks is a thieving scrounger living large at the expense of the overly generous and guillible public.  As for the Trussell Trust, there was some 'controversy' about them charging money to local authorities for branding and PR, but it's mostly the right wing rags complaining about that, so it might just be a case of 'charity has overheads'. There's also the controversy that they engage in religious discrimination, with some higher positions allegedly being offered to Christians only, which is lovely. There's also the controversy of foodbanks existing in an allegedly developed nation, but that's more different.
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May 7, 2017 15:02
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Cerv posted:tbf I think it's the answer that's supposed be informative for the viewer at home, not so much the question Have you stopped beating your wife?
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May 7, 2017 15:32
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Guavanaut posted:It was the Mail on Sunday, not the Sun, but this is the twat who did the "I lied in church and said my kids were starving and they gave me some food from a private charity, government benefits have gone mad" poo poo. "Know kneel down on the grass between the food you stole from people who actually need it, we need to take a picture. Oh, don't look so grim, you don't want your corporate overlords to be angry do you?"
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May 7, 2017 15:40
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jabby posted:Have you stopped beating your wife? If McDonnell was a self-described wife beater I'd applaud any interviewer who asked him that
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May 7, 2017 15:40
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Cerv posted:If McDonnell was a self-described wife beater I'd applaud any interviewer who asked him that My point is that McDonnell has self-described as a Marxist in the past to specific groups of people who know what Marxism is. Asking him if he's a Marxist on national TV, where the audience has a lot of preconceptions and in the majority does not know what it means, is not a question that can possibly inform the audience in any way. McDonnell was not in a position to deliver a lecture on Marxism and undo people's beliefs in a one-line answer. It's a question aimed to give the newspapers something to report that paints him in a negative light and overshadows his policies. In isolation it wouldn't be particularly noticeable, but when contrasted with the interview of Jeremy Hunt it makes it very obvious who get's asked questions to provoke negative stories and who gets an uncritical platform to spout party slogans.
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May 7, 2017 15:47
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*accusatorially* Are you a UKMT poster?
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May 7, 2017 15:47
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radmonger posted:--> O level math nerdery Um not to out-autist you but the median is an average. You're thinking of the mean average.
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May 7, 2017 15:49
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And in fact he's probably thinking of something closer to the mode, what most people get. Which yes, the top five people doubling their income every year for no reason wouldn't affect that.
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May 7, 2017 15:52
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HJB posted:Not all remoaners are classist, I'm willing to accept that some are merely arrogant. There are lots of thick middle class people.
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May 7, 2017 15:53
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